I'm very depressed - too many things going wrong - I don't know what to do

[DaddyBear77]

I have been crying a lot lately and that's not something I ever do.

I wake up every morning and the very first thing that happens is that my wife tells me how bad or wrong I am. Even if I shut down in the first 15 seconds when I realize that's what is happening, I still wake up to that kind of trauma every day.

There are other major problems, too. There's a major financial crisis as I've talked about here many times. There is also the fact that about 9 months ago, my job changed to this horrible, monotonous, clearical-type reporting job. I thought switching roles would be good for me, but it turned out that I'm now extremely unhappy with my new role and I can't switch back.

This is all turning out to be too much for me to handle. I canceled my appointment again to see a psychiatrist because of threats from my wife to leave me. This morning my wife said she isn't going to support me even seeing a psychologist because she thinks I just want to use those sessions to find new ways to attack her and recruit them against her.

I don't know what to do here. The tools help but not enough. I think I've finally hit the end of the road on this relationship. It seems like maybe I get to pick this relationship OR pick myself.

Thanks for listening. This is so hard, as I know it is for so many of you too.

~DB77

[takingandsending]

Hey D-Bear77.

I am sorry that you are in so much pain. It sounds like a mental beat down for sure. And you are right, sometimes, even using all of the excellent tools we learn here, it's not enough to prevent the caustic words from wiggling their way in and eating away at you. I have joked before that what I really want is a vaccine for BPD speak ... .something that makes me impervious to constant criticism, blame and shame. So, I really understand where you are at.

But, this moment is not every moment. Everything changes continuously, so there is cause for hope, even certainty, that just as you were once in a better place before, you can be in a better place again. But it may or may not be with your wife.

And, I would like to frame your statement about choosing slightly differently - this is not a choice between yourself or your relationship. No one should ever be asked to choose between themselves and their partner. That can only ever be lose-lose. By choosing yourself, you are doing your part to choose a healthy relationship. The rest is up to your wife. You don't get to choose this for her, no more than she gets to choose for you. She has a choice to seek treatment, work with DBT, do her best to enter recovery from this tough illness. Those are choices you don't get to make. But choosing to love yourself, to not accept abuse, to understand and take care of your needs - that is your choice. Don't make it exclusive of having the relationship with your wife. That is not your responsibility to bear. Not sure I am explaining this shift in perspective that clear, but to me, it means a lot.

I too often jumped in to take on the responsibility for all the failings, all the problems because it was easier than choosing me, and I blamed my xw for putting me in that position. Now, I see that all along, I chose to ignore my needs because I didn't believe that I should have those needs. That was my choice. And when I stopped choosing that, and my xw could not choose things she needed to do to become healthier, leaving became a little easier. And I still have to keep choosing to believe that my needs are not wrong or right, but just needs, because this is a very underdeveloped muscle in me. But it gets a little stronger each day.

Hang in there D-bear. I believe there are infinite opportunities for growth and better days when we align with self love and self care.

[DaddyBear77]

Phew - these bouts of depression are serious. I'm not really used to them, or maybe I'm not really used to feeling my own feelings.

In any case, I took a shower and feel better, stronger, more able to put things in perspective.

By choosing yourself, you are doing your part to choose a healthy relationship. The rest is up to your wife.

takingandsending, thank you - I really appreciate the re-framing, especially because in my slightly-more-with-it frame of mind, I can see that I was falling into a kind of black and white thinking myself. You're exactly right that choosing to take care of myself IS what will make a healthier relationship.

In regards to whether to stay or go, here's my big thought on this now that I've taken a deep breath:

I've been resisting the urge to end this relationship for a long time, specifically because I know that I still have a TON of things to work on myself. I'm not going to give up right now because I think it would be giving up on myself, in a way. I know I'm not personally where I would like to be with my own relationship skills and still have a lot of work to do on myself.

[GaGrl]

What does that look like, DB?  Does it mean you will, despite your wife's objections, seek psychiatric and/or psychological help?  Or do you intend to continue fighting it out by yourself?  (hint... .definition of insanity... .)

Have you considered a therapeutic separation?

[formflier]

Go to pyschiatrist and psychologist.

It is your body... not hers.  She doesn't get a vote... .period.

I crossed this issue a couple years ago... it wasn't fun... .but there is nothing they can do to stop you.

Insert heart doctor in your wife's argument and it will make make sense... .

FF

[Panda39]

This is all turning out to be too much for me to handle. I canceled my appointment again to see a psychiatrist because of threats from my wife to leave me.

I'm not trying to beat you up here but the psychiatrist appointment isn't about your wife and what she needs/wants it is about what you need!  And clearly in that moment this morning in particular it was just what you needed.  You must take care of yourself!    When will you ever think it's okay to put your needs first?  What will that take?  How bad do things need to get?

Concerned,
Panda39

[BeagleGirl]

Insert heart doctor in your wife's argument and it will make make sense... .

First of all, I'm really sorry that you are fighting to get out of/stay out of that dark place where there is an abundance of pain and not much hope. 

I really like FF's perspective here.  pwBPD will find all sorts of things threatening.  They could potentially see a cardiologist appointment as being a threat because if your heart is pumping oxygen to your brain you might start thinking things that might have a bad impact on them and if it's also pumping oxygen to your muscles you might find the strength to run away from them.  I don't think they are thinking in terms of health and sickness, just status quo and risk of negative (for them) change.  It would be great if they could understand that the best for them as well as you is for you to be healthy, and that standing in the way of that health is basically ensuring some sort of death (of relationship if not yours from stress).

[formflier]

My psychologist played out a bit differently than many on here.

My wife demanded I got in "for a tuneup"... or something like that.  She was projecting her stuff onto me.

I called a previous T (in a different state) I had worked with, who helped me shop around and find a good one.  My wife went with me for first visit and put on quite a show of accusations and such.  I started going weekly... .soon my wife demanded I stop going because she was such a bad influence. 

I obviously didn't listen to the demand... .   

The bottom line... .it's your health... .don't ask permission.  Your medical providers would likely need to know that your wife is not onboard.  It will likely alter their treatment... .somewhat.

FF

[babyducks]

Hi DB77,

I wake up every morning and the very first thing that happens is that my wife tells me how bad or wrong I am. Even if I shut down in the first 15 seconds when I realize that's what is happening, I still wake up to that kind of trauma every day.

I am glad you recognize that the behavior/actions you are on the receiving end of as trauma.   Because that is exactly what it is.   Trauma.    Your body is having a perfectly natural reaction to the trauma that is being inflicted on it.    You can't control your bodies natural reaction, you can't will it away or ignore it.  If you woke up every morning and hit your thumb with a hammer, your thumb will require some treatment.   Be subjected to repeated daily trauma causes something called Complex Post Traumatic Stress Disorder.   I have a mild case of it from living in an emotionally abusive environment for so long.

This is all turning out to be too much for me to handle. I canceled my appointment again to see a psychiatrist because of threats from my wife to leave me. This morning my wife said she isn't going to support me even seeing a psychologist because she thinks I just want to use those sessions to find new ways to attack her and recruit them against her.

DB, you've gotten a lot of encouragement to make that appointment and go get the treatment your bruised thumb,  I mean your bruised psyche needs.   I would suggest you go too.   I've read some of your posts and have noticed that you've been deadlocked in struggle for power and control with your wife for some time.   Power and control struggles can become abusive.    Especially when there is a serious mental illness at play.   You tell me, do you see this comment as an abusive one?   I do.   Her wants and needs to protect herself and control you are being placed before your physical health.

I'm not saying it's easy to walk into those power and control struggles and put your own wants and needs first.  I know it's ridiculously difficult.    I also know if you keep doing what you are doing you are going to get more of what you are getting.   Can you live like that?

How can we help support you so that you make the best possible choices for you?

'ducks

[Notwendy]

 I canceled my appointment again to see a psychiatrist because of threats from my wife to leave me.


DB, I hope you can get to an appt with the psychiatrist. Would these threats have happened? I don't know, but they do work for her in the sense that they get her what she wants- you to cancel the appt.


It's a tough situation because these threats make you fearful. Then, it is your own fears that you need to work with, and when you are down, feeling badly, it is hard to get the energy to do so.

To stay or leave this relationship is a big question ( and only one that you can answer- we can not tell you what to do about that). From your posts, I think this is not a question that you do want to face all at once. That can be tabled. Self help can be done in steps- without addressing this question at the moment.

Some issues that could be faced -

First, your depression. You sense that you need help and made appointments with psychiatrists- and cancelled them under your wife's threats to end the relationship.

Second one is your fear- of your wife leaving- as the threats seem to incite this fear.

There are other issues like not enjoying your job, but when someone is depressed, they may not enjoy things that they might have enjoyed or at least tolerated- so that situation seems to not be as urgent to deal with.

Can you make one goal? That is to seek help for the depression. By doing that, other things may be more doable.

Why do you even need to tell your wife about the appt ahead of time? This is your body. Do you need your wife's permission to brush your teeth? Take a shower? No. You also don't need your wife's permission to seek medical care if you need it. This is your body and mind. You don't need permission to take care of your body, mind, and health. This is not her body or mind. Please try to get this idea firm in your mind.

Think about your fears of your wife leaving you. Probably the worst of them is over your daughter. However, your daughter loves you and if she was old enough to understand, she would want you to be in good health physically and mentally. You will have to trust me on that. IMHO, the  best thing you can do for that child is to take care of your mental and physical health.

Please do this for you- and for her.

[formflier]

While this post is mainly for DB... .others passing through can benefit as well.

Intermittent reinforcement:  It is doubtful that DB intends to reinforce his wife's bad behavior, he likely "just" wanted to calm the storm of the moment. 

I would submit that his wife wants nothing to do with talk of any mental health professional... .let alone actually seeing one.  Most of the time DB complies... .sometimes he makes appointments, cancels... makes another.  But... .more often than not, his wife can "dysregulate" or (do her thing with threats) and talk of mental health professionals "goes away"

It's working for her... .so... .why would she consider a different pathway?  Most people don't change for changes sake... .especially if they are "getting what they want".

Let's say DB brings up mental health 5 times.  3 of those times he drops it and 2 of those times he makes an appointment but cancels it due to his wife.  DB just "trained" her on what she should do next time she needs this to go away.

Going forward:  Let's say DB starts going to the providers.  He goes 5 times.  4 times she pitches a fit yet he still goes.  One time she pitches a fit and he stays home to "comfort her".

The one time is intermittent reinforcement and it is likely he wiped out all the boundary progress in the previous 4 times he did it right. 

Very very very important that this theory and the consequences are understood.

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=85479.0

Common Trap: Remember, you don't want to inadvertently give them intermittent reinforcement to dysregulated behavior. This is easy to do, and once established extremely difficult to unlearn.

Intermittent reinforcement: slot machines use this. They pay out on irregular schedules. You never know when you will win, but you know that if you keep pulling the handle that sooner or later a pay out will occur. It may happen on the third pull or the twentieth pull, but you will win if you keep trying. The fact that you KNOW that you will eventually win, keeps you hooked into trying

[formflier]

The "prescription" is important enough to put in in separate post.

DB,

Don't bring up or do anything about a mental health professional until you are ready to go... .regardless of consequence. 

Every time you back down, the hole gets dug deeper and will be harder to turn around.

Said another way, you are better off with status quo... .rather than making and cancelling appointments.

Can you reflect this back to me in your own words?

FF