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VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?" Parental alienation is when a parent allows a child to participate or hear them degrade the other parent. This is not uncommon in divorces and the children often adjust. In severe cases, however, it can be devastating to the child. This video provides a helpful overview.
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Author Topic: Hospitalizations, ER trips, and whether to stay or go  (Read 431 times)
Michael43

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Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner
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« on: March 20, 2017, 07:14:13 PM »

Hi all.  I am coming to this group as a means of support.  I am definitely in the conflicted category.

My wife has BPD.  We have been married for 7 years.  The first 5 were great--the last 2 have been years from hell.  I did not know about her BPD before we got married.

We do have a 3 year old daughter.  I'm not sure at what point my wife lost confidence in herself... .it either was having the daughter or a promotion to a management position at work.  Both occurred at about the same time. 

In the last 2 years my wife has had 4 psychiatric hospitalizations and about 11 ER visits.  She also had an inappropriate emotional relationship with a male coworker and tried to blame it on BPD.  I made it clear another relationship like that would result in a divorce.  Most of the ER visits are due to what she calls "disassociation" where she shuts down at work, collapses, and has the ER called.  This is something that her coworkers can recognize.  She claims not to recognize it, but she once told me that it occurred because they "gave her too much work to do."

My wife tried DBT last fall but was very half-hearted about it.  She rarely filled out her worksheets or participated in the group discussion.  I was called into a meeting where the lead therapist said EMDR therapy for trauma would be better for her.  She is currently attending both DBT and EMDR therapy.  It seems like she is putting more effort into it now---but it is more important whether she puts these skills into practice.

We have been working on boundaries.  Based on the boundaries that we agreed upon, I have started getting a separate maintenance order for our finances.  It is like a legal separation, but only for financial purposes.
I have made it clear to her that another psychiatric hospitalization would give me the option to actually separate.  For her, she will make up a story to a therapist to get put into the hospital.  This gives her a vacation from her stress and responsibilities for 2-4 weeks.  Of course, she reacted to the financial separation by making suicidal threats.

I have made it clear that I love her but not her behavior.  It is very hard for her to comprehend it; I don't think she can internalize it.

I have made the decision that if she can improve her behavior I can spend the rest of my life with her.  However, she has to make some changes.  I am getting close to the point where I can no longer expend emotional energy on improving the relationship. We are 1 hospitalization away from a true separation.  My family is either ultra conservative or liberal about the issue.  Some members want me to get a divorce, and some want me to stick with her and be willing to go down with a sinking ship.  Honestly, I want to do something in the middle?

Can I get some support for setting boundaries and sticking with them?
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formflier
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« Reply #1 on: March 20, 2017, 10:27:18 PM »



Can I get some support for setting boundaries and sticking with them?

Welcome

yes... .I love boundaries.  They helped me take back my life... .and my marriage.  Things are much better.

I'm glad you found us.!   Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)

Can you give us examples of boundaries... .how she tries to violate them... .and how you respond.

We can go from there.

Couple links you can click on and read...

https://bpdfamily.com/content/setting-boundaries

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=85479.0

FF
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Panshekay
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« Reply #2 on: March 20, 2017, 10:37:20 PM »

You are in a difficult situation for sure, especially having a 3 year old child in the mix.  It sounds like you are doing well with setting boundaries.  What fears do you have?  What plans do you have if she loses her job?  That's one of the issues our soon to be xdil has... .7 jobs in one year. 
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Stop looking for happiness in the same place you lost it.
Michael43

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« Reply #3 on: March 21, 2017, 04:04:15 PM »

Here are some of my boundaries (As they would say on Dragnet, names have been changed to protect the innocent):
We will work to do positive things they enjoy together on a regular basis.
We will focus on what can be done to improve their relationship.
We will actively listen to one another.
We need to have private time, personal space, and individual and joint friendships.
We will both be willing to end discussions peacefully and quickly if they become to heated.  They may be allowed to take a “time out” of the discussion.
We need to take responsibility for managing their own feelings.
We need to verbalize their own concerns and be responsive to one another.  We both need to make an effort to effectively communicate.
We will work to solve problems together without blame and come up with “our way” solutions for problems.
We will be faithful emotionally and sexually to one another. An improper emotional or sexual relationship will result in a Divorce Filing.
If (wife) chooses to practice self-harming, destructive, or emotionally abusive or threatening behaviors (husband) will be removing (child) from the situation for several days.
Husband has set the boundary that he will not pick up wife from work, the doctor’s office, or the Emergency Room if it is caused by her behavior or psychological issues.
If Wife’s behavior leads to a hospitalization in a local hospital or psychiatric facility, Husband will seek a Petition for Separation Agreement for financial protection. 
We reserve the right to orally add limits to this agreement at any time.
Wife will use the flowchart about when to call the doctor and when to go to the emergency room.
If wife makes another emergency room trip that is deemed not necessary, husband has the option to pursue legal separation. (This is what tripped the legal separation).
If wife’s behavior results in another inpatient hospitalization at a psychiatric hospital, husband has the option to move forward in making arrangements to have wife live separately.  This is based on the limits of what husband can tolerate in the relationship and to protect child.

These are what we have so far for written boundaries.  I also have an unwritten boundary that I will only respond to 1 text from her per day while she is at work.  To me losing a job isn't make or break, as we already have a separation of finances.  However, if she refuses to get a new job then things would be different.  My fear is also exposing my 3 year old to her behavior and her dysfunction.
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formflier
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« Reply #4 on: March 21, 2017, 06:39:08 PM »

Do you believe there is a difference in a boundary... .A request and an agreement?

Please expand on your answer... .It will help us point you in right direction.

FF
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Michael43

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« Reply #5 on: March 21, 2017, 07:24:10 PM »

Do you believe there is a difference in a boundary... .A request and an agreement?

Please expand on your answer... .It will help us point you in right direction.

FF

I know some of these sounds like goals or objectives, but a boundary in itself is personal based on our values.  Crossing boundaries has consequences, but it is also important to be consistent in sticking to your own boundaries.  There are some of these boundaries that my wife completely disagrees with.  However, just because she thinks her behavior is acceptable as a coping mechanism doesn't mean I think it is acceptable.  I am trying to walk the fine line of being supportive but not being an enabler.
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formflier
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« Reply #6 on: March 21, 2017, 09:17:58 PM »


A true boundary... .IMO... (in my opiniion)... .is something that you control... .100%... .regardless of what the other person does.

So... .any boundary that says "we" in it... .flunks.  (yeah... .this is a bit of an academic argument... .but still)

If a married couple was on the same page... .the marriage could certainly have boundaries.  I do see value in a marriage as an entity... .however, most of us are on these boards because we are not on the same page with out spouse...

Thoughts... ?

FF
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teapay
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Relationship status: Married 14 years
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« Reply #7 on: March 22, 2017, 07:07:59 AM »

You have a mixture of relationship goals and boundaries here.  Your “we” statements are r/s goals and seem like good aspirations for a relationship.  Your “I” and third person statements are boundaries because they are of what you will do, presumably based on want you want.  I have many similar ones, since I’ve also been through the hospitalizations, suicide attempts, self harming, sub abuse, extramarital r/s and similar experiences with my W too.  Of course, boundaries are nothing unless you’ve got ability and the guts to enforce them.   BPD will challenge boundaries, can go about it intelligently and can smell no guts in the non.   Boundaries are also more effectively enforced if you have the ability to bestow consequences on behavior.   This is a concept I needed to help my W understand better, sort of action/reaction model, which I found works well with DBT.

Lots of nons have difficulty with boundaries because they are still ill themselves or there are still significant co-dependencies in the relationship and they fear consequences themselves.  I had to get to the point where 1) I was confident that my reasoning and judgment was sound and 2) I was okay with the marriage ending and the family situation changing before I could effectively enforce boundaries and move my life/marriage/family in the direction I wanted it to go.  In my relationship with my W, I’ve come to believe it is more important for me to confront the illness and draw her out of Oz and into more normal behaviors than just detach, protect myself and orbit around her illness.  If she refuses and ultimately fails, it would be okay because I would still be moving myself and my kids more towards the direct I want to go.
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Michael43

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« Reply #8 on: March 26, 2017, 10:38:26 PM »


Lots of nons have difficulty with boundaries because they are still ill themselves or there are still significant co-dependencies in the relationship and they fear consequences themselves.  I had to get to the point where 1) I was confident that my reasoning and judgment was sound and 2) I was okay with the marriage ending and the family situation changing before I could effectively enforce boundaries and move my life/marriage/family in the direction I wanted it to go.  In my relationship with my W, I’ve come to believe it is more important for me to confront the illness and draw her out of Oz and into more normal behaviors than just detach, protect myself and orbit around her illness.  If she refuses and ultimately fails, it would be okay because I would still be moving myself and my kids more towards the direct I want to go.


Thanks for your support.  It has taken me a little while to research, prepare, and be confident about my boundaries.  Like you I have reached a point where I am very assertive in pointing out her behavior and requiring change for the relationship to continue.  I am happy that I am at a point where either her behavior will improve or I will move my family in a better direction by separating from her.
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formflier
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« Reply #9 on: March 29, 2017, 06:04:11 PM »

Like you I have reached a point where I am very assertive in pointing out her behavior and requiring change for the relationship to continue. 

Hey... .for you and others that might happen along on this post. 

While I'm not against the above statement, it's really not boundaries.

Boundaries is about controlling yourself and the access to your "property" (the stuff inside your boundaries).  If another person doesn't get in... .great!  If they do get in because they meet criteria... .that is great as well.

The key is that you hold.  There is no need to "point out" behavior to other people. 

Again... .if the approach you describe is working for you... .great.  Keep it up.  My only intention is to help sort out terms and methods... .NOT to say that your methods are wrong or anything like that.

FF
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