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How to communicate after a contentious divorce... Following a contentious divorce and custody battle, there are often high emotion and tensions between the parents. Research shows that constant and chronic conflict between the parents negatively impacts the children. The children sense their parents anxiety in their voice, their body language and their parents behavior. Here are some suggestions from Dean Stacer on how to avoid conflict.
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Author Topic: Do You Ever Wonder if You Are Borderline?  (Read 2807 times)
seeperplexed

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« on: February 13, 2017, 08:07:25 PM »

Hey all... .last time I posted here I was an absolute shell of a person. Total nightmare after my breakup, which left me utterly traumatized and skinny and anxious. Bad times... .

But here I am, I'm about 3 1/2 months NC, and while still completely shaken up and ruminating, I am so much better. The pain subsides, but you must be loving of yourself.

One thing I have been struggling with recently, as I try to piece myself back together bit by bit, is the fear that I may actually be BPD myself. Is this a common concern, or is it actually a valid perspective? I have a history of impulsive behaviors, suicidal gestures, but this was my first romantic relationship. I sort of have a tendency to shy away from intimacy.
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« Reply #1 on: February 13, 2017, 10:08:31 PM »

It's best to see a professional for knowing these things to be honest.
Yes I have thought so in the past because the r/s with my ex was extremeley stressful I started acting out in ways I did not normally. And in my case, my ex kept insisting I was insane. If that is repeated and over to you many times eventually you will consider that as a possible reality and question your sanity. I was concerned about how I started handling things so I went to a professional to check. Nope I was not BPD. Perhaps I had some traits, but I think we all have some undesirable habits or traits being human. You are not necessarily BPD if you had suicidal tendencies or made gestures in the past or have intimacy issues. I was told I had an ambivalent attachment style which is known to do push/pull which appeared BPD like but it wasn't because I had BPD. I was just a stressed out non being gaslighted and projected onto by my ex. People do many things they regret or later feel embarrassed when feeling less in control of themselves and under a lot of pressure and or stress. Relationships can bring out the worst in you at times. I have also experienced loneliness and my own fears of abandonment after the breakup. After some time things gradually got better and I could truly see it was just that I was under a lot of stress and needed to dettach more to be more of my happier self again. NC  also helped with realising I'm not BPD and that I am fine without my ex. Again, best to seek professional advice.
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heartandwhole
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« Reply #2 on: February 14, 2017, 01:51:50 AM »

Hi seerperplexed,

You are not alone. Many members question if they might have BPD after these kinds of intense relationships and breakups. There is often a very loaded dynamic in these relationships that can take a while to unravel. Three and a half months is not that long, considering. I can tell you that I was still reeling with hurt at that point. But feelings DO change.

Have you been working with a therapist, seer? I found it very helpful. These behaviors you describe could be due to many things, none of which might be BPD. Only a professional (preferably experienced in personality disorders) can diagnose that.

The fear is normal and is likely to resolve as you recover from this breakup. Try not to worry about labels too much; just gather as much support around you as you can and keep taking good care of yourself as you process your experience. 

heartandwhole


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« Reply #3 on: February 14, 2017, 01:56:48 AM »

No. I think most people on here are NPD and don't realize it.
Yes I can see that. But, if they are NPD why would be trying to find answers? A true Narcissist would not be on here hurting. Although I do agree with you. Some members use No contact as a punishment.
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Freida

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« Reply #4 on: February 14, 2017, 02:18:05 AM »

Yes I did wonder but therapist did tests and I'm not. I also don't believe I have NPD. I do think I am co-dependant and look for love in all the wrong places. If anyone knows the 'right' places, please let me know or maybe I'll just love myself (NPD?)
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earlyL
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« Reply #5 on: February 14, 2017, 03:56:26 AM »

I have definitely questioned it but I am sure I am not now (but see a therapist so that has helped with that conclusion). I think it is right though that we all have BPD traits. I keep think back to the mirroring at the beginning of the relationship. It is a natural thing to do when you first meet someone you are interested in, but i do remember thinking there was something a bit creepy about my exBPD mirroring at the time, butI just ignored the red flag.

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Raul
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« Reply #6 on: February 14, 2017, 06:33:27 AM »

Hi Louise, interesting thoughts. When did you start analysing the mirroring? I was so naive it never even occurred to me, I was just in the frame of mind that this person was IT, the best person I encountered all my life, I was also 15 years older and had been around so it was like, this is what life and companionship is all about! It did change soon after we started living together and the arguments and the rage were over the top, always initiated by my ex, I must say I did not understand any of it, but I was so in love with her, obsessed my therapist says, that I just put up with everything and tried to fix everything! Pretty sad really... .
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earlyL
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« Reply #7 on: February 14, 2017, 08:28:01 AM »

Hi Raul,

I don't think you were naive at all, I worked with my exBPD partner first and was told quite a lot about her mental health issues beforehand so I don't know whether I was looking for stuff, I didn't know her diagnosis though. I can't think of any actual examples though, it was a feeling. I have done a lot of work with my T now on gut instincts and boy do I wish I had followed them.

I was really like you though, I totally fell into it all thinking it was the real deal, I had been single for 5 years and never been with a woman, I assumed it was so right because of all these things, I had never been with anyone so intense before, and who seemed so interested in me. I do remember the intense staring at me, and there is one incident where before we got together the way she looked at me it was a bit freaky, I remember walking away feeling relieved, and in my dark moments now I try to remember this. If I am truthful I now feel relieved at times. Since watching her discard me in my own home I don't miss her, I am sure that will come though, it is such a difficult process grief.

I was the same as you, I look back over my diaries and I even have written I don't think I would ever cope if she left me. She was such a huge part of my life. One of the things she said to me during her discard was 'you don't fulfil my needs anymore' I think she hit the nail on the head, I feel so sad that that's what the relationship was to her. I didn't feel she fulfilled me, I just felt we were a good team and in love. But it helps to think it wasn't going to mean the same to her I guess.
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Kelli Cornett
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« Reply #8 on: February 14, 2017, 09:13:57 AM »

Yes I can see that. But, if they are NPD why would be trying to find answers? A true Narcissist would not be on here hurting. Although I do agree with you. Some members use No contact as a punishment.

Yeah answers about BPD. Not themselves. Huge superiority complex it's all their fault, they are victim they did nothing wrong. That is completely NPD.
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jonmnemonic
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« Reply #9 on: February 14, 2017, 10:12:19 AM »

Yeah answers about BPD. Not themselves. Huge superiority complex it's all their fault, they are victim they did nothing wrong. That is completely NPD.

Sounds like you're projecting.
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SuperJew82
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« Reply #10 on: February 14, 2017, 12:01:05 PM »

It's funny - well not really: My ex BPD diagnosed girlfriend would tell me that I'm a narcissistic sociopath and she felt sorry for all of my friends that had to deal with me. I would make jokes oabout being the friendly caring sociopath with a big heart just to play off her projections.

Keep in mind - throughout the year and a half that I spent with her, I didn't meet one of her friends. She met at least a dozen maybe two dozen of my friends. I have about half a dozen really close friends I confide in. I have seen a therapist for getting through this relationship and have never been diagnosed with a personality disorder or anything. Everyone has NPD traits if you look hard enough. I have a caretaker mentality. I feel awesome when I can help someone, and I sometimes get teary eyed when I watch Disney movies with my daughters ( even though I'm a pretty manly dude! )
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jo19854
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« Reply #11 on: February 14, 2017, 01:09:17 PM »

Sounds like you're projecting.

Agree  100% with jonmnemonic

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hurting300
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« Reply #12 on: February 14, 2017, 01:51:56 PM »

Every relationship is different, I escalated arguments because when I'd catch her lying she'd shut down. In return that made me angry because I wanted answers. Does that make me borderline? No. Does her being in a different relationship every year and having guy friends do things for her borderline? Maybe not but it does show a bad "past". I'm done with labels. She was untrustworthy and a liar. She was selfish to me. Borderline or not I didn't need her.
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« Reply #13 on: February 14, 2017, 01:52:40 PM »

No. I think most people on here are NPD and don't realize it.

In my case, most certainly ✌️
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FallenOne
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« Reply #14 on: February 14, 2017, 02:11:29 PM »

No. I think most people on here are NPD and don't realize it.

Highly disagree with this... I am not a Narcissist... I don't even like talking about myself.
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Maboo

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« Reply #15 on: February 14, 2017, 03:53:05 PM »

Given I am seeing a therapist and about the same time past for me since breakup, I'll share some points that came up.

I too was questioning whether I have BPD traits or not after the relationship was over, most of it came from me looking back at the relationship and analyzing my reactions and behaviors.

My therapist brought it up several times. He negated the option of me having BPD and told me the reasons why someone who had a relationship with pwBPD have these thoughts. The first thing you should tell yourself, though, is that the fact you ask yourself if your behavior had some sort of BPD traits means that you are capable of looking at yourself and judging your actions, something that a pwBPD has less chances to do properly, especially during "crisis" times such as break ups, as their shields might not allow it. My therapist mentioned to me a few times that "in order to be with her, you must be a little 'crazy' by yourself. No one 'normal' can take it". It doesn't mean you are crazy, but that in order to be with the pwBPD, we tend to adjust ourselves in order to survive in this relationship. But for a non-BPD, they are simply stronger then us in their own game, and eventually, no matter how much we played by their rules, we might find ourselves out. He told me that one is very likely to develop temporary BPD traits while in the relationship, which fade away with time after the relationship is over.

Also, don't forget that labeling can always cause problems, and "BPD traits" as individuals can be a common thing, like abandonment anxiety, impulsiveness, depression. But the fact you can see those, meaning you can stand and look at them from "the side", that's your guarantee for sanity, in my opinion. I believe this is the reason why many pwBPDs fail to take themselves and stick with therapies. I admire and have enormous respect to pwBPDs who in case of realizing they might have a problem, take themselves to get treatment. I think it requires tons of courage from them, something that for nons can be very trivial. 
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« Reply #16 on: February 14, 2017, 04:31:20 PM »

Every relationship is different, I escalated arguments because when I'd catch her lying she'd shut down. In return that made me angry because I wanted answers. Does that make me borderline? No. Does her being in a different relationship every year and having guy friends do things for her borderline? Maybe not but it does show a bad "past". I'm done with labels. She was untrustworthy and a liar. She was selfish to me. Borderline or not I didn't need her.

You said it. Whatever you want to label it, it was simply torture. The lying was non-stop. Mine would blatantly lie to me. I would demand the truth. I would get a different lie. I would tell her that could not be true. She would tell me another version of the lie. Eventually, I would start accepting most of the minor lies - but then I'd put my foot down when she told a major lie. She could continue to lie with the evidence right in her face. She would sometimes admit to the lie, only to regroup later to say it was some kind of "test" or something illogical.

wow... .thank God we don't have to face that paranoia anymore.
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hurting300
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« Reply #17 on: February 15, 2017, 03:03:54 AM »

You said it. Whatever you want to label it, it was simply torture. The lying was non-stop. Mine would blatantly lie to me. I would demand the truth. I would get a different lie. I would tell her that could not be true. She would tell me another version of the lie. Eventually, I would start accepting most of the minor lies - but then I'd put my foot down when she told a major lie. She could continue to lie with the evidence right in her face. She would sometimes admit to the lie, only to regroup later to say it was some kind of "test" or something illogical.

wow... .thank God we don't have to face that paranoia anymore.
Tell you how bad it got. I had a smart phone if you put the wrong code in to unlock it 3 times it would snap a pic with the front camera. Well guess what? My phone was locked down. I ask her if she did it. The answer was NO. So I said well I have to take it to Verizon wireless to get it unlocked. I even told her I'd know because it snaps a pic. Guess who it was in the picture? My ex. I ask her why she lied. She locked down. Omg I was so angry.
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« Reply #18 on: February 15, 2017, 02:19:17 PM »

It's been said already, but never discount the ability to be "crazy by proximity" and also the intense projection by the BPD. You need to bend your mind a lot to accept BPD behaviour and their crazy making behaviour is bound to affect yours.

Mine made me anxious, depressed, lacking in sense of self.

But I know I am not BPD as these feelings receded after I split up with her and when I am not around her (thanks in part to a little mindfulness).

But to answer the original question... yep, I did question myself. I discussed it with my T and I started working on fixing residual issues I had (which is also distinguishing from someone who actually has BPD).
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hurting300
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« Reply #19 on: February 15, 2017, 04:32:31 PM »

Good job FSTL.
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« Reply #20 on: February 15, 2017, 07:29:38 PM »

I was friends with my ex for a few years before we became a couple, and during that time he was diagnosed with BPD by his psychiatrist. I had not seen the worst of his difficulties by this point, and although I had known him ever since he had his first girlfriend and was aware that all his intimate relationships had been brief and turbulent and usually ended with him accusing the other person of abusing him, I did wonder confusedly if the psychiatrist had made a mistake. With me he was rarely anything but gentle, funny, and good to be around (although looking back there were some warning signs - I saw him being very aggressive to people online and I knew even then that I didn't want to make him angry). Once we were in a relationship, his paranoia and insecurity came out, and his behaviour to me became progressively more volatile. I realised what his previous partners must have been dealing with. He would also accuse me of being abusive and crazy, at one point saying, "It's a good thing you're crazy. It's the only thing that stops you from being completely evil." I did doubt my sanity and my ethics for a while and wonder if I really was this awful person. But probably because I knew he had been formally diagnosed and I knew his relationships had all followed this pattern, I never wondered if I had BPD myself - I could recognise that all my previous relationships had been stable, for example. I am also not impulsive and my aspirations, interests, and beliefs have remained pretty constant, whereas he seemed to swap identities with the weather.
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« Reply #21 on: February 15, 2017, 08:18:20 PM »

since we can be influenced by a lot of things... .a partner with BPD can make you reflect their behavior.

If everybody acted like BPD it would be the normal behavior on the patterns of society.

If you get too deep into the BPD you start questioning yourself and going in circles... .its an expected result.

In my case i can see i started mirroring a lot of her behaviors and know that it is over i was pretty convinced that iam BPD and maybe she was just stressed by me.
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« Reply #22 on: February 16, 2017, 02:22:06 AM »

Im not borderline but i did have cptsd

Many of us are closer to their mental state than we think.
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« Reply #23 on: February 16, 2017, 02:39:56 AM »

I would agree with those here who say most of us are generally showing NPD traits or less degrees of narcissistic injury from childhood. At least this is my problem. The fact that you worry about having BPD is a clear sign that you don't probably have it. People with BPD can't even bring themselves to admit they are wrong about calling you bad names, how can you expect someone to diagnose themselves if that is how emotionally stunted they are?

You are emotionally aware, don't forget it and don't let their projections of their damage impact who you actually are!
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« Reply #24 on: February 16, 2017, 03:32:52 AM »

I too thought that after I we had broken up, but I do think it's just the remanence of mirroring your partner.  I have learned a fat amount about people with BPD on this site and I think that goes into play to.  

I don't have a fear of being alone because I can't handle being around people for long periods of time, and I would never cheat on my partner or want to go through many partners, however.

I do feel like I have carried on some symptoms, but I couldn't classify myself as BPD.


What are your symptoms?
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« Reply #25 on: February 16, 2017, 12:06:32 PM »

I've wondered that recently. I think that perhaps due the abuse I may have picked up some of her character traits. I find that I'm examining myself and actions more closely these days.
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« Reply #26 on: February 16, 2017, 12:27:13 PM »

a partner with BPD can make you reflect their behavior.

Mine made me anxious, depressed, lacking in sense of self.

question: do other people really have this sort of power over us?

some of the thoughts expressed in this thread are of the urban legend variety; namely, the idea that we can "catch" personality traits, and that if you are introspective and consider whether or not you have a personality disorder, that its a clear sign you do not have one. plenty of people with a personality disorder are introspective and question their behavior - short of being hospitalized, how else might someone be diagnosed?

what is true is that even an introspective person may lack objectivity, or the grounding to affect meaningful change in their lives. this applies to us as well.

roughly 50% of people romantically involved with someone with a personality disorder meet the criteria for one themselves. thats a pretty high, and sobering number. NPD and BPD is a legendarily compatible romantic combination. additionally, a hallmark of a "BPD relationship" is emotional immaturity in both partners.

personality traits and behaviors are two different things. we do not all have NPD or BPD traits (though many of us do). personality traits are deeply ingrained, much harder to change than behaviors. however, the behaviors that we refer to, are not unique to BPD or to personality disordered people. those behaviors, yes, are ones that we can all relate to on some level.

so what are the implications of this for us? our relationships have ended. its no longer about our exes, but us. presumably, we want to go on to have healthier relationships of all kinds in the future. this involves work. it involves facing some hard questions, and some hard truths, unique to each of us. theres a payoff of growth if we face it, and we all have room for improvement, as these relationships and our own behavior will attest to.

and if youre wondering if you have a personality disorder? see a therapist.
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« Reply #27 on: February 17, 2017, 10:42:51 AM »

we all have BPD characteristic in our-self. We all have narcissistic too. The problem with BPD that they show it a lot. If you got in the relationship with BPD and couldn't get out , then this is a problem with you.
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« Reply #28 on: February 17, 2017, 01:15:38 PM »

Hi all,

I wondered the same after my relationship ended and I explored the possibility with my T and she discounted it.

I do accept that I had / have narcissistic traits that played into the dynamic of my relationship.

As Onceremoved says there is well documented magnetic attraction between between borderlines and narcissists. The narcissist appears to offers the BPD a stable sense (it's false) and the BPD offers the narcissist - idealisation and a willingness to subsume their needs. These relationships can last for a while but without skilled therapy for both partners they rarely end well because neither partner is being authentic and both are disconnected from the real self. Typically the narcissist's false self ends up shattered into pieces.

If you're interested in reading more about it's worth taking a look at The Narcissistic / Borderline Couple: New Approaches to Marital Therapy
by Joan Lachkar

I'm not suggesting that all our relationships followed this dynamic but it's worth remembering that BPD and NPD exist on a spectrum, which means that this relationship dynamic can occur between two people who express NPB / BPD traits but not the full blow disorders.

And I think are a lot of members here whose partners exhibited BPD traits but wouldn't be diagnosed with the full blown disorder. This may well be true of some of us - who have narcissistic traits but not full blown NPD. This doesn't make these relationships any less destructive or painful. Understanding and owning our behaviour can be painful and uncomfortable it's is a great way to detach and move forward

Reforming
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« Reply #29 on: February 17, 2017, 10:54:57 PM »

People throw out labels way to much. I just wanted to help as well. I had no clue what BPD was.
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In the eye for an eye game, he who cares least, wins. I, for one. am never stepping into the ring with someone who is impulsive and doesn't think of the downstream consequences.
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