Christmas dilemma - Advice please

[defogging]

'Tis the season for no-win situations!

My uBPDw is very attached to her family, and wants them to stay with us during Christmas, it would be 5 people including a baby.  We do not have any extra beds in the house, so I am objecting to it.  We have had a couple of discussions about it that ended in arguments, as she cannot compromise on anything.  They live an hour away, I told her they could either come and go on the 24th/25th or stay at a hotel nearby.  I don't have a problem with them spending time here, it's the extra hassle of inadequate sleeping arrangements for everyone when our house is already dysfunctional enough.

She has gone behind my back and told them they will be staying with us.  This has been a big issue for us, I am constantly being blindsided by promises she makes to others.  I'm also pretty sure that she has been telling them I don't want them to stay and am being a jerk, as bad mouthing me is another common occurrence.

I got upset with her today, and told her that if she moves forward with this without my agreement that I will not be here on Christmas and she can be responsible for making dinner for 25 people.  My emotions got the best of me, but how can I not get ticked off when this is constantly happening to me?  I am prepared to follow through with this and be out of town.

I figure my options are the following:
1.  Give in and let them stay - This just invites more of this behavior
2.  I discuss it directly with her family and let them know that uBPDw and I are not in agreement - risk of upsetting the in laws
3.  Be gone on Christmas

What do you think I should do in this situation?

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[Radcliff]

Hello defogging.  Hmm... .you are in a bit of a pickle!  With the declaration that you won't be there on Christmas, you've painted yourself into a corner.  You would likely end up looking like the villain to your wife and her family, and also end up not in your home for Christmas, which I am not sure is what you want.

I think you ended up caught in an understandable, but unfortunate confusion about boundaries.  Boundaries are about how we control our own behavior.  In the long term, there's a chance they will influence someone else's behavior, but that is not the primary goal.  A short term play to change someone's behavior (also known as an ultimatum) is almost certain to work out poorly.  The list of times where an ultimatum is appropriate is very short, and you can only play that game if victory is certain.

To learn more about boundaries, you might want to visit this page on setting boundaries, this thread on scripts for setting boundaries, and this thread on boundary setting examples.

OK, another topic is protecting someone from the natural consequences of their actions.  You are wise not to sign up for being responsible for feeding 25 people without your wife's help!

Let me ask you this -- do you and your wife have any small children?  If so, some extra care to make Christmas run smoothly may be warranted.  If not, you've got some latitude.

For example, if sleeping arrangements are awkward, who cares?  Her family signed up for it.  You can gently ask beforehand where people are going to sleep.  If she starts freaking out the day of, you can do helpful things like set up linens, etc., but just smile and be friendly and don't react to any drama.

Looking specifically at the three options you mentioned:

1.  Give in and let them stay - This just invites more of this behavior
2.  I discuss it directly with her family and let them know that uBPDw and I are not in agreement - risk of upsetting the in laws
3.  Be gone on Christmas

1.  Letting them stay -- a chaotic Christmas and your wife may do more things without your buy-in
2.  Discuss it with her family that you and their daughter don't agree -- Hmm... .can you see any ways that that might be a bad idea?
3.  Be gone on Christmas -- In your heart, do you really want to do this?  If not, then #1 may be your best option.

I have painted myself into plenty of corners.  Sometimes it's best to just suck it up and admit it.  The issue of her doing things without your buy in is a complex one, especially with a pwBPD.  You'll need to practice the tools and work on the relationship more before you can make any headway on that, and it may be a persistent challenge.

I think one of the things you're saying is that you want to get through these holidays without being walked all over.  After reading the boundaries links above, can you think about how you might reframe things, and discuss some boundaries around your behavior that make you feel OK with things?  Validate your wife's desire to have her family visit before you discuss your boundaries, though.  You want her to feel supported.  W.r.t. boundaries, they might involve specifically what your meal contribution will be (for example, maybe you handle the meat, but others will have to pull everything else together -- maybe her relatives can bring sides cooked the day before).  Then do what you said you were going to do.  If there is trouble in the other areas, pitch in like anyone else might (i.e. don't be a jerk about it) but don't all of a sudden take responsibility for all of the sides because nobody showed up with them.  You can be a helper in the other areas, but not an owner.  These are just some ideas -- you'll be able to best figure out where the boundaries should be.

One more thought on her family.  Regardless of how onery they might be or what baggage they bring (literally and figuratively  your best bet is likely to play the gracious host.  These folks will be a factor in your life for years and years.  The gracious host role is hard work, but it is one that you can take pride in, and is likely to bring benefits to you in the years to come.  If you've any doubt, consider the alternatives -- surly host and absent host.  Which do you choose?

Finally, are there any silver linings?  Can you embrace the chaos?  Are any of her relatives fun?

WW

[waverider]

Has you wife put forward any proposal as to where everyone can sleep? i would put the problem of solving that in her court. Let her solve that problem and let her explain it to the inlaws who may decide for themselves they dont want to sleep under the table. After all if there is no solution, there is no solution, it doesn't have to be your problem. if there is a solution even if not ideal just roll with it.

If it is just a case of you not relishing the fact it is going to be overcrowded is that worse than all the fighting over it?

[Notwendy]

I can understand your wife wanting to have her family stay for Christmas. The issue is no room or beds for them.

A solution that comes to mind is- something like an Airbnb or VRBO home rental for the weekend, where there is room for all of you to stay together. Perhaps the family wouldn't mind this idea and chipping in for the cost. ( a hotel would cost them money anyway).  If there are several people and a baby, they might prefer this as it would be more comfortable.

One thought is that they may prefer not staying in a space that is small with no beds, and are afraid to say something- they don't want to offend.

My H liked to stay with his parents for the holidays, but as our family grew, it became less comfortable. I suggested staying in a hotel and he thought this would "insult " his family. I think his mother may have been relieved to not have the extra stress of guests and the cooking, but she would never say it as she would be concerned it would "insult" us.

This is when I realized families have unspoken "rules". Some don't say what they really think and then just feel resentful, others may speak too openly. If your wife has BPD, she may come from a family with poor boundaries and /or unspoken rules.

It may be these "unspoken rules" that are getting in the way of a solution. Her family may choose to be all cooped up and uncomfortable rather than say something. Finding a larger place where everyone can stay together and have a place to sleep might be a solution. She may desperately want their approval and feels she needs to do this - but a larger place for the holiday may be a way to accommodate everyone.

[defogging]

Thank you for the replies, yes this is a pickle that I'm in!  Yes, it's just an issue of beds and her adding more chaos.  I am fine with spending time with them, they can stay at our house right up until we go to bed and arrive right when we wake up on Christmas morning.  I've told uBPDw this and it's not good enough.  I'm also willing to pay for their hotel rooms.

Wentworth - Agreed it was a mistake to throw out an ultimatum, but I can work around that.  I'll just take a page out of her playbook and ignore that.  She won't bring it up again, and I'm pretty sure she doesn't remember a lot of our arguments as everything seems to change all the time.

I guess my understanding of boundaries is different than what you describe, at least in one way.  To me, setting a boundary results in them not getting their desired outcome and can bring about a change in their behavior.  By what you describe it sounds like I would be setting boundaries on my behavior and how I react to it.  Put on a happy face and go along with it.  How does this solve the ongoing issue of her making promises to others and setting me up at the same time?  It seems like that reinforces the behavior but helps make the situation bearable in the short term.

I should clarify that me reaching out to her parents isn't a nuclear option.  They are well aware of her behavior and have reminded her in the past that she should discuss things with me before making plans with them.  It actually helps a lot of the time.  They get a very different story from uBPDw and when I reach out to them they see that I'm not the villain I'm portrayed as.  In reading the strategies for eliminating a drama triangle, the advice for the persecutor is to be more assertive.  That is what I was thinking with this idea.  Still not sure it's worth it though.

waverider - She has a plan, which involves moving all our kids into one room, me moving back into our bedroom, and having in laws in the basement and various kid's rooms.  I don't sleep in our bedroom because she makes sleeping difficult for me, making noise, lights on, kids in there, etc.

The in laws won't go against her on anything.  The dynamic in their family is to go along with whatever she says and avoid upsetting her at all costs.

"If it is just a case of you not relishing the fact it is going to be overcrowded is that worse than all the fighting over it?"  Not really, it's the additional chaos she introduces in these situations.  Leads to more stress with getting everything ready for them.  Her battle cry is "I'm so busy all the time, you need to help me".  It's an endless cycle where she over promises to people, over schedules herself, and then expects me to make it work.  It's also the disrespect she shows me by going behind my back.  She knows she can get her way by doing this and I'm sick of it.

Notwendy - Agreed an Airbnb is another idea, but it wouldn't fly either.  Public image is very important to uBPDw so she will have to host and open up our house to people.  You're correct about unspoken rules, you can see from what I've written above that their rule is to just go along with her to avoid arguments.  This makes life very difficult for me.  She gets her way around them, hence she wants them around all the time.  It creates more battles for us because I don't like the dynamics when they are around, I used to enjoy their company but being set up as the bad guy all the time has made it less fun.

Thinking about this more this morning, I may have a workable solution.  She has offered that just BIL/SIL and baby would stay at our house while her parents would come back and forth.  We actually have space for this.  Unfortunately this probably still comes with me looking bad because she's telling her parents I said they aren't allowed to be here.  Oh well.  I will tell her that I'm going to stay in one of our kid's rooms so I can sleep, and the kids can sleep in our bed with her.  I am going to set a boundary that she is responsible for all the preparation so they can stay in the basement, and shift more of the food making responsibility to her.  Of the 25 people coming over on Christmas day, only two are from my side.  In the past I've done the cooking while she socializes which isn't fair.

[pearlsw]

Hi defogging, Notwendy, waverider, and Wentworth,

I can't say I have a lot to add here, but just want to say what a helpful and interesting discussion this is because I think a lot of us find ourselves in these tough holiday situations.

What do you think of the direct approach, if this is true, of telling folks directly when you see them that you are glad they are there, but just did/do feel worried they might be uncomfortable with the limited accommodations? Sometimes just being direct and putting your thoughts out there... .well, you could find that you directly connect with others who may also be suffering.

Thanks for sharing this with us all - it gives us all a great chance to learn!

take care, pearlsw.

[defogging]

pearlsw - Thanks, that's what I was thinking with contacting her family about it.  Being assertive that I'm looking forward to spending time with them but everyone staying at our house is likely to be cramped and uncomfortable, and allow them to make their own decision on what to do.

It's probably a good idea for me to call my FIL and discuss the situation with him.  He's reasonable and we get along well.  If nothing else it will diffuse the distortion campaign uBPDw is almost certainly waging on me right now.

[waverider]

At the end of the day if it is overly cramped it will be obvious to your inlaws that your concerns are genuine regardless of what spin your wife puts on it, so yes just tell them straight what your concerns are. Then take it from there.

[Radcliff]

Hello defogging, I see your point about your inlaws.  I actually am communicating with some of my in-laws on our current situation, and they have been tremendously helpful -- the two I'm talking with are good at staying in the center of the drama triangle and don't feed any drama.  They care for my wife and are loyal to her, but also understand her issues and care for our children and me.

On boundaries I think the big difference between what you're saying and what we teach here is that influencing the behavior of the other person is not the primary goal, it is a possible secondary benefit.  The primary goal is that it defines your own behaviors.  This is actually great news, because it guarantees you'll be a winner, since you can control your behaviors.  Influencing someone else's behavior is a roll of the dice.  Using your example specifically, setting boundaries around how you'll help with bedding prep and cooking is great boundary usage.  The primary goal is to avoid you being strung out and miserable supporting something that might be unreasonable.  A secondary benefit is that you are not protecting your wife from the consequences of her actions.  You are not jumping in and saving her if she invites too many people over.  That might influence her behavior next time, it might not.  But you've got the guaranteed win that you didn't feed the beast or wear yourself out doing someone else's work for them.

To learn more about boundaries, you might want to visit this page on setting boundaries,
this thread on scripts for setting boundaries, and this thread on boundary setting examples.

WW

[Notwendy]

Wentworth made a good point about boundaries being about you, not the other person.

One difficulty with the boundary on visitors is that it is your wife's home too and it isn't unreasonable for her to want to invite her family to stay.

Your point about lack of space is also reasonable and logical. One problem with dealing with these issues using logic is that it doesn't address the emotions your wife is feeling. She may "want " this due to a perceived emotional need and the logic won't meet that. I think if you look back at some of your conflicts with her, her position has been an emotional want and yours is logical ( ie she wants something and you either can't afford it, or there isn't room... etc)

Then there is the family dynamics and emotions, and unspoken rules in each family. Once we were visiting my in laws and there was an impending storm. I wanted to leave before the bad weather. That was logical. A storm was coming. However my H felt that my wanting to leave was an insult to his family and dug his heels in. I got concerned about travelling in bad weather and the conversation went downhill.

One aspect is making meaning out of something. I said "bad weather". He said " you don't like my family". You are saying "not enough room" and your wife is making other meaning out of that.

One thing about boundaries is that we can not control how other people think. You can not control how your wife thinks about your concerns about house guests.

If you do talk to her parents, be very careful about triangulation. Look at the Karpan triangle. If her parents agree with you, she may perceive this as victimizing her.

When a request seems illogical, and a logical solution doesn't help- consider there is something emotional behind it.

Consider natural consequences as Wentworth said. Instead of rescuing your wife from an overcrowded weekend, talking to her parents, fixing an impending difficult situation before it happens, one alternative is to let her do it her way- let them be cooped up and uncomfortable. Then they may come up with their own solution ( stay somewhere else) next time.

[defogging]

Thanks again for the replies.

Wentworth - We're not far apart on what we're saying.  Maybe a better way for me to say it is allowing her to face the consequences of her actions, rather than changing her behavior.  (although her no longer offering my time to other people would be a wonderful change)  That is one boundary I've set lately, when she volunteers me without asking the answer is no.  It's not going well, haha.  Hopefully it's an extinction burst and will calm down soon.

What you and others have said has allowed me to reframe my thinking.  In pushing back on them staying here I was trying to avoid the consequence of everyone having a stressful and uncomfortable Christmas.  Instead, I will allow uBPDw to deal with the chaos of making it happen and allow her family to experience it.

The root of the issue is the drama triangle I'm in with her family.  With this situation they will come over, pretend everything is great, and help her out.  With the boundaries I will set over Christmas this will unfortunately feed into the cycle.  I will appear unsupportive, she will make it clear to everyone how I'm not helping her, and I will hear more about how her family supports her while I don't.  I'm trying to find a way out of the triangle, but as long as they bail her out I can't.

Notwendy - You're spot on with your description of her wanting things due to emotions and me not giving in because of logic.  So many examples over the years.  The big one is she decided we need to move, this happened one year after we had bought a house that we both really liked at the time.  She went behind my back and contacted realtors, took tours of homes, while trying to badger me into it.  I objected because it's very expensive to move and the net gain would be reducing her commute from 20 minutes to 15 minutes.  She, of course, uses this as an excuse for why she's late everywhere she goes.  Constant anger and guilt about it.  This is where I caught onto black and white thinking.  Everything about the new neighborhood is perfect, and everything here is miserable.

You can see what I wrote about the drama triangle above, I'm definitely in one.  Her family won't agree with me on things, at least publicly.  And that's okay, I'm not trying to get them to side with me.  She is their daughter and they should support her before me.  They've confided to me that they see my side of things a lot, but that can make it equally as frustrating when I hear that from them and they still go along with a crazy idea that uBPDw came up with.  It makes me the odd man out and solidifies uBPDw's position that I'm not supportive.

[Tattered Heart]

Wentworth - We're not far apart on what we're saying.  Maybe a better way for me to say it is allowing her to face the consequences of her actions, rather than changing her behavior.  (although her no longer offering my time to other people would be a wonderful change)  That is one boundary I've set lately, when she volunteers me without asking the answer is no.  It's not going well, haha.  Hopefully it's an extinction burst and will calm down soon.

That sounds more like punishment and control. A boundary on her volunteering you for things would be to let her know that it is inappropriate for her to volunteer you for things without talking to you about it first and then ask her to allow you the option of saying yes and no. The consequence would not be you saying no every time. That's just being uncompromising. A better consequence would be that when you do choose to say no that she has to tell the person that she spoke too quickly in volunteering you and that you cannot help out. You said yourself that the way you have been handling it isn't working. Maybe it's not an extinction burst.

My H and I used to have this issue. People would ask me "Can H help do this?" I would say yes and then tell him about it. He would get mad because I didn't give him a say. When I finally figured out what he was telling me, I don't even offer to ask my H for the other person. I tell the person who asks me if my H can help to go ask him directly so I don't have to be the middle man.

I'm trying to find a way out of the triangle, but as long as they bail her out I can't.

One way out of the triangle is to move out of the persecutor position and begin trying to work with her while at the same time letting her deal with the consequences of overcrowding in the house. If the issue is solely that there is no where to sleep for everyone, then you can help her with food prep, house prep, gift wrapping, activities planning, etc. You become the supportive spouse instead of the persecuting spouse. The only area to not help is in figuring out sleeping arrangements. It sounds like you've been given some really great options from waverider and Wentworth.

I really like waverider's suggestion on putting the responsibility of figuring out sleeping arrangements on her. Talking about the issue may be a sore spot now because you've dug in your heels and she has too. A great way to start the conversation may begin with an apology for giving an ultimatum, sympathizing that you know it's important for her to be with family on Christmas, and ask her how she will handle sleeping arrangements. Can you practice how you could say something like that here?

[defogging]

A quick update on this:  I called my in laws this morning and discussed it with them.  It went very well.  I kept it simple and told them I wanted to make sure they understood my concern was around the sleeping arrangements and they are welcome to spend time with us over Christmas.  We worked out a solution that works for everyone, which is my BIL and SIL staying at the house while MIL and FIL come back and forth.  They thanked me several times for calling and clearing things up, which tells me they were hearing something different from my wife, as I suspected.

Tattered Heart - I'm afraid that in the interest of brevity I oversimplified what I'm saying.  There is compromise (see above), it's not an answer of no from me every time.  However, there is a big difference between "my parents will be in the area around dinnertime, can you make extra food for them to join us" (of course) and "no problem, my H will come over this weekend and re-roof your house" (Huh?).  The reality is I've been forced to put my foot down because the boundaries I've tried to set through discussing it have been ignored and abused. 

"A boundary on her volunteering you for things would be to let her know that it is inappropriate for her to volunteer you for things without talking to you about it first and then ask her to allow you the option of saying yes and no".  I tried discussing it a thousand times, the obligations without my input keep coming.

"A better consequence would be that when you do choose to say no that she has to tell the person that she spoke too quickly in volunteering you and that you cannot help out"  Tried this also, it leads to a distortion campaign where she tells the other party I'm a selfish jerk.

I believe the healthy model would be for both parties to respect each other's time and prior commitments.  If someone asks me if my wife can help them with something I wouldn't dream of promising them yes without asking her.  It can be kept very simple "I think H/W is free that day, but let me check with them first".  The thing is, she would be surprised how often I would say yes if she would show me the respect of asking me first, as I'm a person that will readily help people out (to a fault at times).  Or, she could do as you mentioned and have that person contact me directly to discuss it.

"The only area to not help is in figuring out sleeping arrangements"  Unfortunately, this would feed into the pattern.  uBPDw is very high functioning, and has no issues with deciding on logistics.  Her pattern is to over schedule and over burden herself and then cry out that she needs help.  Everything is planned out to the letter, but I need to jump in and execute it.  It has gotten worse over time and it became expected that I would execute her plans for her.  I try to discuss it with her, and let her know I think she is taking too much on, this results in her arguing that she has plenty of time.  Round and around we go.  The only thing I can do at this point is make clear that I think she is taking on too much, and if she insists on taking on everything, then she needs to make it happen.

I plan to let her clean up and prepare the basement for BIL/SIL (I wouldn't be able to do it to her standards anyway).  I am reasonable, if she needs help with moving something heavy I will do it.  The other things you mentioned are things that I already do for her - I handle the cooking, help prepare the house, and wrap presents.

[storagecold]

I've been through this as well with my uBPDw of 15+ years. We lived in a 1,000 SF house at the time.

I changed my tune from trying to argue or reason to, "All are welcome! I'll sleep on the floor if needed! Tell me what I need to do to help you!"

Of course, nothing I ever try to plan or do or provide would ever be good enough, so I simply turn the burden over to her, be on my best behavior, and be nice no matter what, and I mean no matter what -- some of the "in-laws" stories I could tell you about their actions (they are a lot like my wife) would curl your hair.

This method of operation has been what works best for me over the years. Good luck.

[WitzEndWife]

I find that with my uBPDh, he likes to put me in a pickle, and then hand me the responsibility of dealing with said pickle. That sounds like what your wife is doing to you. I'm in agreement with waverider, in that I think one way you can avoid enabling here is to set a boundary for yourself (I am not going to take responsibility for her pickles), and empower her to figure out where everyone will sleep. Yes, you will likely get push back, but this is where you need to be firm. If you compromise or take on her pickle, she will keep handing them to you.

You can even say something like, "Since they're your family and you know them better than I do, you will be MUCH better than I am in knowing where everyone will be comfortable sleeping." That way, you can kind of build her up - instead of saying, "This is your mess, so you deal with it! I'm not helping!" You can even offer to help her out with something else that you actually want to help with.

If she pushes back, you can always say, "I'm not comfortable doing that, but I'll help you in other ways."

It's interesting learning how to build boundaries around behavior that is clearly undesirable. The point is, you don't have to manage the consequences of their actions, they need to learn to do so.

[defogging]

I find that with my uBPDh, he likes to put me in a pickle, and then hand me the responsibility of dealing with said pickle. That sounds like what your wife is doing to you. I'm in agreement with waverider, in that I think one way you can avoid enabling here is to set a boundary for yourself (I am not going to take responsibility for her pickles), and empower her to figure out where everyone will sleep. Yes, you will likely get push back, but this is where you need to be firm. If you compromise or take on her pickle, she will keep handing them to you.

You can even say something like, "Since they're your family and you know them better than I do, you will be MUCH better than I am in knowing where everyone will be comfortable sleeping." That way, you can kind of build her up - instead of saying, "This is your mess, so you deal with it! I'm not helping!" You can even offer to help her out with something else that you actually want to help with.

If she pushes back, you can always say, "I'm not comfortable doing that, but I'll help you in other ways."

It's interesting learning how to build boundaries around behavior that is clearly undesirable. The point is, you don't have to manage the consequences of their actions, they need to learn to do so.

This is a very accurate description of my situation, she creates the pickle and then hands it off to me.  Frustrating, isn't it?  I find there can be a fine line between being a supportive spouse and being walked on.  As I'm learning her patterns it helps when I can recognize the pickle coming my way, and think of ways to hand it back to her peacefully.

I like your suggestion about how to re-frame my responses into something that will build her up instead of being a battle, I need to work on that. 

What you said about finding something else to help her with (that I want to do) is another thing I try to do.  Doing all the cooking for Christmas is a good example.  I enjoy cooking, so I have no problem doing that.  My frustration is these things I do become "automatic" in her mind after awhile, then she adds to my workload.  I think it's so she can feel that rush of being helped out again, and to her it shows I care.  To me it just feels overwhelming to have more tasks thrown at me, hence the necessary push back.

[isilme]

My frustration is these things I do become "automatic" in her mind after awhile, then she adds to my workload.

The concept of "normal" resets and the amount of "help" needed grows.  H loves to complain about how I am lazy and do nothing but take naps.  Yet somehow laundry is clean, dishes are usually clean, sheets changed, bills paid, cars maintained within reason, food is cooked, and trips to the store are made, the lawn is mowed, trash taken out, and pets cared for, all while working 40+ hours a week, and he lifts no fingers to do any of it.  He thinks it's "enough" he goes to work and "everyone" should just be happy with that.  And some days, I can agree, looking at his impaired adulting abilities. 

He likes to ask why I've not done XYZ, ignoring that I've been a little busy with ABC.  I kinda made my bed and most days can live with the fact that at times it's like being a single person caring for the household and yard, with another person making more dishes and laundry dirty.  Arguing over chores never got anywhere.

I like the rephrasing idea - it's harder to refute that and toss the ball back to you. 

[WitzEndWife]

I think it's just a matter of continuing to reinforce what you are and are not comfortable doing. And also to reinforce positive behavior from your spouse. If she does something to help you or meet you halfway, you can say, "I really think it's wonderful when we work together like this. It makes me feel like we're a team!" or something like that. You can think through what feels right to you.

I've started kind of thinking of my husband as a teenager in an adult's body -which he is, essentially. I think back to being a teen and how my parents got me to take on more responsibility. I didn't like it at first, but eventually it became a habit. The more you do for your spouse, the more she'll just think is normal. But change is scary, so you have to reinforce those habits. Maybe invite her to do more things with you that she expects you to do. "I could really use your help with chopping these vegetables. You're so good at that! Do you mind pitching in?" Stuff like that. She will appreciate that you want to do something together, and it keeps you from having to shoulder everything.

[Radcliff]

isilme, just hearing you describe all your doing makes me feel like I need a nap

WW

[isilme]

Wentworth, me too 

Really I kinda reconciled that at times I can count on having a partner, but in many ways, I need to be able to do what I want to be done around the house as if I was single.  Fights got us nowhere.  Discussions could not happen without fights.  Me being passive-aggressive and leaving things until he got tired of the mess just made me feel stressed.  So, to fight my own stress, I leave what can be left as long as needed, and then take care of it.  I don't do dishes or laundry every day - but I try to keep us from having NO clean dishes and my happy-place is a clean sink (no dishwasher - that's in the 5-more years maybe column of expenses).  H would just wash things as needed if left to him. 

I see it as my attempt at a boundary about not letting his poor executive control as far as adult-stuff, like not being good at keeping up with bills or laundry, bother me.  I know to some it just enabling, but I I do what I see needs doing for ME and leave what he can deal with to him.  I can't have the electricity cut off trying to teach him a lesson and have to live with that.  I CAN leave his clothes in a clean pile after washing the dirty pile and let him deal with how hard it is to find socks. 

I see it as triage - find what you NEED to do for your own sanity, what you can do within reason, and then you kinda have to let the rest slide and fall on them to manage. 

[waverider]

Wentworth, me too 

Really I kinda reconciled that at times I can count on having a partner, but in many ways, I need to be able to do what I want to be done around the house as if I was single.  Fights got us nowhere.  Discussions could not happen without fights.  Me being passive-aggressive and leaving things until he got tired of the mess just made me feel stressed.  So, to fight my own stress, I leave what can be left as long as needed, and then take care of it.  I don't do dishes or laundry every day - but I try to keep us from having NO clean dishes and my happy-place is a clean sink (no dishwasher - that's in the 5-more years maybe column of expenses).  H would just wash things as needed if left to him. 

I see it as my attempt at a boundary about not letting his poor executive control as far as adult-stuff, like not being good at keeping up with bills or laundry, bother me.  I know to some it just enabling, but I I do what I see needs doing for ME and leave what he can deal with to him.  I can't have the electricity cut off trying to teach him a lesson and have to live with that.  I CAN leave his clothes in a clean pile after washing the dirty pile and let him deal with how hard it is to find socks. 

I see it as triage - find what you NEED to do for your own sanity, what you can do within reason, and then you kinda have to let the rest slide and fall on them to manage. 

pwBPD can be a bit like railway trucks that you want to be somewhere. They can move but have no motive power of their own to get there. You have to be the locomotive or nothing gets moved. You have a choice move them, or do without the goods they are carrying. Getting all stressed about why they cant move of their own accord gets you in a worse place.

This all about acceptance rather than enabling. Enabling is allowing someone who is capable of doing something to avoid it. Acceptance is about realising someone just doesn't have the ability to behave in a certain way to act as though they do.