Wife dysregulated nearly half the time - we’re both deteriorating rapidly

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

  I have posted mainly on the “bettering a relationship” board, but the relationship continues to deteriorate. It feels like the ship is sinking, and I’m filled with anxiety, fear, sadness, regret, and shame. My uBPW wife of nearly 34  years has been steadily getting more and more dysregulated over the past 10 years since we retired. It seems as if she’s heading into a true mental health crisis, and it’s really really hard for both of us. We have two adult children, and we try to keep our marital conflict out of their lives, so they would be stunned to know what’s really going on behind closed doors. I’ve written about it elsewhere so I won’t go into detail here, but in the last couple of months, her extreme anger and rage has become apparent on almost half of the days, and even on the “good days” she always finds several opportunities to harshly criticize me for at least five or 10 minutes.

Briefly, she considers me a covert narcissist, autistic, financially abusive, guilty of coercive control, a womanizer and flirt, completely untrustworthy, etc. I am far from a perfect husband, and I may be mildly autistic (difficulty with social cues), and there is some truth to financial abuse if you consider frugality in the early years of our marriage. I thought I was creating a great life for her by being the breadwinner while she could stay at home and concentrate on raising the children, and she seemed to be just fine with it at the time, but now she looks at her life as an opportunity wasted to achieve bigger things. I am guilty, in a much milder sense, of some of those things, but one thing that I am not, and she is convinced of, is that I am a flirt, and I’m looking to have another woman. I would say I do have some of the traits of covert narcissism, but I don’t have it at the disorder level, that’s for sure. But as I hear these and many other criticisms over and over and over again, I start to wonder if they’re true. She thinks that I am 100% to blame for all of our problems as a couple and for any of the struggles that our adult children have. She has even reached the point now where she doesn’t want to be out in public with me for fear of how I will behave, either flirting with women or trying to look like an impressive person.

I am an introvert, codependent, with a deep fear of abandonment. I have been as supportive, validating, and empathetic as I know how to be. I have tried not to JADE, although I do sometimes. I have assured her repeatedly of my devotion to our marriage and that I am not looking for another woman, but she doesn’t believe me, and it’s almost a daily threat of divorce now. This is so corrosive to my morale, and I see how much she is suffering, and it is heartbreaking. Lately most evenings we don’t even eat dinner together, and we spend the evening in our separate bedrooms.

I guess I’m just venting. I feel hopeless. I found this website extremely helpful, and I’ve looked at “rage phobia” and the distress tolerance techniques in particular.

I really don’t want to divorce, but I may not have a choice. Should I be secretly planning in the background just in case? I don’t want to follow through unless I’m forced to, say, if she moves out or wants me to move out.

She keeps mentioning finding a therapist, but nothing seems to happen.

Any thoughts or words of encouragement?  Does anyone know how to deal with a deep fear of abandonment?  Thanks for listening.

[GrayJay]

  I have posted mainly on the “bettering a relationship” board, but the relationship continues to deteriorate. It feels like the ship is sinking, and I’m filled with anxiety, fear, sadness, regret, and shame. My uBPW wife of nearly 34  years has been steadily getting more and more dysregulated over the past 10 years since we retired. It seems as if she’s heading into a true mental health crisis, and it’s really really hard for both of us. We have two adult children, and we try to keep our marital conflict out of their lives, so they would be stunned to know what’s really going on behind closed doors. I’ve written about it elsewhere so I won’t go into detail here, but in the last couple of months, her extreme anger and rage has become apparent on almost half of the days, and even on the “good days” she always finds several opportunities to harshly criticize me for at least five or 10 minutes.

Briefly, she considers me a covert narcissist, autistic, financially abusive, guilty of coercive control, a womanizer and flirt, completely untrustworthy, etc. I am far from a perfect husband, and I may be mildly autistic (difficulty with social cues), and there is some truth to financial abuse if you consider frugality in the early years of our marriage. I thought I was creating a great life for her by being the breadwinner while she could stay at home and concentrate on raising the children, and she seemed to be just fine with it at the time, but now she looks at her life as an opportunity wasted to achieve bigger things. I am guilty, in a much milder sense, of some of those things, but one thing that I am not, and she is convinced of, is that I am a flirt, and I’m looking to have another woman. I would say I do have some of the traits of covert narcissism, but I don’t have it at the disorder level, that’s for sure. But as I hear these and many other criticisms over and over and over again, I start to wonder if they’re true. She thinks that I am 100% to blame for all of our problems as a couple and for any of the struggles that our adult children have. She has even reached the point now where she doesn’t want to be out in public with me for fear of how I will behave, either flirting with women or trying to look like an impressive person.

I am an introvert, codependent, with a deep fear of abandonment. I have been as supportive, validating, and empathetic as I know how to be. I have tried not to JADE, although I do sometimes. I have assured her repeatedly of my devotion to our marriage and that I am not looking for another woman, but she doesn’t believe me, and it’s almost a daily threat of divorce now. This is so corrosive to my morale, and I see how much she is suffering, and it is heartbreaking. Lately most evenings we don’t even eat dinner together, and we spend the evening in our separate bedrooms.

I guess I’m just venting. I feel hopeless. I found this website extremely helpful, and I’ve looked at “rage phobia” and the distress tolerance techniques in particular.

I really don’t want to divorce, but I may not have a choice. Should I be secretly planning in the background just in case? I don’t want to follow through unless I’m forced to, say, if she moves out or wants me to move out.

She keeps mentioning finding a therapist, but nothing seems to happen.

Any thoughts or words of encouragement?  Does anyone know how to deal with a deep fear of abandonment?  Thanks for listening.

[Rowdy]

Hi GrayJay

Sounds like exactly the same dynamics of my wife (now my ex) and I’s relationship.

I too am an introvert and I can see now became co dependant.
I also may be on the spectrum for autism too, which was also down to my wife pushing me to go and see the dr because she believed I had a problem. Whether that is true or not I don’t know, I did fill in a couple of questionnaires from the dr, one for autism and one for adhd, which led to the dr putting me forward for an official diagnosis but that was over 2 years ago and I haven’t heard a thing since.

Like you I would be accused of financially abusing her. Everyone is on a baseline level of narcissism to some extent, it’s how we survive as a human race, but it doesn’t make us a narcissist unless we display obvious narcissistic traits. I think to some extent because of the dysregulated behave we are subject to we have to be narcissistic, or how the partner might perceive being as narcissistic, to cope with some of their behaviour.

I would also be accused of all sorts of adulterous behaviour, to the extent that I would actively try and avoid making eye contact with a female, striking up conversation with a female, talking about a female, and fearing any female ringing me about any work they wanted done (being self employed in property maintenance)

We were together 27 years but got together at a fairly young age so still have a way to go until retirement age. We split up because my wife blindsided me by monkey branching. Yes the red flags were there but because of her seemingly intense love and adoration and my lack of knowledge of bpd even existing, even though I can now see where she would split I still didn’t think she would leave me like that. I always considered I had a secure attachment style which I think might have been part of the problem, because I felt emotionally secure she may have seen this in her mind as a lack of caring. Anyone that knew us knew that was not the case and I did everything I could to support her and show her I loved her.

So what have I learnt coming out of the relationship.
Am I a narcissist? Well, no. If I was I doubt I would have put up with her behaviour for 27 years. The way she discarded me I would have just walked away, or probably destroyed her and her bf in seconds. Was I financially abusing her? No, she is mentally ill and part of her behaviour and one of the criteria on the DSM is her impulsive overspending. I on the other hand am sensible, and I will not spend what I haven’t got. While early on in our marriage I worked full time to support our young family she went to my place of work and had a row with my boss because she hated me going to work and leaving her (fear of abandonment) and wanted me to quit my job so she could work full time, open a business and I look after the kids. I’d work part time too, but she was the main bread winner then. If I went to pay for something she would always take over and pay for it, even a few months ago because our son and his girlfriend are expecting our first grandchild, we went to a local pub to meet his girlfriends parents, I was in the middle of buying a round and she came in and took over insisting on paying. But she would always accuse me of being tight fisted.
When we split up she stayed in the family home for a few months and told me to transfer the household payments I made into her name.  She couldn’t understand why her outgoings doubled because she insisted I paid for nothing, yet the reality was I paid for half of our household outgoings. She monkey branched because, as she told our son her new bf can support her financially better than I can. This is probably true but in my book is a shocking reason to leave someone and shows a lack of morals.

Am I autistic. Again I’m not so sure about that. Although I do have a tendency to answer posts like this where I talk about my own situation in an attempt to draw parallels and get my message across which does seem to be how an autistic person communicates so I might well be. Being an introvert and my ex being highly extroverted, she just suppressed me. That’s what walking on eggshells around someone does to you. You become withdrawn and a shell of your former self. In the beginning like I said I would work, and I would work long hours to support our family. I taught my wife a lot about control, told her how to sort her financial problems out, how to cook a meal without getting stressed and overwhelmed and get dysregulated. She was like a lamb to some extent at the beginning and I was a bit like a shepherd, yet she quickly turned into a wolf.

Her best friends partner (her real best friend that she has known since she was a 5 year old, not the fake best friends she seems to cycle through and discard) and I have spoken a lot since we split up. He said to me recently I have been a lot more talkative and spoken with him and had a hell of a lot more interesting conversations with him. While I will always be an introvert I am finding myself again and realise, although I always knew, that I was being suppressed by my wife. You kind of know that while you are in the relationship, but it’s only now after a couple of years you begin to realise just how much. I even did karaoke for the first time last year and was told by everyone that I was brilliant and had the whole room clapping, something I would never have done if I was still in that relationship because she liked to be the centre of attention. Sounds silly I know, but the woman I am now in a relationship with was working behind the bar that night and she had already been interested in me for nearly a year and at that moment she said made her realise she wanted to be with me.

You mention her finding a therapist. I have not read any of your previous posts so forgive me I don’t know if she is diagnosed bpd or is self aware. My wife hasn’t, and isn’t although I’ve told her since we split up that I believe she has a personality disorder that has played a massive part in her behaviour and our marriage breakup. She is also mid 40’s so still has some ability to charm men into a relationship with her, I am not aware of your wife’s age but am guessing post retirement age. Not wanting to sound harsh but the older we get the less chances there are running off with someone else. Maybe that is being somewhat misogynistic and you can never say it won’t happen but I believe there is some truth to that.

But the takeaway from that long winded message is there is a certain amount of projection and gaslighting going on here. She more likely has a mental illness so the reality is you probably are not autistic, not financially abusive, not narcissistic or any of things she has accused you of, but instead you might just be suppressed, sensible in a financial sense and defensive at times against her behaviour.

There is hope. If your wife is self aware then hopefully you can convince her to seek therapy, it’s for her own good as well as yours. I never wanted to split up with my wife, but again now that I have there is hope. I consider myself to be in a better relationship now. Certainly far less stress and I’m finding myself again. As for the fear of abandonment you have, I can’t answer in the sense that all the time I was in that relationship I was not aware of having a fear of abandonment. At the end of the day, we can not control another persons thoughts and feelings, and stressing about something out of our control is wasted energy. If you have a fear of abandonment and codependency issues are you seeing a therapist yourself as that would be your best course for developing ways to deal with these issues.

[Notwendy]

We have two adult children, and we try to keep our marital conflict out of their lives, so they would be stunned to know what’s really going on behind closed doors.

Yes, stunned at the severity of it but I doubt they are entirely unaware.

While you have stated the cause is your wife's focus on social media messages, is there anything else you can point to as to why the situation has worsened in the past 10 years?

For my parents, I think my father's retirement made him more available to my BPD mother to project her thinking. He also had co-dependent tendencies. His presence also served as an emotional release for her- to project, and her behavior got his attention, so it was a self reinforcing situation. While he used to not be available to her when he was at work, after retirement, she could contact him at any time. If he went out somewhere, she could still call him every few minutes.

I would second the suggestion for you to get counseling, to help you cope and also to be able to get some way to have time to yourself, so to possibly change this increased spiral.

[maxsterling]

Regarding the ASD diagnosis - be careful here.  My bpdW makes that claim about me, too, when she is dysregulated.  It’s a form of projection and putting the blame on you for communication issues.  I’ve brought up my potential ASD with 3 therapists who all laughed me put of the room, telling me that pain for an evaluation was a guaranteed waste of money.  We then discussed the behaviors W claims are ASD, and concluded that these behaviors are most present when dealing with bpdW and are most likely trauma related and/or coping mechanisms. In other words, “not communicating clearly” only happens when dealing with her and stems from an intense fear of saying the wrong thing.  It’s not because I don’t see social cues.

[Rowdy]

Regarding the ASD diagnosis - be careful here.  My bpdW makes that claim about me, too, when she is dysregulated.  It’s a form of projection and putting the blame on you for communication issues.  I’ve brought up my potential ASD with 3 therapists who all laughed me put of the room, telling me that pain for an evaluation was a guaranteed waste of money.  We then discussed the behaviors W claims are ASD, and concluded that these behaviors are most present when dealing with bpdW and are most likely trauma related and/or coping mechanisms. In other words, “not communicating clearly” only happens when dealing with her and stems from an intense fear of saying the wrong thing.  It’s not because I don’t see social cues.

This. My brother laughs at me when the suggestion I have autism is brought up and he absolutely shuts that down. He does however dismiss my concerns my ex has bpd as nonsense and she is just mental. My eldest son did mention it a couple of nights ago though and said he doesn’t think I am autistic.

I always felt different but that may just be my introverted nature. Certainly nothing that impacts my day to day life. But my ex used to mention it, and did so one time at a family dinner where her mother turned round and said yeh I know or something similar. Bear in mind my ex’s mother has never told her kids she loves them, and never cuddled them or showed any affection. Her mother (ex’s grandmother) also was sectioned under mental health several times and conflict and lack of love has been passed down from generation to generation. More likely than not projection.

[SuperDaddy]

Hi GrayJay,

She is not afraid that you will cheat. In the past, maybe she was, but not now that you've retired. All of those accusations are fabrications of her unconscious mind to create a dramatic scenario and put herself in an "emergency situation", because this is how she gets the reward from her endogenous opioids. This is a self-destructive behavior, but it is uncontrollable and unconscious.

She will not move out nor tell you to move out. Unless you start to threaten her to move out, then she will echo that. But that echoing will be criticism, not an actual request. The reality is that she doesn't want you to leave, because you are her source of "relief." Research has found that pwBPD have a very low baseline tone of endogenous opioids (which is painful), but they also get an exaggerated tone when under stress (which causes relief and is rewarding). So she needs to create some stress with you to feel better.

Reference: https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC6863154/

In this video, why do you think Andrew felt relief when waiting for the train to run over him? He could see his shadow, so he was backwards to the train but didn't worry. All of them, Andrew, Kyra, and Christina, describe that they get relief when they are cutting themselves (see 17:15).

The problem is that this opioid-seeking behavior can become addictive, especially in intimate relationships, especially when you are 24/7 with that person, and it gets even worse if you are codependent. It gets to a point in which the pwBPD will create the stressful situation just for the reward, when they don't actually need any relief. Since you retired, your wife has begun to develop this addiction, slowly. It's like a smoker who gradually increases the number of nicotine receptors in their brain. The more months and years go by, the harder it is for the smoker to quit smoking. In that same video at 13:28, why do you think Christina was obsessed about telling everyone that she should be able to use the markers on the papers?

In my case, the only solution was to have a "Living Apart Together" relationship. And I'm hoping that medication and therapy will resolve the problem. If you aren't ready to do that, then you can gradually start to spend more and more time out of home, but when you get back it will be tough and you'll be accused of cheating anyway. Is there any job you can take?