How should I respond to this?

[WhataLife]

Greetings and Salutation.

I was posting over at TAM for the past 6 months, and a very informative gentleman suggested that I head over here to this site.  He really opened my eyes this past couple days on this whole new concept called, BPD.  I'm still learning all the "lingo" so forgive me if I'm slightly behind here.

My beautiful new wife appears to have all the signs for BPD.  Her childhood supports it, her relationship history supports it, and the past 1.5 years we've been together supports it.  

I just got the book, "Stop Walking on Eggshells" and that is going to be a fantastic read.  We just had a baby girl about 12 weeks ago, so I have zero desire to leave the relationship and try again.  It wasn't either of our first marriages, I am 36 and she is 31.  Additionally, she is from Thailand and I am from the USA.  She is mostly fluent with English (She speaks 7 languages!) but doesn't understand the finer points of the English language.  I, unfortunately, only speak English.

So without getting into all the details, I have a specific question about something that happened tonight, and how I should respond appropriately:  We had a big blow up this past weekend, and things were just settling back down.  I was showing her how to log into Google Drive on her new laptop, and cell phone.  I had put Drive on her devices several months back, but she didn't know how to use them.  We use the same Drive, FYI.  

Now, I had stored many many folders on Drive, including pictures.  I had all the pictures separated into events, like Colorado 2014 trip, Fiji trip, Florida 2012 trip etc etc.  Most of the folders were way before we were together.  She had blown up at the beginning of our relationship about finding pictures of my exes on my computer/FB/ and even finding a stack of cards from an ex GF on a shelf at home.  I burned the cards for her sake and thought I deleted all the photos online.  

Fast forward again to today.  :)iscussing Drive.  She said she got it on how to use it, and started exploring.  Apparently I had a couple photos of an ex GF with my daughters (ages 12 and 11 - joint custody with their mother.  Good co-parenting happening there) scattered throughout Drive.  I literally had probably 10,000 photos on there.

My wife, immediately screamed at me, called me a liar that I had deleted them, and said we were done and she wasn't talked to me ever again, took the baby upstairs and slammed the door shut.

I, having started to read up on BPD, haven't talked to her since.

Now, I was watching on Drive from my home office, and she deleted all of our wedding photos, all my amateur flower photography photos, anything to do with me and my wife.  Of course, Drive backs all of them up, so I'll stash them away on a separate hard drive later.

But to my question... .how do I handle this in a loving way?  I know that an apology will be pointless.  It was truly an oversight on my end to keep the photos.  I have no sentimental value with them (Except the ones where my daughters were with my ex... .I didn't want to delete those I suppose)

Thoughts?

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Radcliff]

Hi WhatALife,

Congratulations on the new baby!

Great that you found Eggshells.  Try also "I Hate You Don't Leave Me" and "Loving Someone with Borderline Personality Disorder."

Your wife needs validation and reassurance.  Her need for it likely far outstrips what you could possibly provide, but do what you can reasonably do; it helps.

Any sort of stress seems to make BPD symptoms worse.  An upcoming visit of a parent, a big trip, work issues, etc.  Having a baby is right up there among the most stressful.  Forgetting about BPD particulars, anything would do for the typical new mother to lessen her stress, do it.  Change every diaper you can.  Feed the baby any chance you get (if you're doing formula or pumped breast milk).  If she's solely breast feeding, get up and bring the baby to her, then bring the baby back.  Take the baby for walks when you get home in the evening.  (I'm remembering that you are an experienced dad so this may be old hat to you.). Not only might this help your wife, but it will help you form a strong bond with your child, and it's important for you to close to the child as he/she grows up -- it always is, but even more so with BPD in the house.

[WhataLife]

Hi WhatALife,

Congratulations on the new baby!

Great that you found Eggshells.  Try also "I Hate You Don't Leave Me" and "Loving Someone with Borderline Personality Disorder."

Your wife needs validation and reassurance.  Her need for it likely far outstrips what you could possibly provide, but do what you can reasonably do; it helps.

Any sort of stress seems to make BPD symptoms worse.  An upcoming visit of a parent, a big trip, work issues, etc.  Having a baby is right up there among the most stressful.  Forgetting about BPD particulars, anything would do for the typical new mother to lessen her stress, do it.  Change every diaper you can.  Feed the baby any chance you get (if you're doing formula or pumped breast milk).  If she's solely breast feeding, get up and bring the baby to her, then bring the baby back.  Take the baby for walks when you get home in the evening.  (I'm remembering that you are an experienced dad so this may be old hat to you.). Not only might this help your wife, but it will help you form a strong bond with your child, and it's important for you to close to the child as he/she grows up -- it always is, but even more so with BPD in the house.

You are correct... .she does need reassurance and validation.  The problem is, she won't accept it.  In the previous 12 months, when I would get her flowers, or cards, or leave notes around the house telling her my feelings of adoration, she would appreciate it at the time, then at the first "blow up" she would chuck them all into the trash can.  She used to go through the house and throw away our family printed photo's as well!  Until recently, I couldn't grasp why she would do this!

Your suggestions with the baby helping are spot on.  She doesn't work (Stay at home since we got married) and she does a fantastic job of house keeping.  I assist whenever and whereever I can, but she jumps up so fast at night at the "sigh" from the baby, I sometimes don't even know it until she's out of bed.  Also, she doesn't like me to take the baby anywhere without her, and won't let me within 500 yards (exaggeration of course!) of the baby when she is "exploding".

I try to get good face-time with the baby after work (I work from home, so we are typically within ear shot of eachother at all times) where I just play with her on the ground. 

It's just really tough with the way she explodes and goes into Silent Treatment mode for 4 days.

Last night, as we lay in bed, (her back to me of course) I tried to scratch her back a little (Physical Touch is her 2nd highest love language) and she said to stop, so I did.  I then told her, "Thank you for finding those photos so we could delete them... .I didn't remember they were even out there still!"  She just pulled away and flipped on her phone to go back to texting or whatever.

I told her "I loved her dearly, and only her" and said goodnight.

We haven't spoken today yet (only 1 day into the explosion... .3 to go!).  We are scheduled to leave for a little family vacation in Colorado Friday morning (She said while she called me a liar that she wasn't going and would never speak to me again!) so hopefully I can convince her to ride along with us and she'll be fine once we get there.

Ahhh, the thrills of BPDing with your love.  :D

[north69]

I'd also be careful being so close to having given birth that it's not hormonal, post partum depression or the like.

I researched that in depth when my wife went funny after childbirth, but in the end I'm here on the BPD forum as she's got no better. But definitely worth considering .

And do all you can to help. I was useless at first and this strongly went against me - things have spiralled since then and I'm now NC with a possible divorce on the cards.

I wish you much better luck than I had & send you all the best

[WhataLife]

I'd also be careful being so close to having given birth that it's not hormonal, post partum depression or the like.

I researched that in depth when my wife went funny after childbirth, but in the end I'm here on the BPD forum as she's got no better. But definitely worth considering .

And do all you can to help. I was useless at first and this strongly went against me - things have spiralled since then and I'm now NC with a possible divorce on the cards.

I wish you much better luck than I had & send you all the best

Yes, that is possibly part of the picture... .but not likely the reason.  She's exploded since I've known her, and her childhood, you can almost pin-point when it all started.  She witnessed her mom attempt to kill her dad with a gun (Missed his heart and shot him in the arm) when her mom found out her dad was cheating on her at 4 or 5 yeas old... .  Her mom passed away when she was 13 years old... .her stepmom attempted to murder her via food poisoning (weeks at the hospital that saved her life) and her twin sister was killed in a car crash at 17 when my wife was driving the car.  The way that my wife deals with pain, is to block the people out of her life.  She never progressed past a very young maturity level.

And she's always been this way with me.  She told me she had been declared sterile from her doctor, and couldn't have kids.  She always lamented this fact to me.  So we never used protection, then she tells me she's pregnant a few months into dating!  I quickly married her within 2 months, and here we are! 

Whirlwind of a trip.

[Radcliff]

Hello WhatALife,

Wow.  My wife has the kind of back story people write books about, but your wife has her beat hands down.  That's a terrible set of circumstances to have come from.  You didn't mention whether the concept of therapy has come up with your wife.  Seems like a worthwhile thing to explore.  Perhaps with the idea to deal with past trauma, rather than implying that she has any flaws in the present day.  Step carefully.  Many of our pwBPD are very anti-therapy, so I would definitely not rush into this.  You have also probably heard that it can often backfire to even discuss the existence of BPD, so you might just discuss therapy in general terms...   Every situation is different, so you will have to judge hers.  Has the topic of therapy ever come up, and do you think she would be receptive?  Does she have any idea that she goes over the top, or does she seem to believe that all of her behaviors are entirely justified and normal?

[WhataLife]

Hello WhatALife,

Wow.  My wife has the kind of back story people write books about, but your wife has her beat hands down.  That's a terrible set of circumstances to have come from.  You didn't mention whether the concept of therapy has come up with your wife.  Seems like a worthwhile thing to explore.  Perhaps with the idea to deal with past trauma, rather than implying that she has any flaws in the present day.  Step carefully.  Many of our pwBPD are very anti-therapy, so I would definitely not rush into this.  You have also probably heard that it can often backfire to even discuss the existence of BPD, so you might just discuss therapy in general terms...   Every situation is different, so you will have to judge hers.  Has the topic of therapy ever come up, and do you think she would be receptive?  Does she have any idea that she goes over the top, or does she seem to believe that all of her behaviors are entirely justified and normal?

She was married for 9 years, given at the age of 16 by her father... .she was shipped out at the age of 22 to USA after meeting the guy once.  Needless to say, it was a marriage that wasn't going to last.  She claims only intimate 5 times in those 9 years.  Basically roomates.  Very controlling in-laws.  When she finally seperated, she lived the high life for several years.  Partying every night, getting wasted, lots of BF it sounded like.

Her last BF before me, beat her silly.  Cops found her in the closet nearly dead as they arrested him.  It took her a good 9 months after being with me, before she wouldn't flinch when I reached over to hold her hand.  Ya... .it's a pretty rough life she came from.

So I asked her about counseling/therapy in the past, and she said, NO way.  She doesn't need it. 

She has ZERO idea when she goes over the top.  She believes it's completely justified.  Like this current episode... .she is still slamming doors, and refuses to answer the simpliest questions.  Total ignore going on.  In the past year, I would try to push through, give her hugs, tell her I loved her, bring her cooked meals, flowers, candy... .and all were thrown directly into the trash can, I kid you not!  After 6 months of that (oh and she ALWAYS demands a divorce when she gets mad... .) I stopped doing those things for her.  I didn't realize it was an illness.

I haven't been a perfect husband, who is?  But I have never cheated on her, never raised a finger against her, given her anything she's asked for, don't make her work, pay all the bills, manage all the finances and then every fight she screams at me that I never take care of her.  I am learning quickly that I can't respond to these attacks, however hurtful they are (My love language is Words of Affirmation, darn it all, and it there isn't a close 2nd!)

The silence is cutting, and I think she knows it, that's why she does it.

Then in 4 days, she'll just be like, Hey.  and I get to act like nothing happened.  If I try to ask for closure or to discuss things, she regresses again for another day or two.

I'm really at my wits end internally, although I think I put up a very strong front.


EDIT:  I can't figure out how to edit my orginal post... .I said she was 31, she's actually 33 now.  Sorry about that minor detail!

[Turkish]

Hi WhatALife,

Inter-cultural relationships can be hard. The mother of my children is from Mexico (I'm from the USA), and the differences between our own two countries may be less,  they were still significant.

The core commonality I see here,  given a BPD rubric, may be fear of abandonment. It's good that you've obtained the books.  We have lessons to the right of the board, some of them developed from those books.  Take a look, especially at Lesson#3.

Like you, mine has a history of rebelling. Though this can put things into perspective, how wet deal with things now is key.  Take a look at the communication lessons,  and please ask any any all questions so we can help you move things forward.

She has ZERO idea when she goes over the top.  She believes it's completely justified.  Like this current episode... .she is still slamming doors, and refuses to answer the simpliest questions.  Total ignore going on.  In the past year, I would try to push through, give her hugs, tell her I loved her, bring her cooked meals, flowers, candy... .and all were thrown directly into the trash can, I kid you not!  After 6 months of that (oh and she ALWAYS demands a divorce when she gets mad... .) I stopped doing those things for her.  I didn't realize it was an illness.

How do you respond to this? Have you ever just asked her what is bothering her? This may help:

A 3 Minute Lesson on Ending Conflict
Turkish

[WhataLife]

Hi WhatALife,

Inter-cultural relationships can be hard. The mother of my children is from Mexico (I'm from the USA), and the differences between our own two countries may be less,  they were still significant.

The core commonality I see here,  given a BPD rubric, may be fear of abandonment. It's good that you've obtained the books.  We have lessons to the right of the board, some of them developed from those books.  Take a look, especially at Lesson#3.

Like you, mine has a history of rebelling. Though this can put things into perspective, how wet deal with things now is key.  Take a look at the communication lessons,  and please ask any any all questions so we can help you move things forward.

How do you respond to this? Have you ever just asked her what is bothering her? This may help:

A 3 Minute Lesson on Ending Conflict
Turkish

Hi Turkish.

Yes, getting my learn-on has been eye opening, to say the least.

Regarding asking her what is bothering her, I get a head shake, and a mumbled No, if she responds at all.  When she is raging, it's a flat out ignore and walk out of the room type of deal.  (In the past, when I tried to confront the silence, she would move to screaming and yelling, so I avoid that currently.)

Her communication skills, while raging, are basically that of a 4 year old.

I haven't found a ":)iffuse" button yet that actually works when she rages.  I'm growing more and more weary that there isn't one actually.

Last night, she was on her phone until 1am in bed, then suddenly got up, grabbed the baby who sleeps in the crib next to us, and walked into the baby's bedroom and slept on the floor in there.  FB shows she was online for awhile further.

I can't tell if she is romantically involved with another at this point or not... .and I don't have access to her phone/phone records currently, although her culture looks down upon cheating heavily, and she has always adamantly swore that she would never cheat, so I'm not sure what to think.

Really looking for tips on how to get past the Silent Treatment.

[Radcliff]

Hello WhataLife,

That's a tough situation.  It sounds like your wife is not anxious to let you have a huge role with the baby, and any overt effort to increase your role might be met with resistance.  But raising a child is a marathon.  Be ready for any opportunity to spend time with the child, lighten your wife's load, etc.  When my youngest daughter was  a baby and toddler, I read to her every single night.  Sometimes I stayed in the marriage and stayed in the house so I could be there for her every night.  Today my daughter and I have a strong relationship, which helps compensate me for some of the misery I put up with.  In the past couple of years I've been keeping a journal of the craziness and realized that perhaps I could have left and gotten 50/50 custody (i.e. with a journal, it becomes clear to an evaluator what's going on), but that's a topic for another day.  My wife is still such an amazing person in many regards I'm conflicted daily about what to do.

Another book that might be useful is "Understanding the Borderline Mother," by Christine Lawson.  It's mostly geared towards adult children of mother's with BPD, so it's not ideal for a dad with a BPD wife, but I still found it helpful and felt it was important to read to understand the potential impacts on my kids.

[Turkish]

We have quite a long discussion on silent treatment here: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=68733.0

Regarding possible cheating? I won't venture to guess from afar. At the core of BPD is emotional dysregulation, and a pwBPD will soothe their emotions how they can.  She may be texting girl friends, hard to say.

Understanding The Borderline Mother is an instructional resource,  but I found it a tough read (my mother is borderline). It would be more immediately helpful to go through the lessons at the right of the board to deal with the tactical situation right now.  

[Radcliff]

Turkish, thanks for providing the link, and the qualification about Understanding the Borderline Mother.  I agree, it's not the most urgent book to read, and your advice to use the resources at the right for tactical improvement does seem more urgent now for WhataLife.  For me, the book was helpful to get an understanding of the potential long term negative impacts on the children.  It was helpful for me to have it spelled out.  So perhaps bump it down the priority list, but still worth reading at some point.  I liked your link to the book's page on bpdfamily.com -- I need to become familiar with those resources and how to link like that.

[WhataLife]

Howdy.  It's been a little while.

I'm running out of ideas here.  My wife just got back from seeing her "Lawyer" for 2.5 hours.  Headed straight for the shower, and then when I asked where she was, said, My Laywer.  When I asked what they were talking about, she said private stuff.  Intuition is saying, something isn't right.  I have spent TONS of time with a lawyer... .2.5 hours (Granted take 1hr of drive time out possibly) would leave 1.5 hours of face time.  She doesn't have any money?  How is this possible?

I now have access to her phone records (but it's a month behind, due to the billing cycles) so I'll see if she's in contact with anybody that I don't know.  She continues to flip out, accuse me of sleeping around and goes on multiple day silent treatments, followed by screaming and yelling at me.  Then after 4 days, she'll just wake up and we get to pretend that nothing happened.  Am I going crazy?  This isn't normal right?

To repeat, she has full access to all life, including phone, computer and all bank accounts etc.  I hide NOTHING from her.  Yet she continues to accuse me of cheating every 2-3 weeks!  What is happening here?  I work from home and am always within ear shot of her.  Seriously?

2 weeks ago, she was on a 5 day stint, and has said we were absolutely done and she was leaving.  I broke down and talked to a friend and his wife (her best friend) asking for their help.  Up until now, I've not brought a single person into the picture.  They are speechless as I am, and not really trained for helping.  But I couldn't do it alone anymore. 

And to top if off, my Exwife is getting chummy chummy with my sister and telling her a bunch of nonsense about me, who in turn is telling my current wife things that aren't true.  I finally told my sister to back the heck off.  My wife claims she sees right through the Ex's crap, and isn't falling for it (When she is white, not black!)

I'm really at a loss of what to do.  My life is like a yo-yo.  One day we are picking out new homes together and decorating our house, and the next she's talking to her lawyer.  I really feel that I need to protect myself legally, but if I do that, she'll be gone for good... .which at this point would at least allow peace and quiet.  But I DO NOT want to raise our 5 month daughter in a divorced family again.  (I have a 13 and 11 year old daughters from the previous marriage - joint custody)

Am I the ass-hole?  She doesn't work and i pay for everything, then she accuses me of cheating at every single moment.  What the heck am I supposed to do with this life?  The goods are great, but the bads are happening more and more frequently and they are really getting bad. 

Should I just cut my loses and be done?  Or just grin and bear it? 

[Radcliff]

Hi WhataLife, I'm sorry you didn't get any responses to your last post.  I've been mostly offline for a while. 

You say your gut says your wife was not really seeing a lawyer.  Trust your gut.  Pushing you away and watching for your reaction to cling to her may give her a sense of security.  It puts you through the wringer, though.  Try not to respond much to it, positive or negative.

Let us know next time you log on and we can try to get more of a discussion started.  I found that this place didn't start making a real difference to me until I became a regular, started reading the posts of others, and began learning from all the learning links here.

Wentworth