Stopping the narrative that's on repeat

[Depression = 72% of members]

Here are the cycles that I keep going through:

I see the ex and I think:

 |--->he's a jerk. Contact is painful, best to not be in contact.

But my thinking changes, and in the future I'm afraid I will think like this:

 |--->He opened himself up to me and told me about all his problems, I am the one that he truly cares about. Because he opened up to me I am the only one who can help him, and yet I have abandoned him.  His getting better depends on me and my actions, and making things right. How could I been so cruel to someone who is so hurt?

I wish I thought like this:
 |--->He is an addict. I'm his drug. I bear no responsibility in his addiction, or delivering him from it. His recovery does not depend on my actions. I must look after my own well being.


Here's a summary of the cycle I go through with the ex:

Contact with BPDex induces engulfment, then I feel relief from engulfment when I see BPDex hasn't changed behaviours, and is still with replacement, he then gives me a little crumb which feed my ego that I'm the one he wishes he could be with, then I feel rejected when BPDex does something insulting or hurtful (like rubbing it in about replacement, or telling me to move on, or trying to sleep with me), I go no contact and I'm happy for a while. THEN, I start to think NC was too harsh. That I rejected BPDex. That I'm too sensitive and that I always react by shutting out BPDex. I feel sorry for him in his little misery. I feel sorry that I pushed away a sick person like him and didn't help him more. That I am selfish, and uncaring. I should show more strenght, more love. I should be able to be more resilient to his hurtful actions because they are not personal, they are only cries for help. I start to think about his childhood and the things he told me, I imagine the abuse he went through, and I feel sorry for him and view him as a little child who is afraid and who simply needs unconditional love and only I can give him that.

Usually, around this time BPDex starts manifesting on social media - requests to connect, likes, etc. Posts that mirror my interests - I mull it over and I think: he needs me, he wants me to help him get better. He wants to be with me. And I feel bad, and guilty, and blame myself for abandoning him, for cutting him off, bla bla bla. And so contact happens again. See above.

How can I change this? It's a cycle that repeats over and over. No contact works at first... .but then I regret it. His story of "poor me" re-enters my narrative and I feel sorry for him and guilty.

[caughtnreleased]

Here are the cycles that I keep going through:

I see the ex and I think:

 |--->he's a jerk. Contact is painful, best to not be in contact.

But my thinking changes, and in the future I'm afraid I will think like this:

 |--->He opened himself up to me and told me about all his problems, I am the one that he truly cares about. Because he opened up to me I am the only one who can help him, and yet I have abandoned him.  His getting better depends on me and my actions, and making things right. How could I been so cruel to someone who is so hurt?

I wish I thought like this:
 |--->He is an addict. I'm his drug. I bear no responsibility in his addiction, or delivering him from it. His recovery does not depend on my actions. I must look after my own well being.


Here's a summary of the cycle I go through with the ex:

Contact with BPDex induces engulfment, then I feel relief from engulfment when I see BPDex hasn't changed behaviours, and is still with replacement, he then gives me a little crumb which feed my ego that I'm the one he wishes he could be with, then I feel rejected when BPDex does something insulting or hurtful (like rubbing it in about replacement, or telling me to move on, or trying to sleep with me), I go no contact and I'm happy for a while. THEN, I start to think NC was too harsh. That I rejected BPDex. That I'm too sensitive and that I always react by shutting out BPDex. I feel sorry for him in his little misery. I feel sorry that I pushed away a sick person like him and didn't help him more. That I am selfish, and uncaring. I should show more strenght, more love. I should be able to be more resilient to his hurtful actions because they are not personal, they are only cries for help. I start to think about his childhood and the things he told me, I imagine the abuse he went through, and I feel sorry for him and view him as a little child who is afraid and who simply needs unconditional love and only I can give him that.

Usually, around this time BPDex starts manifesting on social media - requests to connect, likes, etc. Posts that mirror my interests - I mull it over and I think: he needs me, he wants me to help him get better. He wants to be with me. And I feel bad, and guilty, and blame myself for abandoning him, for cutting him off, bla bla bla. And so contact happens again. See above.

How can I change this? It's a cycle that repeats over and over. No contact works at first... .but then I regret it. His story of "poor me" re-enters my narrative and I feel sorry for him and guilty.

[heartandwhole]

Hi caugntnreleased,

I can very much relate to what you've written, and I hear how difficult it is to stop the cycle. It was for me, too. I kept thinking that if I just reacted better, more perfectly, then he wouldn't suffer as much (pwBPD also came from a background of abuse), but I forgot something really important—that I was suffering, too. And I although tried, at least superficially, to take care of myself (he made attempts, too), my needs, wants, and desires were being severely neglected.

I found that once my beliefs around the relationship "died," so to speak, I was able to detach and stop the cycle of Fear, Obligation, and Guilt .

I start to think about his childhood and the things he told me, I imagine the abuse he went through, and I feel sorry for him and view him as a little child who is afraid and who simply needs unconditional love and only I can give him that.

I would ask yourself if that is true.  :)oes it come from experience loving yourself unconditionally?  

Usually, around this time BPDex starts manifesting on social media - requests to connect, likes, etc. Posts that mirror my interests - I mull it over and I think: he needs me, he wants me to help him get better. He wants to be with me. And I feel bad, and guilty, and blame myself for abandoning him, for cutting him off, bla bla bla. And so contact happens again. See above.

Again, I would question this. Aren't these beliefs that keep you attached to the cycle? What if you didn't believe that anymore?

How can I change this? It's a cycle that repeats over and over. No contact works at first... .but then I regret it. His story of "poor me" re-enters my narrative and I feel sorry for him and guilty.

What would it be like to feel that regret and not act on it?

This cycle can be stopped, caught. I know how difficult it can be. Have you thought about taking a break from social media, to give yourself time to focus on yourself?  

heartandwhole

[caughtnreleased]

Hi Heartandwhole,

Thank you for your messages. My ex and I broke up three years ago, and I have tried many many things, including a long break from social media. I would only check in on his page every 4-5 months. At first when I did that I would be devastated because it would appear that it was working out with the replacement - something I was sure was impossible. Then it didn't work out and I felt validated. We recycled. Things ended because he was the same as before. I was sure I was over it when it ended that time. And then... .slowly slowly all those thoughts (see above) slowly came back to me.

I agree that these are beliefs (I know they are false) that enter my mind. But my mind is working hard to forget all the evidence that would demonstrate the falsity of these beliefs. My mind has somehow been molded to seek approval from him and "heal" him... .NO MATTER WHAT HE DOES! I have tried meditation, some therapy, etc. I realize that my suffering is my own doing - but it's almost this innate subconscious thing that my brain does to me... .it goes back to it's position of comfort which is to seek him out, forget that he's a sex (and other things) addict, and think "If only I feel his pain more, I will be good enough for him, one day... .one day... ."

I am fully aware that it is screwed up but it's like when your knee gets hit by a hammer, your leg shoots out. I wonder if CBT would be helpful under these circumstances. Are there exercises that someone can recommend? I am open to anything at this point because I've come to understand that my brain is currently working against me. I know where it all comes from. As a child I was ostracized by my mother, she ganged up on me with my sister because she saw me as her rival. My role in the family was to fight the irrational emotional rages of my mother, and be my fathers "protector" against my mothers rages and took it all on the nose.  I was also my father's "emotional" partner in the family, except he never stood up for me. I was the "fixer", the "other woman" and the "outcast" all at once.

Cue - wanting to relive it all with the "perfect match" BPDex.

[Grey Kitty]

CnR, you sound like you are really mad at yourself for opening up and trying again, and getting hurt again.

And you "know better". As in you've done this enough times that you are pretty much certain what the painful outcome will be.

But you still do it.

How about turning the question on its ear. STOP asking yourself "how can I be so stupid?" and beating yourself up.

Instead, ask yourself--what is it that makes this appealing or compelling to me? What yearning calls you?

There has to be something. And you may feel ashamed of yourself when you realize it or admit it. Still, I bet there is something there--something good that you want and chase after.  Got any ideas what it is?

[caughtnreleased]

Yes, I am quite angry with myself - mostly for pining after him, and then for being hurt. I feel like a fool. He told me on the third date who he was, and I spent the next three years hoping that he would do the work to get better. It made me think of the Carl Jung quote: The meeting of two personalities is like the contact of two chemical substances: if there is any reaction, both are transformed. The reaction was enormous for me. And I was transformed... .hugely so. It was painful but it transformed me. I wanted so badly for it to transform him... .apparently it hasn't.

What he held for me was my yearning to be "special" for someone. He was very special for me, so I desperately wanted to be the same for him, and when we were together he would give me special treatment, before the discard of course. He kept it going too - he fed it, all this time, and I ate it up because... .because I wanted so badly to be special. I felt understood by him. I wanted him to feel the same with me. I desperately wanted him to not be messed up. To recover. To be capable of love. That's why I orbited... .I didn't want to give up. I thought he could recover. I thought he wanted to recover. I couldn't accept that I wasn't special... .But I think I may have understood this time, and yes I feel dumb. It's one thing to "know" that a person is sick and treats others like objects, it is another to finally "understand" it. I think I may have finally understood.

[heartandwhole]

I am fully aware that it is screwed up but it's like when your knee gets hit by a hammer, your leg shoots out.

Yep. I totally get that. That's why I think if you can interrupt that process by either questioning your thoughts, or just feeling and breathing for at least 10 minutes before acting on any of them, or both, would help.

I wonder if CBT would be helpful under these circumstances. Are there exercises that someone can recommend?

I do think CBT would be helpful, because it deals with changing patterns of thinking and behavior. Have you checked out MoodGym? It's an online CBT program.

I am open to anything at this point because I've come to understand that my brain is currently working against me.

I hear you. I wonder, though, isn't your brain just doing what it does? I think it's the believing of the thoughts that are causing the problems. If I swore up and down to you right now that you were wearing a purple and green-striped shirt, would that thought hurt you or cause you problems? Of course not, because you wouldn't believe it. 

My role in the family was to fight the irrational emotional rages of my mother, and be my fathers "protector" against my mothers rages and took it all on the nose.  I was also my father's "emotional" partner in the family, except he never stood up for me. I was the "fixer", the "other woman" and the "outcast" all at once.

That must have been so hard for you, caught.    I'm sorry that you were put into those really inappropriate roles.

You are very self-aware and don't forget what you describe about the cycle in your original post is the human condition to some extent. You are definitely not alone—we all battle with beliefs and behaviors that don't serve us. But I understand what you mean: sometimes we can feel quite stuck. I feel that way too, sometimes.

It takes effort to break the patterns, but it can be done. You'll get there, I'm convinced. You need to find the tool that fits really well with you and your style of working on yourself. Keep experimenting and trying things. Have you checked out the new Self Awareness board? There are tons of tests there that might help steer you in a good direction.

heartandwhole  

[caughtnreleased]

Thanks Heartandwhole,

I really appreciate your message.  I will definitely check out that website you recommend.  The only impulsive things I have done in the context of my BPDex is to react in anger and throw everything out the window (well - throw him out the window). This is what I always end up regretting... .that I acted out of anger or fear. I wish I could act out of "understanding" - understanding that he cannot give me what I want, rather than "react" emotionally - which I find I do always regret.
 

I think it's the believing of the thoughts that are causing the problems.

I'm trying to narrow down on the thoughts that I am believing. Do you mean to say that when my mind starts saying - "but you can help him", "but it was so special between you", "if only you do x,y,z it will work out" "you are better than the replacement, if you do x,y,z he'll figure it out" - I should turn around and tell my mind it's full of bs and I don't believe it? Mostly I have not acted on these thoughts- just felt tortured by them to the point where I need to contact him again because they're on repeat and contact helps to reset them... .(he never disappoints). It's just that with distance the thoughts start again. I want the torture to stop (yes I do it to myself - and he feeds it). I would like for those thoughts to simply not happen... .for me to focus my thoughts and energy on more productive and rewarding relationships and projects. Thanks again for the advice.

[heartandwhole]

I'm trying to narrow down on the thoughts that I am believing. Do you mean to say that when my mind starts saying - "but you can help him", "but it was so special between you", "if only you do x,y,z it will work out" "you are better than the replacement, if you do x,y,z he'll figure it out" - I should turn around and tell my mind it's full of bs and I don't believe it?

I would like for those thoughts to simply not happen... .

If only we could control our thoughts!  In my experience, I can't control what thoughts float into my awareness... .I'm not even sure if I can control what I believe—I do or I don't. That's been my experience. I think there is an attachment that happens to our thoughts (we believe them) that can keep us stuck. With awareness and patience, I think we can observe when we attach and when we don't and explore that for our freedom.

For example, you could question the thought that "I can help him." Are you sure that you can? Only you? No one else on this Earth can help him? Do you know what is good for him more than he does? How true does that feel when you zoom out to include the whole world, the purpose of his life journey, the purpose of your life journey?

When these thoughts appear, you feel something. Then, you may or may not act on the feeling. What are the feelings trying to tell you? Maybe something like, "I want to help him," or "I want to be special to him, to someone," etc... .In my view, that's where you want to dig in.  You might find other thoughts buried in there, like, "I am not worthy/special," or "I can't help myself."

Don't let me put words into your mouth, but it's an investigation that can bring a lot of insight. Have you checked out the Work of Byron Katie? I have found questioning my thoughts helpful. It's not for everyone, but you might want to have a look, in the spirit of exploring what will help you stop this cycle. 

I had similar thoughts to yours, caught. There was a moment in my relationship where I just stopped believing them. Not sure how that happened, as I wasn't consciously questioning them. Maybe it was some kind of self-protection? Divine intervention?  I think something just clicked and I realized that pwBPD's emotions were his reality, in the moment, but that his other romantic relationships (past and current) were also felt as "the closest, the most special, the best (choose your superlative)." Suddenly I just didn't believe his words anymore. That set me free. 

heartandwhole

[caughtnreleased]

Thanks for the precision on the thoughts. Yes it's hard to not believe them. I have been practicing catching myself trying to seek an underlying meaning in the actions of BPDex, and mostly "believing" that he and replacement have what I want (ie: an intimate and loving relationship) - which I recently discovered couldn't be further than the truth - still, my mind does want to go back to that. I think it stems from my mother having chosen my sister as the golden child and cast me out. I've realized that "thinking" that way is self inflicted suffering - and I've decided that maybe I do that a lot.  I've recently listened to some podcasts that mention the "second arrow". Sometimes you cannot stop the first arrow (the pain that someone else causes you), but you can definitely stop the second arrow (the pain that you cause to yourself after receiving the first arrow, that is blame, shame, guilt, etc.).  I certainly do a lot of blaming. Guilt is a big one. I often tell myself that I am not enough... .was not enough... .I realize that these are the thoughts that are causing damage to myself and that I need to change.

I think something just clicked and I realized that pwBPD's emotions were his reality, in the moment, but that his other romantic relationships (past and current) were also felt as "the closest, the most special, the best (choose your superlative)." Suddenly I just didn't believe his words anymore. That set me free. 

heartandwhole

Yes, I wonder - I think this last time something did click for me.  In wanting to cheat on his replacement with me he tried to convince me by telling me of our own "closest connection" which was why he was soliciting me for sex. I think that's when I realized that "connection" for him was vastly different to "connection" for me. He told me I was a temptress. All these actions screamed zero responsibility, extreme anger and aggression - by sleeping with me he could insult me (I'd be the discarded "other woman" and replacement (whom he would be betraying). In this moment I realized that nothing he did could be taken personally.

Strangely, while I have felt anger towards myself for being foolish and maintaining hope that this man might get better, I have not really felt anger towards him.

On another note, this entire experience makes me realize that I know many many many men who have a great deal of anger, and they take it out on women... .BPDex is particularly bad, but there are so many others who have similar issues - this is a wider problem that I have encountered in the dating world and frankly I am at a loss as to what can be done... .Of course, I think that there are fewer who have it as deep and destructive as BPDex, nevertheless, this is a recurring theme that I have experienced with men and I'm not really sure what can be done.

[Borderlinestar]

Thank you for sharing this. I still have intense feelings about separating from my family of origin.  For me, i realize i have to develop the parts that did not get what i needed when i was traumatized.  So my brain and emotions shift. It is all about me growing now not relapsing.  I am recovering. I am not sure what form or shape this will take in gaining my true identity. I need a stonger value system.  My mother has no access to me now. I do not know if i will reconnect with her.  The overwhelming anxiety is intense at times, but i think it has to do with me forming into an adult and i have not allowed myself at some level to completely separate from abandoning her.  At times i am so free. Today out jogging in the beautiful southwest. Then the intense growth attack. I use the DBT, etc. These emotions have to process out.

[Grey Kitty]

I have been practicing catching myself trying to seek an underlying meaning in the actions of BPDex, and mostly "believing" that he and replacement have what I want (ie: an intimate and loving relationship) - which I recently discovered couldn't be further than the truth - still, my mind does want to go back to that. I think it stems from my mother having chosen my sister as the golden child and cast me out.

How deeply have you considered what you "missed out on" when your sister was the golden child?

Please understand--I am NOT trying to in any way diminish the pain and hurt and unfairness of what you received instead. (Guessing you were more of the skapegoat)

I know people who were the "golden child" growing up. Yeah, I guess it is "better", but it still isn't the right way to raise a child either. It leaves a different sort of damage. I know people who are recovering from that.

Just like things are with your ex--you find yourself believing that somebody else has what you wanted... .even though the reality of what they have doesn't really match what you truly desire.

[caughtnreleased]

How deeply have you considered what you "missed out on" when your sister was the golden child?

I have recently been thinking about this a lot actually. My mother recently left her cell phone in my possession - and I decided I would put my mind to rest. I went through all her text messages to my sister (I know... .not the best thing... .but hey, it's the least I could do to put my mind to rest), and knowing this is their primary mode of communicating, it confirmed that there was no greater kindness, or care, or whatever.  I have understood that my mother only had crumbs to give, I got some, my sister got some. She had a lot of poison though and there I may have gotten a bit more.  As a result, the main difference between my sister and I is that my sister cannot be alone and has gone from one relationship to another and is now in an unhappy marriage. I on the other hand have not been in a relationship for years.

Just like things are with your ex--you find yourself believing that somebody else has what you wanted... .even though the reality of what they have doesn't really match what you truly desire.

I sometimes wonder if what I truly desire is really unobtainable though. It feels as though healthy relationships are the minority not the norm, and unhappy (not to mention unhealthy) relationships are everywhere.

[Grey Kitty]

If what you want is a healthy, fulfilling relationship with somebody who values you, yes, it is possible.

Just not with somebody disordered like your ex or your mother.

As you get healthier, you will attract healthier people. It does get better.

[heartandwhole]

In this moment I realized that nothing he did could be taken personally.

Bingo    You say it better than I did, caught. It's like nothing "stuck" anymore, I had become velcro. I think this is a good thing, although I know it can be confusing for the ego, because it then means we may not be as "special" as we thought. There is a ton of freedom in that, though, in my experience.

heart

[caughtnreleased]

If what you want is a healthy, fulfilling relationship with somebody who values you, yes, it is possible.

Just not with somebody disordered like your ex or your mother.

I think I need to burn this into my brain. Yes I want a healthy, fulfilling relationship with someone who values me... .I guess I have to stop grasping after being valued by people who cannot value others.

[Grey Kitty]

I think I need to burn this into my brain. Yes I want a healthy, fulfilling relationship with someone who values me... .I guess I have to stop grasping after being valued by people who cannot value others.

  Honor those desires, and be gentle with yourself regarding how much time and effort it will take.

Your mother started this--she trained you from the beginning to chase after what she would never and could never give you. Old patterns, habits, and coping mechanisms like that don't shift quickly or easily.

[woundedPhoenix]

I think I need to burn this into my brain. Yes I want a healthy, fulfilling relationship with someone who values me... .I guess I have to stop grasping after being valued by people who cannot value others.

For me things fell into place when i realised that in the end most of what drove my behaviour was directed in some way to get my ex to value me again. Most of the time it wasn't even conscious, but deep down i was mostly 'locked in' by my unconscious tendencies to gain 'control' how she felt about me. It seemed the only way to feel good about myself again.

Even my rescuer complex was based on the belief that if you can save someone they will forever be gratefull. And as a consequence they will feel good about you and never leave. Now i know that is just a fantasy and not how healthy relationships work.

That value must come from within first, as long as you don't really know how to value yourself, you keep yourself trapped in this co-dependant dynamic.

[Lucky Jim]

That value must come from within first, as long as you don't really know how to value yourself, you keep yourself trapped in this co-dependant dynamic.

Hey CnR, I agree with WP, above.  If your self-worth comes from within, there is no need to look to others, such as your Ex or your mother, for your value.  If you get to that point, you may find that their emotional "hold" over you will dissipate.  It all starts with loving and accepting oneself, in my view.  It sounds easy, but is actually pretty hard.  Yet a lot of benefits flow from this simple premise.

LuckyJim

[Grey Kitty]

That bit about not valuing yourself actually is more insidious--If you don't value yourself, then what happens when somebody else acts like they do value you?

Chances are you don't believe them, and blow things up because you can't trust this person who is obviously deceiving you.

So you find people who don't value you to be more "comfortable" in the sense that it fits what you are used to and your prior experiences and your internal message. You are kinda drawn towards people who treat you badly instead of people who do value you.

Yes, you can overcome this--change is uncomfortable, but things will feel better as you get used to it.

Don't be surprised that you are doubting, wondering, and feeling weird--growth feels like that. Kinda like sore muscles as you train to get physically stronger.

[Lucky Jim]

So you find people who don't value you to be more "comfortable" in the sense that it fits what you are used to and your prior experiences and your internal message. You are kinda drawn towards people who treat you badly instead of people who do value you.[/quote]

Agree w/that, GK!  To state the converse, if you can love and accept yourself just as you are, you will care too much about yourself to ever allow yourself to be the object of someone else's abuse or other belittling treatment.  Took me a long time to grasp this concept, which sounds easy but is actually pretty hard because it requires a change in one's internal view of oneself.

LJ

[caughtnreleased]

That bit about not valuing yourself actually is more insidious--If you don't value yourself, then what happens when somebody else acts like they do value you?

Chances are you don't believe them, and blow things up because you can't trust this person who is obviously deceiving you.

So you find people who don't value you to be more "comfortable" in the sense that it fits what you are used to and your prior experiences and your internal message. You are kinda drawn towards people who treat you badly instead of people who do value you.

Wow this is so bang on. There's a man who seems to value me - he invited me to go to the theatre a while back. I thought  "Woa... .the Theatre? This is SO serious, it's too much." The tickets were worth 80$ or something and I thought "I'm going to owe him... .no this will be too uncomfortable"... .so I turned him down. I got back in touch with him recently and again he is really generous, inviting me for dinner, being very attentive.

Somehow... .I can't return the attention. I feel overwhelmed. I don't deserve it so therefore it must not be genuine.

[caughtnreleased]

Don't be surprised that you are doubting, wondering, and feeling weird--growth feels like that. Kinda like sore muscles as you train to get physically stronger.

I have been feeling strange lately, things feel "uncomfortable" - I thought it might be a light depression or something... .it's like every activity that I want to do there's a little whiny voice at the back of my head that says "I don'T FEEEL like it, I don't want to. Let's just lie in bed and sleep, eat."  This is for activities that I WANT to do: work, exercise, socializing, music. I'm fighting that voice but it feels like I'm walking around with a little child attached to me who is kicking and screaming and doesn't want to go. Everything takes so much effort. Although with work I have a newfound inspiration and when I finally manage to leave that naggy whiney voice behind I get really immersed and excited. It's been my escape from this feeling of discomfort. For the first time in years I am working 8-10 hours per day on something I am thoroughly enjoying. Still I'm feeling out of sorts, "comfort" is lacking. Funny, the BPDex has been sending random texts where it seems he's having an argument with me (except I'm not responding so he's arguing with himself). The latest told me that I was very strange - more so than him. 

[caughtnreleased]

This then brings me to another question - why is it that when kindness/generosity is sincere we reject, but when it's "love bombing" we fall for it.

Anytime anyone was ever generous, or kind or whatnot, I was made to feel undeserving of it by my mother. If I ever reported on someone complimenting me for a skill I had she would respond with the fact that the person was being overly nice to me and I was undeserving of a) the compliment and b)the kindness. I once worked for someone who was relatively famous, and my mother would ask "do they actually like you?"... ."how nice of them to keep you employed", etc... .So insidious to make me think I was unworthy and I internalized it on so many levels.

How do we accept that we are worthy when we have been brainwashed to think we are not?

[Grey Kitty]

Keep trying doing different things than you've been doing before, push through the uncomfortable/unfamiliar feelings and see what you find on the other side. You spent years being taught that you weren't worthy of anything good. Learning something different will take time and practice. 

You might try taking this nice and generous guy up on dinner... .but do keep your eyes open to how he treats you. Try to listen to your gut feelings about him, especially as you have more experiences with him; they could change. (It sounds like he wants to date you... .are you interested in him? And are you ready to date? Still, you can let him take you out on one date and then decline more. Happens all the time!)

This then brings me to another question - why is it that when kindness/generosity is sincere we reject, but when it's "love bombing" we fall for it.

Dunno why, but I can throw a bit of perspective onto it:

Love bombing is being painted white and having praise thrown at you.
It feels a LOT better than being painted black and having abuse thrown at you.

They share one thing in common, though: You are on the receiving end of a bunch of stuff that isn't who you really are. The painted white woman on the pedestal isn't you, and doesn't exist; she's a projected construct of the guy doing the love bombing. Just like the painted black woman isn't you and doesn't exist. She's another projected construct of somebody else.

Kindness/generosity/praise from somebody who sees you as a real person is a different animal entirely. Somebody who barely knows you can be kind too, but the more they know you, the more it means.

Start by trying to see the difference in how people have treated you in the past... .then think about why you picked the ones you did.

[caughtnreleased]

You might try taking this nice and generous guy up on dinner... .but do keep your eyes open to how he treats you. Try to listen to your gut feelings about him, especially as you have more experiences with him; they could change. (It sounds like he wants to date you... .are you interested in him? And are you ready to date? Still, you can let him take you out on one date and then decline more. Happens all the time!)

I did spend an afternoon with him. It was nice. Still I felt like he comes on too strong. I stopped answering his messages because I didn't feel interested and he was sending many, some long, and always expressing interest to spend time with me. I'm not sure he appreciated being ignored since I later got back in touch... .and the tone had changed somewhat. Messages were significantly less interested, and much shorter.

Start by trying to see the difference in how people have treated you in the past... .then think about why you picked the ones you did.

I recently did this exercise - I was baffled because I never felt as though I had been love bombed, because I don't take well to compliments. I always find them insincere especially from people who don't know me well. I realized that the love bombing that my BPDex did was to turn me into "his" mother theresa. He confessed his entire ugly past to me. I was going to save him. I was going to be his therapist. When I read about BPD, and realized what was going on I told him to go to therapy and broke it off (also his confessions of the past were pretty scary and there was no "but that is all behind me, I don't do it anymore" part to it - in fact he was still highly promiscuous and using drugs). When it ended, I obviously stopped being Mother Theresa - but I then realized how intoxicated I was with him - it was too late, I was hooked.  I guess I have a bit of a mother theresa complex.

Another ex... .we can call him NPDex, did love bomb me. I kept rejecting him and he would keep love bombing me. He would write poems, draw portraits of me, yaddi yaddi. Even when I was seeing someone else, it didn't dissuade him. I finally figured that a man who could take a few rejections must have something going for him so I went for it. Why? Because it was easy. All I had to do is say yes. At the time there were other men who were interested, but they seemed more shy, less forward. It would have required more work, that I put myself out there, reciprocate interest, take initiative, risk something. I couldn't do it so instead I picked up the narcissist. It took no effort. He pursued, and escalated the relationship to something that appeared serious, but in the end he was just using me. That relationship probably wrecked me more than any other, really. I came out a depressed burnt out mess and it set me up for BPDex.

This is an interesting exercise though because it gets to the heart of some of our weakness.

They share one thing in common, though: You are on the receiving end of a bunch of stuff that isn't who you really are. The painted white woman on the pedestal isn't you, and doesn't exist; she's a projected construct of the guy doing the love bombing. Just like the painted black woman isn't you and doesn't exist. She's another projected construct of somebody else.

This is a really useful way of putting it. Thanks Grey Kitty for the advice, it's really very helpful. This work is incredibly hard... .sometimes I feel trapped in a "dis"comfort zone. Like the place I've come from (abuse) no longer feels right or comfortable, except the place I'm going to doesn't either... .it's a challenge. I feel like I'm some free floating electron who doesn't feel like I fit anywhere ... .and wonder if I ever will.

[heartandwhole]

I feel like I'm some free floating electron who doesn't feel like I fit anywhere ... .and wonder if I ever will.

I totally get that, caught, and sometimes feel that way, too. It can feel very uncomfortable. I feel it can be viewed in a positive light, too, however. This is that in-between state where all potential lies; that place where change and transformation happens—not quite free of the past, not quite stepping into the future. As long as it doesn't go on too protractedly, I think this can be a really good place to be.

It's okay to not have all the answers just yet. It's okay to feel wobbly. Perhaps there is a lot of processing going on even out of your awareness? Perhaps the universe is preparing you for something better than you have imagined? The "don't know" place can be very powerful, because we relax effort and allow energy to flow as it needs to.

You are doing great work here. I can feel how open you are to possibilities. That takes courage and self-compassion. 

heartandwhole