Where do I even begin?

[Depression = 72% of members]

Mostly, I just need to talk... .I need someone to hear me and understand what I'm going through... .this post will come across as rather disjointed... .I'm still dealing with the grief of our break up... .the humiliation and disrespect I've suffered... .her sexual misbehavior... .bear with me... .I'm pretty sure my wife has BPD.  The best news in all this is that she is in therapy... .and it looks like she's willing to work with the therapist... .there isn't a dx of BPD yet... .but I think that's where this is heading... .today her therapist recommended a psychiatric evaluation. 

We've been married 9 years... .she's significantly younger than I am... .by 22 years.  We have four children... .3 biologically mine... .one she brought into the marriage.

A few weeks ago we had a major fight... .after the argument she left with the children at 9PM and drove five hours to her mother's house... .she came back... .left the children with me... .and went to a friend's house.  As it stands now, we plan to reconcile... .my condition was that she continue the therapy she recently began, and that we do couples therapy... .and I have my own first counseling appointment next week.  We plan to live apart for at least another week... .maybe longer.

The fight that set this off involves suspected infidelity.  To make matters worse, the suspected partner is her cousin's 22 year old son... .so... .first cousin once removed?  Second cousin?

Back in December she told me her cousin was back from Germany (we live in the Czech Republic) and was a bit down due to a break up and wanted to spend time with her... .no problem.  But I started to get an "edgy" feeling... .they were finding too many opportunities to be alone together... .some of the stories didn't  add up about where they had been or what they we doing.  She fell and hurt her ankle so he came to stay with us and help her with the kids while I was at work... .I came home early from work one day to find them sitting on the couch together, her leaning up against him, their legs laid over top of one another... .seemed weird and I mentioned it... .and I was a bit frustrated with the amount of time they spent together sitting in the kitchen talking or staying up watching movies after everyone went to bed.

One evening she was going to a dance club with some family friends and took him with her... .after she left I was straightening the house and went to close her underwear drawer... .and found one of those photo booth picture strips of the two of them kissing... .big fight... .I kicked him out of my house... .she disappeared from the dance club in one of her "flight" panics.  The excuse they both offered was that the picture was taken and sent to the exgirlfriend to make her jealous because he wanted her back... .and I believed this nonsense because I didn't want to believe my wife would have a fling with her own cousin... .I even got a message from the ex girlfriend on FB after I tried to contact her... .stating yes... .they sent her the picture... .but she knew it was my wife and her ex... .later... .so I actually let the punk move back into my house because he'd taken a job in the area and if he went back home his commute would be 3 hours one way... .later I discovered my wife created a FB page in early January and that was where this message came from... .her... .she had created a second FB page... .and was listed on HIS FB page as his "girlfriend"... .his Instagram... .had pictures of them together... .never showing her face... .but pictures of them holding hands... .etc... .The exgirlfriend did eventually contact me... .after I created an Instagram account... .and she forwarded me text messages between my wife and her cousin... .she had his FB password after the break up... .he didn't change it... .the messages were VERY sexual explicit and while not 100% certain... .I'm convinced they had an ongoing sexual affair.  I beat the 22 year old punk... .so many things I ignored... .forced myself to believe so as not to confront the idea that my wife was cheating with her cousin... .two black eyes, a broken nose, and a concussion... .that was the night she ran off to Germany... .I'm not proud that I beat him, but I think it's understandable.  She claims the ex-girlfriend faked the messages... .which while possible... .is highly unlikely.

She's had a history of texting guys... .almost always old school friends she's reconnecting with... .and it quickly turns into sexting... .I've caught her at this at least four times... .at least once one of the guys came to our flat while I was at work... .

She's admitted to one affair (with her first serious boyfriend) and I suspect others... .including the cousin.  In her fourth pregnancy she was diagnosed with chlamydia... .I have been 100% faithful and was tested after my divorce from my ex... .so it didn't come from me... .she and the midwife explained that possibly it wasn't screened for in Czech and Germany when she was pregnant... .and that sometimes the tests miss it... .and to keep the peace I "accepted" this explanation.

She lied about who she was when we met... .she claimed... .at the age of 20... .to have been with only two men... .her first boyfriend (the one she later cheated with) and the father of our son (I've adopted him).  She really came across as a modest young lady... .we dated for almost  a year... .most of our courting consisted of taking walks... .going to dinner... .watching TV together... .we were 3 months into the relationship before sex started... .she really came off as the shy modest innocent girl she said she was... .After catching her sexting we had a big blow up... .and then a few weeks later went to dinner where she told me the partial truth about herself.  Between boyfriend number one and the father of our son... .in a two year period... .at least 30 sexual partners... .drugs... .etc. 

She lies about little things... .about big things... .sometimes she doesn't even know she's told a lie.  She lied about who she was.  When I found pictures of a guys johnson on her phone she said it was sent to her phone by someone she didn't know... .that she hadn't requested it... .didn't chat with him.  The first texting incident she at first tried to claim she was talking with this guy for her girlfriend... .she later admitted the truth. 

When I caught her sexting another ex boyfriend she tried to claim she was actually sexting with his wife... .somehow that was supposed to be better.  She gave her dad $1500 without telling me... .in June she took out a loan for $1500 without telling me (she as no job outside the home)... .

When we first met, and into the first year of our marriage she was affectionate and enjoyed sex... .she has since become distant... .it's quite rare that we ever cuddled... .that she gives me tender words... .that she expresses appreciation for the lifestyle my hard work affords us.  She does things she either truly doesn't remember doing... .or really doesn't remember doing.  She's gotten onto my FB and blocked people... .and then denies doing it... .and in at least one case... .where she had no reason to lie about it... .says she didn't block a person on my FB account.

I could go on, but at this point I'm just rambling... .my sister is a psychologist... .I gave her a full history of our marriage after I found the picture of her kissing her cousin.  After describing all the behaviors in a much more coherent fashion than presented here my sister mentioned BPD as one possible dx.  After reading the criterion it's like reading a template of my wife.  She's only apologetic for her behavior when she things I'm ready to call it quits.  She loves attention, excitement, gets bored easily, wants to be a 30 year old wife and mother... .yet also wants to be an 18 year old girl with no responsibilities (her words).

she invited this man to live with us... .the disrespect... .making ME feel guilty for HER behavior.  When I found the picture it wasn't HER fault for taking the picture (supposedly to make the exgirlfriend jealous), it was my fault because I was snooping.  When I confronted her with the text messages it wasn't her fault... .it was mine because I refused to believe the story and had the audacity to contact the exgirlfriend.

I love her, I don't want to divorce her... .but I can't live like this any longer... .too much humiliation... .but I love her... .she's not a bad person... .she's a lovable person with a problem.  I am firm on this... .if she doesn't go through with the therapy I'm gone... .I will try to get custody of my kids... .but will always stay close so they have stability... .but I won't live like this any longer.

As she goes through treatment I expect lots of bumps... .I don't think her texting is over... .I don't think her infidelity is over... .but as long as she is attempting to address the problem then I will stay with her and support her... .and I'm scared as hell.

[daverisk]

Mostly, I just need to talk... .I need someone to hear me and understand what I'm going through... .this post will come across as rather disjointed... .I'm still dealing with the grief of our break up... .the humiliation and disrespect I've suffered... .her sexual misbehavior... .bear with me... .I'm pretty sure my wife has BPD.  The best news in all this is that she is in therapy... .and it looks like she's willing to work with the therapist... .there isn't a dx of BPD yet... .but I think that's where this is heading... .today her therapist recommended a psychiatric evaluation. 

We've been married 9 years... .she's significantly younger than I am... .by 22 years.  We have four children... .3 biologically mine... .one she brought into the marriage.

A few weeks ago we had a major fight... .after the argument she left with the children at 9PM and drove five hours to her mother's house... .she came back... .left the children with me... .and went to a friend's house.  As it stands now, we plan to reconcile... .my condition was that she continue the therapy she recently began, and that we do couples therapy... .and I have my own first counseling appointment next week.  We plan to live apart for at least another week... .maybe longer.

The fight that set this off involves suspected infidelity.  To make matters worse, the suspected partner is her cousin's 22 year old son... .so... .first cousin once removed?  Second cousin?

Back in December she told me her cousin was back from Germany (we live in the Czech Republic) and was a bit down due to a break up and wanted to spend time with her... .no problem.  But I started to get an "edgy" feeling... .they were finding too many opportunities to be alone together... .some of the stories didn't  add up about where they had been or what they we doing.  She fell and hurt her ankle so he came to stay with us and help her with the kids while I was at work... .I came home early from work one day to find them sitting on the couch together, her leaning up against him, their legs laid over top of one another... .seemed weird and I mentioned it... .and I was a bit frustrated with the amount of time they spent together sitting in the kitchen talking or staying up watching movies after everyone went to bed.

One evening she was going to a dance club with some family friends and took him with her... .after she left I was straightening the house and went to close her underwear drawer... .and found one of those photo booth picture strips of the two of them kissing... .big fight... .I kicked him out of my house... .she disappeared from the dance club in one of her "flight" panics.  The excuse they both offered was that the picture was taken and sent to the exgirlfriend to make her jealous because he wanted her back... .and I believed this nonsense because I didn't want to believe my wife would have a fling with her own cousin... .I even got a message from the ex girlfriend on FB after I tried to contact her... .stating yes... .they sent her the picture... .but she knew it was my wife and her ex... .later... .so I actually let the punk move back into my house because he'd taken a job in the area and if he went back home his commute would be 3 hours one way... .later I discovered my wife created a FB page in early January and that was where this message came from... .her... .she had created a second FB page... .and was listed on HIS FB page as his "girlfriend"... .his Instagram... .had pictures of them together... .never showing her face... .but pictures of them holding hands... .etc... .The exgirlfriend did eventually contact me... .after I created an Instagram account... .and she forwarded me text messages between my wife and her cousin... .she had his FB password after the break up... .he didn't change it... .the messages were VERY sexual explicit and while not 100% certain... .I'm convinced they had an ongoing sexual affair.  I beat the 22 year old punk... .so many things I ignored... .forced myself to believe so as not to confront the idea that my wife was cheating with her cousin... .two black eyes, a broken nose, and a concussion... .that was the night she ran off to Germany... .I'm not proud that I beat him, but I think it's understandable.  She claims the ex-girlfriend faked the messages... .which while possible... .is highly unlikely.

She's had a history of texting guys... .almost always old school friends she's reconnecting with... .and it quickly turns into sexting... .I've caught her at this at least four times... .at least once one of the guys came to our flat while I was at work... .

She's admitted to one affair (with her first serious boyfriend) and I suspect others... .including the cousin.  In her fourth pregnancy she was diagnosed with chlamydia... .I have been 100% faithful and was tested after my divorce from my ex... .so it didn't come from me... .she and the midwife explained that possibly it wasn't screened for in Czech and Germany when she was pregnant... .and that sometimes the tests miss it... .and to keep the peace I "accepted" this explanation.

She lied about who she was when we met... .she claimed... .at the age of 20... .to have been with only two men... .her first boyfriend (the one she later cheated with) and the father of our son (I've adopted him).  She really came across as a modest young lady... .we dated for almost  a year... .most of our courting consisted of taking walks... .going to dinner... .watching TV together... .we were 3 months into the relationship before sex started... .she really came off as the shy modest innocent girl she said she was... .After catching her sexting we had a big blow up... .and then a few weeks later went to dinner where she told me the partial truth about herself.  Between boyfriend number one and the father of our son... .in a two year period... .at least 30 sexual partners... .drugs... .etc. 

She lies about little things... .about big things... .sometimes she doesn't even know she's told a lie.  She lied about who she was.  When I found pictures of a guys johnson on her phone she said it was sent to her phone by someone she didn't know... .that she hadn't requested it... .didn't chat with him.  The first texting incident she at first tried to claim she was talking with this guy for her girlfriend... .she later admitted the truth. 

When I caught her sexting another ex boyfriend she tried to claim she was actually sexting with his wife... .somehow that was supposed to be better.  She gave her dad $1500 without telling me... .in June she took out a loan for $1500 without telling me (she as no job outside the home)... .

When we first met, and into the first year of our marriage she was affectionate and enjoyed sex... .she has since become distant... .it's quite rare that we ever cuddled... .that she gives me tender words... .that she expresses appreciation for the lifestyle my hard work affords us.  She does things she either truly doesn't remember doing... .or really doesn't remember doing.  She's gotten onto my FB and blocked people... .and then denies doing it... .and in at least one case... .where she had no reason to lie about it... .says she didn't block a person on my FB account.

I could go on, but at this point I'm just rambling... .my sister is a psychologist... .I gave her a full history of our marriage after I found the picture of her kissing her cousin.  After describing all the behaviors in a much more coherent fashion than presented here my sister mentioned BPD as one possible dx.  After reading the criterion it's like reading a template of my wife.  She's only apologetic for her behavior when she things I'm ready to call it quits.  She loves attention, excitement, gets bored easily, wants to be a 30 year old wife and mother... .yet also wants to be an 18 year old girl with no responsibilities (her words).

she invited this man to live with us... .the disrespect... .making ME feel guilty for HER behavior.  When I found the picture it wasn't HER fault for taking the picture (supposedly to make the exgirlfriend jealous), it was my fault because I was snooping.  When I confronted her with the text messages it wasn't her fault... .it was mine because I refused to believe the story and had the audacity to contact the exgirlfriend.

I love her, I don't want to divorce her... .but I can't live like this any longer... .too much humiliation... .but I love her... .she's not a bad person... .she's a lovable person with a problem.  I am firm on this... .if she doesn't go through with the therapy I'm gone... .I will try to get custody of my kids... .but will always stay close so they have stability... .but I won't live like this any longer.

As she goes through treatment I expect lots of bumps... .I don't think her texting is over... .I don't think her infidelity is over... .but as long as she is attempting to address the problem then I will stay with her and support her... .and I'm scared as hell.

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[livednlearned]

Hi daverisk,

I'm sorry for the pain and suffering that brings you here, and glad you found the site.

You've been through a long string of hurt and grief, wow.

Did your wife seek therapy for herself? Do you have a way to gauge whether she attended or not?

While things cool down it's probably a good idea to take a break from one another.

How are the kids doing? What's their relationship like with you? With their mom?

Hang in there. I know what you're going through is tough.

LnL

[daverisk]

Lnl,

Thanks for acknowledging my pain. 

The children are confused... .scared... .trying to normalize life.  They know something is wrong... .but not what.  The four-year old is in regression... .peed her pants yesterday for the first time in over a year.  The eight-year old has security issues.  Says things like, "I love you daddy, I love you because you'll never leave us"  She's being saying things like this for the last two months... .she knows something isn't right.  The other two are just trying to normalize life.  We've told the kids she is staying with her grandmother to help her (she's very sick)... .and they Mom every day after school for a few hours. 

After we had our argument about the picture... .she left for a night... .she was in the club with our friends dancing and just grabbed her jacket and left without a word to anyone.  The next day our friend picked her up in the village next to us.  She says she stayed in a hotel... .alone... .but I have no idea.  That was the day she fell and hurt her ankle.  That day she told me about feeling overwhelmed being a 30 year old mother of 4... .a wife... etc.  The next day she went to the doctor for the ankle... .asked for something for her depression... .and was referred to the therapist.

Is she really going?  I think so... .after her 3 times a week sessions she's normally more calm... .and more open with her feelings... .

It was a HUGE step for her to be able to share the psychologists suggestion she see a psychiatrist... .she seemed to be genuinely scared.  The therapist mentioned the idea of Dissociative Identity Disorder after whatever happened yesterday in counseling.

While DID is possible... .this seems more like BPD to me.  My ex-wife has DID... .(I seem to be attracted to women with mental/emotional issues... .either that or I cause them  )... .while I see some dissociative behavior in my wife... .that can be related to BPD as much as DID.

Her behavior has really spiraled over the last few months... .is this typical?  She's maintaining an "extreme" hair style... .long fake lashes... .longer fake fingernails... .younger clothes... .she's had at least six new tattoos in 3 months... .perhaps more... .one matching tattoo with the cousin/lover that will be hard for me to deal with.  She is definitely in some type of crisis period.

The original plan was for me to stay with the kids during the week... .and have her here on weekends... .but she changed her mind about that and will stay at the friends on the weekend as well.  Part of me sees the rationale... .stability for the kids... .not wanting me to need to find a place to stay... and it's a way for her to make sure I don't go anywhere... .when she came home with the kids and saw my packed suitcase in the hallway she had a meltdown... .but it also provides her the opportunity to engage in her extreme behavior... .I know she is staying with the friend... .I don't know what she does in the evenings.

Since I am 22 years older, I always assumed (but didn't like the idea) that as I got older and unable to perform that she would take a lover... .now I'm reconciling myself to the fact that as she goes through her treatment process she will almost certainly engage in more texting... .and quite possibly in more infidelity... .and trying to decide if I can live with that... .with the hope that on the other side of this is a beautiful life together.  I definitely need to establish some boundaries... .I guess (hope) my therapist can help me work through these issues.

[livednlearned]

Her behavior has really spiraled over the last few months... .is this typical?  She's maintaining an "extreme" hair style... .long fake lashes... .longer fake fingernails... .younger clothes... .she's had at least six new tattoos in 3 months... .perhaps more... .one matching tattoo with the cousin/lover that will be hard for me to deal with.  She is definitely in some type of crisis period.

I have read that changing appearance (identity) can be a sign of a dysregulation or more serious crisis.

the hope that on the other side of this is a beautiful life together.  I definitely need to establish some boundaries... .I guess (hope) my therapist can help me work through these issues.

That's great you are seeing a T. You are aware of your values in terms of her infidelity, and yet I can see how you'll need to figure out how to reconcile your boundaries around those behaviors so that your values matter, too.

Therapy for her could be stabilizing during the early part of treatment. Sometimes things get worse before they get better, too.

When will the psychiatric evaluation occur?

[daverisk]

We live in a country with socialized medicine... .it could be months.  Her grandmother, who has dementia... .waited six months for an evaluation.  It would probably be faster if we paid for it out of pocket.  This is a topic I want to discuss with her, but I don't want to push her either.  A gentle nudge might push her to do the evaluation more quickly... .or it might push her to resist the help she's already getting.

[JoeBPD81]

Wow, daverisk, that's a tough story.

I was married for 11 years but with a long relationship even before that. She was much more social than I was, and men liked her. She had feelings for a couple of guys during our dating period, and it was very hurtful, she was my first girlfriend and I didn't have eyes for anyone else. I didn't fully trusted her from then on, I didn't though she was cheating, but I couldn't believe she loved me for real, part of us died. I had to keep my distance and I couldn't be totally in love with her any more, I couldn't afford that. So for me she was more like a best friend, and a daughter, some who I loved spending time with, and then bother with couple's stuff. She was attractive and my first and only sex partner, so I didn't complain.

I used to think "maybe she's cheating" I had no suspicions, or rarely, but I thought about being prepared. Finding out hurts like hell, knowing you trusted and  believed this person. So I used to think "as long as I don't find out and she still wants to be with me, it's ok". And then, " if she stops wanting to be with me, what can I do?, it's ok too, I don't own her." With this, and that, my boundaries became walls, I needed so much distance in order not to be hurt by her, by her moods, her selfishness, her abuse, her disrespect... .That I wasn't sure I loved her anymore. Long story short, I left after the hardest year of my life.

I guess my point is, she might or might not have cheated, but otherwise our life was pretty easy and comfortable. I didn't ask much and she asked quite a bit, but it was easy. Now that I have a BPD girlfriend, if I wasn't devoted to her, this wouldn't work. All the sacrifices we do, for someone who cheats on us? I can't think about it. As it is, we know our friends and family don't understand why we cope with them.

She could say, "look, I love you but I don't believe in monogamy, and I need to be in an open relationship". And you could take it or leave it, but all the lies and the covering up... .And bringing the guy under your nose... .I can understand that you lost it. (I wouldn't if you had hit her).

We know about the cheating, but I'm scared to ask what other traits of BPD she has, because this is already too much. I hope you find what's best for you, and the kids. And that treatment does wonders for her.

[daverisk]

Other traits of BPD in my wife?  Numerous.  A big self-image issue.  She has created a virtual fantasy world for herself on the internet... .she really needs to be the center of attention.  It's all about her public image... .30 year old mother of four... .still sexy... .a lot of knock off name brand high quality goods... .LV, MK CoCo Chanel, Guici, Rolex... .if it's a big name brand she has the knockoff and claims it's real.  In the two years we've been in the Czech Republic I can't tell you the number of tattoos she's gotten... .at least five or six since december... .Her own self image won't allow her to see herself or acknowledge the destruction she causes.  Back in May of last year when I discovered she was sexting with an old boyfriend it wasn't her behavior that was the problem... .but that I was snooping... .I actually apologized for looking at her messages.  She was pissed and I apologized because I didn't trust her.  She's tried that with our current situation.  In spite of all the evidence to the contrary she claims everything was done to make the ex girlfriend jealous... .nothing more... .One of the text messages she sent me when she ran off to Germany for three days was "I told you your snooping would destroy us."  Even IF I would believe the unbelievable... .it was still HER behavior that brought us to this point... .not my snooping.  Risky and self-destructive behaviors?  She's blocked people on my facebook account... .usually sexting partners... .then denies doing so... .I'm wondering how much of that is actual lying... .and how much dissociative behavior.   If you asked any of my students... .when I was a teacher in the US... .what they remember about my wife and it would probably be her driving... .horrible... .fast... .dangerous.  Impulsive... .yep.  She can't wait for anything.  I've been variously idealized and devalued so many times I can't count them... .she does that with friends as well.  The girl who was her inseparable best friend for 18 months here is now the dumbest b in the world... .She pushes me away... .and when she feels me slipping pulls me back in... .financially she's a mess.  I've cleared several thousands of dollars of debt that she had before we met... .she maxed out a 6000 credit card I gave her to buy something and forgot she had.  Her raging hasn't been horrible... .but it's there... .I seem to have instinctually figured out how to disarm that most of the time.

An open marriage is out of the question... .and I don't think she wants one... .the sex isn't really about sex... .it's about self image... .esteem... .part of the idolization... .she uses sex/sexting to get the attention she wants.

[JoeBPD81]

Sounds wild.
I don't suggest an open marriage, I don't know how it can work for some people. I was just saying that lying makes everything worse.

I'm confused because some things I read, my GF is nothing like that. She avoids attention at all cost, she would like to live in a cabin in the woods, alone. She doesn't buy anything for herself, most of her clothes are donated from family members. She doesn't have a FB account, nor Instagram, twitter... .  She paints amazingly good, but only shows her works to me and the kids. She spends all her money and time for the kids. If the kids were just a bit grateful, she would be happy just taking them to places, helping with homework, inventing games for them... .She does all that, and the kids treat her like a slave, and blackmail her to get more and more all the time, so she's devastated.

So no attention seeking , and no neglecting the kids. Self destructive, a lot, she might die from organ failure from anorexia any day, if she doesn't kill herself, witch it's on her mind a lot. She invalidates herself all the time saying horrible things about her ability to function, herself, her body... .She's a real bully to herself. And she tells me I shouldn't worry, that it is not being mean, it's just objective truths, and don't hurt her. But I see they do.

Oh, and she feels strongly about zero tolerance on cheating. But she hates men in general, so she isn't tempted.

But all in all,  your wife and my GF don't seem to fit the same diagnosis. Forgive me, because this mustn't be helpful to you, but I'm just puzzled.