What is our part in this?

[Zemmma]

With no disrespect: Maybe we should spend less time looking at the similarities between our exes, and more time looking at the similarities between ourselves as a group. I noticed strange behaviours from the BPDex from the beginning of the relationship until the present day. But I am now alone, and I have to look at myself. I am wondering about my thoughts, emotions and behaviours. I do understand that a lot of it has to do with how I was treated in and out of the r/s, the hot and cold, push pull, overstatement of love by the BPDex/  idolization, devaluation, mixed messages, recycles, etc. But what is it about me that makes me:

-put up with abhorrent/ disrespectful behaviour
-defend myself when I am being needlessly attacked (desperately needing to be understood, instead of calling him out on his cruel words or unfounded accusations)
-want to come back to someone who often treats me poorly
-see the r/s through rose coloured glasses (dismiss the bad, honour the good)
-lost in confusion
-stuck in denial
-not accept that it is over
-not willing to let go even after months and years
-obsessive about the relationship, thinking of him constantly
-so so sad for so long
-in total disbelief that he doesn't love me anymore or that he could leave me (even though he has done it over 10 times- has basically been struggling to stay or leave me the whole time we were together)
-unable to believe there is anything that will ever be as good
-unable to move on

Many of these pwBPD have moved on from us. They are coping fine! Many people heal after a break-up, whether with someone with BPD or not. What keeps us so stuck? So tied in? And how do we heal from this?

Am I a fixer? A control freak? Have I distorted the r/s in my mind so much that I can't see it for what it really was? Why do I puzzle constantly about what happened? My part, his part.

And why is there such a disconnect between my cognition and my emotions? Laid out on paper I can see over 100 reasons why we should not be together anymore. But my brain fights it still. My heart tells me he is the only one. There is nothing the BPDex can say or do to get over the idea that we should be together. Do I have no boundaries? I once said to a friend who was upset I was going back into another recycle, "There ARE NO DEAL BREAKERS with him!" Why is that?

This feels like there is something wrong with ME, not him.

[roberto516]

The fact that you pose this question shows there's nothing "wrong with you". Are the ex' coping fine? If you consider running from fears and emotions fine then yes.

I dug deep to figure myself out. Parental influences and finally shining a light on the truth about my family. It wasn't easy.

I think there's 2 kinds of people who get involved woth a BPD. Those who are idealized and then see the warning signs so they have enough self worth and value to get out right away.

And then theres us. My therapist said it best. My ex will have to find someone as damaged as her and they will push pull for however long they can both stand it. A "normal" person wouldnt put up with it.

Admitting we are damaged is something that takes a lot of strength. Look at normal and successful people and normal relationships. How many of those people have any insight.

I must say, when you began to post I saw a lot of defenses. Just like me. And then I realized that one day you'd probably begin to focus inward. This is a huge step for you. You should be proud.

[Emotions]

Oh what a tangled web we weave

[Harley Quinn]

Zemmma,

What a fantastic post!  You are healing.  Whether you realise it or not right now, you are doing great work here.  I have followed your journey from the beginning and can see immense progress in this post.  You pose some very insightful questions.  Have you managed to answer any of these for yourself so far?  I found many answers right here in the articles and lessons.  Is there anything in particular that you have found on the site that has helped you to gain clarity for yourself?

Love and light x

[enlighten me]

I'm a big fan of genetics. I also went through the why did I get sucked in question. My conclusion is that I and most of the others here are just wired that way. Most of us are carers/fixers. We like to help others and see the best in people. I posed a question a while back about what members do for a living and the majority where police, military, medical (all protective/ carers jobs where you look out for others).

I have friends who would have walked away within days. They are fairly selfish types, some would say have strong values but their values are all about their wants and needs.

So if anyone is beating themselves up about staying in one of these relationships then you should realise that the reason you did is because your a selfless person that puts others first.

[Lalathegreat]

I have never been upset at myself for FALLING for pwBPD, he was absolutely amazing. I do think there is a lot of value in recognizing what kept me there long past when the honeymoon had ended. I am working with a therapist to change the following patterns:

* I will do anything to "help" a friend and that impulse can very easily turn codependent and dysfunctional.
* I avoid conflict at all costs which makes it difficult to place strong boundaries or communicate directly when I'm feeling "attacked"
* I grew up in a home where a certain amount of verbal abuse was "normal" making it harder to immediately identify in my relationships
* I grew up in a home where the easiest way to avoid escalating a conflict was to stay quiet and "shut down". It has made it almost impossible for me to learn how to stand up and communicate when things begin to go off the rails.
* I married young and lacked dating experience when I met pwBPD
* I do have issues with my self esteem and my pwBPD was an extraordinarily attractive man. I often felt that he was (physically at least) out of my league and that I would never do any "better".

Hmm, I think those are the biggies... .

[Zemmma]

roberto516: As to whether I was "damaged." Uh, yes.

I had a very normal childhood with loving parents. BUT...

... .when I met my BPDex I was absolutely at the lowest point in my life. My husband who I had been in a relationship for 27 years (since I was 15!), lived with for 23 years and and married for 17 years had just ended our marriage. He just suddenly said he was "done" before even telling me he was unhappy. Surprise divorce- and he was cruel about it. I was a mess! So yes there was trauma. New trauma, not old. When my BPDex swooped in (only a few months later) I was literally sleeping 1 to 3 hours a night (with the ex-husband still in my house), seeing a therapist and struggling with what was even real anymore (while on the surface keeping everything going, running a business (breadwinner), raising two kids, pretending to my family and the world that everything was fine).

So my story is a little different. But the attachment did happen when I was in that low and vulnerable state.

Now I am feeling like my old self about everything else in my life. Five years have passed and I am almost always at a neutral place about my ex-husband. He has a new gf that is involved with my kids and the in-laws  and I am okay with all of that now (even though I thought I would never be).

But this BPD man who has told me that he doesn't want to pursue a r/s with me anymore. He tells me that our r/s is f'd up, he thinks we have no future... .I guess I just feel that because the r/s was so intense to me, that it must have been to him as well. I mean, I was there. I heard and read the words he spoke and wrote to me, I saw his face, he literally gasped when I walked into the room at times (not just in the beginning: even five years into our r/s). Claimed I was what he was waiting for all his life... All of that was fake or has been forgotten? I guess because I have never left someone who I have been that close to, and never would, I just can't wrap my head around it. I can't believe anyone would choose to not be in this r/s. Is that ego? Projection? A lack of differentiation?

Obviously my feelings are not his feelings. But even when he tells me how he feels straight out, I don't believe him. True, his words and actions don't always match. Is it just a coping mechanism against the pain I felt when my husband tore my world apart: my unwillingness to believe what is clearly happening, what has clearly already happened?

Okay. I need therapy obviously. I am guessing that this guy is coping better than I am.

I do feel that some of the things the exBPD's do at the end of a r/s are perfectly natural . In my case, I am wondering about my unwillingness to accept it as a breakup as opposed to trying to make it about BPD... Even people with BPD should be able to choose the people and situations that are right and wrong for them.

Harley Quinn: I don't really think I am healing or progressing but I appreciate your kind words and wisdom always. If anything I feel I am just circling. And lonely and bored and sad without the bf.

And for the others: I am in the healthcare/ therapy field, but I don't think I was doing the r/s as a generous act for him in any way. My motivation for staying was selfish for certain. I was getting amazing rewards for being in that r/s. He was a very caring and giving person when I was with him. Did so many sweet and generous things for me. Problem was a lot of our communication happened on text and we lived apart (across the city, seeing each other 2 to 3x per week), so there was a lot of room for conflict and his imagination, seeing as he was suspicious, distrustful, jealous...

I don't know. I want to feel better. I want to want to detach from him. Ha! I'm stubborn and faithful like a fool. Truth be told, I would take him back in a half second.

Not so sure I am healing.

Do appreciate the support.

[truthbeknown]

I am going through this right now too (read birthday post and what to do).

As yesterday was a big day for me to "wake up" and realize that it was over.  Sure I knew and have know for awhile (since Jan) that this was a disordered relationship.  So the questions that you pose and the similarities that perhaps we have are very interesting to me.  Recently, my daughter also went through something (i think she has borderline traits like her mom) and a friend who is a therapist told me rather then recommending to parents to punish a child for such behavior; she would ask- what did you learn from this?  Now my daughter couldn't really get the main lesson about herself.  She got the external lesson but was not able to look at her own behavior.  This is why I think she has some traits like her mom.

For me and as you ask what is the commonality in the group I believe we do ask questions but perhaps our focus should be on "what did we learn from this one."

For me, I learned that perhaps I'm confusing denial with minimizing.  Why?  because BPD folks minimize their own behavior and things that are worth confronting.  Is it possible (I asked) that I'm emulating my partners behavior but on the opposite side of the equation.  I started thinking about the movie the Matrix.  In that movie, Keanu Reaves (NEO) became the opposite side of the equation to Agent Smith.  Smith exhibited all the "demonizing traits" that a person can have- similar to the hater stage and the discard stage in BPD folks.   We (from what I can tell from the boards) and specifically myself- tend to be the other side of the equation.  I tend to go or have in the past tended to go more positive the more my partner goes negative.  example: my now new ex said, "I'm not very nice I don't even know why you want to be with me." in the beginning of our relationship and even when she was on meds.   Why did I let that go?  why didn't I just walk away?  I told myself that there are so many people that have low self esteem and low confidence and maybe she just needed re-affirming that everything was okay.  This was a major red flag looking back.  In understanding what I did, I minimized.  Is it possible that this is the opposite side of their equation?  They minimize the good in us and we minimize the bad or negative in them?  We become a circle joined together like NEO and Smith in the movie- fused together in the ultimate battle of positive and negative.

Next, I learned that in this relationship I started out with a weakness that I felt very defective from.  She excepted my apparent defectiveness and that hooked me.  It had to do with sexual dysfunction from a spinal cord injury that I had received and apparently that part of my body never fully recovered.  I was embarrassed, ashamed and thought I would never have sex again!  She accepted me with this flaw and still was attracted to me (and still is apparently- physically at least) and I thought this meant love! I confused this with love so deeply because my flaw told me that most women would not accept me with this problem.  So, I am being vulnerable and sharing this b/c I learned through this experience that I was willing to compromise on her red flags because I was convinced she had empathy for me.  I just thought she was a little kooky and I had compassion for her because I told myself she had compassion for me.   I knew her mother was "mommy dearest" and that was going to be a struggle.  In fact, her mom refused to FB friend me in the beginning- almost as if she knew something that I didn't (that she would sabotage our relationship to keep her daughter from leaving the nest).   

I also learned that this doesn't just happen in individuals.  I was part of a coaching group in November where a woman convinced over 2000 people that we would be able to help people with PTSD through a program she developed.  There was a promise to help all these people with an alleged affiliation with the military.  We all got suckered into this and you know why?  Healers and helpers WANT to believe in the good in people.  We tend to have a blind spot for thinking with a criminal mind or a sociopathic mind.  Needless to say some of those that i was close to realized this lesson after it was all over.  It  actually was the beginning of me starting to ask more questions of my partner (to myself) in Jan. when she started disrespecting me.   I started realizing that the common denominator in brainwashing is DESIRE.  A good brainwasher knows that if you take someone's desire and exploit it, you can control them.  In the coaching program, the desire was to be part of something BIG, to help the world.  Gosh we were so high on this!   In my r/s recently my desire was to be with someone of my own religion of origin, and to be with someone who initially looked entrepreneurial (she wrote a children's book), and to be with someone who was loving and kind (she loves children and wants to write about peace in the middle east).  These desires to be part of something bigger then myself I believe is what HOOKS me.   Also the desire to be accepted despite my afflictions caused me to want to ramp up my empathy for ALL of her flaws.  It was a perfect recipe for disaster once the BPD chooses to reveal that they are not really loving you but rather are manipulating you for their own benefit (whatever that may be).

Now, I am dealing with my own fallout just as you are.  Thanks for choosing this topic. 

[Zemmma]

truthbeknown: I relate so much to that positive/ negative balancing act you have described.

I have often overstated my position of love, desire, commitment because he was casting such a negative view. And then, of course he would distrust me because I was seemingly blind to the negative aspects of our relationship. He too must have viewed my perception of the r/s as distorted.

You make such an excellent point! That is exactly what happened. I always thought of it like this. The thing I needed more than anything was LOVE/ AFFECTION, therefore as long as I was getting that at least intermittently, it didn't matter how much pain, hurt, garbage was thrown my way. I would do anything for the love/ affection.

The thing he needed more than anything was to AVOID PAIN. As long as he felt pain, it didn't matter how much love and affection I gave him. I tried to show him in every way I could. He just couldn't absorb it, didn't trust in it. He never trusted me.

No matter how open I was or how much I revealed, he thought I was being secretive and hiding. The more I gave him, the more he demanded. And if I didn't respond to him exactly as he imagined I should, I was bad. I used to write texts saying things as plainly as, "the reason I didn't respond to your message exactly as you thought I should, is because it is ME who is responding to it, and I can only respond as ME." I spelled it all out in defence of myself, and he would still admit he had given me an "evil text persona."

Can't win.