Were you a martyr for love?

[Roselee]

as "martyrs", how many of us took pity on our partners, particularly when they asked for our forgiveness? how many struggled with guilt at the prospect of rejecting them?

This is my life right now!  Still, 4 months out... .I can't shake the thoughts that maybe I should have been more understanding and maybe shouldn't have shut him out in the end. 

Every day is a struggle with me. I actually have to convince myself that I did the right thing. I really focus and remember the awful things that were said to me and the crazy things I was accused of, and that is the reason why I had to step away. I have to remind myself of the times I looked at myself in the mirror, and yelled thru tears to my reflection "what are you doing!... .how many times does this need to happen to you!"

Yet, still, I have guilt. Guilt that me, always being "the fixer", couldn't fix this... .therefore, I failed. And the question remains, did I fail myself as well.  And I do still feel bad for him... .but I am slowly getting in a better place, where I also remind myself that he chose the easier route, which was to blame rather than make himself better.

Good to hear though, that I'm not alone with the guilt. Thanks for sharing that!

[Lucky Jim]

Hey Roselee, No, you neither failed nor failed yourself.  You didn't cause him to suffer from BPD and you couldn't cure it.  It's doubtful that anything you could have done would have led to a different outcome.  Don't beat yourself up!  Sad to say, most BPD relationships are not built to last, in my view, so it's OK to let go of the guilt.  Instead, suggest you focus on being kind and caring to yourself, which is something most of us overlook in a BPD r/s.

LuckyJim

[Swhitey]

Roselee,

I can connect to what you are expressing, it is suffering and it is painful. I am 6 weeks out, 1 week NC, and I feel I have only made baby steps in my recovery from this... .abusive relationship. There is a lot of shame and guilt that I need to work through as a result, it is going to take sometime to start to notice gains in my self esteem again. Please know, you are definitely not alone, and I am glad that you acknowledged that.

If I may suggest and share something that has helped me in the past during difficult times (and I am working on this too) I notice that sometimes the words we choose to describe and event can invoke a stronger feeling that is more difficult to process and work through. I don't like the word "Failure". When I ruminate with that word, I notice I attach that word to myself as a whole, and not to the situation. It leads to me thinking and feel like I WAS solely the blame, which is simply not true. There is no evidence that will support that idea. The truth is, that it takes two to tango: and while you WERE %100 responsible for what you contributed to the relationship, your ex is ALSO %100 responsible for what they contributed to the relationship.

I try to change the self talk to something a little more gentle like "I was unsuccessful" or better yet "we were unsuccessful" If we can practice subtly changing the way we think about something we can gradually change the way we feel about something. Be gentle with yourself.

Feedback on this idea is most welcome

[Roselee]

Swhitey... .very good advice about choosing the softer type words to describe oneself or an event in my personal life.  Falls in line with Lucky Jim, saying to be kinder to myself.

Which I guess, is another trait of possibly being a Martyr for Love. I do tend to be hard on myself.  Interesting and grateful for it to be pointed out to me!  As I am working as well as struggling daily to become a better me, this is very helpful!
Thank you for that!

RL

[once removed]

i did pity my ex, at times at least. i remember vaguely a particularly nasty fight we had. she was raging, or upset, or both... .and it struck me how very childlike, and sick she appeared. see, my ex was diagnosed as bipolar. she blamed her relationship struggles on it, and so did i (partly with her encouragement early on). if i remember correctly, i hugged her or something, and, trying to comfort her, i said something along the lines that she was just a sick little girl. i meant it with compassion. it was pity, and it also makes me cringe pretty hard to this day.

pity, i believe, should be reserved for people who are not in control of their circumstances, or are otherwise not capable adults. it doesnt really have any place in a romantic relationship, as it puts us in a one up position, a seemingly powerful position for the martyr to be in, and it can feed our sense of nobility.


people do have a tendency to assign strong feelings to certain words. i always found "let go/letting go/let her go" would create a painful visual that tugged at my own sense of abandonment. any other phrase was fine. and i very much agree, this was an unsuccessful effort for both parties, one person alone cant make it work. one of the hardest lessons ive had to accept is that two people can love each other very much and not be right for each other. i dont know if thats a failure any more than a person cant drive a square peg in a round hole - it is what it is.

perhaps this is a unique struggle for us, too; words and what we make them mean.

"you deserve better"
"i just hurt everyone"
"ill never be good enough"
"im just a ______ , im bad news"
"you are better than me"
"i push people away"
"ill never be happy"
"i cant love"

how many of us heard statements like these? how did we respond at the time?

[heartandwhole]

I don't think I heard those specific lines, once removed, but words were a huge part of what kept me in the relationship. Since we were long distance and communicated mostly by email, I put way too much stock into words, and in the end, they were the means by which my heart got broken.

I did hear early on that pwBPD's former relationships hadn't lasted longer than a few months. Even though I wasn't romantically interested at the time, that did raise a little  for me, but I chalked it up to youth. There were lots of other declarations that gave me pause, but because so many of his words became more and more of what I wanted to hear, the disturbing things he said faded into a distant echo.

That was on me. As beautiful as many of his (and my) words were, they fed into a fantasy that I hoped would save me from the uncertainty I was feeling in my life at the time. I'm all for beautiful expressions, including verbal and written, but what I really needed, I think, was something earthy and real instead of lofty and dream-like.

In my opinion, relying on words, ignoring words, using them to make excuses; all that can be just another way to avoid real intimacy. 

At least for me, if he was saying the right things, then I could convince myself that the relationship was worth the great effort that it was requiring. Never mind that I was practically ignoring the reality.   

heartandwhole

[once removed]

At least for me, if he was saying the right things, then I could convince myself that the relationship was worth the great effort that it was requiring.

i didnt hear those specific phrases either; i heard them in a previous relationship though. i think id learned to take them at face value, as statements of emotional unavailability. i met a gal some time after my ex who told me she was "bad news" and i believed her.

ive never been totally comfortable using the word "recycle" where it applies to my ex and me. frankly i think what we did was far more dysfunctional: it must have been literally one hundred times or more that either she or i said "its over". we might have even meant it for a few hours tops.

then came the make up. typically this was where shed appear childlike, and tell me things like "ive been a bad girl", and things very similar to "you deserve better." this fed into my own fantasy like a hand in a glove. it validated my views, and it told me that deep down she understood the dynamic, and that was enough for me to excuse things, and get that self esteem boost in the process.

i chose this relationship, and i set out to prove, as someone who had never ended a relationship before, that i was capable of doing it this time if need be. i wasnt. threatening, having a foot out the door, was really nothing more than a push pull game of my own, with her, and with myself really.

i think you couldnt be more right that all of this, really, is a way to avoid real intimacy. id have never known it at the time. id probably have balked if you told me that i was avoiding real intimacy. i dont need much better evidence than the fact that i chose a relationship with a plan of being emotionally unavailable. i also didnt know that this path would inevitably lead me to choose an emotionally unavailable partner - more evidence that i was avoiding true intimacy.

self awareness is a great catalyst for change. what changes can we affect, or have affected, to be more emotionally available to emotionally available people/partners? where were we off base in our idea of what it means to be emotionally available?

[Turkish]

i dont need much better evidence than the fact that i chose a relationship with a plan of being emotionally unavailable.

What do you mean by this? I'm not trying to be obtuse... .

[Curiously1]

If I could just make things better for her then I'd get the love I need resonates with me a lot. Getting my needs met through another person rather than leaving and fearing I won't find what I am looking for.

[once removed]

What do you mean by this? I'm not trying to be obtuse... .

it was something of a conscious repetition compulsion. i wanted to "slay the dragon" through the form of a romantic relationship, and i thought i had the tools this time.

i started high school with what are often referred to as "nice guy issues" (a form of martyrdom). my buddies eventually passed on some good advice to me. stuff like "women like confidence". i started to grow out of some of the cringe worthy ways i pursued women.

my relationships in high school ended badly though. i was on and off with a girl with a girl with disordered traits for around two years (referenced a couple times in this thread) and was mostly a lap dog.  we finally fell out, and for once i started working on myself, and rebuilding my confidence (even read the book Boundaries!) i got into a relationship with a girl everyone described as a "nice girl" (even after an incident that suggested an unresolved previous relationship on her end, another sign of emotional unavailability... .i almost walked away). she came on too strong at first and i kept some space (though it was a welcome change). eventually i really gave my heart away. she went distant on me over time, and i panicked. ultimately she left me for the unresolved previous relationship (and likely cheated in the process). it was a big blow i didnt ever really feel myself get over. the lesson i took was dont give my heart away.

i didnt regain that confidence and life got pretty stagnant coming out of high school. i pretty much lost touch with anybody that wasnt in my three or four closest friends and i felt pretty isolated. somewhere in there i met my ex, online, through a mutual friend. i felt incredibly drawn to her and felt i had to talk to her. she had an unresolved previous relationship, and something (if not that) kept me from seriously pursuing it. we liked each other, but we remained friends for about three years. i became fairly familiar with her messy relationship history, and id learned of some red flags from our mutual friend. i saw it all as something i could conquer if i chose but tried to heed red flags. shed joke, "you cant handle me". id tell her she didnt know who she was messing with and that this guy didnt "handle" anybody  . we kinda lost touch for half a year to a year. when we reconnected, the stars just seemed to align. id told myself that it was time, "even if its another crazy one" (yeah, i had the mindset that "crazy" girls were attracted to me, not vice versa). "this time ill walk away", i told myself.

its not like i didnt try. i had the conflicting belief that she was the one for me, and that our relationship was unhealthy and there was no way i could marry her or start a family as things were. the result was that i stayed.

i was a different partner in a lot of ways. i didnt act like a wounded puppy in response to abuse or try to change for approval/love. i learned to take time outs (i failed, a lot). i wasnt clingy and needy.

as i write this, i realize its as if i just learned to adapt to and minimize abuse and (continue to?) use it to elevate myself (which she helped), and that contributed to me feeling in a one up position. i wasnt happy and i was exhausted. it was always some rage from her or circular argument we were having, or she was excessively clingy and needy, which once upon a time, seemed attractive/manageable to me. we fought all the time from the start. i grew to dread her from the moment id wake up, and desperately ate up any alone time i could get. i wrote a few journal entries in the beginning that were pretty telling. i remember being uncomfortable with how strong she was coming on at first, and fearing that she was going to say "i love you" before i was ready, and she did, and i said it back, before i was ready.

low self efficacy comes to mind. i consciously believed i "deserved better" and knew the relationship was unhealthy (i said it to her many times) but i didnt live it. somehow, i made myself comfortable. she was the dependent one, she was the one that couldnt leave, i could quit any time i wanted. so to answer your question, when we say we had a choice, looking back, though i obviously underestimated the extent to which things would/could play out, i feel like i got exactly what i signed up for.

in terms of affecting change, i had to separate healthy pacing of a relationship from push/pull games. i needed to learn more about boundaries, and identify where mine were weak. being able to walk away from a dysfunctional relationship is important, even attractive. threatening it a hundred times without follow through is enmeshment. i needed to recognize that what i was drawn to was not necessarily, inherently, the same thing as what im attracted to and distinguish between the two. i needed to learn to live my values and be true to myself if the latter was going to be emotionally available to me and i to it. i needed to recognize that i was victimizing myself and i had the keys to freedom. i needed to learn to give my heart away again, but that trust is built slowly and over time. i needed to stop living in fear of being hurt again. i will be hurt again. ill hurt others. people arent perfect. i have gained the confidence that i will not set myself up for the hurt i was replaying.

im in the camp that says it took that relationship to get there. like heartandwhole said, the fantasy died, and i no longer believe in it.

[ArtistGuy70]

Great post. Absolutely I considered myself a relationship martyr.

Look at everything I did for her. I did this. I did that. I helped her when she was having her breakdowns. When she had problems with too many meds. After her car accident. Etc. etc. etc. The supporting boyfriend. The loving partner. And yes I know why I did these things (aside from being a loving person). It made me feel heroic. Superman lives! My self esteem machine. No wonder things come crashing down hard when our BPD partner leaves (or asked to leave). When they betray us. They push us right off that pedestal we were on during the relationship. Kryptonite!

I think this rings true for most of us on here. The question is, how do we stop being that martyr? How do we get ourselves off the cross? How do we hang up that cape and only put on the Super suit when needed for a healthy relationship and partner? How do we put on that cape for OURSELVES and OUR OWN HEALTH?

[once removed]

i think in most cases, the "martyr" is looking for a savior in many of the same ways a person with BPD is. someone who will get them, understand them, treat them better, appreciate them. they can be drawn toward people who will pay this lip service (or otherwise mirror). its another side of the same self fulfilling prophecy coin.

The question is, how do we stop being that martyr?

self awareness is a catalyst for change. seeing our patterns is a good start. so it falls on us to really identify our patterns throughout our history. i can trace my own martyr tendencies back pretty early. i would say, romantically, they started emerging around ninth grade.

the short answer for me is something like: good boundaries and better self differentiation. recognizing and letting go of the fantasy.

but as   heartandwhole touched on, im not sure we ever completely stop all of our tendencies. we learn to be self aware about them, and then we learn healthier coping mechanisms.

with practice, i do think some of them may go into "remission" so to speak. speaking for myself, ive spotted people and situations i felt that old draw toward, but that draw no longer has the same pull for me. ive found new confidence as a result, and that has begun to have an effect on the kinds of people and dynamics i find myself drawn toward.

[In a bad way]

I'm sorry but I have to disagree with a lot of this, not wishing to upset anyone.
I don't see myself as a martyr, I did what  I did through love, I wasn't trying to be a hero.
I wasn't thinking I'm superman as someone said.
I helped her, I helped her kids, I helped her mum and everyone because that is me.
I didn't want thanks or to get in anyones good books. it's nice to be nice, it's natural to me.

[Turkish]

My T said,  "there's nothing wrong with being a Caretaker. I'm a Caretaker." He also said that I wasn't codependent. "I'm treating a woman who is codependent.  Codependency affects every relationship in one's life.  You aren't codependent; you just choose poorly."

That being said,  I had just saved my ex,  who couldn't afford it,  $2000 on a new engine for her car.  Earlier in the year,  I had loaned her $3k for a debt her friend called on her.  Still,  she treated me like crap.  I persisted, kept suffering,  and engaged in our one and only recycle later that year.  What I was trying to provide was what she needed,  but it wasn't what she wanted.  What a pwBPD wants is a moving target,  and most of us here failed to hit it.  Trying to keep hitting that target without understanding what it is... .that's what brings most of us here. 

I kind of understood what it was then,  and it conflicted with my values.  I understand what it is now,  and it certainly still conflicts with my values.  I let go a friendship with a woman who is dBPD because of it.  I'm just not going to go there anymore,  even though I did for decades. 

Call it martyrdom,  or just "poor choices" as my T did,  but I like to think I've moved past my old way of thinking. 

[devastatedwife]

It certainly rings bells for me. I think in some instances I was a martyr, at least in that I was the one who was reacting to all the crises in a better and more mature way than pwBPD.   Hello. Really?

I contributed to the unhealthy dynamics just as much as he did:

• I tried to be the "perfect" partner = I shoved aside what I wanted and needed in order to win/earn pwBPD's love and keep him attached to me. That image I had of being such an understanding and caring partner also made me feel better about myself.
• I avoided taking responsibility for my life = I bought into his dream and hoped that it would take me away from the stagnation I was feeling and help me avoid decisions that would bring more joy and aliveness into my life. I thought, "If only he would change/get better/stop doing X,Y, Z, things would work out."
• I sacrificed what I wanted and needed and prioritized pwBPD's wants and needs, because I thought that meeting his needs would be the best way to meet my own = As a child, that was a smart thing to do, as I was completely dependent on my parents. As an adult, it was dysfunctional and brought me pain.

I got myself off the cross through a kind of act of grace, I think. Suddenly, I saw the reality of what was going on. I saw the pattern both in pwBPD and myself. I didn't believe the story/fantasy anymore and that was the moment I was free from continuing the cycle— with that person.

The last part of that sentence above keeps me humble and knowing that this is an entrenched, learned way of coping that will undoubtedly rear its head in certain relationships and/or situations. But I'm okay with that because I know that I can see it, survive it, act differently, and continue to grow. 

Thanks for letting me share, once removed. This is a very interesting exercise.

heartandwhole

This is still me.  My husband just left me and seeing someone else.  After 19 years of marriage and him telling me that he would be happier or wouldn't yell and scream if I just changed "this" about me (and I did) he still left.  I keep blaming myself.  When he points out all the ways I wasn't there for him I believe him and blame myself.  My friends keep pointing out that the things he is saying are just normal marriage things and don't warrant the anger he is showing me and the lying and cheating but I still keep blaming myself.  How could he not just leave but he doesn't even seem to miss me? 

I don't know who I am anymore.  Even though our marriage was bad I can't imagine not being with him.  I can remember the good times not just the bad but I am conflicted because I can't trust him.

[vortex of confusion]

as "martyrs", how many of us took pity on our partners, particularly when they asked for our forgiveness? how many struggled with guilt at the prospect of rejecting them?

I definitely took pity on ex. I would feel horrible when I would try to call him out on something only to have him act like a whipped puppy. Even now, he still tries these tactics. I don't feel guilty about it like I once did.

Part of the reason that I stopped doing stuff without him was the fact that he would act like I was rejecting him by not including him in everything that I was doing.

There were so many times when he would beg for my forgiveness and tell me everything I wanted to hear. I felt like I didn't have a choice but to listen to him and forgive him. Forget the fact that his actions didn't really change for any sustained periods. If I would try to call him on it, then I was horrible and I was rejecting him and I was demanding. I didn't want to be any of those things so I would give in because I would feel horribly guilty.

I took a lot of pity on him because he doesn't have the street smarts that I do. He is from a small town and doesn't have the life experience that I do. So, I took pity on him and tried to protect him whenever I could even if that meant that I put my own needs and desires aside.

[heartandwhole]

I don't know who I am anymore.  Even though our marriage was bad I can't imagine not being with him.  I can remember the good times not just the bad but I am conflicted because I can't trust him.

Hi devastatedwife,

I'm sorry that you have blamed yourself for so much that went wrong in your relationship. That is something so many of do, and can relate to. There comes a time when we need to put ourselves first, and it can be scary and confusing, because, at least for me, I didn't know myself as well as I thought. It can be easier to look toward fulfilling others in order to get our needs met, than simply dealing directly with our own needs and wants ourselves.

Try to be gentle with yourself about this, as it is likely what you learned to do from a young age. You can learn different responses, though. It will take a lot of self-compassion and effort, but in my opinion, getting intimate with ourselves is the foundation of all of our relationships.

Hang in there. I know how painful it is to be left. There is hope for things to get better. Keep posting. 

heartandwhole

[once removed]

I'm sorry but I have to disagree with a lot of this, not wishing to upset anyone.

thats okay this isnt going to apply to everyone, though i think everyone can learn a great deal from it. i, for one, happened to score pretty high on the poll.

like  Turkish said, theres nothing inherently wrong with being a caretaker, let alone helping others.

but like any behavior or trait, we can take them to unhealthy territories.

i didnt consciously react to bad treatment from my ex by telling myself things that boosted my self esteem. i thought it made me a patient person (patience is a virtue). i thought it made me a strong person. my faith tells me to turn the other cheek, to love, to forgive. and i still believe in those things.

all of that served to see myself as noble. the good soldier in a relationship that wasnt otherwise truly fulfilling for either party. of course my faith doesnt say anything about remaining in a romantic relationship with an abusive person, or being/seeing yourself in a one up position. it does say a lot about boundaries.

i think we should cherish our caretaker tendencies, but amend them. to learn where we may be driving into unhealthy territory. not to change our values, but to live them, and to protect them with boundaries.

why? i think it creates a much greater capacity to love others, and accept love from others.

[spacecadet]

i think we should cherish our caretaker tendencies, but amend them. to learn where we may be driving into unhealthy territory. not to change our values, but to live them, and to protect them with boundaries.

why? i think it creates a much greater capacity to love others, and accept love from others.

This is a great thread. It was hard to pick out one good point when there are so many. But I love this quote, we do need to live our values and that includes holding ourselves in high regard and having boundaries.

I believe my ex tells himself and may even really believe that he wants a healthy r/s, an adult bond with someone. But when I displayed both the blossoming of affection/fondness for him, and boundaries for myself, that's when he, well, he voted with his feet ha ha. Of course this is the very stuff of adult friendships and r/s's.

The question asked is a good one. I don't think I am a martyr for love, but I have maybe had a conceit that my ways are healing for someone in pain. And often friends turn to me when they need to talk without being judged, as well as when they need cheering on to success. So maybe I have a drop of wisdom or nurturing.  This I can also give to myself. And maybe ultimately to a partner who appreciates what I give and reciprocates, not necessarily with as much feminine type nurturing but with a masculine type protectiveness that draws me in.

This morning I woke up feeling really good, clear headed and ready for the work ahead of me and for new friendships. Very grateful to be here (on the board) and to be where I am in life.

I would like to echo the value of journaling, and also recommend a practice of meditation. It helps in getting more in touch with emotions and instincts, as well as taking us to a more peaceful and contented place. There are many Buddhist centers that have spells of meditation open to the public, with some introductory instruction on techniques.

Thank you Once Removed for raising this very thought-provoking topic.