Achieving indifference

[Depression = 72% of members]

It's difficult for me to quantify where I am in the recovery process after being in a r/s with a pwBPD.  It seems it's not an on/off light switch but more of a dimmer.  One gauge in my own progress is my emotional responses (or lack thereof) to music, pictures, and memories.  I've made strides.  Achieving indifference about my xw has always been my goal.

I'm curious to know what's worked for those of you who've achieved a significant level of indifference?  Meditation has helped, but I'm open to more ideas... .

Thanks,

bi

[bestintentions]

It's difficult for me to quantify where I am in the recovery process after being in a r/s with a pwBPD.  It seems it's not an on/off light switch but more of a dimmer.  One gauge in my own progress is my emotional responses (or lack thereof) to music, pictures, and memories.  I've made strides.  Achieving indifference about my xw has always been my goal.

I'm curious to know what's worked for those of you who've achieved a significant level of indifference?  Meditation has helped, but I'm open to more ideas... .

Thanks,

bi

[heartandwhole]

Hi bestintentions,

I can really relate to your dimmer analogy. That makes a lot of sense, and I feel it was part of my experience, too. Even though I felt I had a kind of moment (which was probably more like a series of realizations) when I stopped believing the words and the fantasy of the relationship dissolved, my heart and mind needed time to come back into balance—to not react automatically out of stress, so to speak.

What helped me was NC, therapy, time. My regular practice of yoga, of course. I also achieved goals, learned new things, moved. The many changes helped.

I wasn't trying to achieve indifference per se. It kind of snuck up on me, I think, because I turned my focus onto myself, other activities and people.  I'd call it acceptance or peace, rather than indifference. I care about pwBPD and wish him well, but he is not part of my daily life or thoughts anymore.

Have you started any new hobbies or activities since your separation? Are there some goals that you'd like to pursue? I think bodywork can help a lot too. I had some Rolfing sessions with a great practitioner.

heartandwhole

[Icefog]

I long to achieve indifference and I am working very hard to get there. I am engaged in therapy, enjoying various aspects of my life, laughing more, exercising and getting proper rest and sleep for the most part and have not had contact for 4 months. Yet there is still this perpetual rumination that plaques me. Some days I cannot get out of my head and the thought of her return or contacting me haunt me day and night. I know if I keep at it this will eventually become "background noise" and fade with time but man is it hard on bad days. I have never experienced such anger, sadness, loneliness and anxiety. I don't know if it was the abrupt and absolute departure after three years with no reason or something else that is in the way for me. I know "this too shall pass" but I sure wish I could erase my memory for the past three years. 

[GlennT]

To achieve indifference simply do NC, and stay away from where they are, and knowing what they are doing. I have not achieved indifference because I have been spying on her social media sites, and talking to her friends. Total indifference cannot be done unless you do total NC. NC mutual friends, in-laws, and yes, even a job.  I am 8 years NC, and still stuck in anger because I have not been doing total NC. Knowing she is still stalking victims. I believe people who have children with them, or work with them, can never attain total indifference. Recently, I met someone new, who has been flirting with me, but I just discovered she is flirting with several other people as well. This may seem normal to some people who believe flirting is harmless, but it triggered me. I became angry with her, the ex, at all people with this disorder, and myself for flirting back at her. So how can I achieve indifference? Must I do NC with everyone who flirts with me and other people? It did'nt bother me much before I met the person with BPD. Indifference is taking me years to attain, even though I have been NC for 8 years!

[Insom]

How do you define indifference? 

[joeramabeme]

I agree with H&W, I didn't set out to become indifferent.  It is a byproduct of NC, but not produced by just practicing NC. 

In a weird way, you will know that you are indifferent when you are indifferent to the idea of being so. 

This outcome is usually the result of becoming more involved with your own life.  In the beginning it is nearly impossible to do this, at least it was for me.  I was obsessed with thoughts of what she could be thinking and if we would get back together.  As time passed and I did not want to do nothing all day, my thoughts gradually turned towards what will I do today.  From there, it shifted to what do I want to do and then what I would enjoy doing. 

I am not totally indifferent still, but a lot more so.  Today I saw she signed up for her second try at Match.  The first time I saw her there my heart sunk and I of course had to see what she wrote and my mind went on and on.  After having met a number of women online that are of no particular interest, when I saw her picture I just thought to myself; who cares and good luck if you think happiness awaits in the world of online dating.  Still a degree of cynicism and anger towards her but far more indifferent than the first time as I more clearly see that she has made a colossal mistake to give up a 10 year marriage in exchange to sit on Match and date what amounts to primarily long shots.

[bestintentions]

@JRB - my ex has maintained an almost nonexistent online presence, which really helps with any urges to see what she's up to.  Thankfully, those instances have been few and far between for me but were extremely painful in the moment.  Yes, while indifference has been a by-product of NC, I find I'm asking myself if that's the only way this is achieved and if it's (for lack of a better term) "healthy".

@GlennT - we do have children together although they are adults, which helps.  I have heard stories of people longing for toxic lost love after 20+ years and I definitely don't want to be that guy.  Even though you are struggling, it still sounds like you are cognizant of your own moral compass and what you expect from anyone you'd be in a new r/s with.  Bravo to that.

@Insom - thinking of the ex and being able to say to myself "That person was a part of my life once" and actually mean it without a hint of longing.  Not having visceral reactions to images or memories of times passed.

@Icefog - I can relate exactly to what you wrote.  Exactly.  I'm a bit further out than you, with the divorce finalized over 4 months ago.  I can tell you this... .I can feel it turning around for me, and I want to speed that up if at all possible (although I'm content with the passage of time if that's the only way).  I'm finally able to really see the awful, awful things she's said and done to me and take them exactly for what they are instead of trying to see the good in her.

@H&W - yes, there have been new activities, time with new and old friends, picking up the guitar again

Thanks to all who responded.  Just to add to the thread a bit more... .I did engage in a LDR (with an old flame overseas) for roughly three months post-divorce.  This included a trip for me to see her (my first time out of N. America).  During the trip, I witnessed several red flags and was thankful for my experiences in those moments... .definite borderline traits 

bi

[Insom]

Thanks, BI.

You know, it's been 20+ years for me since last contact and while I'm not pining, this issue is up for me right now in an annoying way.

Here's what it feels like.  I'm thinking about him often with a great degree of curiosity.  Who were you?  What drew me to you and you to me?  What happened to you after I left?  Who did you become?  How did our relationship shape me?

I googled and found a bunch of social media sites and dating profiles and it was a weird experience, seeing how he presents himself today.  I had remembered a few things about his physical appearance like the color of his eyes and hair, but couldn't quite remember his nose or jaw and how his face all fit together until I saw a profile pic.  Until googling I remembered him as a romantic, dark presence: swooping, pressuring, alternately menacing and affectionate.  Someone to fear.   In his social media profiles he comes off angular, gangly, sarcastic, preening, nerdy, not-kind, a turnoff.  Not someone who would draw me in today.

Anyway, I wouldn't call this indifference.  But any intense feelings of anger or bewilderment or betrayal or longing I had about him faded long ago.  It's like I care and I don't at the same time.

[bestintentions]

@Insom - my recent LDR was after not seeing this person for 26 years.  We knew it was a long shot based on family circumstances and, not to mention, 3500 miles separating us.  But we thought it was worth it to give it a year and then figure out what to do next (turns out no need for the full year).  During our initial reconnection, I threw everything out there about my marriage/divorce.  I flat out asked her if she'd had a history of mental illness.  We talked pretty extensively about BPD and I wondered aloud to her if she had traits (she admitted to a couple).  Part of the attraction when we first met was that she was living with a guy.  I fully acknowledge looking back that I'm not proud of my behavior especially since after things with her dissolved the first time, I jumped right into another relationship with my now xw who was married at the time.  These are things I wouldn't do now, but I was so young then that I eventually just chalked up the craziness/roller coaster to inexperience and immaturity - especially since my marriage ended up lasting 23 years.  I don't feel guilt about my early transgressions so much, but I believe they helped shape me into the more enabling/forgiving/codependent person I became.

[Insom]

Thanks for sharing that experience.  These patterns are interesting, aren't they?

[bestintentions]

A month out from my original post... .

I read "Free Will" by Sam Harris a few weeks ago, and I don't think I can attribute progress specifically to the book but, boy, I feel so much more like myself lately.  While the book is definitely not focused on aspects of mental illness, it has helped bring acceptance of my reality.  I've even seen my xw twice in the last two weeks to exchange a bit more post-divorce items.  I've told her I miss her and hugged her, but something's different.  The pining and pull to her is truly fading.

bi

[heartandwhole]

The pining and pull to her is truly fading.

That is encouraging news, bi !    It's amazing what some time and distance can do, isn't it? What's taking up the energy that used to go toward your relationship with her?

heartandwhole