Challenges with addictions, close relationships and knowledge

[Lollypop]

Hi

I thought it worth putting an update here. I feel the need to write and vent as I want to react, I can feel this rise of "right that's it, I'm done" but I won't be reacting other than finding myself some balance, reflection and work out what it is that I want.

I want to increase rent - DS currently only pays £25 per week. This was set at the beginning when he first started to work a few days per week (17-18 months ago). He's now working 4-5 days, sometimes 6 days per week. He loves his work. I've left the increase because he was making good progress with his money, buying equipment, car etc. I've been trying to time it right and I can see that this ISN'T treating him like an adult. With all the dramas and his depression since February I've not felt it OK to add more pressure onto him. Perhaps this is an excuse. I always intended to increase the rent steadily to the point that he's paying a similar amount to renting a place of his own - he has to have an incentive to leave. Remember, we're exploring a way forwards to get him to be able to live independently - my number one goal.

Perhaps the goal needs changing to "get him well and drug free"?  That's out of my control.

So, DS26's temporary split from the 18 year old GF came to an end.  He's been great since, working hard, going to therapy, back on track with his reduction in valium (apparently) and setting himself an achievable goal of getting onto this last training course he needs. He wanted to book this early March and with all the dramas and his state of mind it slipped.  The GF on the other hand hasn't coped very well and has been very needy. He gave her mixed messages and when she reached out to him he reacted very badly and said some nasty things. Drama again.  Anyway, it's all calm on that front now.  I met up with her today to get my key back (I hadn't realised she had it) - she's scatty and as unreliable on this front as he is. I couldn't take the risk of her having a key to my house (she's stalked him). I felt the need to meet up with her, see that she's OK, I care about her.

DS26 has his eye on somebody else. This is most probably going to get awkward and challenging for everybody concerned. The young lady is 25 and my best friend's daughter. They've been long term friends, highly dramatic relationship, have a brief few months together at 16. Basically, there's history and he has "always loved her". She came back home a month ago. This was originally temporarily following two year's of travelling. Within a week, her BF broke up with her and so her plans to do some more travelling are now in question. She's in limbo, still in touch with the Ex, not working and so is bored, spending quite a bit of time with my DS. They went out on an official date and I think my DS opened his heart - I'm guessing this now : she's now a bit confused and DS is giving her time to work things out about what she wants to do. My best friend isn't aware of a potential intimate relationship (I don't think so anyway) but has raised an eyebrow as today, yet again, they are spending the day together. This is none of my business and I'm trying to take it in my stride to be honest. My best friend will NOT be happy about any development and who can blame her. She's been my shoulder during some very tough times. This young lady is a VERY strong young woman and doesn't take any crxp. My H and I have watched this situation unfold without comment to DS - H is rubbing his hands with a smile and says "she'll soon get a place and hopefully she'll move him in and get him off our hands."  

So that's DS's news.

My news. The ex-GF tells me that my DS spends up to £200 per week on weed. I'm speechless. I guessed at maybe £100. Does this knowledge change anything?  Yes, my determination to raise the rent.  Yes, reinforces my understanding of his addiction.  Yes, in my hope that therapy turns him and his addictions around.  

My feelings are now confused. My knee jerk reaction is to immediately double his rent with a tight incremental plan.  Ask questions about the therapy.  Ask questions about his intentions to deal with his addictions.  We are paying for private therapy and we are expecting him to commit to this therapy (for us, that includes his addiction).  I don't want words - I want action.

Today, I'm doing nothing. I'm saying nothing to nobody. My H and I have recently argued, my H is so very patient but struggles and is actually very resentful about the situation we are in.  I don't want to add fuel to the fire.

Thanks for reading.

LP

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[MomMae]

Hi Lollypop,

I am sorry that today is one of those times that you are feeling down.  I understand.  It is very hard to be continually understanding and reasonable when you don't always receive that in return.  It is hard to always have that worry about an over-the-top reaction to a basic discussion.

Regarding increasing your son's rent: I think you are right that he should be paying more now that he is making more.  If he is not paying market value (which clearly he is not) and your goal is to get him to the point where he is so that he can move out, then a rent increase is definitely in order.  What about telling him that it will be increased starting in August.  That way he has time to get his head around the idea.  Maybe broach the amount that you want him paying and ask him if he thinks he can swing that starting in August or if he wants it to be phased in over a couple of months starting in August?  So the discussion possibly can be about how best to work on the increase taking both of your needs into consideration?  Just a thought... .

Also, I was wondering if it was possible that his ex GF could be exaggerating how much he is spending on weed?  I only say this because you had thought it was substantially less and there has been some drama going on between them.  Of course I don't know, but maybe she would like to stir the pot of trouble between the two of you a little bit? 

I hope that you take some time for yourself today, Lollypop.  You have been doing an awesome job with your son and deserve a little reward and some time to regroup. 

  MM

[Lollypop]

Hi MM

Thanks so much for the reply. Isn't this an amazing place?  

I don't feel down, just so very frustrated. It's a complex balancing act and because there's no rule book I haven't got anything to hold to. It's like trying to hold water.

I logged out and thought about it and decided 4 weeks notice of an increase was good. His first car MOT is due at the end of August and he'll most probably have to replace the car or at the very least have a big repair and service bill.  I know I'm making excuses but this would be his first ever time going through this process. It's like he's a baby and I'm nudging him along all the time. But he's an adult! I'll give it some more thought and speak to him over the next few days.

The old me would have already been on the phone at least twice by now  

I definitely need to (and will) talk to him about his rent and agree an increase plan.  

I think the ex-GF is telling the truth. I told her that I'd been concerned when she started to go out with him as I thought she'd get drawn into the drug scene. She said that she did try to smoke with him at first but found it so very strong and couldn't cope as it was extreme. She also said she can see he gets a lot from the feeling of superiority it gives him being able to smoke something that strong in his peer group. I already knew all of this from my DS. I thought though that he smoked 2 joints per day (that would be £10). I asked how much she thought he was spending and she said about £200 as he smokes 3-4 joints per day. The maths work. It's not just the amount of money, it's the amount of damage he does to himself by such a negative choice. As I've said before, it all comes down to the drugs in the end.  I can only hope that at some point he's ready to want to make a choice to stop.  I forgot to take everything that he ever tells me with a pinch of salt, take a number and at least double it to get nearer to the truth.

Truth.  We make progress.  Again, I've let an external influence affect me but I've posted and NOT shouted or shamed.  It's given me a kick up the backside to increase the pressure a little bit as it's definitely needed.  Forwards we go.  Assertive but loving.

I've spent the entire day on the internet. So, maybe not so good. I feel better though - thanks MM.

LP

[Lollypop]

So literally as I walked away from the laptop in DS strolled.

He handed over his rent (late by one day) and he started to get himself something to eat.

I struck while the iron was hot.

His rent is doubling to £50 per week and starts after he has gone on his training course.  So this will be (hopefully) end of the first week of August.

He's of course mumbling a bit. Dancing around. I'm feeling so stressed Mum. I'm anxious about everything Mum. I'm not sleeping, I'm worried about money, I'm worried about my training course, I'm worried about everything.  Poor you, I say. That's so awful.  It's not your fault Mum. 

 

Massive step made today that I've been avoiding 5 months.

[MomMae]

That is awesome, Lollypop!    You are an excellent and thoughtful mum and DS is lucky to have you!   

[ElizabethL]

Hi LP,

It great to hear you're making progress with your son in terms of therapy.

Yes, my daughter is 20, and it's been about 7 months since she came home.
We have done everything to get her back on track, but she's incredibly frustrated with us anytime we talk about her plans and she gets angry and screams at us to leave her alone.
Truth be told, I've wanted to give up many times a kick her out, but my fiancé reminds me that we have to try to get her back on track. Sadly, she seems to be giving up on college. She has a new boyfriend who has cp so he's totally dependent on her for his independence. It's so strange. She a whole different person with this guy. Things she hated now she loves... it's almost like she doesn't know who she is, so she's taking on other people likes.  I've tried many time to get her on the pill but she tells me she doesn't have the time. I'm so damn nervous every month for her to have her period.

Since she been back I've worked hard on myself to let go of all expectations I had for her.  Although, it's a struggle seeing her make choices that can impact her for the rest of her life, I simply accept her for what to is.

I'm not sure what triggered her latest outburst because we never even got into a fight. It's was like a light switch was turned on and she pulled this idea and issue out of nowhere. It's crazy to think that not having eggs in the house would trigger her.
She is working, but keeps taking days of the spend with her boyfriend.
I would love to have 3 steps forward so I could feel good about having her home. Lol

I feel like she trying to emotionally blackmail me. I wish I knew how to end this, but I'm at a loss... The sad thing is I'm willing to help her but not under these circumstances. I feel that issues will arise anyway.

Thanks for responding LP,
I wish you continued luck with your son.

[wendydarling]

Hi LP 

Oh my, I've worked out it took you, four hours from vent to one resolution, double rent! Sometimes it's good to stay on line and pay it forwards    Seriously, as we know it is small steps, as you often say focus on the big stuff, top priorities, let the small stuff go.

Keeping on track, family and girlfriends - dynamics what's happening, as we reflect and move on, keeping healthy.
Karpman triangle

My DD's been signed off work, I understand and accept why. Today a friend of DD's (whose sister is dx BPD) has launched a non profit organisation to help pwBPD earn a living, they are reaching out for investors, seems like a great business model to me. DD's working towards working and that is brill. Step towards back in the workplace.

Good day LP!

WDx

[Lollypop]

Hi

I'm trying hard to see the balance of acknowledging his real limitations versus infantilising.  I'm just a mum, not a professional. We both handled the conversation ok, not really great, but it will do.  Certainly a LOT better than we did 12 months ago. The skills work.

Thanks for the nod WD About that triangle. I'm always aware but sometimes slip!

WD: this is indeed very good news. Working for herself must sound very appealing to her and, whilst it does have stresses, it is very fulfilling. She's working stuff out!

Taking REAL care of ourselves, our needs and our own well-being takes time to learn. This includes laughing, having fun - steering myself towards the light!

Have a great day.

LP

[Lollypop]

So just sharing.

I'm demonstrating how to live a healthier and happier life to my family.  

Shock, horror taking the ultimate step myself.

I've give up alcohol! If I can do this, my DS will see he can too.

It'll help pay for the bloody boat too ⛵️⚓️

Day 10

[wendydarling]

I'm trying hard to see the balance of acknowledging his real limitations versus infantilising.  I'm just a mum, not a professional. We both handled the conversation ok, not really great, but it will do.  Certainly a LOT better than we did 12 months ago. The skills work.

I can understand that, I see 'limitations' as movable through therapy, using skills learnt here, it's a fluid situation, while it took 5 months longer than you'd like to get double rent if you look at it in context of what's happened over the last 6 months and longer, what you have achieved - I find ideal timelines don't necessarily correspond to what's really happening, changing. Look at the great progress you've made getting DS to take responsibility to get into therapy, did you think double rent would come before therapy? I did. I feel there seems to be a right time to move different things forwards, patience delivers. Infantilising is where one denies someone's maturity in age or experience what you are doing is the opposite you are acknowledging, constructively dealing with your DS's limitations, struggles at a pace he and you can work with. Not sure if I'm making sense?

Go you LP, leading the way, 10 days alcohol free  how about treating yourself to some upgraded boat furnishings   

WDx

[Yepanotherone]

You were absolutely right to raise the rent LP , I'd have done the same and would have felt enraged too that so much of his money goes on weed rather than " real life adult " stuff ... .Like a roof over his head !
I'm treading eggshells right now ... .My DD's therapist is leaving her position for a new job and only told us on Tuesday this week. This made me feel very nervous and sad as my DD has teally bonded with this therapist .  Inamongst knowing my DD is feeling a bit lonely as her friends all head off in new directions , Im just waiting on her crashing or acting out. Additionally , she normally plays up when an event is looming ... We are going on vacation next week  and she's already getting antsy about it, saying " I don't want to go " . This vacation is for my older daughter's 21st birthday however and I'll be damned if I let my BPD DD spoil it ! So I'm trying my best to keep a calm environment , no drama , no confrontation .
So sure enough as anticipated after the bad news on Tuesday , Wednesday morning I opened up my DD's bedroom door first thing in the am ( as I always do these days ... .Habit ! Just to check she's there and breathing !) and while she was still sleeping , the stench of marijuana stung my eyes ! She'd obviously been smoking it during the night . Now the old me would have gone completely nuts !( because right now , she's on probation ! And I want her to completely quit all drugs ).  The new me closes the door and goes downstairs to ponder my next move .  
In any case , the reason I'm bringing up the weed . Here in colorado, it's legal . It seems everyone smokes it ! I myself am beginning to question why I still feel that smoking weed is so very wrong !
My DD says she is going to be applying for medicinal marijuana as soon as she reaches the age of 18 . She says it calms her down and quietens her mind when it's racing . She's asked if I will allow her to smoke it in the house when she's " completely legal " i.e. 18 and with a medicinal marijuana card . My knee jerk response ,  stubbornness and my long hard held belief that ALL drugs are " bad"  and that weed will only transcend Into other hard drugs , will mean I will likely still dig my heels in and not allow her to smoke it .

I spoke with my older daughter about this whole "weed" thing as I'm aware there is definitley a generational gap too in the way I view it . My older daughter is an amazing young lady , very bright , very mature , compassionate , empathetic and sensible. She's always had her head screwed on the right way , but even she has tried the whaccy baccy every now and again ! I asked her what her true beliefs are in regards use of weed for " medicinal " purposes. We agreed that it definitely has its place in certain conditions eg MS or seizures , but I still can't believe that it's good for mental health conditions . We had a debate about cigarettes vs alcohol vs weed and " whats worst for your body " and it does seem that most young folk these days believe weed is the least harmful out of all the " vices " that they can get their hands on .
I just don't know what to think or make of it anymore . Am I old fashioned ? Is weed really the way to go ? Maybe I should try it myself some day !

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Lollypop]

Hi Yep

Just like BPD and needing to know the facts, the same is true of drugs.

Weed is seen as the modern answer so there's a mammoth normalisation of its use. It's also now marketed as not only having specific health benefits but being able to do much more than this like a wonder drug. There's no doubt that a lot of people use it to self medicate.

Does that make it safe? Who would know the answer to that very important question And would they be believed (either way)?  

I've got my gut instinct, experience of seeing anxiety worsen to the point of non function, my GP and the psychiatrists view. I played my part in that non-functioning because he couldn't cope with my fearful reaction to his drug use, the chaos, my enabling, the arguments, my Saving, my interference and delving hindered and stunted his personal development. Always remembering that my DS doesn't smoke a leaf - he smokes skunk which is extremely strong. He's experimented with various substances, prescription and non.

My experience is that it's incredibly difficult, actually impossible, to reason with an emotionally immature teenager who regularly uses mind altering substances.

Remembering he's 26 and not 17. His reliance and his high tolerance level (because of long term use) scares the hell out of me. Weed is no different than alcohol where tolerance levels are concerned. You take a fake mind altering substance and the brain reacts and tries to counteract it, then you need more to get the same feeling. It's subtitle and not noticeable at first.

Like everything in modern life things gets blurred. It's not easy to navigate. That's how I feel as an older person who wasn't  involved in the drug scene. I've been accused of having a closed mind, being ignorant of the benefits, and a host of justifying reasons (that are very similar to those used for alcohol use).

My advice is get the facts (as they're seen today), accept that these facts may change, live your life in your home as you want.

My problem is that my lines in my sand weren't clear in shifting sands.i tried to keep it simple.  No drugs in the house or smoking. Is it ok to have a packet of nurofen plus (knowing he abused, legal, easily available)? Is it ok to have Himalayan pink rock salt in quantity (as a "tonic" Is it ok for codeine? Is Valium ok because it helps him sleep?  (disregarding the safety issue as it's bought over the Internet, and its non prescribed).  If I can see the need for the Valium and he refuses to go the the Dr (because they continually fail him as he's a druggy) and allow it in the house; is that my rule broken?

I still can't answer these questions Yep. I'm trying to use my common sense judgment. It's hard.

I got told (again) yesterday by somebody I met on the Internet who has had a problem with both weed and alcohol. "I didn't learn until my Dad kicked me out of the house". I couldn't do it. Right or wrong neither of us could cope with the fear.

My aim is to get my DS living independently, hopefully with a skillset that he is reasonable able to cope. I know he'll most probably always smoke weed. I can only encourage him and hope he stops.

I've stopped drinking alcohol. Alcohol was once the popular choice! I'm demonstrating to my younger son (17) that a life can be lived without drugs or alcohol. I'm doing this for myself and him. Crazy huh? Actually I feel brilliant, the best I've done for years.

Let us know how you get on Yep. I'm sorry to hear about the therapist. I know that build up about family celebrations and then of course the potential trial of the actual event. Wanting so badly to just be able to celebrate. Remember to breathe!

What's your thoughts about what I've said?

LP

[Yepanotherone]

I totally agree with you LP , regardless of how my DD might try to change my perceptions about Marijana , I just don't believe it's a good thing for her . I've done a lot of reading , pros as well as cons to try and give it a fair trial but like you  , my gut instinct is to want my girl to just Stay away from it . I cannot imagine how they can justify use of a mild altering drug in a medicinal sense particularly for mental health conditions . There are too many unknowns . Of course she throws it out there as part of her arguement that in Scotland , the teens are " all drinking underage , getting completely plastered , and you did that too mum when you were young , so what's the difference ! Weed is soo much healthier for you than alchohol ever would be !" Urgh !
I'll be interested to see if she DOES get the medicine card . She has to apply for it and have a diagnosable condition that fits the criteria for medicinal use . Here in Colorado , the list of " acceptable conditions " does NOT include bipolar or mood disorders and in fact from what I've read , having one of these as a diagnosable condition will actually work against you for being successful in getting the card . Yet i already know of some people who did get their medicinal Marijana or "red" card as it's known here ,  regardless of having a mood disorder. So I don't know . We shall soon find out in 6 months when she turns 18 !
Turning 18 will be a bigger milestone than I could ever have imagined and as it draws closer , I do get more nervous . For all the reasons I've discussed in previous posts and for the obvious ones that all readers here will understand ... .But the biggest hope is that she'll actually make it to her 18th birthday! My DD told numerous doctors and therapists that she has never believed she'll make it to her 18th birthday , because her thoughts in her head told her from a very young age , that she'd be dead before then . So you can imagine my increasing agitation ( and hers !) as we get closer and closer to this milestone !

[Lollypop]

Hi Yep

Hugs to you, I can see that birthday milestone in a different light now. You're doing an amazing job, she's lucky to have you. But you knew that already!

Let us know about the medical card situation. It'd be good to know.

LP

[Lollypop]

 

Well, you can knock me over with a feather.  I'm definitely detached because I'm finding this unfolding scenario (not yet a drama) quite hilarious.

Just to re-cap my DS finished with his emotionally needy 18 year old GF. He declared his undying love for his oldest friend who has been "thinking about it".  This weekend oldest friend went away, leaving the cat to play.  It looks as if DS has entered (oh forgive me but I couldn't resist ) into a new relationship with... .an older woman.  Now this is completely new territory .  I've offered to meet her but kept my lips tightly shut when I wanted to suggest we could do our knitting together (she's 5 years younger than me). I don't knit by the way.

DS is riding cockahoop with his new found experience and looking forward to a friends with benefits relationship.  Meanwhile, oldest friend is creating her own drama "what, you couldn't wait?".  Well, she does have a point.  I wonder if DS is actually changing his mind and kiboshing the potential relationship with the old friend - it certainly makes my life much easier as her mum is my best friend.

Honestly, I can't keep up.  I'm nearing the point that my Mum reached when she said "I've had enough of this shxx with my brother."

Onwards I go. Rent increased and due in 2 weeks.  We are now talking openly about his new living arrangements... .wait for it... .he intends to live in a horse box.

I'm going out now to meet my art friends for a very pleasant exhibition and talk.  I'm living my life and leaving him to his.

Sweet lordy, I'm smiling inside.

LP