Cold chill

[Frankee]

I decided to post under this topic because I need help on a current situation.  I'm really looking for a "what I should do" and not what my BPH should do.  I've already accepted that I can't control his emotions, moods, and what he does.

Monday we had a text/phone call war about my mess up on the bank account.  I forgot to figure in a bill that was paid.  We weren't overdrawn, but depleted on funds for the week.  I thought I did a good job with validating and all that.  So I thought that we were going to be okay.

Tuesday we had a blow out.  He started "venting" about his feelings.  It's good to vent, but when he started attacking me, taking some pretty low blows, I could feel my blood boiling.  We both ended up screaming at each other and saying really mean things.  I know I didn't handle it well at all and all the tools I learned here were chucked out the window that day.  I screamed at him that I already felt like sh** about the situation and I didn't need him screaming at me about it.  I was a sarcastic b*** the rest of the afternoon and he was poking at me, egging on our current foul moods.  We were in the same house, but we pretty much gave each other cold shoulder.  Then he picked up our oldest from school and got angry because I missed a conference yesterday with his teacher.  I snapped at him that I told them I couldn't make it because of work.  Then he said I talked to them and said it was taken care of.  I stared blankly at him.  I know I'm forgetful sometimes... but I have no recollection of saying that at all.  Then he got angry and said I lied to him.  I still can't remember ever saying that to him.  So now I'm thinking he thought I said that and turned it into his reality.

Wednesday morning, I had a really bad cry.  I was so mad and hurt and angry that we went back through this cycle.  We were still co-habiting.  In the same space, but talking around each other.  I was steamed at the cruel things he said.  I was mean, I admit it.  He was downright cruel.  Said things that made me feel like crap scraped off his boots.  So I was being stubborn.  I was finding it hard to validate and everything else when I was still steaming.  I went to work, did some more reading about understanding everything I was feeling and how to feel better.  When I came home, I was feeling better.  We were still talking around each other, still feeling the tension.  He spent most of the night in his den while I took care of the kids.  I was kind of glad for the distance.  We went to bed and still could slice the tension with a knife.  We still didn't talk and kind of just, kept distant.

So now going on day four.  I know I let this go longer than I should.  I'm just finding it extremely difficult to be affectionate and bridge this cold distant feeling we have.  I'm still hurt and angry at the really cruel things he said.  I've already told him that the things he said was hurtful.  I know I messed up and was the start of all this.  How do I get past my stubborn feeling and start to mend this iceberg between us?  I can't make him do anything and saying what he should do won't help me.  I need to figure out what steps I can take to get past this resentment I'm feeling and start moving forward again.

[isilme]

So now going on day four.  I know I let this go longer than I should.  I'm just finding it extremely difficult to be affectionate and bridge this cold distant feeling we have.

It's okay.  Sometimes you both need that space.  You need time to process what's happened.  You need to figure out what is actually something you could have done differently and what is more a manifestation of his BPD that no action of yours would make better.

I find it hard to validate and back off of JADEing when I am tired or sick.  It happens.  It's not on you to constantly "fix" things after a fight, to do anything to make himself less angry or upset.  The best you can do is find ways to not increase the anger, but you're human too, with your own feelings that need to be said. 

Mistakes happen.  IN a r/s without BPD, people get upset, deal and move on.  BPD makes things hard to manage at the onset and hard to move on from.  He has a disability.  It makes him be ugly - this is not an excuse, this does not make it okay, but it DOES make it okay for you to ignore his comments when he is trying to make you feel as bad as he does by insulting you.  Insults really can only hurt us if we allow them in - fighting THAT is something you CAN do.  And a lack of reaction to an insult sometimes can make them stop using them as much.  I really think they want to ramp us up to their emotional level so they can force us into the same disordered feelings they have.  So they say horrible things, ugly things, all to bring us down into their personal pits of despair. 

So - he's disabled.  You have partly accepted this as part of the whole package.  In a way, we all are working to be no more resentful of a spouse missing legs who can't help change light bulbs than we are of a spouse who has a broken emotional thermostat.  I don't like it, and I tell him I don't like it, and then try my best to get us from the shouting to the silent treatment - he has a cycle.  Moody - rage - Silent Treatment - Uncomfortable Cohabitating - Resolution.  We kinda have it down to about 1-3 days max, now.  20 years in, but it's progress from daily rages. 

Give yourself permission to be uspet, to get it out here or another safe venue, and then see if you can feel more like resolution.  He is doing the same thing, but he's less cognizant of his roles in all of this, so while you can't control him, you are the one most likely to step forward and move things closer to "normal".  I usually don't bring things up - I just treat H as if nothing happened.  Somehow, that makes it "safe" for him to apologize.  It's weird.

[Frankee]

I really think they want to ramp us up to their emotional level so they can force us into the same disordered feelings they have.  So they say horrible things, ugly things, all to bring us down into their personal pits of despair. 

I don't like it, and I tell him I don't like it, and then try my best to get us from the shouting to the silent treatment - he has a cycle.  Moody - rage - Silent Treatment - Uncomfortable Cohabitating - Resolution.  We kinda have it down to about 1-3 days max, now.  20 years in, but it's progress from daily rages. 

I usually don't bring things up - I just treat H as if nothing happened.  Somehow, that makes it "safe" for him to apologize.  It's weird.

Thank you for the reply.  That was actually helpful.  It's really frustrating because this is true.  He's even said he does certain things to get a reaction.  It's almost as if he doesn't want to feel completely crazy, knowing that I have it in me to act just as bonkers sometimes.  While I admit that I have the full capacity to come completely unhinged, I am able to regulate it a lot better than he can.  When I am pushed to that point, I act just as crazy, but not as cruel.  It also is frustrating that even in the midst of our screaming match, he did bring up a few good points.  It's just the way he addressed the points was anything but gentle.  Which only made me feel worse.

My H has the same cycle. Right now we are in the uncomfortable co habiting.  I've been wanting to take the approach of acting like everything is normal, usually acting normal helps, but I feel like I'm faking it and he knows.  I'm just hesitant if that is the right approach or like pouring salt in open wound.   

[Meili]

How do I get past my stubborn feeling and start to mend this iceberg between us?

I have found that focusing on what I ultimately want makes it much easier. Does remaining stubborn help you achieve your goal?

It is easy for us to talk about not taking it all personally. The truth is that sometimes we do take it personally. Sometimes we are not mindful in the moment and take up the argument. Beating yourself up over the ordeal and continuing down a path that takes you further from your goals won't help though.

Things are what they are in this moment, you can't change that. You can learn from it (and it really does appear that you are) and prepare to do something different in the future. There are some things that you can do:

• Regulate your own emotions
  
  • Pause
  • Pay attention to your body posture
  • half-smile
  • validate and cheerlead yourself
• Validate (do this at every step)
  
  • soothe
  • employ the 6 levels of validation
• Ask/assess
  specifically, but gently ask "how would you like me to help? Do you want me to listen, give advice, or help you figure out what to do?"
  
  * if the answer is "just listen", then skip the next step and move to the last one
  
  * if the person wants your input, assess exactly what is going on
  
• brainstorm/troubleshoot
  
  • Generate
  • Collaborate
  • Anticipate
• get information on your role (if any) and what you can plan on hearing about the outcome
  

[isilme]

but I feel like I'm faking it and he knows.  I'm just hesitant if that is the right approach or like pouring salt in open wound. 

In a way it is faking - you know things aren't "normal".  I do it to show him I am moving past the drama, that I have no desire to prolong it.  I show him with my actions that "yes, you freaked out, no, it was not right, but also no, I am not abandoning you over it, so can we please move forward and you try to not do it again?"

 

[Frankee]

In a way it is faking - you know things aren't "normal".  I do it to show him I am moving past the drama, that I have no desire to prolong it.  I show him with my actions that "yes, you freaked out, no, it was not right, but also no, I am not abandoning you over it, so can we please move forward and you try to not do it again?"
 

I tried the acting normal.  I thought we were getting better last night.  He initiated contact first.  Then went bad again this morning.  I had to run errands and wanted to get it done before he went to work.  I was at my oldest a school paying for a fall festival.  I left my phone in the car.  I get back and he had called 11 times.  Was freaking out.  Asked where the baby was, I said right here and told him where I was.  He flipped out and was yelling to bring him home and hung up.   I had time to clear my thoughts and try to make sense of why he was so angry.  I knew it was because I didn't answer,  but there was more too it.

I walk through the door and casually say hi.  He was furious.  Yelled that I don't leave the house with the baby and refuse to answer the phone.  It clicked in my head that he was scared I had grabbed the baby and ran away.   As absurd as that sounds to me,  that happened to his half brother when he was a baby.   His father ran away with him and he never saw him again.  I said I was sorry for scaring him like that.  The look he had was anger,  distress, and almost as if he had been crying.

Then he blows up because I bought a few groceries without asking and because I "lied" the other day.   The lie I still can't remember saying.   He yells because we hadn't gone over a budget before I spent money.  He says he's warned me for years about lying and said if I keep doing it that he would lose interest.  Now he has lost interest.  Now he doesn't care about anything I have to say because I lie, I'll always be a liar,  I'll never change and I've proven that,  and doesn't trust me at all even with the finances  because tomorrow I will say we have no money.  I left the hot dogs and meat in the car when he left to work so he yells that I'm not using my brain.

As I type this, I'm crying and hurting so much.   Not the first time.  Everytime I feel like I'm starting to do better or feel better,  this happens.  I don't even know what to say or do.  I know I'm supposed to emotionally detach, but I couldn't this time.  What can I do?  How should I even start to recover from this?  Where do I even begin?  Sitting on my bathroom floor, crying bad,  feeling so hurt.  How do I stand up to this? 

[AskingWhy]

Frankee, please don't kick yourself for "backsliding" on your communication skills.  Many of us nonBPDs have done this.

Having a BPD spouse/partner can be trying and some days you have just had enough. 

Then we get sucked into the cycle drama and go for it.  We all know the vulnerabilities of our partners and we go for the jugular with words known to hurt.  Then we regret it, knowing the pwBPD really has no control in how he is feeling.

Don't punish yourself and move on.

Living with a pwBPD can try even the sanest person.

[isilme]

I am so sorry - I think we've all been in these really bad patches.  Something is triggering him, something is making him unable to scab over whatever is hurting. And many of those comments about being a liar, being an ugly mean person, I've heard them, too and they cut deeply.

He keeps thinking you "lied".  He might think you are hiding money or spending it on another life to be able to leave him.  Based on your last post that seemed to be a BIG issue.  All his current comments are based on his emotions RIGHT NOW.  Those WILL change, but he needs to find a place to self-sooth and calm the F down.  Until then, you are going to be feeling light a high wire artist.  Money is also a huge item for even non-BPD couples to fight about.  Being overspent in his mind makes him feel unsafe, insecure, and even if it's not true, probably in danger of living on the street.

H has reacted like this when an unexpected or forgotten bill, or a repair expense crops up.  Suddenly we are going to be homeless, have no food, have to sell off all we own (I am not exaggerating, this all makes sense to him).  As someone whose BPD mother got us evicted, I think I know this fear better than he does and work really hard to make it highly unlikely.

How are you taking care of yourself right now?  Are you sleeping?  Are you getting enough to eat/time to relax at all? 

Cry.  Cry all you need to.  Find a place where you are safe and alone and scream it out.  I do this in the car.  I look insane I am sure, but I yell out everything I have pent up to get it out.  Get something you like that makes YOU feel good.  A long bath, cook a dinner you like, something that lets you calm down yourself.  Right now, you are both a feedback loop for each other, each feeding into the dramatic exchanges.  And if you are tired, stressed, and can't focus, it's very hard to be the one to snap free.  I am sorry

[Frankee]

He keeps thinking you "lied".  He might think you are hiding money or spending it on another life to be able to leave him.  Based on your last post that seemed to be a BIG issue.  All his current comments are based on his emotions RIGHT NOW.  Those WILL change, but he needs to find a place to self-sooth and calm the F down.  Until then, you are going to be feeling light a high wire artist.  Money is also a huge item for even non-BPD couples to fight about.  Being overspent in his mind makes him feel unsafe, insecure, and even if it's not true, probably in danger of living on the street.

H has reacted like this when an unexpected or forgotten bill, or a repair expense crops up.  Suddenly we are going to be homeless, have no food, have to sell off all we own (I am not exaggerating, this all makes sense to him).

How are you taking care of yourself right now?  Are you sleeping?  Are you getting enough to eat/time to relax at all? 

Cry.  Cry all you need to.  Find a place where you are safe and alone and scream it out.  I do this in the car.  I look insane I am sure, but I yell out everything I have pent up to get it out.  Get something you like that makes YOU feel good.  A long bath, cook a dinner you like, something that lets you calm down yourself.  Right now, you are both a feedback loop for each other, each feeding into the dramatic exchanges.

I am tired.  He seems to be stuck on repeat with the push/pull cycle.  The way he reacted to me being gone and not answering the phone was blown completely sky high.  If I had been on his end, I would have been like...   Oh,  okay.  I was just worried because you didn't answer the phone.  Glad you and the baby are okay, see when you get home.  In his mind, I had cashed my paycheck, grabbed the baby, and ran for the hills.  That is the only explanation for the complete meltdown he had.

I keep trying to remind myself his emotions are a rollercoaster.  Just so hard in the moment.  My H is the same way.  If there is any hiccup in paying bills, rent,  or other expense... We are going to get kicked out, we're going to starve, have to pawn his stuff since he has all the nice stuff.   I do believe that it makes him feel out of control, insecure,  and all that.

Right now I'm struggling.  I have two little boys and right now is high time for play.  Doesn't help I did something to my left wrist and has left me with a dull aching pain.   Been rubbing icy hot and taking medicine, not helping yet.  Every 5 minutes it feels like one of them is screaming or crying.  It's wearing down my current mood something awful.  I'm counting the time to bed time.  I think I'm going to put them to bed a little early so I have alone time before my H comes home from work.  I think some self pampering after their bedtime would help.  I need to do something. 

I'm still trying to figure out what to say or how to act when my H comes home.  I'm hoping I can relax before he gets home.   If I had to deal with him the way I'm feeling right now,  would be a recipe for disaster. It makes me wonder.  Do the cycles ever break or do they only become less frequent and less volatile?

[Frankee]

Frankee, please don't kick yourself for "backsliding" on your communication skills.  Many of us nonBPDs have done this.

Having a BPD spouse/partner can be trying and some days you have just had enough. 

Then we get sucked into the cycle drama and go for it.  We all know the vulnerabilities of our partners and we go for the jugular with words known to hurt.  Then we regret it, knowing the pwBPD really has no control in how he is feeling.

Don't punish yourself and move on.

Living with a pwBPD can try even the sanest person.

I'm glad that I'm not completely crazy.  I try not to kick myself.  I try to remind myself that things I don't think are a big deal are sometimes the possible end of it all in his mind.  I'm frustrated by how when he gets this way he's so stubborn.   It's like a kid throwing a fit.  Sticking their fingers in their ears and shutting their eyes. He has completely shut down to any reasoning, any attempt I make to validate,  or show him I'm not going to leave. I know he's still going to be like this when he comes home and I'm dreading it. 

[pearlsw]

Hi Frankee, You have gotten a lot of good advice here already, but as I read your post I want to make some additional suggestions. And this is going to be BIG. But let me tell you a few stories to help ease this pill down... .

I had a boyfriend years ago - my second boyfriend. He was a good guy in a lot of ways, a hard-working blue collar guy. I learned a lot from him, even worked with him a bit on job sites. I am glad I knew him. On the other hand it was not easy with him and it wrecked my life quite a bit. After many hard years he fell apart, secretly started doing drugs behind my back and then even stole from me. A lot happened in those years.

I felt justified too in my anger (afterall, he was always bringing a lot of problems into our lives) until one day I didn't feel justified anymore. I just couldn't live with arguing back. It was not me. It was giving me high blood pressure and it was against all I believed in in my bones. I started a regular mediation practice and I gave up arguing like that for good. I slowed down my reaction times and I had control over my life again despite all going on with him. I gave up arguing. It can be done.

My first boyfriend and I barely argued so I was not used to this level of difficulty. (I thought I'd never face this stuff again til I met my current partner, and his BPD stuff... .) I gave this 2nd relationship my all - couples counseling, standing by him through his depression, job loss, weird legal stuff (charges pressed against him, charges he had to press against someone else for a work related theft.) A lot of drama someone else brought into my life that had no place in my life... .until I finally said "no more" and brought it all to a peaceful/friendly end.

I can tell you this. Please. As one human to another. Give up the screaming and yelling and arguing. There is no point. Let it go. Commit to healthier ways of communicating. Don't give another person any buttons to push. You can bring the temperature down on this whole thing a whole lot if you just put these behavioral controls on yourself come thick or thin. It is possible and it is worth it. You can't change him as you say, but you can change you. Choose peace. Choose freedom from this kind of interacting with anyone. I guarantee you it is worth it.

There are great tools here to support this. Meili's post lists a lot of them! You don't have to take up mediation, but you have to give up thinking it is okay to be a little less crazy than he is. We are not justified in this. We are simply not. We have to do our best and communicate in a healthy way and then let the chips fall where they may. It may work, it may not. My husband left me today despite me talking to him in nice ways. I would feel worse about it if I was mean to him. I was not. I was kind. If I never see him again, I will know my last words were kind and that will make it easier for me to go on with life. Please. Toss aside all you thought you knew, all the tools you rely on and start fresh. Relearn how to communicate. It will at the least bring you some peace. I promise.

Okay, those were my two cents! I wish you nothing but the best!

[badknees1]

Frankee... .right now at this very moment. I feel exactly the same way you do. you, we are not alone. As I type this I am so mad, sad, disrupted that I am shaking. BPD wife just blasted me with insults and stormed out of the house. I ave been really working on controlling my anger when this happens but I blew it. Do you wonder who pays the physical and emotional price for this? My wife is angry yes disregulated, yes but she got her likes in and feels justified. Me... .I was willing to talk,not blame or accuse... .now I am in an emtional fetal position. I think my go to place right now is a comfort food or activity to get my emotions and my body calmed down. I just want to remind you some of us are going though the same thing right now and somehow you are going to be OK.

[Frankee]

I can tell you this. Please. As one human to another. Give up the screaming and yelling and arguing. There is no point. Let it go. Commit to healthier ways of communicating. Don't give another person any buttons to push. You can bring the temperature down on this whole thing a whole lot if you just put these behavioral controls on yourself come thick or thin. It is possible and it is worth it. You can't change him as you say, but you can change you. Choose peace. Choose freedom from this kind of interacting with anyone. I guarantee you it is worth it.

I hate yelling and screaming too.  I find it unproductive, waste of time, and doesn't resolve anything.  I hate when I allow myself to explode like that.  I know it's because I'm not finding constructive healthy ways to alleviate the stress and building anger.   I really wanted to be all of that because that is me.  I'm easy going, roll with the punches, easily adapt to situations, but not put up with crap...   Or that's who I use to be.  Fighting really hard to be that person again.

My husband left me today despite me talking to him in nice ways. I would feel worse about it if I was mean to him. I was not. I was kind. If I never see him again, I will know my last words were kind and that will make it easier for me to go on with life. Please. Toss aside all you thought you knew, all the tools you rely on and start fresh. Relearn how to communicate. It will at the least bring you some peace. I promise.

I agree.  I try to make my words kind when I can.  I try to tell myself that I don't like when someone talks to me like that or why would I  feel bad about something I said because I was angry in the moment. I don't always follow that thinking, but acknowledging that I know it's wrong and putting an effort to change is a step in the right direction. 
I decided yesterday to bombard my mind with positive imagery. Really let it sink in.  I can say that I am feeling better today.  I found a way to help self soothe and heal from a blitz attack.  I like to look up motivations,  strong moms, positive quotes.  It seems to help lift my spirits.  Hopefully tomorrow is just as good.

[Frankee]

I feel exactly the same way you do. you, we are not alone.

As I type this I am so mad, sad, disrupted that I am shaking.

I have been really working on controlling my anger when this happens but I blew it.

My wife is angry yes disregulated, yes but she got her likes in and feels justified.
 
I just want to remind you some of us are going though the same thing right now and somehow you are going to be OK.

I'm sorry to hear you are having to feel the way I feel.  It's a real bad feeling.  I blew it too.  I came completely unglued and I hate it.  I hate yelling and screaming.  It is a waste of time, not constructive, and energy sucking.   It makes me mad that he does feel justified in the really horrible things he said.  It's the BS mentality of...   If I had just listened, if I hadn't lied, if I had forgotten whatever...   Then he wouldn't behave this way or say such things. Playing victim and blaming us for the way they behave/react. 

I'm getting better at identifying the times he's gaslighting/ manipulating/  projecting and such, but other times it doesn't lessen the blow of his cruel words.