Separating and Feeling Hopeful

[Depression = 72% of members]

Hello,

This is my first post and I'm reaching out for a supportive community while I navigate a ton of uncertainty with my wife. About two weeks ago, she "asked" for a divorce after 2.5 years of marriage. I put "asked" in quotations, because it was more a result of me probing her calmly if she wanted to leave after she told our marriage counselor that she knew our marriage was a mistake 6 months in. I had suspected an affair over the last two months, to which she vehemently denied and turned my questions into subtle manipulative comments against my character. In that time, she tanked - which I'm learning is called dysregulation. She's lost a ton of weight, has been drinking excessively, staying out late, and generally been beyond reproach. At the same time, she's stuck around and found ways to reassure me that she's not leaving, so it has been a very confusing time.

After telling me she wanted a divorce, she left town on a work trip and extended the trip to visit friends in another town. When she came back, she already had an apartment lined up and was ready to move out. I moved to this town for her career and staying in it does not make much sense for me, so I've already been honest with my employer, who has offered me a remote position in order to move back to my hometown where I have more support. The quickness and impulsiveness of everything raised red flags for me, as well as her spiraling behavior. Knowing that she has family members with BPD I finally started to really consider the possibility that she was somewhere on the BPD spectrum herself. The more I considered it, the more it made sense, and the more I felt empathy for her. She's confided in me in the past that she was scared that she had traits of BPD, too, but I made the mistake of not validating these fears and just reassuring her that she was fine. Now, I can see what a cry for help that moment was!

While all of this turmoil was happening, she gave me permission to access her computer, social media, text messages, etc in order to prove she wasn't having an affair. I didn't take her up on it initially, because I felt like it was her way of saying "there's nothing to see here" and so I trusted her and told myself that it was my own fear of being cheated on that was fueling my suspicions. When she came home from her work trip briefly (before leaving to visit friends), she had dropped off a back pack that had a new journal in it. I read the journal, which detailed her affair with the exact person I had suspected. I then went on her laptop and found more proof, and learned that she was doing things with this person that would jeopardize her career (not to mention ruin our marriage and his marriage). It all clicked in that moment - she was attracted to the most high risk situation, and was leaving subtle proof of it around the house to bait me into confronting her and blowing up.

I took the opposite approach. The evidence of what I had on her was killing me, because it could absolutely ruin her career and that was too much of a burden to carry on my own - despite friends and family members encouraging me to use it as blackmail to get her to cooperate with me during a divorce. Earlier this week, I sat her down after meeting with a divorce lawyer and learning my rights and the process of divorce in our state. When my wife and I sat down to negotiate the process and splitting up things in the house, she kept saying "I respect you and I want to do this process with respect." I had enough, and said "no you don't, you've been lying to me for some time, you know it, I know it, and it would be beneficial to both of us if you just came clean." I absolutely shocked her, because I said it assertively but kindly. It took about 30 minutes of denial and her crying in my arms, but she eventually told me everything I had already learned, without me having to tell her how I knew. Then, the conversation turned to "what is wrong with me, do you think I'm broken? why do I do things like this? I've been so out of control."

I had no intention of staging a BPD intervention, but she asked me if she thought I was borderline between tears and confessions (I never answered that question straight on, I knew better). I was strong, calm, and loving throughout this whole process, while also making it clear that I did not condone her behavior and that she crossed so many lines with me and was so close to losing her job, too. We went through some behaviors and thought patterns together, with me attaching some names to things to help her understand. When she described splitting, I told her "that's called splitting." When she described mirroring, I told her "that's called mirroring." Each time I put a name to something it was like a light bulb went off in her and her affect and demeanor became more relaxed. She's highly intelligent and very hardworking, and each thing we named together I also helped her see how a really good therapist could help her to mitigate the risk of going into some of those feelings and behaviors, especially when stressed and triggered, and that her life could be absolutely amazing with some work. She told me the next day "this is the first time in my life I've felt hope, and not the shallow kind like something can quickly fix this."

My wife, who avoids conflict and can only sit in a hard conversation for 15 minutes at a time, sat with me for 6 hours on the couch being so honest and unburdening so much of herself - and I had to be the one that said "ok, time for bed". I've never felt closer to her, to be honest, even knowing that our separation is imminent. We've been sleeping and living in separate rooms and that's been going very well. She put in for her new apartment yesterday, which felt very sad but also like the right thing. I feel like I can finally start thinking about my next steps and grieve a bit, because all of this has been happening so fast and I had to snap into emergency mode to slow the bleed with her and pull her back off her ledge. She used those exact words with me later that night, before bed. She pulled me in for a hug and said "thank you. No one has ever held me accountable in my life like you just did and no one has ever had the strength to pull me back from the ledge." I can't tell you how much work I've been doing on myself to get to this point, but I'm going to keep at it, especially now that I can see what's really going on and how much more powerful this is than negotiating things like going out on more dates to spend quality time together or who cooks dinner. The work I've been doing even gave me the strength to say "hey, I can't process this with you, but I imagine it's going to hurt to break things off with X(affair partner) and that you got pretty attached to him. I'm sorry that you're going to go through that kind of pain and I really hope you reach out to someone for support, because you deserve it." I know that probably sounds crazy, but it felt so right to say. I love her. I don't want her to hurt, and I feel confident that I can deal with my hurt while still validating hers. 

I'm still trying to sort out my own feelings about this, and I told her that, but I approached her about the potential of a "healing separation." It's clear that we need to take the pressure off of our marriage and that we both have work to do to undo some of our own behaviors that are toxic when they comingle. However, it also feels to me that there is still so much love left between us that there is potential of a new and different relationship between us, with time, therapy, and distance. I wasn't going to present her with this idea just yet, given how much she's had to think about already and I don't want to overwhelm her, but she was perceptive enough to know that something was on my mind and requested that I share. I told her about the idea of a healing separation and told her that I didn't need an answer now and needed to think about it myself, but that maybe with some time and distance from each other to relieve the immediate pressure we could consider if it would work for us. The only thing it would do differently is slow down the divorce process, which is good because it is an expense we both really can't afford right now. We both are moving out, we both know we have work to do, and we both know that where we are is not healthy and cannot continue. She asked me to print out some stuff for her on it, so I did, put it in a folder, and gave it to her last night with the same "no pressure, think about this on your own time" statement.

I know that a healing separation will absolutely require her to do her work and we've already talked about DBT programs. One of the challenges is that she could lose her job if a BPD diagnosis was revealed, so I know there is strong incentive for her to conceal what she's learning about herself. My work, however, is being less outcome dependent and re-developing my sense of self such that I don't need to know what she's doing in order to be ok and secure. I started this a bit ago, and it's what has been giving me the strength to confront her with such calmness and love.

So that's my story so far. I know we are in the early days of this turmoil, but I am hopeful, at the least to know that maybe I could leave her better than I found her, as our marriage therapist told me the other night when I went to see her alone. I'm resisting the need to attach that hope to something concrete, like us getting back together one day. It just feels like hope though, and like a better life is coming.

Thanks for the support everyone, your posts have helped me get here and I'm grateful.

[lighthouse9]

Hello,

This is my first post and I'm reaching out for a supportive community while I navigate a ton of uncertainty with my wife. About two weeks ago, she "asked" for a divorce after 2.5 years of marriage. I put "asked" in quotations, because it was more a result of me probing her calmly if she wanted to leave after she told our marriage counselor that she knew our marriage was a mistake 6 months in. I had suspected an affair over the last two months, to which she vehemently denied and turned my questions into subtle manipulative comments against my character. In that time, she tanked - which I'm learning is called dysregulation. She's lost a ton of weight, has been drinking excessively, staying out late, and generally been beyond reproach. At the same time, she's stuck around and found ways to reassure me that she's not leaving, so it has been a very confusing time.

After telling me she wanted a divorce, she left town on a work trip and extended the trip to visit friends in another town. When she came back, she already had an apartment lined up and was ready to move out. I moved to this town for her career and staying in it does not make much sense for me, so I've already been honest with my employer, who has offered me a remote position in order to move back to my hometown where I have more support. The quickness and impulsiveness of everything raised red flags for me, as well as her spiraling behavior. Knowing that she has family members with BPD I finally started to really consider the possibility that she was somewhere on the BPD spectrum herself. The more I considered it, the more it made sense, and the more I felt empathy for her. She's confided in me in the past that she was scared that she had traits of BPD, too, but I made the mistake of not validating these fears and just reassuring her that she was fine. Now, I can see what a cry for help that moment was!

While all of this turmoil was happening, she gave me permission to access her computer, social media, text messages, etc in order to prove she wasn't having an affair. I didn't take her up on it initially, because I felt like it was her way of saying "there's nothing to see here" and so I trusted her and told myself that it was my own fear of being cheated on that was fueling my suspicions. When she came home from her work trip briefly (before leaving to visit friends), she had dropped off a back pack that had a new journal in it. I read the journal, which detailed her affair with the exact person I had suspected. I then went on her laptop and found more proof, and learned that she was doing things with this person that would jeopardize her career (not to mention ruin our marriage and his marriage). It all clicked in that moment - she was attracted to the most high risk situation, and was leaving subtle proof of it around the house to bait me into confronting her and blowing up.

I took the opposite approach. The evidence of what I had on her was killing me, because it could absolutely ruin her career and that was too much of a burden to carry on my own - despite friends and family members encouraging me to use it as blackmail to get her to cooperate with me during a divorce. Earlier this week, I sat her down after meeting with a divorce lawyer and learning my rights and the process of divorce in our state. When my wife and I sat down to negotiate the process and splitting up things in the house, she kept saying "I respect you and I want to do this process with respect." I had enough, and said "no you don't, you've been lying to me for some time, you know it, I know it, and it would be beneficial to both of us if you just came clean." I absolutely shocked her, because I said it assertively but kindly. It took about 30 minutes of denial and her crying in my arms, but she eventually told me everything I had already learned, without me having to tell her how I knew. Then, the conversation turned to "what is wrong with me, do you think I'm broken? why do I do things like this? I've been so out of control."

I had no intention of staging a BPD intervention, but she asked me if she thought I was borderline between tears and confessions (I never answered that question straight on, I knew better). I was strong, calm, and loving throughout this whole process, while also making it clear that I did not condone her behavior and that she crossed so many lines with me and was so close to losing her job, too. We went through some behaviors and thought patterns together, with me attaching some names to things to help her understand. When she described splitting, I told her "that's called splitting." When she described mirroring, I told her "that's called mirroring." Each time I put a name to something it was like a light bulb went off in her and her affect and demeanor became more relaxed. She's highly intelligent and very hardworking, and each thing we named together I also helped her see how a really good therapist could help her to mitigate the risk of going into some of those feelings and behaviors, especially when stressed and triggered, and that her life could be absolutely amazing with some work. She told me the next day "this is the first time in my life I've felt hope, and not the shallow kind like something can quickly fix this."

My wife, who avoids conflict and can only sit in a hard conversation for 15 minutes at a time, sat with me for 6 hours on the couch being so honest and unburdening so much of herself - and I had to be the one that said "ok, time for bed". I've never felt closer to her, to be honest, even knowing that our separation is imminent. We've been sleeping and living in separate rooms and that's been going very well. She put in for her new apartment yesterday, which felt very sad but also like the right thing. I feel like I can finally start thinking about my next steps and grieve a bit, because all of this has been happening so fast and I had to snap into emergency mode to slow the bleed with her and pull her back off her ledge. She used those exact words with me later that night, before bed. She pulled me in for a hug and said "thank you. No one has ever held me accountable in my life like you just did and no one has ever had the strength to pull me back from the ledge." I can't tell you how much work I've been doing on myself to get to this point, but I'm going to keep at it, especially now that I can see what's really going on and how much more powerful this is than negotiating things like going out on more dates to spend quality time together or who cooks dinner. The work I've been doing even gave me the strength to say "hey, I can't process this with you, but I imagine it's going to hurt to break things off with X(affair partner) and that you got pretty attached to him. I'm sorry that you're going to go through that kind of pain and I really hope you reach out to someone for support, because you deserve it." I know that probably sounds crazy, but it felt so right to say. I love her. I don't want her to hurt, and I feel confident that I can deal with my hurt while still validating hers. 

I'm still trying to sort out my own feelings about this, and I told her that, but I approached her about the potential of a "healing separation." It's clear that we need to take the pressure off of our marriage and that we both have work to do to undo some of our own behaviors that are toxic when they comingle. However, it also feels to me that there is still so much love left between us that there is potential of a new and different relationship between us, with time, therapy, and distance. I wasn't going to present her with this idea just yet, given how much she's had to think about already and I don't want to overwhelm her, but she was perceptive enough to know that something was on my mind and requested that I share. I told her about the idea of a healing separation and told her that I didn't need an answer now and needed to think about it myself, but that maybe with some time and distance from each other to relieve the immediate pressure we could consider if it would work for us. The only thing it would do differently is slow down the divorce process, which is good because it is an expense we both really can't afford right now. We both are moving out, we both know we have work to do, and we both know that where we are is not healthy and cannot continue. She asked me to print out some stuff for her on it, so I did, put it in a folder, and gave it to her last night with the same "no pressure, think about this on your own time" statement.

I know that a healing separation will absolutely require her to do her work and we've already talked about DBT programs. One of the challenges is that she could lose her job if a BPD diagnosis was revealed, so I know there is strong incentive for her to conceal what she's learning about herself. My work, however, is being less outcome dependent and re-developing my sense of self such that I don't need to know what she's doing in order to be ok and secure. I started this a bit ago, and it's what has been giving me the strength to confront her with such calmness and love.

So that's my story so far. I know we are in the early days of this turmoil, but I am hopeful, at the least to know that maybe I could leave her better than I found her, as our marriage therapist told me the other night when I went to see her alone. I'm resisting the need to attach that hope to something concrete, like us getting back together one day. It just feels like hope though, and like a better life is coming.

Thanks for the support everyone, your posts have helped me get here and I'm grateful.

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Tattered Heart]

Welcome lighthouse0,

I'm sorry that your relationship has been experiencing so many difficulties, but it sounds like you both are making a plan to try to work things out while separated. What an amazing moment of clarity she had. I hope that she is willing to stick to therapy. And I hope that you will be able to find a place where you can get healthy too. It makes all the difference in the world.

One of the challenges is that she could lose her job if a BPD diagnosis was revealed, so I know there is strong incentive for her to conceal what she's learning about herself.

What kind of job does she have that she could be fired for having a mental illness? Mental illnesses are covered by the ADA in the United States and so long as she is able to perform her essential job duties it shouldn't be a problem for her.

[lighthouse9]

Hi Tattered Heart,

Thank you for the validation and hope - I really appreciate it!

I don't want to reveal too much about her career, but it is a governmental role where it is ok to judge someone's capabilities according to physical and mental health. She would have a career outside of this role should she lose it, but she loves what she does as part of the organization she works for and its part of why I confronted her to "slow the bleed" because her behavior was absolutely putting her career at risk.

[Tattered Heart]

I wondered if it was government or military.

As you begin to work on yourself, what would you say is one of the first areas you want to address first?

[lighthouse9]

Yep - you were spot on! It's a hard line, too, because I've actually feared that she might not be as cut out for the work she does as she thinks she is - but that's on a superior to figure out if she can't figure it out for herself.

I think my first area is become less outcome dependent. I'm an achiever and always have been, so making goals and planning how I will achieve them is a big part of how I operate. I'm working with a coach right now on these things and he's really helped me see how achieving things doesn't really make me happy but not achieving them makes me really unhappy. I've been working on doing things because I enjoy them or because they feel like something that I do, like they are things I do to live my values. I've hit that flow state a few times lately, where I'm just in it and enjoying myself and not really giving a crap how things turn out. More craftsman and less big box store producer. I tend to get a lot of attention for the things I do well and tend to roam in prestigious places, so I've been working on checking myself to make sure that I'm doing the work I do because I love it and believe in it, not because I want the status it brings. Being outcome dependent has made me super stressed out and anxious, and I can see how it also put a ton of pressure on her. I tend to outshine and intimidate people and not know I'm doing it, which I'm sure made it much easier for her to split me into good and bad ad infinitum. I'm not all good or all bad, and even when I achieve great things there are shades of grey in there, places where I'm not proud or things I wish I would have done differently. I've only been at this for a few months, but working on being less outcome dependent has given me a lot of strength, has helped me to regain my health, and is starting to make me feel like someone who can be ok in the moment, even when my head and heart feel like they are in different places (like right now).

[Tattered Heart]

That's a good place to start. I'm looking at the same thing in myself. Perfectionism and striving can create stress.

Like you said your performance and abilities make it easier for your pwBPD to put you on a pedestal. I don't remember where I read (or heard) that people with personality disorders are often drawn to people who have a lot of strength because it helps them feel better about themselves. If they can be proud of the SO and their achievements then they can be proud of themselves for picking that person.

Our abilities also set us up for care taking behavior, after all, we know how to handle various situations without stress easily. We are problem fixers.

With your W do you tend to focus on getting tasks done and forget to address the human element in doing things?

[lighthouse9]

It really can create stress- and just because I welcome it, doesn't mean it's a good thing or that it is good for others. I am definitely a caretaker and problem fixer, and it's something I'm really focusing on right now - not running in like a knight in shining armor and just making things better. This is a good reminder, as I'm already planning ways to make things better, when I know what she really needs is to figure out some of those steps for herself.

I absolutely struggle to sometimes address the human element in things. I'm in my 30s, but two years ago was diagnosed as on the autism spectrum because of challenges I could see arising between my W and I. I was struggling to relate to some of the people she hangs out with, since my friends were all pretty neuro-diverse and I kind of self-selected folks that thought similarly to me. Her friends didn't really make sense to me and I had to learn how to make small talk with them. The diagnosis was really good for us at first - it brought us into counseling together every few weeks and we learned some skills for communicating and connecting, and she learned some skills for putting her boundaries up when I was getting in too deep with something or obsessing. All of that went out the window when we moved again and she really came to resent me for it, even though the initial impetus to pursue evaluation was based on a loving conversation we came to together. She used it against me in the last few months, but has come to apologize for it and tell me that my ASD was not what pushed her away. Thankfully, I've lived most of my life without a diagnosis, so I barely identify with it and really only lean on it to help me resolve conflict in my life that is predictable, like people thinking I'm "too intense" or upset all the time (my face never does the right thing, I'm actually really goofy and joyful).

I feel like lately I've been learning so much about validation and every time I validate her (for valid things) she just opens up. She had a hard day at work yesterday and I kept saying things like "that must be really awful" "I bet you're tired!" "You're right, it's not fair that people are on vacation and you had to do more work." I think in the past I probably would have kicked my spectrum brain into high gear and started analyzing ways that her workplace could have reorganized their workflow so that this problem didn't occur  . Like I said, I have my work, too, and our stuff can definitely set each other off.

What have you found is most helpful for yourself during challenging or revealing times like this?