Doing bills for BPD spouse

[nodoover]

When we first married I told my husband I would pay off his large credit bills if he added me to the deed of his house and I did all the bills while we are married.

My question is does anyone else do the bills besides me? Being a woman and not the first on the credit cards and we get medical through his old employer, we are retired have medicare and supplement.  Anyway I calmly tell hubby when he is not upset to let me handle the bills and just give me permission to talk to people about accts.

This sometimes works but most times he will listen to me calmly taking care of a problem then pull phone away and start yelling at who ever is on the phone.

He did this just a few minutes ago when I was talking to billing dept of our medical office. He hung up after so I couldn't finish with the lady that I had already almost had everything figured out and settled in a good way.

Is there anything I can do, or is there a way to handle this better?

And I don't understand why when I have taken care of problem he then wants to call and yell at everyone afterwards?  In his mind we shouldn't have to deal with this but he isn't rationally thinking at all about possibly our doctor cancelling us if he becomes too much of a problem for him.  He has already caused issues in the office yelling and doctor was able to settle him down.

By the way I keep reading that BPD is supposed to get better when you are older.  I think that is only true if person gets help, drugs, counseling etc.  Hubby has gone a few times, taken drugs a few times, says they don't work and refuses.  I think he is worse after he retired because he sits around thinking negative stuff all day and has no friends or outside activities except our dog if it wasn't for him he would have nothing to do.

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Notwendy]

I don't have the same situation exactly but I assist my elderly BPD mother with her bill pay from her account. I think this is about control. She has needed assistance with keeping track of them and while the simplest thing to do is just let me manage it, she still feels she needs to be in control and that may mean being difficult.

I think there's a need to be in control, and that could mean sabotaging efforts to help them. My BPD mother can be difficult to deal with when she does that.

My guess is that when you handle the phone calls, your H feels helpless and even possibly triggered due to feeling inadequate. Since he can't do this as well as you, he shows you he's still in power by sabotaging your efforts. He then controls the outcome, even if it's negative. Being retired, he may feel a lack of purpose and self esteem from employment.

IMHO, you can handle bill pay quietly on your computer but if you need to speak to someone, this needs to be done in private. It's possible he just can't handle this situation. While you are retired, perhaps there's a quiet nook in a coffee shop or restaurant, or drive somewhere and call from a parked car outside a place where there's wifi if you need it.

[nodoover]

Thanks, I do the bills in office of our house.  I was a bookkeeper before I retired, I do our taxes also so I enjoy doing the bills.  Keeps my brain active! 

Normally I do everything on my own alone but its almost like hubby enjoys when I need him to give permission for me to talk to billing.  Most bills I have permission now we have set up and today he gave permission for the future for medical bills and I changed email to our bill one from his personal one so that won't happen again where he gets a bill.

I think you are right he feels out of control.  I guess I am doing all I possible can.  I still get embarrassed when he treats people like that on the phone, they are only doing their job.

[Notwendy]

Thanks, I do the bills in office of our house.  I was a bookkeeper before I retired, I do our taxes also so I enjoy doing the bills.  Keeps my brain active! 

Normally I do everything on my own alone but its almost like hubby enjoys when I need him to give permission for me to talk to billing.  Most bills I have permission now we have set up and today he gave permission for the future for medical bills and I changed email to our bill one from his personal one so that won't happen again where he gets a bill.

I think you are right he feels out of control.  I guess I am doing all I possible can.  I still get embarrassed when he treats people like that on the phone, they are only doing their job.

Yes, I understand the feeling. His behavior though, is on him- it's his choice.

With my elderly mother- she has been secretive about her finances and not wanting to have our input. On the other hand, she got to the point where she did need assistance and family members were the most trustworthy people to handle her account. The paradox is that BPD affects the closest relationships the most. In your situation, the obvious person to do the bills is you, but since you are your H's wife- there's relationship dynamics. If you were doing bookeeping for a client, it would be more straightforward.

The "permission" dynamic is part of it. You know you don't need to have permission to do a task that has to be done and you do it well. But he needs to feel he's competent and in control.

With BPD mother, she'd want to go over everything in the account in detail, down to the penny, which increased the time to do the task, and also was frustrating as the bills that were paid were recurrent necessities, rent bill, pharmacy bill, medicare supplement. etc. She knew what they were but would still want me to discuss all of them with her. Eventually, I did what you just did- got access to them, and just sent the payments on a schedule. However, one difference is that we don't live in the same house and so I can do this in my own space.

I think in a way, your H is feeling his own insecurities and knows you are doing a better job at this than he does. Also, there's some distorted thinking that may be going on- if he isn't keeping a watch on the money- even though there's no reason for him to need to do that. Perhaps if you see this as his emotional need, rather than as personal to you, it will bother you less.

[CC43]

Hi there,

I agree with Notwendy's assessment.  I also live with a controlling husband, and though I wouldn't say he has BPD (even though his daughter does), he does demonstrate some BPD-like traits from time to time.  When he feels stress, he tends to take it out on me.  That includes yelling, bossing me around and controlling my life, such as restricting my social life or throwing a tantrum if I leave the house.  The more stressed and distressed he feels, the more he attempts to control me.  I think he does this to regain a sense of control in his life.  However it can be extremely annoying.

Like you, I handle most of the finances in my household, including paying for most of the bills, preparing taxes and such.  I think my husband is somewhat "blind" to what I do.  He'll say things like, "I pay for everything, I do all the shopping, I do all the cleaning . . . " when the reality is, I'm probably responsible for 85%.  Yet the only things he "counts" are the tasks and bills he takes on himself--so in his eyes, what he says is true.  And yet, like you, when I step up and pay an unusual bill or fix a household item (say, the A/C), and he catches me in the act, he'll oftentimes throw a little tantrum.  He'll say, the A/C isn't broken, you don't know what you're doing, etc.  But he can't fix it himself, and he doesn't want to pay anyone to fix it, either.  So we'll sweat buckets a few days, and he'll still be in denial about it.  So what do I do?  I have to arrange for someone to fix the unit, without telling him.  Ideally, I can schedule to get it fixed when my husband isn't around.  And then I'll pay the bill, in secret.

Since I'm the wife, I bet my husband feels a bit emasculated sometimes.  But I think, that's his own choice--if he doesn't want to fix the house, and he doesn't want to pay for repairs, then fine.  But I don't like living in a house where everything is broken.  My coping mechanism is to take care of it myself, but try to do it in secret, so he doesn't blow a gasket.  Sometimes it works, and sometimes it doesn't.  But I guess my boundary is, I'm not going to let him bully me into living with broken stuff and allow bills to go unpaid (I don't like to pay late fees or have the utilities turned off).  If I'm on the phone with a vendor, he might shout at me, "What are you calling XYZ for?  Get off the phone!"  In fact, that happened just this past week.  But I ignore him.  So I guess what I'm saying is, it's easier to ask for forgiveness than for permission.  I think he knows he's being unreasonable, and he probably thinks he's "helping," and he doesn't realize he's being rude, and he's not even aware that he's shouting.  He's MAD because I'm not doing exactly what he wants me to do, and I'm REMINDING him that he's not taking care of things the way he should.  He feels insecure, but at the same time, he doesn't want to do the work or pay the bills.  And so he has to sit with that.  That's his problem, and I don't want to make it mine, too.  Here's something that happened this morning:  one of the smoke alarms started beeping because the battery was low.  My husband got frustrated because he couldn't find it.  He asked for my help.  I said, let me try the basement.  He said, no way is it in the basement, you're not hearing it right.  Instead of arguing, I simply went to the basement.  He told me not to go there, but I went anyway.  And it was beeping in the basement.  The point is, I didn't get sucked into an argument, and didn't say "I told you so."  I just focused on getting that annoying beeping to stop.  And then, when he replaced the batteries himself, I thanked him profusely.

Indeed, retirement was a tough transition for my husband.  I think he identifies with the role of being a provider.  Not earning a salary has been a hit to his ego, I think.  He also misses the social connections at work, and the intellectual stimulation.  Moreover, he misses the subsidized cafeteria, where he'd enjoy gourmet breakfasts and lunches every workday, and I can't possibly replicate the range of options at home.  Figuring out what to eat and what to do with all his spare time, and finding new friends and activities did not come easily.  Sometimes, I had to play cheerleader, suggesting all sorts of activities to get us out of the house.  I nudged him to volunteer in an area of interest, in addition to getting more active with sports.  That helped a lot.  But most of all, I try to heap on the praise.  When he contributes around the house, I'm sure to thank him and compliment his work.  And I mean it.  I try not to resent taking on more than my fair share of duties, because the alternative--constant fighting and broken household items--isn't worth it to me.  Yes the roles might seem to be a little reversed sometimes, and I try to be sensitive to that.  But I love my husband, I don't want to make him feel bad.  I think what I'm saying is I try to keep from triggering him too much.  "Triggers" include "reminders" of work that he should be doing but doesn.t want to.

[nodoover]

Wow, thank you so much for writing I needed to know there were people that understood what I am going through and figured out ways to survive it with a good mental attitude.

We are the same in most things you said, especially about the repairs. If I start any conversation telling him about something wrong with the house whether small or big he immediately flips out because he can't handle the thought of spending money to fix it or that he can't do it.

I have done some things myself, I have hired people when I can.  My biggest problem is he has no hobbies except our dog and doctor, grocery store and dog walks are pretty much only time he leaves the house.

I have tried to help with activities ideas but finally realized when nothing worked out that I was being too co-dependent.  I set up short travels to coast or camping throughout the year and that has helped him to get out.

He is very good at housework, something I very much appreciate after my ex did nothing.  He will wash dishes without being told but anything more he will do but I have to ask.

He is good at taking care of outside of house until his back hurts.

[CC43]

Hi again,

Your husband sounds similar to mine. My husband is good at taking care of the lawn, though I help on tasks that require bending over, such as weeding or picking up leaves and twigs. He takes charge of the lighting, the thermostat, the mail and the trash most of the time. I appreciate all that!  The more I show appreciation, the more willingly he seems to take care of things.

One approach is to propose an activity that you plan to carry out and invite him to join you. For example, every couple of days I’ll state, I’m going for a walk, do you want to come?  He’ll join me sometimes, which helps him get out of the house. For bigger activities, I’ll say, I want to see a hockey game on Friday night, would you care to join me?  If I take the initiative and invite him, he might come, though I doubt he’d ever propose something like that on his own. You might try this out. Even if your husband declines to join you, I think you should go anyway and enjoy yourself. If he sees you had fun, maybe he’ll join you the next time. Just a thought.

[nodoover]

Just to answer about getting out, I already ask him to walk with me and he does quite a bit or walks the dog alone sometimes if I can't.  The dog is the one thing he does.

I also set up things for us to do all the time from rides to the country, going out to eat, going to hear music, etc.  He says he appreciates my setting things up.  I don't ask him all the time as I need time by myself or with my friends too.

When I said he doesn't get out much I meant without me, except for dog and grocery store or medical appts.  I would love more time at home to have quiet time to do yoga, meditation etc.  Sometimes I get a bit frustrated and jealous that he gets all this time at home and I get very little.  But maybe he is jealous I go out with friends, or my classes, but he never says that.

Every 2-3 months I go to visit my daughter next state over, 6 hr drive and stay 5-6 days.  So he has plenty of time alone.  He used to act weird and start fights when I got back but he is used to it now and my reactions have changed so we no longer fight. I ignore him if he acts up so he doesn't as much.