My 34 year old narcissist son

[Confused1234]

 Hello I have read two of Randy's books and I have determined that my 34-year-old son is narcissistic with borderline personality disorder.  I am going to a family marriage counselor to get guidance for my depression and dealing with my son. My son claims he hates  me has threatened to kill me and my husband.  He has made threats his whole life so I don't take them to personally, but it's very disturbing, now that he is 34 going on 4  years old.if it was anyone but my son to say the things he has said  I would get a restraining order.  My son lives in a house that I own " rent free" which I was completely manipulated into buying for him, he is supposed to be paying the rent , and now he claims that he wants more money from me, he says I'm  wealthy and that I should share the wealth with him ,  1) , my health is  deteriorating  I may be getting an  ulcer  from this kid  ,   My new husband of 15 years is at his wits end because he sees me so upset even though I try and hide my daily feelings from my husband.  My child is ruining my beautiful wonderful life I don't know what to do ,  I keep away from my son so we don't argue,  he is  living rent free yet he keeps calling me and saying horrible things.  I have learned from the book to talk calmly with love to him, I want him to get better he doesn't know that he has borderline personality disorder , if I tell him he will probably threatened to kill me again .  What other help can I get ?  I'm at a point because I love my husband so much I don't want to divorce him but I feel I should so he can have peace and I can move to another state far away from  my son , I know this must sound crazy but I'm going crazy with my son,  and my husband and myself need peace which means we may have to separate and I may have to move far away .  i'm sure my son feels abandoned but   he has pushed me his father his stepfather , grandmother his sister and everyone so far away from him with his violent and  nasty mouth ,My daughter moved  to Canada ( with her  Canadian husband ) and she said she's never coming home to the USA because she's at peace being so far away from her brother, I am happy for her?  I wish I could do something to help my son I know he's in a lot of pain but he's 34 when does it end ?

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[drained1996]

Hi Confused1234,



Very sorry to hear the circumstances with your son are so difficult, it's a very familiar story around here.  You've come to the right place for knowledge, understanding and sharing. Dealing with a loved on that has traits of BPD can be mentally, emotionally and physically draining, we understand! 
One thing many of us have learned is that we cannot change our person with BPD, but we can change how we react to and communicate with them.  In the upper right margin of this page you will see some tools and lessons in place to help guide us to do exactly that.  It's all a process and the suggested tools work together hand in hand.  Communicating boundaries and limits is one you may want to pay particular attention to given what you have shared.  Also, dealing with threats of violence... .and in this case homicide should be taken seriously. 
https://bpdfamily.com/pdfs/safety_first.pdf
It would a good idea to contact the proper local authorities and get direction of what to do when these situations occur. 
Has your son been to a therapist in the past?  It's good to see you are seeking therapy yourself, many here have found a professional to be of great help in their journey.  Keep sharing!  We are here to walk with you.   

[Naughty Nibbler]

Hey Confused1234: 
I'd like to join Drained1996 in Welcoming you.
I'm so sorry about the problems you have with your son.  Is he currently employed (any history of stable employment?)

I am going to a family marriage counselor to get guidance for my depression and dealing with my son. My son claims he hates  me has threatened to kill me and my husband.  He has made threats his whole life so I don't take them to personally, but it's very disturbing, now that he is 34 going on 4 years old.

I want him to get better he doesn't know that he has borderline personality disorder , if I tell him he will probably threatened to kill me again.  He keeps calling me and saying horrible things.  I have learned from the book to talk calmly with love to him, 

It isn't necessary to tell you son he has BPD.  You can't change him.  The only thing you can control is the way you interact with and react to him.  The way you do this, can change the results.  You have to take your son's threats seriously, but he may have learned that he can manipulate you with threats.

You may have to decide that it is better to get a restraining order (RO) than to divorce your husband.  Not that a restraining order will resolve everything, but it could give your son a period of time to think things over and maybe get some help for his behavior problems. If he is informed that the RO can be removed, should he get some counseling and comply with certain boundaries, perhaps it can lead to a better result.

Has he ever gotten physical with anyone? 

Has you therapist given you guidance on setting BOUNDARIES?

Perhaps the new year can be an opportunity for you to revisit your tools for interacting with your son.  Boundaries are for you.  You don't have to take abuse.  You don't have to listen to abusive language.  What is your boundary for when you son calls and is verbally abusive?  Do you stay on the phone and listen, or do you let him know that you have to hang up the phone (and that he can call you back, when he is in a better frame of mind). As Drained1996 mentioned, it is good to have a Safety Plan.  You might want to make a plan or revisit a current plan.  Perhaps it is something to review with your therapist.

Sometimes some fresh input can be valuable.  If your sessions with your current therapist have gotten stale, perhaps a new therapist could be helpful.  You might even want to bring some of your own material to a session.  Print out some highlights on a Safety Plan, bring it to a therapy session and discuss it with your therapist (until you develop a good plan and feel confident with it).

You might want to visit/revisit boundaries and specific communication tools.  Discuss them or revisit them with your therapist.  Do some role playing and practice runs - anticipate a conversation where you son makes a threat.  Is there a better strategy to handle it?

Because I love my husband so much, I don't want to divorce him, but I feel I should so he can have peace and I can move to another state far away from my son.  I'm sure my son feels abandoned, but he has pushed me, his father, his stepfather, grandmother his sister and everyone so far away from him with his violent and nasty mouth 

Is your husband unwilling to move to another state?  It might be helpful to consult a real estate lawyer, to review some options.  Who is on title to the house he lives in?  If you and/or your husband are on title, you could evict your son.  It wouldn't be pleasant, but might be necessary. 

I hope you review your situation for the new year.  What boundaries can you modify, for a better result?  What are all your options?  Divorcing your husband doesn't sound like a good way to resolve things with you son.  You deserve to be happy and reduce/eliminate the stress in your life.

[Confused1234]

 Thank U both of you for your replies I'm shaking inside reading them, the house that my son lives in is totally in my name, he's currently not employed he's a pot grower of course, and my husband will never move from the town we live in ,he's one of six , and all of his wonderful siblings and their families live in the same town , I think part of the problem is that my son is running out of money and is not hireable so everything of course is my fault because I am his mother , I can either pack up and move to another state or I can tell my son that I don't ever want to talk to him again and he needs to start paying rent or move out which will bring on many threats,then  at that point I would tell him I'm going to get a restraining order if he doesn't stop threatening me, he has not been  violent he has never touched anyone , in a violent way except for his father when he was a teenager his father would try to restrain him and hold him down which was ridiculous and just cause more rage,  but he has broken things by kicking slamming my question is -is this too strong ?  It's not very loving it's extremely tough love,  he is so mentally fragile I hate to be this extreme but if it was anyone but my son this is what I would do, everything I'm reading tells me to do it with love I don't know where the line in the sand is supposed to be between love and Toughlove , my stomach just keeps flipping I am so upset i'm not able to think straight anymore. Thank you for all the great advice you both have shared I'm reading reading reading

[Lollypop]

Hi there confused

My BPDs is 26 and currently lives at home.  He's a habitual pot smoker and drugs have been a huge part of his life.  I came to this forum just 12 months ago. My BPDs was diagnosed in sept 15 following a crisis in USA. He was doing the bare minimum working a few days per week to just keep him in pot, not paying any rent - going nowhere very slowly.  We live in the uk and I gave him money under the pretense it was an inheritance - it was just enough to get him out of our house on a positive note;  he decided to go travelling in California with the money and hoped to eventually find work. Of course, in his mind he was leaving us forever and he never did find any work (he has a dual citizenship).

With hindsight, this decision of ours to deal with the situation in this way now seems utterly ridiculous but "it is what is is".  We can only make our decisions based on where we are in the process.  I was completely exhausted and felt I had no choice, I just couldn't throw him out into the street.  I devised a way out for him yet again.  I swore I would never have him back home again.  I see now that all I was doing was I preventing  him from growing.

I found it so very difficult to make decisions when I was in fear or feeling obligation or guilt.  I knew deep in my heart that he was behaving poorly (pre diagnosis) and that we needed to take control and kick him out. I just couldn't find the courage to do it.

Our BPDs, of course, downward spiralled and we started to pay his rent and living expenses.  We were trying to give him yet another (undeserved as we saw it) opportunity to make a life for himself.  We simply ran out of money - all our savings went and we couldn't afford to maintain his lifestyle in California.  Sounds crazy now as I write this.

We got him to return home.  I tried to keep things very very simple.

1.  Everything my adult BPDs26 should do for himself, he should actually do himself.  This was such a relief to us when we finally realised this.  All decisions about his life were his to make, regardless if we agreed with them or not.  For him to behave like an adult, he had to be treated as an adult.

2.  I read about BPD, I learnt about his limitations and this helped me understand why he behaved like he did.  I got active in this forum and it's been our life saver.
Knowledge is power.

3.  I practised validation skills, a LOT until I sounded natural. I got it wrong many times but just kept trying hard.

There's a lot of other things we've done but I'm trying to keep things simple for you as possible.  Baby steps.  There is hope.  My BPDs is now working and paying us rent; he's inching forward and finding a way to live his life.

I discovered I was either too Soft or too hard when dealing with my adult BPD son.  He does not respond well to "too hard" and I ended up doing a merry old dance around him, providing him with everything he needed to "help".  He's good at manipulating me too.

I felt I had to try the one thing I'd never tried and that was to have a relationship despite the problems.  I had to change our situation.  It may not have to be a black and white choice of never seeing them again.

I'm learning to be assertive but caring.  im in new territory here!

I'm learning to be the parent he needs, not the one I thought I should be. I learnt that I was part of the problem as I tried to fix him.  I can't change his behaviour but I can change my own.

I stopped giving my adult son money. I know that stomach flipping you describe!  He then had to find work that he was capable of.  

I'm not saying this has been easy. We've got stronger as we've gone on.

This journey starts with you.  It sounds as if you've got a strong support network available to you in your husband and family.  We are all here to support you if you want us. Maybe you decide in professional help too.

I really look forward to reading your posts.

he's currently not employed he's a pot grower of course,

 I think part of the problem is that my son is running out of money

Is not hireable

 he is so mentally fragile

[Confused1234]

Wow thank you  for taking the time to write I can't tell you how much I appreciate it, I can't believe my life has gotten this complicated with a 34-year-old I will keep at this form I will keep educating myself,  Learning about BPD is new to me I'm trying to take in as much as I can, many thanks

[Lollypop]

Hi confused

It can be overwhelming at first.  Baby steps.  You're doing exactly the right thing by reading and learning g about BPD, validation, boundaries and limits.

Take care of yourself, you must feel frazzled.

L

[Lollypop]

Hi there confused

I hope you don't mind but I've replied on the forum.

I'm so very sorry that you're having to deal with all of this. I can see you're very worried about your son and his future. 

I'm very concerned that you feel unsafe and you've hinted that that your son may become violent towards you if he's unstable?  Do you feel that he may react very badly if you refuse to give him money?

Have you spoken to anybody about this?  I know you threatened a restraining order but have you done this?

I look to others on the forum for advice as this is beyond my experience.

Here's my reply as a wider issue:

You ask a question that everyone of us constantly asks ourselves. I've often felt I'd come to the end of my road and that I couldn't take any more. How tough Should I be?

We are all different, our BPD's are different and all our situations are very different. I can say though that I've often felt my only way out of my own pain (in dealing with my BPDs) was to kick him out and have no contact.  It's a perfectly normal reaction and sometimes a very necessary one for our own self preservation or safety.

I encourage you to keep on reading about BPD and posting on the forum.  It takes a while but little by little it starts to sink in.  You will begin to understand that you can't change your son - the only thing you can change is your reaction to him. 

Only you can decide if you want or can have a relationship with him. Your reading about BPD will help you understand a better way of speaking to him on a day to day basis.  It will also help you to set and keep your important boundaries and limits. These may include contact with him on your own terms.

My BPDs is an adult. He has his own problems.  The only way he can learn how to solve these problems is by attempting to do this himself, in his own way.  He sometimes fails or makes mistakes.  He then learns to try another approach.  For some things, like his drug addiction to weed or not seeking treatment, he chooses to ignore for the moment.

It sounds as if your son is a very creative thinker and has the experience to get himself out of scrapes and difficult situations. He's functioning but not in the conventional way.

It's wonderful to hear that you've got support from your daughter and son-in-law. Also, that you're in touch with your ex-husband and you're not allowing your BPDs to play you against each other.

Take care of yourself. Keep on reading and learning. You will find your confidence will grow and you are better able to decide how you want to live your life, with or without your BPDs.  Keep on posting

I hope I've helped you

L

[drained1996]

Hi Confused1234,

Just wanted to say we understand how stressful it is in situations such as you are facing.  We hope you have found the support and information that has been shared thus to be helpful!  We would love to hear how you are doing and are here for questions, thoughts, or concerns you may have anytime!