I feel sad - him not joining a trip with my fam is now my fault

[Maya60]

Hi all,

My dad will be 60 in December this year and as a present my parents will give me, my partner, brother +gf a trip to Cape Verde. A nice hotel for about 1.5 weeks at the beach in December.

I love to travel and my partner knows this. Earlier this year my parents also wanted us to join them (on their expenses) to Gambia for a week. I went, my partner did not want to. Fine. Got a little argument, but we got over it.
Then I planned a larger trip to Asia with a friend since my partner did not had enough weeks off to go and the money for holidays, so we had a huge fight over this. Him not wanting me to go etc.

So yesterday I told about the holiday present my parents want to buy us. And he did not want to talk about it. Only being angry and saying he didn't want to discuss it and "when will this ever stop?" (me and my travelling).

I feel terrible. I should be the one feeling let down for not wanting to join this special trip. But now it's turned upside down and I am a horrible person for not staying at home when my dad becomes 60.  

We have not talked since this argument happened yesterday night. Went to bed without a word. He went to work this morning without a word.

I do not have the energy left to discuss these issues over and over again... .

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[isilme]

Travel and BPD are tough together.  Many times they may want to leave where they are to escape their feelings, only to find that they can't handle the stress of travel and that their feelings with them wherever they are.  Also, since pwBPD have poor Executive skills, they are pretty bad usually at planning and preparing for things like trips.  I do ALL planning for trips, from reservations to driving, mapping out routes, arranging meeting times, budgets, pack my own clothes, clean house, pet care, etc.  H is only responsible for his own stuff - get it ready, together and packed.  So while he is taking hours to simply pack clothes for a 2-night stay somewhere... .I have cleaned the litter box, done the dishes, taken out the trash, fueled up the car, downloaded updates to Garmin, secured items outside the house on the porc, AND packed my own clothes.  If I left something as simple as buying discount tickets by a deadline to him, we'd pay full price every single time.  It is sadly at times very much like traveling with a child.  One who gets cranky and easily angry, and is unable to "wing it" and figure out how things work as you go, but won't listen as you try to explain before hand what to expect.  So, travel is very hard on those of us with SOs with BPD. 

BPD also has a big fear of abandonment.  You traveling without him is a pretty obvious trigger.  This is not to say don't travel, especially for big events like birthdays and what not.

Being around your family is scary for him.  They might see through him.  They might not like him.  They are competition for affection from you.  He might not be able to hold onto a charming act in front of them as long as the trip would last.  BPD likes the isolation of being at home, so they can drop the public mask and relax into wallowing in their poorly managed emotions.  Being away from home can feel like being in public for days, especially with people like a loved ones' family. 

So you have travel stress, tied up with a family visit where other people can judge him, tied up with fears you will abandon him. 

And, BPD will also blame all negative feelings on you, and make all adversity your fault, regardless of the actual chain of events.  Toss into all f this the unrealistic and unhealthy expectation you will never travel without him, or you are just a meanie, and you've got

So, with all of that said, you are not to blame.  You are allowed to travel.  You simply need to work on some validation with your SO about addressing the feelings of being abandoned (it's not based on reality, but on feelings - always remember it's about feelings).  You can use some tool like SET to work on assuring your SO that your love of travel does not mean you want to leave them, that you'd love for them to join you and share in these experiences.

It takes time for them to feel comfortable.  You can never force it, explain it, or use logic about it.  You need to make sure they know you "hear" their feelings, and that you understand, and that travel is not meant to hurt him and its important to you and something you can share if he will try.

[Gumiho]

Travel and BPD are tough together.  

Another reason why BPD is a spectrum disorder, my SO loves traveling, maybe more than I do, and I already wish I could travel all the time  ^^

I recall going all jealous when she gone on a trip with family members to a place we vowed to go to together, because it was her first time going there, yet she wouldn't even tell me until she was already traveling there. It ended up as one of our biggest disputes, though I would have been perfectly fine if she told me how she got dragged there immediately, not a month after the trip.

Vice versa when I flought to SEA last February, she threw her worst fit in our history cause she couldn't come along because of work, and it was the cause of her major splitting, even though she was the one who funded the trip. Oh how I still remember the hours and hours of constant JADEing back over days, I get goosebumps when thinking of me looking for a taxi in a tropical rain storm with an oversized suitcase when I arrived at the airport, while arguing on phone... *shivers*

Don't forget this trip is for YOU (and family) and you deserved it. Don't let him drag you down~! (rather drag him along, even if against his will? )


Gumiho

[Maya60]

Travel and BPD are tough together.  Many times they may want to leave where they are to escape their feelings, only to find that they can't handle the stress of travel and that their feelings with them wherever they are.  Also, since pwBPD have poor Executive skills, they are pretty bad usually at planning and preparing for things like trips.  I do ALL planning for trips, from reservations to driving, mapping out routes, arranging meeting times, budgets, pack my own clothes, clean house, pet care, etc.  H is only responsible for his own stuff - get it ready, together and packed.  So while he is taking hours to simply pack clothes for a 2-night stay somewhere... .I have cleaned the litter box, done the dishes, taken out the trash, fueled up the car, downloaded updates to Garmin, secured items outside the house on the porc, AND packed my own clothes.  If I left something as simple as buying discount tickets by a deadline to him, we'd pay full price every single time.  It is sadly at times very much like traveling with a child.  One who gets cranky and easily angry, and is unable to "wing it" and figure out how things work as you go, but won't listen as you try to explain before hand what to expect.  So, travel is very hard on those of us with SOs with BPD. 

BPD also has a big fear of abandonment.  You traveling without him is a pretty obvious trigger.  This is not to say don't travel, especially for big events like birthdays and what not.

Being around your family is scary for him.  They might see through him.  They might not like him.  They are competition for affection from you.  He might not be able to hold onto a charming act in front of them as long as the trip would last.  BPD likes the isolation of being at home, so they can drop the public mask and relax into wallowing in their poorly managed emotions.  Being away from home can feel like being in public for days, especially with people like a loved ones' family. 

So you have travel stress, tied up with a family visit where other people can judge him, tied up with fears you will abandon him. 

And, BPD will also blame all negative feelings on you, and make all adversity your fault, regardless of the actual chain of events.  Toss into all f this the unrealistic and unhealthy expectation you will never travel without him, or you are just a meanie, and you've got

So, with all of that said, you are not to blame.  You are allowed to travel.  You simply need to work on some validation with your SO about addressing the feelings of being abandoned (it's not based on reality, but on feelings - always remember it's about feelings).  You can use some tool like SET to work on assuring your SO that your love of travel does not mean you want to leave them, that you'd love for them to join you and share in these experiences.

It takes time for them to feel comfortable.  You can never force it, explain it, or use logic about it.  You need to make sure they know you "hear" their feelings, and that you understand, and that travel is not meant to hurt him and its important to you and something you can share if he will try.

You just summed up every possible explanation for his behavior. Wow,  I never thought of the combination of fear and social stress. He feels tense being around my family. He always acts a bit weird when it comes to my parents. He cannot relax, he's always in a kind of different social state, like a very serious acting-trying-to-be -secure kind of mask. Feels uncomfortable for me too, but I do not talk about it cos I think it will become even more tense when I do.

Yes, I told him traveling is like a hobby and it is not meant to be mean to him or leaving him. But it gets very painful to have this conversation over and over again every time I plan a new trip. Almost like the lats conversation never happened. I will try to make it sound more positive yeah, addressing how much I would love to be able to let him enjoy these beautiful trips as well

Ha, I recognize your story about traveling completely! We went to a Greek island last year together and he was completely lost the day before leaving. No suitcase packed until late at night, all arrangements were done by me. He could so overwhelmed by stress and lack of sleep that I had to guide him through the airport.
Exactly feels like traveling with a child  who will mock for every small reason. (I did enjoy the trip together though!).

[Maya60]

Another reason why BPD is a spectrum disorder, my SO loves traveling, maybe more than I do, and I already wish I could travel all the time  ^^

I recall going all jealous when she gone on a trip with family members to a place we vowed to go to together, because it was her first time going there, yet she wouldn't even tell me until she was already traveling there. It ended up as one of our biggest disputes, though I would have been perfectly fine if she told me how she got dragged there immediately, not a month after the trip.

Vice versa when I flought to SEA last February, she threw her worst fit in our history cause she couldn't come along because of work, and it was the cause of her major splitting, even though she was the one who funded the trip. Oh how I still remember the hours and hours of constant JADEing back over days, I get goosebumps when thinking of me looking for a taxi in a tropical rain storm with an oversized suitcase when I arrived at the airport, while arguing on phone... *shivers*

Don't forget this trip is for YOU (and family) and you deserved it. Don't let him drag you down~! (rather drag him along, even if against his will? )


Gumiho

Thank you for your reply as well

The example you gave about being in a fight on the phone while in SEA is exactly the kind of situations I'd like to avoid. He got all build up the last time before I went and is very clingy when it comes to calling or sending text messages. (which can be difficult due to awful WiFi in those kind of countries :P).

[Gumiho]

Yeah right. Avoid that.

I was so enraged by her attempt to try ruining my vacation the moment I arrived. I tried fighting fire with fire (for the first and last time), I acted exactly how she did in each and every of her rages like hanging up the phone, saying awful stuff and returning every argument... .if only I had known about BPD before... .Never do that (acting the same when he's triggering)!

In the end she succeeded and I had an awful first few
vacation days in FOG, horrible.

[Maya60]

The thing is they can make you so angry in these precious moments in your life, and it is so damn hard to stay calm and not react that way... and let them ruin your day  it takes so much patience.

Well, my partner is not diagnosed. But everything I read here fits perfectly. So still a long way to go  hope he'll  try to find some help. I cannot comfort him as much as he needs sometimes. And this travel issue is one of these moments.

[Gumiho]

Why yes, it takes a heartbreaking amount of patience. And much more than that, such as identifying why YOU feel so bad about him not wanting to tag along. (No offense, I really can relate).

I think stepping back a little to get a view on the whole picture may help. The travel (this time) is for YOU. Not him. If he refuses to come along, and wants to be a jerk, let him be a jerk.

Like you can never fix him but himself (if it's really BPD, part of it, or not, I can't tell for sure myself, unless my overly reluctant SO would admit something was wrong, which may or may not happen ever in the rest of our lifes), only he can do that. - don't ever try to tell him he's got a PD, it will be a sure backfire.

In other words - your dad is going to be 60 only once, and it is an important event to YOU.

Now I capitalized some "you"s - that might seem selfish? Maybe it is, so is he, and you may face the hell of a resistance from his part - But you have to be "selfish" once in a while, and you must not feel bad about it (easier said than done) - I am sure he knows full well how important this travel is to you - you told him your part (maybe try to reinforce it with SET), but thats all you can do, and he is invited and free to come along. Is that still selfish? I don't think so.

So you have two options;
● You can go alone. You can still comfort him with the points you deem as relatable, when you're away. But he will have to sort out his issues himself. You won't be away forever, you will be back in xx days, let him know. (risky but maybe worth it)
● You can stay at home with him, and be controlled, validating his errorneous view. (no change)

Is that right? Let us know how things are going~~

Cheer up Maya60~!


Gumiho

[isilme]

Ha, I recognize your story about traveling completely! We went to a Greek island last year together and he was completely lost the day before leaving. No suitcase packed until late at night, all arrangements were done by me. He could so overwhelmed by stress and lack of sleep that I had to guide him through the airport.
Exactly feels like traveling with a child tongue who will mock for every small reason. (I did enjoy the trip together though!).

So, in order to finally get married last year (we got married on our 20th anniversary together), we chose for financial and emotional reasons that a ceremony with just us at an all inclusive in Jamaica was the answer.  H vetoed civil ceremonies, wanting something "nice" so we could have good photos, but that we'd not have a lot of guests or family in attendance.  His family is a huge trigger and mine is pretty much insane (had been worried restraining orders would be required - Dad would have shown just to make me cry - psycho).  Some friends suggested spending more on a honeymoon than the wedding, and I realized we could turn the wedding into the honeymoon, and that lots of ppl do just that, and surprising H, liked the idea. 

Problem - neither of us has traveled by air out of the country.  Both hopped across border towns from Texas to Mexico, but Jamaica is kind of an island, and we didn't have the time off work to take a boat.  So, I took care of as much paperwork as possible - I requisitioned birth certificaes for both of us from our respective home states - I filled in all paperwork, did all reservations, he DID pick a wedding date which I took care of booking.  Mostly, I came to him and said, please sign this.  I did not prattle about it, I kept questions to a minimum, and asked them at times where I felt he could handle thinking about the travel and well, the marriage.  The passport was a pain in butt - had to make an appointment to go in, but no one was ever answering the phone at the Post Office.  Finally, we got it done while off work for Christmas break. 

Night before we needed to be at the airport at 7am he did not sleep.  He had so stressed and put off taking care of packing and thinking about packing he was working on it till about 5 am.  I stayed up to help as much as I could, but needed a couple of hours sleep so I could drive to airport.  We got there, and with BPD he did really, really great on the way there, me carting my dress and his suit in a garment bag as my carry on, one connecting flight, customs in another country, a bus ride to the resort, and then we got to the room and he was hit with exhaustion-adrenaline-depression.  It was fine by the next day, and he almost lost it in a TSA line on the way back, because Dallas customs were a pain compared to Jamaica customs. 

As long as I could fake knowing what I was doing he went along.  I know it was a HUGE effort for him, and still today I cannot believe we actually made it.  I lived in fear for about 6 months that he'd start a fight and refuse to go.  Meanwhile, a trip we make every year has him freaking out and stressed each year.  Trips to see his family for the holidays are "I'm not going!" 

[Maya60]

Why yes, it takes a heartbreaking amount of patience. And much more than that, such as identifying why YOU feel so bad about him not wanting to tag along. (No offense, I really can relate).

I think stepping back a little to get a view on the whole picture may help. The travel (this time) is for YOU. Not him. If he refuses to come along, and wants to be a jerk, let him be a jerk.

Like you can never fix him but himself (if it's really BPD, part of it, or not, I can't tell for sure myself, unless my overly reluctant SO would admit something was wrong, which may or may not happen ever in the rest of our lifes), only he can do that. - don't ever try to tell him he's got a PD, it will be a sure backfire.

In other words - your dad is going to be 60 only once, and it is an important event to YOU.

Now I capitalized some "you"s - that might seem selfish? Maybe it is, so is he, and you may face the hell of a resistance from his part - But you have to be "selfish" once in a while, and you must not feel bad about it (easier said than done) - I am sure he knows full well how important this travel is to you - you told him your part (maybe try to reinforce it with SET), but thats all you can do, and he is invited and free to come along. Is that still selfish? I don't think so.

So you have two options;
● You can go alone. You can still comfort him with the points you deem as relatable, when you're away. But he will have to sort out his issues himself. You won't be away forever, you will be back in xx days, let him know. (risky but maybe worth it)
● You can stay at home with him, and be controlled, validating his errorneous view. (no change)

Is that right? Let us know how things are going~~

Cheer up Maya60~!


Gumiho

Hi Gumiho!

I will go on my trip and did get understanding from him.

But first... .things got even worse than I imaged. After my last post I got home and it was late at night. We agreed to talk about the issue and he was being Mr. Hyde during the whole conversation. His body language was full of anger and he was only talking about how it was all my fault.
According to his view, I was the one who did not tell him the news about the trip in a right way, and that's why he was so angry and why he did not wanted to come along anyway.
I know I always feel quite uneasy about starting a topic like this to him, because it doesn't matter which way I'll tell him... it will never be the good way. So instead of acting like he was angry about the trip, he was now angry about the way I told him.

I tried to make it a useful conversation, but there was no way to rationalize his thoughts. I know he does not want to go so what he was saying was not true. I tried to bend the conversation to saying it is important for me and that he's welcome to join us and I would like it if he did.
But he did not even try to understand any of what I was saying. Did not want to talk. Just an angry face turning on the music, not saying anything.

I felt really awful and packed my stuff. Told him I feel like we are not able to talk to each other and that's not okay in a relationship. And then I left to my parents home to stay the night.

Since he moved in with me (1/2 year now), my life's been so much harder than before and I feel I'm being claimed by him. My parents also feel worried about me, cos they only see his mask when he's trying to act social. They see someone who does not treat their daughter in a nice way and it makes them really said... .My heart kinda broke after hearing this from my parents  

Next day I wrote him a long email with my thought and feelings about the relationship.
I was ready to break up for real this time cos I do not see a way this will ever change without him getting help. He wanted to talk to me after work. We ate dinner together and went through every point in my email. He did not know how bad I felt about many things he wasn't that aware of.

We agreed on everything, only this time I needed to break through to him about his behavior. I asked him if he sees he's not acting in a way other people do, and that he's very quickly an angry person. Asked him if he sees he's hurting people and himself with being so difficult. He said he sees it and wanted to try to improve it (like he promised many times before... .). I said he knows there's only one thing that would help. Therapy.

I will leave next week to Laos and Thailand. And he will make an appointment. I actually set an ultimatum this time... .no help, is no relationship when I come home.

I do not see any other way now unfortunately

[Maya60]

So, in order to finally get married last year (we got married on our 20th anniversary together), we chose for financial and emotional reasons that a ceremony with just us at an all inclusive in Jamaica was the answer.  H vetoed civil ceremonies, wanting something "nice" so we could have good photos, but that we'd not have a lot of guests or family in attendance.  His family is a huge trigger and mine is pretty much insane (had been worried restraining orders would be required - Dad would have shown just to make me cry - psycho).  Some friends suggested spending more on a honeymoon than the wedding, and I realized we could turn the wedding into the honeymoon, and that lots of ppl do just that, and surprising H, liked the idea. 

Problem - neither of us has traveled by air out of the country.  Both hopped across border towns from Texas to Mexico, but Jamaica is kind of an island, and we didn't have the time off work to take a boat.  So, I took care of as much paperwork as possible - I requisitioned birth certificaes for both of us from our respective home states - I filled in all paperwork, did all reservations, he DID pick a wedding date which I took care of booking.  Mostly, I came to him and said, please sign this.  I did not prattle about it, I kept questions to a minimum, and asked them at times where I felt he could handle thinking about the travel and well, the marriage.  The passport was a pain in butt - had to make an appointment to go in, but no one was ever answering the phone at the Post Office.  Finally, we got it done while off work for Christmas break. 

Night before we needed to be at the airport at 7am he did not sleep.  He had so stressed and put off taking care of packing and thinking about packing he was working on it till about 5 am.  I stayed up to help as much as I could, but needed a couple of hours sleep so I could drive to airport.  We got there, and with BPD he did really, really great on the way there, me carting my dress and his suit in a garment bag as my carry on, one connecting flight, customs in another country, a bus ride to the resort, and then we got to the room and he was hit with exhaustion-adrenaline-depression.  It was fine by the next day, and he almost lost it in a TSA line on the way back, because Dallas customs were a pain compared to Jamaica customs. 

As long as I could fake knowing what I was doing he went along.  I know it was a HUGE effort for him, and still today I cannot believe we actually made it.  I lived in fear for about 6 months that he'd start a fight and refuse to go.  Meanwhile, a trip we make every year has him freaking out and stressed each year.  Trips to see his family for the holidays are "I'm not going!" 

I really feel comfort in reading your experiences You have to be so strong to arrange everything and still have that stressy feeling that everything will not turn out as expected. With all that stress of air travel for the first time it could have been really different if he went into another "mode" during the trip. Ha, what you tell about customs happened to mine too, only he was completely apathetic at that moment. It was all too much.

I'm glad for you it all worked out so well and you've had a great wedding/trip.
Haha, staying up till 5 am... .ohh he must have been completely stressed out.

Yes, I see that planning and arranging is a very hard thing to do for a partner with BPD. The start to stress out and cannot see in what order the should start. if they even start!  Mine has no natural feeling of what is most important to do first.