Did you talk about it first? How? Why?

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

This is a question posted to those who were the ones who decided to divorce.  I know some were discarded or otherwise violated, so that it was an obvious or unavoidable conclusion to divorce, so this does not apply.  This is for those who more or less had to make the decision without compulsion, and do it.

For me now my marriage of 19 years feels much like a business, mostly operating for child care of 5 kids.  Love left or died long ago.  My wife still professes to love me, need me, and want me.  Meanwhile, she'll push all she can to guilt, manipulate, distort me.  She's often a quietly passive aggressive person.  I may have the power to continue and maintain my own happiness and sanity, but, maybe not.  I'm still married after all these years of dismay mostly because I'm afraid of making this decision, and hesitant to hurt her feelings.  I have been putting off this decision for too long now.  I kept hope alive by getting myself much better, and it has worked to a point.

I feel like the respectful thing to do is to talk about the future, consider possibilities and solutions, and to discuss divorce.  At the least, I want to feel like we're business partners - and you wouldn't make a huge decision without consultation of the key members.  I suspect the possibilities of a ration discussion is just a fantasy on my part.  I also think that I would feel absolutely horrid if I blind-sided her with unilateral action on divorce - whether that's telling her that I'm done with marriage and want a divorce, or move forward on my own and filed for divorce, and really hit her with it.    I'm not sure what talking about divorce with my uBPD wife would accomplish.  I suspect that if she could have changed for the better, she would have.  I don't understand why I feel I should talk about divorce with her, if I thought it wouldn't do some good.  Partly I don't want to just blow this up on her.

On the other hand, I know that sometimes, business is sudden and unilateral.  Markets change, takeovers happen, new management changes things.  So, although it might be a betrayal to my wife, who is operating under status quo, a new CEO is running my life (that's the healthy me) and maybe things have to shake up - regardless of the business partner.

I wonder if she thinks I'm doing ok with marriage, and things are just hard right now.  I wonder if she really is in denial and expects marriage to continue.  She is of the waif / hermit variety of BPD, and perhaps the concept of divorce is so unthinkably horrible that she therefore thinks it's impossible.  I'm not sure.  A casual observer might suggest to talk about divorce with her and see what she's been thinking - since any reasonable person in her circumstance would know that divorce is a very real possibility.  (I moved to a bed in the basement almost two years ago).  I do not know if there is anything that talking to her would do to salvage or repair the marriage either.  My choices are divorce or continue to do triage, meditation, coping, and finding inner happiness in spite of the marriage.  There's nothing that I can count on her doing that would save it.  So, it's up to me to stay married or not.

I accept that no one really knows what will happen.  I want to feel good with what I do, since I've got to live with it.

Has anyone gone through this?  Are there lessons learned from doing it one way or another?

[SamwizeGamgee]

This is a question posted to those who were the ones who decided to divorce.  I know some were discarded or otherwise violated, so that it was an obvious or unavoidable conclusion to divorce, so this does not apply.  This is for those who more or less had to make the decision without compulsion, and do it.

For me now my marriage of 19 years feels much like a business, mostly operating for child care of 5 kids.  Love left or died long ago.  My wife still professes to love me, need me, and want me.  Meanwhile, she'll push all she can to guilt, manipulate, distort me.  She's often a quietly passive aggressive person.  I may have the power to continue and maintain my own happiness and sanity, but, maybe not.  I'm still married after all these years of dismay mostly because I'm afraid of making this decision, and hesitant to hurt her feelings.  I have been putting off this decision for too long now.  I kept hope alive by getting myself much better, and it has worked to a point.

I feel like the respectful thing to do is to talk about the future, consider possibilities and solutions, and to discuss divorce.  At the least, I want to feel like we're business partners - and you wouldn't make a huge decision without consultation of the key members.  I suspect the possibilities of a ration discussion is just a fantasy on my part.  I also think that I would feel absolutely horrid if I blind-sided her with unilateral action on divorce - whether that's telling her that I'm done with marriage and want a divorce, or move forward on my own and filed for divorce, and really hit her with it.    I'm not sure what talking about divorce with my uBPD wife would accomplish.  I suspect that if she could have changed for the better, she would have.  I don't understand why I feel I should talk about divorce with her, if I thought it wouldn't do some good.  Partly I don't want to just blow this up on her.

On the other hand, I know that sometimes, business is sudden and unilateral.  Markets change, takeovers happen, new management changes things.  So, although it might be a betrayal to my wife, who is operating under status quo, a new CEO is running my life (that's the healthy me) and maybe things have to shake up - regardless of the business partner.

I wonder if she thinks I'm doing ok with marriage, and things are just hard right now.  I wonder if she really is in denial and expects marriage to continue.  She is of the waif / hermit variety of BPD, and perhaps the concept of divorce is so unthinkably horrible that she therefore thinks it's impossible.  I'm not sure.  A casual observer might suggest to talk about divorce with her and see what she's been thinking - since any reasonable person in her circumstance would know that divorce is a very real possibility.  (I moved to a bed in the basement almost two years ago).  I do not know if there is anything that talking to her would do to salvage or repair the marriage either.  My choices are divorce or continue to do triage, meditation, coping, and finding inner happiness in spite of the marriage.  There's nothing that I can count on her doing that would save it.  So, it's up to me to stay married or not.

I accept that no one really knows what will happen.  I want to feel good with what I do, since I've got to live with it.

Has anyone gone through this?  Are there lessons learned from doing it one way or another?

[livednlearned]

Hi Samgee,

It says a lot about you to be so considerate. You don't want to hurt her, and that's admirable.

I understand that this is a process and you are working toward the decision in a way that sits right with you and your values.

It might help to think through how you anticipate she will respond, to identify the likely reactions from her (especially as someone who has hermit/waif tendencies). And then, identify how you are most likely to respond to her response.   

Of the people who left their marriages, there are some big differences. Bill Eddy has described three categories of BPD spouses:

generally cooperative, not dangerous
not cooperative, not dangerous
not cooperative, dangerous

How you tell your wife will depend on which of these categories describe her best. By dangerous, Eddy means people who engage in DV, false allegations of DV or child molestation, substance abuse, or anyone who weaponizes the legal system.

I haven't seen research about the degree to which parental alienation is affected by a BPD parents' severity, though you can be sure that at least some PA will be present, especially during the early stages of divorce.

These are things to consider because once you decide to divorce, it's important that you are clear about how much planning and leverage needs to be in place so that you can stay a few steps ahead of her (for her sake, for yours, and for the kids). For example, if she is generally cooperative, not dangerous, it's possible she could engage in some reasonable problem-solving.

My guess is that, because there are kids involved, even if she is generally cooperative, not dangerous, she will dysregulate and become not cooperative, but you know her best. What are your thoughts?

[SamwizeGamgee]

Thanks for your thoughts.  I read Splitting early in my learning curve.  My perspective and reality has changed, therefore, maybe I should re-read it.  I am certain there will be parental alienation, perhaps not as a constructed psychological warfare, but, she already shifts blame to me, makes the kids' pains my fault.  It's natural to her, since I'm the source of her suffering, then I must be bad, and that opinion gets passed onto the kids.  I suspect her native passive aggression will come across in the many steps of a divorce, from custody to communications.  Add to that denial, and I expect the process to be arduous.  I'll hear her say things that have to be undermining the kids welfare.  But, it's so subliminal and hard to explain.  All these are reasons for caution, and used to be included on my list of reasons to just stay married.

However, to stay married in order to avoid divorce does not sound like a good life to me anymore.    I think that getting divorced and staying married both have events that might damage the kids.  (Aside: her potentially psychotic treatment of the kids, and my finances have been essentially the only things keeping me married).

She's certainly a persuasive blamer, and by nature a high-conflict personality privately, but docile and submissive ("proper" / shy type) in public.  I don't know what she'll do publicly with the stress and shame she will feel with divorce. 

I expect that she will crumble, more or less, withdraw and come back in waves of rages about something or another.  That's just my hunch.  I don't put it beyond her to run away, have some major breakdown, or possibly take her own life quietly.  I have read somewhere that some BPD types just recoil and shut down and "cooperate" (for lack of a better description) or submit in a divorce process. 

Considering how I'll react, I'm not sure.  I feel badly inside already, in a sympathetic sense.  I hate to see others suffer.  However, I'm also emotionally insulated from the marriage at this point.  I used to be conflicted about loving her or not, but, that's solved as I look at the whole-her - and realize that all her dysfunction is toxic.  I was a nervous mess when I started shopping lawyers last year.  Now, I've got my head around it as a business deal, and I'm not afraid of courts and lawyers. 

Since I'm thinking out loud now, I suppose if she goes loudly and high-conflict at any point, my resolve to divorce will increase - seeing the proof of my decision in front of me.  Sort of a self-fulfilling prophecy.  If she has a breakdown and withdraws, I'll feel very sorry for her, and sad - those wobbly knees and resolve moments.

What's got me stuck too is her ability to be normal in her human form.  When she's acting normal, divorce is the last thing on my mind.  I'm not going to say I love her, I'm too aware now for that, but, she's adequately a parent and spouse on good days. 

[michel71]

- since any reasonable person in her circumstance would know that divorce is a very real possibility. 

That is the crux of it my friend. You cannot judge her on the "reasonable person" standard because a pwBPD is disordered. Not reasonable by nature otherwise you would not be on this website. That goes for all of us.

I am in your shoes. I waffle between righteous indignation and a mindset on divorce. Then I don't have the courage of my convictions. I don't want to hurt her but I also don't want to lose her. I still love my wife VERY MUCH. I just know that I cannot live with her right now and I need to protect my assets from the reach of community property. So I am thinking of less severe measures like a separation agreement ( legally binding yet kept out of the court system).

What are your goals? What do you want to protect?

Perhaps something less than divorce would work for you as well. The D word is very harsh and as much as our pwBPD have used it on us ( mine threatened it all the time), when it comes down to us actually communicating it, we are usually serious. There is another option too... .a Legal Separation. It has all the bells and whistles of a divorce, separation of property, etc. But you two are still married.

Good luck Sam. We got your back here.

[livednlearned]

I feel like the respectful thing to do is to talk about the future, consider possibilities and solutions, and to discuss divorce.

Walk us through how you think this might go, how she will respond, what she will do next. And maybe what an ideal conversation might be, given her BPD.

She will be scared and probably go straight to her emotion brain. What are your goals for the conversation? Is your intent to do things in keeping with your values, or do you have something in mind you want her to agree with in this conversation?

The more specific you can get, the better you will gauge how much to say, how to say it, when to say it, what other ducks you need in that row, and what items you are willing to actually negotiate, versus those that are bottom line no discussion.

[SamwizeGamgee]

Michel71 - Separation is skirting what I am doing now. In my jurisdiction, there is a provision for separated living together pending a divorce decree. I'm not pending a decree, nor have I started the process, but, I have geared up for separation under the same roof.  I don't know if Legal Separation applies in my jurisdiction though.  I don't have a  crystal ball, so I can't tell how something like that would work, but, it seems to leave open lots of entanglements for the future.  I should be either in marriage or out.  I don't hold out hope that we'll spark a new romance and get back together.  I have tried to discern if I love her still, or could love her again, and I just can't find the possibility. I don't need an open door haunting me if I do go forward with separation.  I am approaching 20 years married, which is conventionally the point at which lifetime alimony is likely to be awarded - though courts are modernizing, and it's not certain that she'd get lifetime support. As for what else I'm trying to protect, I can accept a 50/50 split of property and assets.  Money and stuff is just window dressing.  Giving half of my pension and benefits seems ridiculous, but, a small price for freedom.  I'm trying to protect my kids from harm and brainwashing.  I'd like to give them the best shot possible to be emotionally healthy - and attract others who are also healthy and happy people.
My wife hasn't uttered the word divorce as a possibility, and certainly not as a threat, though she has talked about (feared) me leaving. 
I'm not clear on many goals for a divorce, other than joint legal and physical custody of the kids with 50% or more to me.  As a fringe benefit, I'd like to have a home I look forward to coming to - even when it's occupied.

Lnl - Your questions leave me a bit speechless.  I have no idea what an ideal conversation with her would sound like.  Maybe it would end with a conclusion that there is no way this marriage can benefit us both, and has to end sooner or later.  Actually, that would be excellent.  I suppose another possibility is that we iron out our differences and find a magical potion to heal the marriage.  However, I cannot hold that false hope for long.

But, I don't think her brain will ever come to that conclusion.  She describes to me frequently how before we were married she was happy, and pure, and good, and since the marriage, she feels she is anything but.  If I said that to someone the next logical inference would be that this bad marriage should end.  But, to her, maybe all the marriage needs is more emotional beatings and manipulation to get me just right.  I don't know, and I can't really understand it. 

You're right.  Throw rational out the window.  She will go right to her emotional brain.  Which will connect all kinds of real and imaginary facts and feelings and it will get crazy right away.  This would be one of those topics that would make her so emotional that later she will not accurately remember anything.  I suspect she will go dark, and hide for some time, depressed and sad.  If she remains verbal, she will make all kinds of accusations or unrelated statements. 

I've thought about maybe discussing divorce in a therapy session or with a counselor of some kind nearby, but, that seems not private enough for what may ensue.   I am prepared to be running an audio recorder at all times after discussing divorce because the crazy will be out then.  I don't think she will make false police reports or claims, but, it might be real enough to her (or she gets coaching from an unscrupulous lawyer / friend). 

I don't think she knows that her behavior and disordered personality is what's keeping her married right now.  Fear of the beast keeps me in line.

These days I tend to speak rather directly (though still kind and polite), and I don't have much more energy to put spin and sensitivity training into everything I say to her.  I'm tired of just taking the blame and softening the reality for her.  I think that I've been easing her into reality by being more honest.  I initially lied to her to hide that I was seeing a therapist.  Later when I told her, and she recovered from the betrayal that it meant to her, I dressed it up as I was working through some depression, and trying to be a great dad and husband.  Lately, I've told her that her malformed personality has caused my suffering and most of her troubles in life.  If I do have a talk with her about divorce, I'll probably be too battle weary to sugar coat it very much.  Please understand that I've got my temper handled, and don't speak with anger.  I've gotten to the point of telling myself that I've had enough.

I'm still looking for advice for what to say, and how and when to say it.  I guess I'll work a little more on answering myself as for what I want.  I consider myself very open for negotiation and compromise - perhaps how I got here after all.   I think my bottom line non-negotiable items are adequate time / access / and power to parent my kids, money enough to do the job, and peace at home.

[Mika1739]

This my own view and it can be tossed out.

What is marriage? I mean what's it for?  Is it realistic to think there is only one person on earth for me and when I find them I will be happy forever?

If your going to start a family then yes marriage makes sense to a degree.  Bedrock to build the family on.
Other than that, in my opinion, it's nieve fairy tale thinking that sets us up for unrealistic expectations.  Then 20 years later we pile guilt on ourselves because we feel different than we did decades earlier and that makes us bad.  Or that makes our spouse bad for feeling different now.
I realized I am not the type of person that is good at making life-long decisions and then living up to them.  But that doesn't mean I am bad, I am just not marriage material.  If you are more power to you, I awe at your incredible power to make a decision and see it through 40, 50 year later.  And likewise I hate to tell those people(and usually dont), I don't envy you... .you seem lets say  waiting to die.  I have been divorced 10 years and I stopped thinking that my divorce was a terrible thing about 5 years ago. Whoever came up with this marriage idea?  Certainley not me so why do I think that life isn't right without the old ball an chain?  To me life is not black and white in a box like marriage puts it in. 

Whats my point?  All marriage is not good and all divorce is not bad.  Parents being married is not always good for kids, in my opinion, it is often negative on children and teens.  How we feel about our divorce depends only on how much we shame ourself for the words and institutions society yolks on us.  Life is to short my friend, you are good, she is good... .life is good and short, enjoy it.

[takingandsending]

Hey Samwize.

Sounds like you are still grieving the end of this long relationship in some ways. Nothing wrong with that. I ended up telling my wife when she wanted to know why I didn't want to build an addition to our house. I could have made something up or lied (believe me, I thought about it), but the truth was, I didn't see a future with us together. It was hard to tell her that. I didn't want to cause suffering or worse yet, a blow up or collapse/crumble in. But it was the truth.

In the end, it really shouldn't be such a big thing to tell someone we live with the truth. That we live in these relationships where we always consider how to couch our truth, how to soften our feelings to not harm our spouses, speaks volumes about how imbalanced and dysfunctional these relationships are. I have yet to meet anybody who has taken me aside after seeing my wife and I interact, and tell me, "Wow. You are so lucky to have your wife. She treats you so well." I have had many friends of hers and friends/family of mine say, "You're a trooper. Better you than me. I couldn't do what you are doing." What that really means is that they wouldn't do what I was doing. In the end, that same truth finally came to me. I am not helping anything by maintaining the appearance of this partnership. And, in fact, I am harming myself.

[livednlearned]

Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.  

(By prepare, I mean prepare.) It should feel like you're studying to pass the bar exam or equivalent or prepare for a six-month trek around the Arctic.  

But I get the sense from your question that you are hoping something will happen if you talk to her first. Do you know what it is?

A reason to leave? Permission to leave?

[SamwizeGamgee]

A bunch of great comments. Thanks everyone.  First off, Livednlearned - I think somehow that's what I was hoping for, sort of a mutual light-bulb moment in which we both agree and part ways, and it's better for everyone.  I don't think that's going to happen quite like that, so I will dismiss that hope.  But, yeah, I think that's what I was hoping for, that and not hurt her, and not throw her into a rage.  A "real" reason to divorce would be nice, something to articulate and demonstrate as why I had to get divorced.  It would take away the looming indecision and guilt. 
I'm preparing - slightly.  I made a lot of preparations early last year but slipped into a lull and just handled the day to day things.  I'll need to light my own fire to get back to preparation.

Ok. Last night was weird.  I talked to her, and it seems like the more honest, calm, and fearless I am the better things go.  Maybe she reflects my calm or something, whereas if I was edgy, or scared of what I was doing she would disregulate.  I was very open about my needs not being met. She was too (she has a very high and generally unmet need for validation and being heard, I try, but not enough I guess). So, we talked, took turns, got things in the open a little better.  It felt good.  It's not the end of trouble, but, I felt like it was groundwork for me to do whatever comes next.   

Takingandsending - very true how I've learned to couch the truth, sugar coat it, or more often lie and keep the peace. The less I do that the better I feel.  Funny you say that you told her about divorce in context of why you didn't want an addition to the house.  I have several topics (new car, fixing up the house, selling the house - or not, kid's financial aid, wood shop purchases, her-side family reunion) that I'm sidestepping because the big variable is that a divorce flips the question upside down.  More avoidance and threading the needle for now.

Mika1739 - your comments are right on.  I had been carrying a traditional view of marriage being a contract literally forever.  Problem is, I learned, that then you feel like death couldn't come soon enough if the marriage is a loser.  In my conversation with my wife last night I was particularly calm because I accepted anything.  Although I sidestepped actually saying divorce, I did say that maybe we are just adults who are not compatible in some - or many - important things.  I liked looking at it this way.  I still believe that marriage is sacred, but, there's no way mortal man can get it right each time, so there's got to be a fix possible.  That's a long way from what I used to carry around on my shoulders.  I like your point that I'm good, she's good.  For most of the marriage, I was trained by my wife to take all the blame, projection, guilt, pain, and responsibility.  I learned about BPD and self-help and pushed back. Then her faults came to focus, and I had all the right answers when I studied BPD.  And now, I accept my faults, responsibility.  I see my weaknesses, but only real ones, and only mine.  I see her strengths too now, and that's healthy balance.   

[livednlearned]

Ok. Last night was weird.  I talked to her, and it seems like the more honest, calm, and fearless I am the better things go.  Maybe she reflects my calm or something, whereas if I was edgy, or scared of what I was doing she would disregulate.  I was very open about my needs not being met. She was too (she has a very high and generally unmet need for validation and being heard, I try, but not enough I guess). So, we talked, took turns, got things in the open a little better.  It felt good.  It's not the end of trouble, but, I felt like it was groundwork for me to do whatever comes next.

I wonder if speaking openly about your needs communicated a form of emotional closeness that soothed her. So maybe it wasn't what you were saying so much as how you felt while you were saying it, and how those feelings felt to her, if that makes sense. I also wonder if she was able to read your external feelings and internalize them for herself? "SamwizeGamgee seems confident, relaxed, open. I must be too."

When you are fearful, she reflects that same feeling and her defensive strategies are triggered.  

Anyway, yes, pwBPD have a bottomless need for reassurance and validation, since they tend not to be able to provide it readily for themselves. A sense of intense betrayal seems to lie in the unreasonable and unsustainable need for a merger fantasy in which you are expected to provide a constant stream of reassurance and validation. Because that is not realistic, you are constantly punished for underperforming the fantasy  

[SamwizeGamgee]

So true.  I think you have it figured out.  I am learning as I go. 
I remember last week there was some type of discussion in which I was basically dropping bombs about the relationship (core personality issues, etc), but I was calm and so was she. 
And yes, I just take the criticism of not doing enough for her emotional support and empathy with due diligence.  I think I have done good work on empathy and validation.  I can't watch "A Series of Unfortunate Events" because it shows the bad things always happening to the kids.  Not proof, and maybe a bad example, but, I'm not a total unfeeling brute.

[livednlearned]

That's an important clue, I think, about how you tell her, if you tell her, about divorce.

I still think you have to have a plan in place for after you pull the rip-cord.

But it does seem like your wife has the ability to regulate her emotions in response to yours. Whether she can maintain that regulation while contemplating divorce is another matter, but perhaps if you manage your expectations, and assume things could go either way, you can at least say that you did things with the utmost decency.

Have you thought about how you would tell the kids? Based on the values you have, it sounds like you would also want your wife involved. That might be tough to do, and she might be inclined to get to them first and tell them bad things about you.

It's good to walk through that scenario as closely as you are thinking about this one. I read research once on kids of divorced parents, and it was like, less than 2 percent had parents who explained to them the day-to-day stuff that kids cared about. Most parents go on about how both parents love them, will continue to love them, etc. Good stuff, but like everyone, kids also want to know how this big thing is going to impact them. Will they have a toothbrush at both houses? Will they keep their last name? Do they have to carry their underwear to school in their backpack like the other kid with divorced parents at school? How will they know whose house they are supposed to sleep at?

Also, it's ok to say, "This is going to be hard. Some days you're going to feel like crying all day, and some days it's going to seem awkward and strange and maybe a little exciting, and some days you're going to worry about mom. Those feelings are all ok, even feelings of being mad are ok. You might even feel mad at me."

[ForeverDad]

What do you think the future holds if you don't divorce?  Improve, remain the same or (gradually) worsen?

What example are you setting for the children?  Do they see good examples in either parent?  You may think staying is a positive but they may perceive it as appeasing and failing to stand up for Right, yourself or for them.  Of course, children don't decide whether a marriage continues or ends, it's an adult relationship.  However it is a factor for you to decide.  Do a search among my posts for "Solomon's Children".  Ponder what the quote from that book and my comments say.

[SamwizeGamgee]

Will do.  And thank you.
I'll have some quiet time this weekend and I'll ponder.
I'm also half way through Walerstein's "What about the kids. " which describes the development stages and how divorce comes across a kids ages.

[scraps66]

I wonder if she thinks I'm doing ok with marriage, and things are just hard right now.  I wonder if she really is in denial and expects marriage to continue.  She is of the waif / hermit variety of BPD, and perhaps the concept of divorce is so unthinkably horrible that she therefore thinks it's impossible.  I'm not sure.  A casual observer might suggest to talk about divorce with her and see what she's been thinking - since any reasonable person in her circumstance would know that divorce is a very real possibility.  (I moved to a bed in the basement almost two years ago).  I do not know if there is anything that talking to her would do to salvage or repair the marriage either.  My choices are divorce or continue to do triage, meditation, coping, and finding inner happiness in spite of the marriage.  There's nothing that I can count on her doing that would save it.  So, it's up to me to stay married or not.

I admire the thoughtfulness thread and understand the motivation having been with someone for so long. 

My sitch was quite different, rages, arguing all the time in front of kids, etc.  The decision was "easy."

Before this point, we were having problems.  Frankly, we were having problems immediately after ex had "forgotten to take her birth control."  Somewhere early in the issues we both took the "Relationship Rescue" questionnaire from Dr. Phil in the book of the same name.  Ex scored ok, that she wasn't suffering much.  I on the other hand answering honestly, I scored an "emotional divorce," whether I admitted it or not I had subconsciously checked out and put myself in survival mode.

In the long and tumultuous time since I have seen this pattern over and over, as long as things are fine with ex, things are fine.  I'm applying this to things like marriage, coparenting, custody, etc.  Situations where there is an assumed, or should be, equity between parties.  I now see this trait in our S12 who has had some significant behavioral issues.  It's a discrete lack of empathy.

There is also a book that I read back then, "Too Bad to Go, Too Good to Leave," which is essentially a list of scenarios and questions that helped me put things into perspective about leaving or not.   

[SamwizeGamgee]

You mention checking out and being in survival mode - I think I have used both phrases in describing my feelings.

Over the weekend, I spent a lot of time with my wife doing projects she wanted to get done and we spent time together.  She's been behaving very well overall.  She probably will never get to the point that she won't project her feelings, and she'll always be a walking raw nerve, in addition to her other traits.  But, there were no rages and conflict.  I think I'm learning an important lesson.  As I am more unemotional, centered and calm in dealing with very serious things in our r/s, she might be able to reflect the same "professional" behavior.

I won't get the "easy" answer to staying or going. 

[takingandsending]

Hey Samwize,

Please consider the following, do you feel you are being the best father you can be when/if you are emotionally checked out and in survival mode? What I came to realize (eventually), in my own situation, was that most of my focus was on my wife's emotional state. Even in your description of how it went this weekend, you aren't focusing on your own feelings but rather how your wife responded to your actions. At some point for me,  , I was able to see clearly that despite all of my efforts for my kids, despite my love and joy in being in their lives in a positive way, my resources were STILL - the majority of the time - focused on managing an awful relationship with my wife.

This truth became crystallized when she went away for 1.5 weeks while I watched the kids. The experience of ease, confidence, peace and happiness was simply night and day from the reality of parenting with her in the house. And this was after I had already implemented many of the tools from this website to reduce the conflict, the rages, the outbursts. The tools are wonderful. They work. And they also take a lot of work. And in the end, the best I ever could achieve was not making things worse - certainly not making things better (better by reduction of conflict, but no better by creating safety and intimacy necessary to have a functional relationship).

Where would you rate your resources for being a dad for your children? Likewise, how much time do you spend on "managing" your wife's emotional volatility? Are you okay with that balance?

Hope this gives you another possible tool in the question you are facing. There is no correct answer. It's an evolution of what you are feeling and what you and your children's needs are. 

[SamwizeGamgee]

This is good stuff. I find several comments cut to the core of the issue.  I will keep mulling them over.  I'm not in too much of a hurry, since it can take just one blow up about the topic of divorce to cause severe damage, so, I consider carefully as I go.
Takingandsending - I think the kids and I do actually fare better when uBPDw is not around.  Is that because she is not around, or because I am different when she's not around?
One thing that is noteworthy though is that by and large, I simply have programmed her out of my head-space.  I don't focus on her emotional state, knowing to stay away from the triggers. I do not know what that does to the kids.  But, from what I understand, absent physical abuse, it seems that most kids want an intact/stable family that provides food, shelter, regularity, nurture, rides, TV, and so forth.  I can do that with, and without, my wife.  Intact family could be provided by one parent.  Deep down maybe the kids are learning how to live with someone that you have cut out of the emotional landscape.  But, I don't know to what degree.