Facing things that remind me of the affair - need to vent

[lighthouse9]

Hi good people,

Just need to vent for a moment, and maybe gain insight on how you all work through the hurtful things, especially when you're trying to keep some hope alive.

I've been mostly understanding about my w's affair before we separated, and have barely said hurtful or impulsive things when they come to mind, because I know they won't do much good. I have of course expressed that I don't condone her behavior and that it cut me pretty deeply, but I am trying to control myself from saying some of the stuff I want to say. The hard part, and I know everyone who has gone through an affair experience's this, is that there's still so much that reminds me of the affair and it's really hard to avoid those experiences.

I'm not an avoider, so I tend to face things head on - but shoot does it hurt and does it suck. Tonight, for example, I'm heading out to go get some work on a tattoo that I started before the holidays. My W had the idea that we should both get tattoos for Christmas, since we've been wanting them and my recent employment made it possible for us to each get what we want. I of course had the wrong expectations of the experience - I thought we'd be going together and being part of the tattoo experience with each other (not getting anything matching or for each other of course). When it came down to it, it was clear that she just really wanted another tattoo and felt guilty spending the money on herself, so she made them "Christmas presents to ourselves" in order to assuage some of her guilt. She wouldn't let me be part of scoping out tattoo parlors and when she chose one and we went to schedule, she almost walked out after scheduling hers, completely forgetting that I had to schedule mine. It was kind of humiliating, and I almost cancelled my appointment, but then thought hey, I really want this thing, too, so don't make it about her.

Her tattoo kind of became the most important thing in her life and the ways she wanted attention for it were just childish to watch. She even had me help her pick out a dress for a holiday party with her coworkers that would show it off, and then proceeded to text with her affair partner and flirt with him while ignoring me the whole night. Needless to say, I've come to hate her tattoo and everything it represents. I know, it's silly, but it just irks me.

The night I got my tattoo, she told me she would be home watching tv and just resting up a bit. When I was close to home, I texted her, and she told me she was out getting ice cream (she's lactose intolerant) and that she would be home soon. It was late enough that all grocery stores were closed, so I called her on it, and she made up another lie for where she was that night. When she got home, she adamantly denied that she was with someone else and said she was at a bar by herself and was embarrassed that she went there after work instead of coming home. I later came to find out that she was at a different bar and then in the woods, having sex with her coworker in the back of her car.

The sick part was that she was just all about my tattoo when she got home and the only time she reacted positively with me over the holidays was to tell people how much she loved it. I love it, too, and it represents a lot for me spiritually. But, tonight, I'm going back to get work done on it and I know I need to face these fears and these places and memories but I so desperately want to break our no contact and say something hurtful to her. It's not like me to be hurtful, but I have such an urge right now to text her and say something demeaning about how I'm getting more work done and hope she's not out screwing someone while I'm out or hope she's got all the ice cream she needs or something pathetic and childish like that.

I won't do it. But I'm posting here because the urge is real and the anger is real and I know it's just because I have to face yet another thing that reminds me of the crap she selfishly pulled.

How do you all deal with places feeling like redzones or like your life is mined?

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[pearlsw]

Hi lighthouse9,

Thanks for sharing this experience. I strongly support the idea that you decided to post it rather than say something to her out of hurt and anger. It is okay to express yourself and express your hurts. The tricky part, I find, with a partner with BPD traits is what am I expecting in return? I try not to be hurtful. I've been saying a few things lately about how he behaved towards me during the holidays - wrecking them entirely because of his jealousy and fears of me leaving him.

A lot of is it actually, in an odd twist to my reply here, because after him breaking up with me so many times over the years, him conducting an off/on relationship of epic proportions, that I was briefly involved with someone else just to temporarily escape my hellish existence with him... .I was completely at the end of my rope in life and beyond.

So, he suffers now because of it, on top of the suffering he caused me for the 5 years leading up to that. He can't let the thoughts go. I don't blame him. And I wish I hadn't done something entirely out of character, that has indeed wrecked my life too, in response to his instability which I did not comprehend back then. I sincerely recognize your pain. I have to look into the face of such pain each day and it is something I would never wish or anyone or intended to have in my life. It is not easy to overcome though we have been trying. I hope you two are able to learn and grow from it as well. I hope I have not offended you with my strange new life background on such issues.

sincerely,

pearl.

[lighthouse9]

Hey Pearl,

Thanks for your reply and for supporting my decision to write things up here instead of doing something out of character, as you so perfectly put it. You haven't offended me at all - and I really applaud your ability to be humane with yourself while recognizing your own hurt, too.

My coach gave me an excellent Esther Perel Ted talk to watch about infidelity, which really humanized the experience for me. He asked me to have my W watch it, and she did eventually, but I don't think she got nearly as much out of it as I did. I've also been reading a book called "Not Just Friends" about healing after infidelity, which also does a really good job of humanizing what both partners (and even the affair partner) experience during infidelity. These things helped, because they reminded me that even in non-BPD relationships, infidelity is incredibly common. That's nice, weirdly, right? I relish the opportunities to be a boring normal couple 

Both resources hold the spurned partner to the higher standard of not doing what I wanted to do last night - make childish, hurtful remarks about things and not retaliate. Again, these things are out of my character, and the last thing I can afford to lose right now is my character. I think what's hard, is that given what my W is going through, and given how quickly she got out of the house and is now going to leave for training in a few weeks, I likely won't get to work through this with her anymore than we have. She already feels like it's all we talk about (couldn't be further from the truth), but her shame is so high right now that she can't sit still for five minutes in her body without feeling like I'm holding her feet to the fire or something.

I've learned how little thought she gave to me and how I would feel throughout the affair. Most people that cheat do give little thought to their partner, until afterwards when they feel guilt. But my experiences, the things I was doing when she was doing what she was doing, the things I saw right in front of my eyes that she explained away, the things I have to live with, my God do they hurt like hell. I'd say I envy her for being able to dissociate away from herself, but that's not true - I can see that that hurts like hell, too.

The only way out is through - and it sounds like you're doing that, despite your partner's inability to go through with you. I feel similarly. I have to go through this, and wish she'd come with me a little bit more. It would be good for both of us. But, again, I'm trying to detach a bit from "what's good for both of us" or "what's good for her" and just focus on me. This isn't me giving up hope, it's actually the most hopeful thing I can do.

The tattoo came out great by the way, and I walked out of there spending way less time and money than I had planned on, which is a big deal right now considering how tired I am and how much I'm trying to save in order to figure out where to go next. It will always be a reminder of what happened, but I tend to get tattoos when I need scars to remind me of something. All of my tattoos represent something I went through that I never wanted to deny about myself, no matter how hard, ugly, or painful. I thought this one would be different, but alas, I was wrong, and that's ok. I never want to deny that this happened - and that doesn't mean I'm not forgiving her or myself or anything. It just means that there's no way forward without knowing that the past is real, and given that that past is my right now, I have to believe in "staying in my character" and not denying reality. One of us has to, right?

I meet the DBT counselor today and I'm really looking forward to letting all of this out somewhere. Our no contact also breaks tonight, which is a bit scary, too. I'm working on staying in my wisemind, so I can keep all of these hurtful things I want to say out of our conversation. I guess this is progress though right, that I can feel hurt and even anger again? It means I'm doing the whole grief thing.

Wishing you all the best, and please be gentle with yourself. We all get out of character every now and then.

[pearlsw]

Hi lighthouse9,

Thanks for the kindness, recommendations, and tattoo update! I like hearing about all that this means for you and how you are able to carry parts of your life around you in this way - in this artistic form. I am not into tattoos myself, but I have a lot of friends who are and I have a lot of love for folks who process and experience life via that form of expression - they tend to be pretty deep.

Yep. I sometimes wish I'd never met this guy at all because it led me to the edge of a cliff I never thought I'd jump off - and at my age after a lifetime of rule following! I felt guilt the entire time, but life was so miserable that you could offered me a cup of poison or a kiss and I'd have wanted it. Well, this was not a run of the mill thing. He was an old love who got away and knowing he wanted me again (in a limited way) was just the fantasy life I needed to get out of my hell on earth.  I knew the consequences would be bad, that is how little I cared though after rape threats, threats of physical violence, health threats, etc. to cross the line I "knew" I'd never cross... .The relationship was a bit of a sham at that point anyway... .

Anyway, hope I didn't hijack ya here! Thanks for the conversation and chance to share.

[Radcliff]

lighthouse9, I can relate to having land mines all over town!  It seems I've been seeing them a lot lately -- hotels where I stayed at when I fled, streets my wife drove down harassing me while I walked on the sidewalk, fun stuff like that.  I usually do a breathing exercise -- in through the nose, hold, out through the mouth.  It is useful for interrupting runaway thoughts.

It sounds like you have plenty of resources, but anyone who knows me knows I'm a John Gottman fan.  His book, "What Makes Love Last?  How to Build Trust and Avoid Betrayal" has a chapter or two on infidelity.  It's a good book.

WW

[lighthouse9]

Hey Wentworth,

Thanks for this! I like the idea of deep breathing - it's funny how easy it is to forget. The DBT therapist I just started seeing was trying to teach me to distract, too. I'm a lean in hard, face your fears kind of person, so I always feel like I'm being a wuss or missing out on an opportunity to learn something if I avoid something or distract myself from it. That works in a lot of situations, but I could really hear her on the point that not everything needs to be a moment to overcome a fear or bad feeling, and there might just be too many of them right now to take them all on at once. For example, I've been waking up in the middle of the night with ruminating thoughts and typically have trouble falling back to sleep. At her suggestion though, I've been taking those thoughts that hit me in the face when I wake up (usually stuff about the affair), and say "hi bad thoughts, I see you" and then roll over to read something on my ipad (not BPD or affair related haha). I've had a good sci fi book that I've been meaning to finish and so last night I made a point to roll over and read the three times I woke up. Sure enough, I was back to sleep within minutes.

The land mines are pretty awful though, though I have a new rule I decided upon yesterday. If I have to be humiliated, then I'm no longer going to work so hard to shield her from humiliation (if it's not gratuitous). For example, I went into the clinic yesterday to get STD testing and the person doing my blood work just so happened to be a student of mine. GREAT. This person who respects me and my good reputation now is probably looking at my blood work order like "Oh, ok, well my teacher sleeps around even though I know she is married." My wife even came to the last class with these students (I had just had knee surgery, so she had to drive me), so they knew who she was. Plus, she's a respected leader in the same medical community and if this person doesn't already know her, she easily could know her. Her face was bright red when taking my blood work and when she said "how are you?" timidly, I just pointed at the blood work order and said "been better, my wife had an affair. I'm here to make sure I'm healthy." She got redder but then said "ok, yeah I was wondering about that but felt really bad being curious and stuff." I just gave my usual canned answer, "Yes, she made some bad choices and we're in the process of figuring out what that means, but in the mean time I have to take care of myself." I figure this is a good way of humanizing the situation and not condemning her, but also not taking any chances with my own reputation in the process.

A similar situation happened with another medical assistant, when I had to go in to request the testing and to discuss getting a referral to therapy. She's a sweet, very kind and competent young professional and so I felt safe asking her. But, her first reaction was, "Wow, Dr. So-and-So? The one who works in _____?" Face palm. Yes, that's the one. "You deserve so much better." Thanks? I gave my canned answer that time, too, because she immediately asked "are you two going to work it out?" "If it were up to me, yes. But I can't answer that and right now just need to take care of myself and hopefully that will inspire her to do the same." When I came in for another appointment the same assistant said "I was at training yesterday and she was sitting in front of me and it took everything in my power not to say something to her about how bad she messed up and how wonderful you are." I thanked her for minding her own business and for remembering HIPAA (haha), and switched the topic. Land mines, I tell you. Land mines. I just hope I don't run into her supervisor. I could tell she was catching on to something before the holidays and was positioning herself as a resource for me to talk to if needed. She'll read right through me if she sees me and know that there's more to this situation than "we need some space right now."

I'll have to check out the Gottmann stuff - his work was what inspired me to be a little more insistent about finding out about the affair and holding her accountable to talking to me about it.

What a weird place to be in right? I'm sure you get this - to be in a place where I want to protect myself and have my space for processing, but also want to protect her and help both her and others understand that she's not a monster, even if she does monstrous things sometimes. For example, I had a final phone call with our old marriage therapist to terminate the relationship and also briefly recap the drama that went down in our last session we went to together (there's a post on that somewhere on here). The woman is great, I imagine, with couples not dealing with something like BPD, but she failed miserably with us and especially after my wife started coming back to sessions after the affair revelation and the conversations about BPD. Needless to say, our last session was basically a masterclass in everything you don't do in therapy with someone with BPD. It was awful. So last, night, she asked me to help her understand where I thought she went wrong and I gave her some honest feedback about the invalidation and how she was pushing too hard to get my wife to stop feeling certain things. I told her that the only thing she really has right now that feels like her is her mixed up feelings, so all we can do is validate them until she can regulate a bit and feel safe to go further, while still holding her accountable for her actions and drawing up hard boundaries. She acknowledged all of this, asked me about DBT (I wanted to be like yo, go look it up!), and asked me to stay in touch with her over email if I felt like it, so that maybe she could consider referring other clients there in the future. Then she ended the call with a big RUN statement. "Hey, in my 40 years of practice, I've never seen these people get better or get help and they just ruin people's lives, so consider that." I wanted to be like cool, and a diabetic who doesn't take care of themselves will also die. But we don't go around talking about diabetics like they're hopeless and not worth care and support.

I had to just suppress my anger and say thank you for your perspective, it was nice working with you, and I moved on. Some folks just don't want to get it. So yeah, tough spot to be in - where I'm grieving my own losses and licking my own wounds and also wanting to attack anyone who doesn't treat her fairly. Have you been there?

Pearl - no hijacking perceived, I actually really appreciate your perspective here. It keeps me in check. There were many times in our relationship that I had to put boundaries up with others before things could go a different direction, because I could perceive myself enjoying something with someone emotionally that I didn't get from my wife. In those situations, I made the choice to either completely end all contact with those folks or to make it clear that I was devoted to her and only talk about her positively. The temptations are natural, as are our attractions. I'm really sorry to hear about the rape threats and threats of violence - those are never ok in any situation, and I know they can really make you feel powerless. Sending hugs.

[Radcliff]

lighthouse9,

Yes, I've struggled with how much to say to people, particularly mutual friends in our small circle of friends who my wife asks to be non-professional supervisors for visits with D12.  I have to approve them, talk to them, and show them the court order.  In the beginning, I felt very anxious about being perceived as the bad guy, and gave a fair amount of detail (not too much, though).  After talking to my therapist, I decided to dial it back and worry less about what they thought.  With the latest friend I briefed, I said basically that there's a court order, she has a lawyer and could have argued facts, but she instead decided to go to therapy and that's fantastic that she's taken that step.  Bottom line, for me, I've found that when talking to folks in our mutual circle, less is more.  I try to restrain my urge for validation or not being seen as the bad guy.  So far, I've been impressed with how supportive folks have been, and frankly, I don't think they want too much info!

Yup, I get it with the run messages.  The forensic therapist who evaluated me for PTSD gave me a big run message.  My therapist has been more subtle, but clearly thinks I should exit.  The thing is, the damage is so great that I'm thinking maybe I should, too, but it doesn't help when advisors seem to have lost all objectivity.  I think the forensic guy was a little unprofessional.  My T knows me and the situation very well, and she likely is responding as much or more to my mental state than to my wife's prognosis, which is where my T and I should be focusing our efforts anyway.  My wife may make a full recovery, but I'm not sure I can feel safe dedicating the remaining 30 years or so of my life to a romantic relationship with her.  Oy.  Time will tell.  Thank you for hosting my hijack for a moment!

WW