What signs did you notice when your BPD was cheating?

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

First and biggest one was her disappearing for hours at a time, like 5 to 6 hours at a time without saying anything about where she was going and when she came back she said nothing about where she was. Remember this is somebody who insisted on us texting each other every single hour of the day.  That's something we did for almost a year.

When she disappeared she was always cold in her last message before she went silent.  For example normally when she was going out to do something she would say, I'm going out to do this. I love you, have a great day.  But when she started disappearing she would just say "I'm going out"

The worst disappearing acts were the overnight ones.  Especially the one where her phone was off or in do not disturb because none of my messages got through.  Something that never happened in a whole year.  I would get a message early the next morning telling me she fell asleep and to please forgive her

When I asked her what she was doing during these disappearances she told me she was "job hunting".
It's funny because we would text while she was in class at college, while she was working, but she could never text me while "job hunting".

 When she disappeared again I asked her how did things go looking for a job? And she said "horrible.  She used a

[firehouse3]

First and biggest one was her disappearing for hours at a time, like 5 to 6 hours at a time without saying anything about where she was going and when she came back she said nothing about where she was. Remember this is somebody who insisted on us texting each other every single hour of the day.  That's something we did for almost a year.

When she disappeared she was always cold in her last message before she went silent.  For example normally when she was going out to do something she would say, I'm going out to do this. I love you, have a great day.  But when she started disappearing she would just say "I'm going out"

The worst disappearing acts were the overnight ones.  Especially the one where her phone was off or in do not disturb because none of my messages got through.  Something that never happened in a whole year.  I would get a message early the next morning telling me she fell asleep and to please forgive her

When I asked her what she was doing during these disappearances she told me she was "job hunting".
It's funny because we would text while she was in class at college, while she was working, but she could never text me while "job hunting".

 When she disappeared again I asked her how did things go looking for a job? And she said "horrible.  She used a

[firehouse3]

When she disappeared again I asked her how did things go looking for a job? And she said "horrible.  She used a  emoji.  Then she said "I regret it.". I got really worried and asked her what happened what went wrong?  She said she didn't want to talk about it.  I told her I said Tell me I'm really worried about you.  Again she said she didn't want to talk about it.

The last day she sounded really excited that morning.  And as usual she just said I'm going out.  Right after she said that I texted her where are you going? And she texted me back and said. "? Jobs". And I texted her immediately after that and asked her which jobs?

I didn't hear back from her for 6 hours.

Finally she messaged me and said, "The usual restaurants and stuff.". So I texted her back and immediately and said which restaurants?  She didn't respond for almost 2 hours.  I texted her again and said we really need to talk this is important.  Almost an hour later She said what happened?  I asked her again what jobs did you go look at today?  No response for another hour.  I called her.  She denied the call and blocked me.  Later that night around midnight she messaged me back that I was mental, that we were finished, and to never talk to her again.

Leading up to this year changed. Before she used to love hanging out with me. We would have cooking competitions, watch movies together etc. But when I suggested we do these things, she would say something like okay cool, but can we do it another time? And when we did hang out she seemed bored and irritated

[ahsim]

mine did this too, almost exactly this, except she’d say she’s going out with friends or she’s too tired or something.
I unfortunately don’t have any solid proof of what she did & I’ll probably never know for sure, but when someone suddenly starts disappearing at night from 6pm only to show up the next morning with nothing but a cold emotionless  “morning” text & when you ask what happened or if she’s ok she ignores it? something is definitely wrong.
not only that but the times she’d go into the bathroom & spend a weird amount of time in there clearly on her phone, or otherwise keep smiling whilst texting someone, constantly be texting in fact whether in bed with me or at the club together.

she completely stopped saying good night & would only occasionally say good morning (again just the cold emotionless one) but still get annoyed when I didn’t say good morning cuz it meant I was petty & ignoring her or something it’s a very silly relationship problem I think but she was clearly making it into some sort of game & it affected me. especially at night when she’d just up & vanish, I’d still sit there upset wishing her a good night. no idea why someone whose on their phone 24/7 couldn’t just say something so simple to me. it’s all such a joke

[firehouse3]

mine did this too, almost exactly this, except she’d say she’s going out with friends or she’s too tired or something.
I unfortunately don’t have any solid proof of what she did & I’ll probably never know for sure, but when someone suddenly starts disappearing at night from 6pm only to show up the next morning with nothing but a cold emotionless  “morning” text & when you ask what happened or if she’s ok she ignores it? something is definitely wrong.
not only that but the times she’d go into the bathroom & spend a weird amount of time in there clearly on her phone, or otherwise keep smiling whilst texting someone, constantly be texting in fact whether in bed with me or at the club together.

she completely stopped saying good night & would only occasionally say good morning (again just the cold emotionless one) but still get annoyed when I didn’t say good morning cuz it meant I was petty & ignoring her or something it’s a very silly relationship problem I think but she was clearly making it into some sort of game & it affected me. especially at night when she’d just up & vanish, I’d still sit there upset wishing her a good night. no idea why someone whose on their phone 24/7 couldn’t just say something so simple to me. it’s all such a joke

Classic BPD.  One set of rules for you, and another for her.  Call them out on it and they have a mental breakdown and try to DARVO you because you've cracked their fragile ego.  Even the slightest bit of criticism is too much for them.  She did the same thing to me.  Complained whenever she didn't get a dramatic loving goodnight text from me, but expected me to be okay with the countless times she went to sleep without saying good night to me when I never missed a single night.

I have no idea how many times she went missing at night without saying goodnight was actually her really falling asleep or was she out with someone else. 

The emotionless texts are a dead giveaway.  Look for texts like that either right before or after they "disappear". Had the same thing happen to me. 

Yep, the unexplained giddiness.  I even had to ask her "Why are you so happy?"  And she said "Oh I'm just happy for you that you're family is coming to visit."  Yeah right.

[HoratioX]

These are the parts the person with BPD (or anxiety, CPTSD, etc.) can do that makes their illness both malignant and blunts the notion of their not having complicity in their behavior.

In order to cheat, they have to actively plan and deceive, both actions that take conscious effort. Yet, I've seen many people with BPD argue that somehow it's the illness running their lives at that point -- as though somehow, they're on some kind of autopilot that relieves them of any responsibility.

I also often hear that cheating is not something only people with BPD do and that not all people with BPD cheat. That last part I agree with. Not all people with BPD cheat. But that first part sounds merely like minimizing the issue. It's like saying alcoholics are not the only people who drink.

No one is arguing that other people can't cheat, too. They can cheat for all kinds of reasons. But with BPD, the proclivity often comes from facets of the illness specifically. And when people cite statistics that people with BPD are either not more likely to cheat than others or more likely to cheat in higher rates, I'm skeptical of the research. How do they know? From self-reported surveys? How reliable are those?

But, yeah, I saw some of these same behaviors in my ex with BPD/anxiety/CPTSD. And there were more than a few times where it seemed she was cheating on someone else with me, though I didn't know for certain (and she would deny it in some cases). Like the phone would ring and she would have an angry conversation with whoever was on the other end. She'd say it was her sister or a friend. But the whole disappearing for hours with the phone off or not returning texts happened, as did the breaking of plans, often at the last moment.

The challenge, of course, is such actions can be a part of various illnesses where they are not cheating. Someone with anxiety can at the last moment decide they just can't go out or be in a crowd, for instance. Sometimes they're having a panic attack that makes them shut down or turn off their phones.  There can be legitimate challenges in their life that have nothing to do with cheating.

But the reality is many of them do cheat. And you can usually feel it in your gut even if you don't have all of the answers. Something else I've noted among people who have dated or been married to someone with BPD is their instincts tell them something is wrong. They know their significant other is lying.

[firehouse3]

These are the parts the person with BPD (or anxiety, CPTSD, etc.) can do that makes their illness both malignant and blunts the notion of their complicity in their behavior.

In order to cheat, they have to actively plan and deceive, both actions that take conscious effort. Yet, I've seen many people with BPD argue that somehow it's the illness running their lives at that point -- as though somehow, they're on some kind of autopilot that relieves them of any responsibility.

I also often hear that cheating is not something only people with BPD do and that not all people with BPD cheat. That last part I agree with. Not all people with BPD cheat. But that first part sounds merely like minimizing the issue. It's like saying alcoholics are not the only people who drink.

No one is arguing that other people can't cheat, too. They can cheat for all kinds of reasons. But with BPD, the proclivity often comes from facets of the illness specifically. And when people cite statistics that people with BPD are either not more likely to cheat than others or more likely to cheat in higher rates, I'm skeptical of the research. How do they know? From self-reported surveys? How reliable are those?

But, yeah, I saw some of these same behaviors in my ex with BPD/anxiety/CPTSD. And there were more than a few times where it seemed she was cheating on someone else with me, though I didn't know for certain (and she would deny it in some cases). Like the phone would ring and she would have an angry conversation with whoever was on the other end. She'd say it was her sister or a friend. But the whole disappearing for hours with the phone off or not returning texts happened, as did the breaking of plans, often at the last moment.

The challenge, of course, is such actions can be a part of various illnesses where they are not cheating. Someone with anxiety can at the last moment decide they just can't go out or be in a crowd, for instance. Sometimes they're having a panic attack that makes them shut down or turn off their phones.  There can be legitimate challenges in their life that have nothing to do with cheating.

But the reality is many of them do cheat. And you can usually feel it in your gut even if you don't have all of the answers. Something else I've noted among people who have dated or been married to someone with BPD is their instincts tell them something is wrong. They know their significant other is lying.

"It was the BPD taking over"  Obviously I can't read someone's mind.  But the problem is when BPDs cheat they are notorious for gaslighting and victim blaming instead of apologizing for the betrayal and hurt and pain they caused.  But they won't do that because their ego is too fragile to admit wrongdoing, especially on the magnitude of cheating.  When they are caught or close to being caught they'll likely block you and stop talking to you because they can't face the shame of their despicable behavior

One thing I learned after being cheated on twice is that they don't stay in contact with you when they are in the act of cheating.  It's almost a golden rule of cheating.  They do not message back or answer calls when they are with someone else.  They are too busy or feel too guilty to do that.  Over time they might start to return messages or calls when they are with someone because they realize it's too suspicious not to, but ver early on, when they don't think you know any better, they won't.

I'll never forget the sickening feeling I got in my stomach when the first woman who cheated on me disappeared for an entire evening and didn't text me back until very late.  Told me she was out shopping and eating with a 'friend' and wasn't in the 'mood' to talk with me (Even though a few weeks earlier she said all her friends lived in other cities).  For several months she texted me right after work, at around 5 pm, to tell me about her day.  That day, nothing.  Until like 11 at night.  I found out about a month later her ex had been texting her for some time, and she finally gave in and decided to meet with him that evening.

Lengthy disappearances without answering texts is a GIGANTIC red flag.

If they are disappearing for 4+ hours at a time (especially in the evening/night) and do not respond to any communication, and start doing this consistently, like 2-3 times a week, you might have a serious problem on your hands. 

My gut told me she was lying because she started acting different.  How she responded to things I said changed, or just felt off.  For example, I remember,  I asked her if she wanted to hang out Wednesday night.  She simply told me "Don't know."  That's not how she's ever talked to me. 

She had countless male friends.  When I found out about it, I was very concerned and told her about my concern.  She of course told me they really are just friends, and she only had any romantic interest in me. 

Women can have guy friends, of course.  But when she has a bunch, and tells you some of them are 'close' watch out.

After we broke up I admittedly did some social media snooping on her.  Found her hidden blog. 

Turns out one of the guys who she said was 'just a friend' and who she had traveled with to watch play keyboard with a band at a concert just a few months ago was also someone she was romantically involved with at least until Dec 2023.  I found a post of her standing behind him, with her arms wrapped around him and rubbing hands together and laying down on the grass  with her head on him and #love.  This guy was in the pictures and videos she sent me of the concert from just a few months ago.  She told me her last boyfriend was 'a long time ago, during the pandemic' which obviously wasn't true.  Maybe this guy was a FWB.  But he was just one of who knows how many guys this girl knew. 

Point is, if I'm ever going to date a woman with a big male friend circle again, she's going to have to give me complete access to her phone, social media, etc. I'm never taking that risk again.

I have no idea how many lies she told me.  They started right away.  She lied to me about her name.  Then lied to me about her age.  Shortly after she told me she had lied about those two things, but said 'That's all I've lied to you about'.  Turns out that was a lie as well.

[EyesUp]

I would underscore that not all people with BPD cheat, and not all people who cheat have BPD.

There are some "classic" behaviors that many cheaters - BPD or not - are known to demonstrate.

And then there are some behaviors that are typical of BPDs under emotionally charged conditions - and cheating certainly qualifies.

You've described some of the classic/general behaviors of any cheater:
- a change in behavior
- a change in routine / schedule
- not being forthcoming about it
- avoidance of certain topics, activities
- notable change of phone behavior
- change in dress

Again, these are potential "tells" for any cheater - they come up time and time again in any discussion of infidelity, and are not specific to BPD.

For the BPD cheater, overlay splitting behavior, i.e., someone with BPD may:
- paint their spouse/partner black, usually while idealizing the AP
- provoke arguments or conflict in order to reinforce that the spouse/partner is "bad"
- completely forget past / shared positives

In my experience, it was particularly confusing because it seemed like my then-wife both wanted to keep the marriage going *and* wanted to be caught.  

As I struggled to understand the change in her behavior, I discovered this place, Stop Walking on Eggshells, etc., and that's when I started to connect the dots.

If you had asked me what I'd do in that situation years prior, I would have said that infidelity = automatic divorce, however when confronted with the reality I was unprepared. I understood that my then wife suffered from depression and anxiety - and I considered if she was able to get validation and empowerment from an affair that it could somehow improve our marriage.

This was typical of the sort of mental gymnastics I attempted to rationalize the relationship... I was addicted to hopium. 

I suppose that might be possible for another couple to work through it in a variety of ways (enter Esther Perel), but I eventually realized and accepted that it wasn't going to work that way for us (ChumpLady FTW).

It sounds like you see the signs, and your partner isn't being forthcoming.  A lot of us have been there.  

Some questions to consider....  how would you feel and what would you do if:
- she admitted to an affair, expressed remorse, and said she still wants to be with you?
- she admitted to an affair, but blamed you for it?  i.e., she rationalizes the affair because she's not getting enough validation or admiration from you?
- she won't admit to anything, but continues to disappear without any accountability or acknowledgement?

The common thread here is that each question invites you to get in touch with your feelings. Instead of wondering what's going on in her head, focus on what's going on in your head.

Is your current situation recoverable?  Why or why not?  It's ultimately up to you to determine if you can work past it and establish a new baseline, or if this is a breach that's not going to be repairable.

One of the big clues that eventually helped me to gain clarity:  I asked my then-wife if she wanted to open up the marriage, i.e., continue seeing her AP, with the understanding that I might see other people too.  Candidly, it was a bit of an experiment - I wanted to see how she'd react more than I wanted to actually have that type of relationship...  It was a hard no for her.  She said that she'd end the affair, but it was clear that she wanted to keep it going - and that she wanted me to be dutifully waiting for her at home.  As noted - This is BPD:  rules don't apply to them - only to you. 

Sorry you're in this situation.  Take care, and know that one way or another you'll be stronger when you get through this.

[ahsim]

These are the parts the person with BPD (or anxiety, CPTSD, etc.) can do that makes their illness both malignant and blunts the notion of their complicity in their behavior.

In order to cheat, they have to actively plan and deceive, both actions that take conscious effort. Yet, I've seen many people with BPD argue that somehow it's the illness running their lives at that point -- as though somehow, they're on some kind of autopilot that relieves them of any responsibility.

I also often hear that cheating is not something only people with BPD do and that not all people with BPD cheat. That last part I agree with. Not all people with BPD cheat. But that first part sounds merely like minimizing the issue. It's like saying alcoholics are not the only people who drink.

No one is arguing that other people can't cheat, too. They can cheat for all kinds of reasons. But with BPD, the proclivity often comes from facets of the illness specifically. And when people cite statistics that people with BPD are either not more likely to cheat than others or more likely to cheat in higher rates, I'm skeptical of the research. How do they know? From self-reported surveys? How reliable are those?

But, yeah, I saw some of these same behaviors in my ex with BPD/anxiety/CPTSD. And there were more than a few times where it seemed she was cheating on someone else with me, though I didn't know for certain (and she would deny it in some cases). Like the phone would ring and she would have an angry conversation with whoever was on the other end. She'd say it was her sister or a friend. But the whole disappearing for hours with the phone off or not returning texts happened, as did the breaking of plans, often at the last moment.

The challenge, of course, is such actions can be a part of various illnesses where they are not cheating. Someone with anxiety can at the last moment decide they just can't go out or be in a crowd, for instance. Sometimes they're having a panic attack that makes them shut down or turn off their phones.  There can be legitimate challenges in their life that have nothing to do with cheating.

But the reality is many of them do cheat. And you can usually feel it in your gut even if you don't have all of the answers. Something else I've noted among people who have dated or been married to someone with BPD is their instincts tell them something is wrong. They know their significant other is lying.

this is absolutely true. I didn’t immediately think it was cheating & I actually had a lot of faith in her at first. especially since she told me how disgusting cheating is & how her dad did that to her mom & how she saw how bad that affected them all. It all gave me a real sense of security.
I hated becoming that “insecure paranoid” person that went & checked all her social media for clues like looking at her spotify playlists, but I unfortunately was pushed to that point, & honestly like you said that gut feeling happened. It’s not even something I’ve felt or experienced before either.
Again I (unfortunately or fortunately?) don’t really have solid proof, just examples of very very suspicious behaviour that even the unsuspecting would be suspicious of. I showed my friends just one thing after keeping silent about everything & they were like Bro…wtf.
It’s sad that I believed I was the wrong one & just being insecure for so long. (Isn’t insulting the person you supposedly care for with that…weird?)

[firehouse3]

Oh yes they do hate cheating.  When they are the ones being cheated on.

I told her about this woman at work who was cheating on her boyfriend with a co-worker.  She didn't care.  She told me "okay? What do you want me to say?"

She talked really bad about a boyfriend cheated on her.  Remember it's all about them

Some other signs to look for are baseless inquisitions or claims you are cheating

She wants texted me at 2:00 a.m. asking me if I was talking to anybody else.  Another time I showed her the itinerary for my family's vacation that I created.  She accused me of having the sunset picnic for a girl I was seeing and not for my family.

Also look for irritability when you ask him what they're doing when they go out, before they disappear.  Also look for irritability when they come back from disappearing

[once removed]

i think you are at risk that the lessons you take from this relationship will be to become more fearful, less trusting, and hypervigilant.

if you dont wish to be with a person who is inherently distrusting, and suspects cheating at every turn, then you really dont want to become one, either. you want to heal from it.

being cheated on can have a way of doing that: creating a lasting wound that festers, and makes us more fearful, and that can affect not only who dates/is attracted to us, but it can color who we gravitate toward as well. for example, after being cheated on, a person may subconciously look for someone who is compliant, or "safe" (wont leave/cheat), or even more likely to cheat.

ive been cheated on in every romantic relationship ive ever had (which is not very many). sure, there are signs; EyesUp laid them out well. but you dont want to find yourself in a relationship where youre hypervigilant about looking for them. you dont want to be in a relationship where youre accessing her phone for proof. you want to be in a relationship where you have trust and communication.

this relationship had neither of those things. i think it would go a long way to focus on the signs that future relationships offer that. a lot of us tried to turn the relationship, and/or the person, into something it wasnt or couldnt be. those are the signs to see.

as for signs in my own relationship, they were there, and in retrospect, they were plentiful. i suspect that she cheated on multiple occasions, with more than one person, probably beginning in the last year of our 3 year relationship. i outright caught her in some suspicious behavior that she had no answer for, and i both discovered and put together more after it ended. my ex was really smothering, you see, couldnt stand to be apart. so i really craved time away from her that i never really felt i got. if it was unusual for her to stop being smothering, i didnt notice, or care. and when i caught her in that suspicious behavior, i made a point to let it go, because i wanted to "teach" her to do the same. yes, my ex was a highly distrusting person who frequently suspected and accused me of cheating. complicating it further was that her fears werent entirely invalid; she caught me sending an inappropriate message to another girl, because she was, unbeknownst to me, monitoring my email.

see what i mean? thats just no way to have a relationship. it was such a mess. heal. grow. aim for the day you dont recognize the relationship or who you were in it.

[HoratioX]

this is absolutely true. I didn’t immediately think it was cheating & I actually had a lot of faith in her at first. especially since she told me how disgusting cheating is & how her dad did that to her mom & how she saw how bad that affected them all. It all gave me a real sense of security.
I hated becoming that “insecure paranoid” person that went & checked all her social media for clues like looking at her spotify playlists, but I unfortunately was pushed to that point, & honestly like you said that gut feeling happened. It’s not even something I’ve felt or experienced before either.
Again I (unfortunately or fortunately?) don’t really have solid proof, just examples of very very suspicious behaviour that even the unsuspecting would be suspicious of. I showed my friends just one thing after keeping silent about everything & they were like Bro…wtf.
It’s sad that I believed I was the wrong one & just being insecure for so long. (Isn’t insulting the person you supposedly care for with that…weird?)

Keep in mind that many people with BPD, etc., are highly manipulative, and their illness can overlap with comorbid issues like sociopathy and pathological lying.

The manipulative ones will often try to gaslight you from the start. Think about it -- they're already presenting themselves in a way to best capture your attention and affection. That's a manipulation, even if it's benign (which it often is not). Then they start laying the groundwork for more, such as telling your sob stories about their ex or their previous lives, usually something featuring much abuse. Some of this may be true. Maybe even all of it. But chances are, it's either an exaggeration or carefully edited to leave out vital information that would look bad -- yes, their ex cheated, but the part they leave out is it was after they did, for example.

So, when someone with BPD, etc., says they abhor cheating, they may well be telling the truth -- to a degree. They hate being cheating on. They may even feel some guilt when they cheat.  But it doesn't stop them like it would a normal person. That's what makes the illness even more insidious. They know it's wrong, but they do it anyway, and they prep for it by trying to gaslight their significant others into thinking they could never do it.

Here's the healthy way to look at it, though: It doesn't matter whether they really cheated or not. It doesn't even matter that you suspect it. What matters is they didn't do enough in the relationship to make it whole. Otherwise, you'd still be together. So long as you didn't cheat or proactively hurt them, they are the ones responsible for the problem. Yes, you may have contributed over time, but if they started it and they did nothing to fix it, you're not the one morally responsible. So, rather than dwell on whether they did or didn't cheat, think instead about how you got out of a toxic relationship where they were at fault regardless.

Instead of spending time and energy on that, spend time on making yourself happy and finding someone who is worth your attention and your affection. And keep in mind the person with BPD, etc., is just going to ruin the next relationship and the one after that and the one after that and the one after that . . .

[HoratioX]

Oh yes they do hate cheating.  When they are the ones being cheated on.

I told her about this woman at work who was cheating on her boyfriend with a co-worker.  She didn't care.  She told me "okay? What do you want me to say?"

She talked really bad about a boyfriend cheated on her.  Remember it's all about them

Some other signs to look for are baseless inquisitions or claims you are cheating

She wants texted me at 2:00 a.m. asking me if I was talking to anybody else.  Another time I showed her the itinerary for my family's vacation that I created.  She accused me of having the sunset picnic for a girl I was seeing and not for my family.

Also look for irritability when you ask him what they're doing when they go out, before they disappear.  Also look for irritability when they come back from disappearing

Exactly. They look for people they can psychologically manipulate, or at least the malignant ones do.

[anonymousfox]

When she disappeared again I asked her how did things go looking for a job? And she said "horrible.  She used a  emoji.  Then she said "I regret it.". I got really worried and asked her what happened what went wrong?  She said she didn't want to talk about it.  I told her I said Tell me I'm really worried about you.  Again she said she didn't want to talk about it.

The last day she sounded really excited that morning.  And as usual she just said I'm going out.  Right after she said that I texted her where are you going? And she texted me back and said. "? Jobs". And I texted her immediately after that and asked her which jobs?

I didn't hear back from her for 6 hours.

Finally she messaged me and said, "The usual restaurants and stuff.". So I texted her back and immediately and said which restaurants?  She didn't respond for almost 2 hours.  I texted her again and said we really need to talk this is important.  Almost an hour later She said what happened?  I asked her again what jobs did you go look at today?  No response for another hour.  I called her.  She denied the call and blocked me.  Later that night around midnight she messaged me back that I was mental, that we were finished, and to never talk to her again.

Leading up to this year changed. Before she used to love hanging out with me. We would have cooking competitions, watch movies together etc. But when I suggested we do these things, she would say something like okay cool, but can we do it another time? And when we did hang out she seemed bored and irritated

This might be a rough take, but to me it honestly sounded like she did escorting or met sugar daddies. But I also might be totally off. It also sounds like she did not care at all about masking it, she didn't even bother to provide a realistic alibi. Maybe she didn't bother to mask what she's doing as well and called it "job hunting". Like what jobs are you going to hunt in the night? And how do you hunt jobs for a prolonged period of time by physically going somewhere? That is such a weird concept to me. At least just say you're meeting up with friends or doing xyz, but job hunting and/or no explanations?

[ahsim]

Keep in mind that many people with BPD, etc., are highly manipulative, and their illness can overlap with comorbid issues like sociopathy and pathological lying.

The manipulative ones will often try to gaslight you from the start. Think about it -- they're already presenting themselves in a way to best capture your attention and affection. That's a manipulation, even if it's benign (which it often is not). Then they start laying the groundwork for more, such as telling your sob stories about their ex or their previous lives, usually something featuring much abuse. Some of this may be true. Maybe even all of it. But chances are, it's either an exaggeration or carefully edited to leave out vital information that would look bad -- yes, their ex cheated, but the part they leave out is it was after they did, for example.

So, when someone with BPD, etc., says they abhor cheating, they may well be telling the truth -- to a degree. They hate being cheating on. They may even feel some guilt when they cheat.  But it doesn't stop them like it would a normal person. That's what makes the illness even more insidious. They know it's wrong, but they do it anyway, and they prep for it by trying to gaslight their significant others into thinking they could never do it.

Here's the healthy way to look at it, though: It doesn't matter whether they really cheated or not. It doesn't even matter that you suspect it. What matters is they didn't do enough in the relationship to make it whole. Otherwise, you'd still be together. So long as you didn't cheat or proactively hurt them, they are the ones responsible for the problem. Yes, you may have contributed over time, but if they started it and they did nothing to fix it, you're not the one morally responsible. So, rather than dwell on whether they did or didn't cheat, think instead about how you got out of a toxic relationship where they were at fault regardless.

Instead of spending time and energy on that, spend time on making yourself happy and finding someone who is worth your attention and your affection. And keep in mind the person with BPD, etc., is just going to ruin the next relationship and the one after that and the one after that and the one after that . . .

thank you for this. I’ve removed her off of everything but one thing & I saw today that she removed me off that & that her brother blocked me. It gives me this tinge of guilt & confusion like, what did I really do to warrant this? do I really deserve to get blocked? (even thought I’m obviously not gonna talk to her brother & I want nothing to do with her.) it’s weird how that happens. your comment helps remind me that what I experienced was plain injustice from a very sick individual. & yes ultimately whether she cheated or not it doesn’t change the fact that she did ALL the classic manipulation techniques you mentioned plus all sorts of other bs. she idealised me, smothered me in love & attention, built me up & threw me all the way down. cheating was that “final straw” in my mind that would make me cut her off for sure. the highest disrespect basically, & although yes of course cheating is disgusting to me the real final straw should of been the red flags I saw DAY ONE. I should of cut her off ages ago & she did not deserve to be in my life that long

[firehouse3]

Another cheating sign to look out for is a sudden interest in fitness

You'll see her buy gym clothes, a gym bag, or tell you about her new fitness routine.  If she shows a sudden interest in getting in shape when you already think something is off, you might be in serious trouble.

This might be a rough take, but to me it honestly sounded like she did escorting or met sugar daddies. But I also might be totally off. It also sounds like she did not care at all about masking it, she didn't even bother to provide a realistic alibi. Maybe she didn't bother to mask what she's doing as well and called it "job hunting". Like what jobs are you going to hunt in the night? And how do you hunt jobs for a prolonged period of time by physically going somewhere? That is such a weird concept to me. At least just say you're meeting up with friends or doing xyz, but job hunting and/or no explanations?

No, you're not totally off at all.  I had wondered if she was escorting or something similar myself.  That whole message exchange.  Saying she felt horrible and regretted it,  and the vomit emoji.  Seriously who reacts like that after talking to people for a job?  I was worried she might have been subjected to some kind of casting couch when on an interview or something.  Considering her financial problems, none of this is out of the realm of possibility

As a BPD, she was hypersexual.  So it makes even more sense she would look to sex as a way to make money.  Early when we first met she asked me if I knew about Only Fans.  Girls dont get on there to view content, but to make it.  When we sexted her pictures had tumblr file names, which made me wonder if she was sharing or selling her nudes somewhere on the internet.  I'm pretty sure she was.

BPDs are just too much to handle.  The hypersexuality is yet another thing you have to worry about.  It's amazing and great when it's focused on you, and then you get that knot in your stomach when you realize how big her male friend circle is and how her insatiable sexuality can be focused on someone else at anytime anywhere due to their impulsive behavior

thank you for this. I’ve removed her off of everything but one thing & I saw today that she removed me off that & that her brother blocked me. It gives me this tinge of guilt & confusion like, what did I really do to warrant this? do I really deserve to get blocked? (even thought I’m obviously not gonna talk to her brother & I want nothing to do with her.) it’s weird how that happens. your comment helps remind me that what I experienced was plain injustice from a very sick individual. & yes ultimately whether she cheated or not it doesn’t change the fact that she did ALL the classic manipulation techniques you mentioned plus all sorts of other bs. she idealised me, smothered me in love & attention, built me up & threw me all the way down. cheating was that “final straw” in my mind that would make me cut her off for sure. the highest disrespect basically, & although yes of course cheating is disgusting to me the real final straw should of been the red flags I saw DAY ONE. I should of cut her off ages ago & she did not deserve to be in my life that long

I saw the red flags from day one too.  Ignored them. One of the biggest mistakes of my life.  Never doing that again.

[anonymousfox]

Another cheating sign to look out for is a sudden interest in fitness

You'll see her buy gym clothes, a gym bag, or tell you about her new fitness routine.  If she shows a sudden interest in getting in shape when you already think something is off, you might be in serious trouble.

No, you're not totally off at all.  I had wondered if she was escorting or something similar myself.  That whole message exchange.  Saying she felt horrible and regretted it,  and the vomit emoji.  Seriously who reacts like that after talking to people for a job?  I was worried she might have been subjected to some kind of casting couch when on an interview or something.  Considering her financial problems, none of this is out of the realm of possibility

As a BPD, she was hypersexual.  So it makes even more sense she would look to sex as a way to make money.  Early when we first met she asked me if I knew about Only Fans.  Girls dont get on there to view content, but to make it.  When we sexted her pictures had tumblr file names, which made me wonder if she was sharing or selling her nudes somewhere on the internet.  I'm pretty sure she was.

BPDs are just too much to handle.  The hypersexuality is yet another thing you have to worry about.  It's amazing and great when it's focused on you, and then you get that knot in your stomach when you realize how big her male friend circle is and how her insatiable sexuality can be focused on someone else at anytime anywhere due to their impulsive behavior

I saw the red flags from day one too.  Ignored them. One of the biggest mistakes of my life.  Never doing that again.

Okay wow. Look, someone without you mentioning it had this gut feeling and you did too. Believe in yourself! I think its probably a given she did escorting with the context you just gave. I mean you never know but chances are likely. And that's all humans need to know in order to derive actionable insight for their decisions in life, since we never "know" anything. And even if she did. You already know you went through a toxic relationship of being used. Just another good reason for you to stay no contact forever and move on, making your life positive:)

Mine was also very confusing, since we had an open relationship. At some point she started doing fitness, but acrobatics. And convenient enough, there was a guy she partnered with from the course, who she started to meet in private (but with other ppl around) but also sometimes alone and that was going on for 6 months or so, but she always told me how she would never, since he is not even attractive. He also made a move on her after his girlfriend broke up with him, which made it sound more believable that nothing happened prior. She still convinced me there was nothing. And there was also another guy she was dating with before me, but he somehow turned out gay and then bi and now has a girlfriend and was just her "friend" all the time, chatting (living in another city/country) and one time he came over to stay with her for 2 days. I mean she also invited me over so I know nothing is going on and stay during those 2 days. But I just didnt want to be a part of this weird situation. As ridiculous as it sounds, I still think nothing happened. But who can say? I will just have to move on, it doesn't matter what happened in terms of me becoming happy again. I think we have to stop giving them any form of control over ourselves, its the least we owe to us.

[Skip]

Another cheating sign to look out for is a sudden interest in fitness

You'll see her buy gym clothes, a gym bag, or tell you about her new fitness routine.  If she shows a sudden interest in getting in shape when you already think something is off, you might be in serious trouble.

Chat GTP: In the phrase "a sign of cheating," the word "sign" refers to:

an indication or evidence that suggests or points to the possibility of cheating. It implies that there are certain behaviors, actions, or patterns that can reveal dishonesty or deception in a context, such as in relationships or academic settings.

So in this context, a pattern of "staying out all night" without a good reason is certainly something that should make us cautious and it's probably worth following up on. Same could be said for finding condoms or panties or Planned Parenthood receipt for a STD test, or at 100 texts to an unknown number in one week.

Buying a gym bag. Getting a haircut.  A few unaccounted for hours here and there... this is more likely than not to be just life. Being suspicious about things like this in our next relationship could be very damaging as it would most likely appear as a lack of confidence, lack of trust and/or paranoia on our part - even clingy.

I've only known her for 8-9 weeks.  Things started electric between us.  We both thought we found our soulmate.  Not long after we first met she told me she was 'very needy'.  I didn't mind because I have anxious attachment and I understand that.  But now after 2 months I'm quite sure she has BPD.  All the signs are there.

I had to text her every 30-45 minutes, or I hear it from her. 

Anxious attachment - be careful. don't fuel that in yourself. 

[firehouse3]

It's good to find a balance

Some people can get cheated on for years and not suspect anything

Some people can never be cheated on but are always suspicious of their partner

You have to find the middle ground