The story of my family - my BPD sibling

[psyche]

Hello everyone, I'm glad I've found this forum and I hope to learn from you all. Things have been getting worse and I'd really appreciate some opinion about this.

Our family has always been dysfunctional. When me and my brother were young our parents were emotionally explosive and neglectful, and physical punishment and cruel words were frequent. Our mother has narcissistic traits and depression and our father is the distant and enabler type.
While I grew up ok, my brother grew into an emotionally unstable and intense adult not being able to properly deal with life responsibilities nor have stable relationships. He has a gf right now and they are currently living with our parents.

My parents often vented about him, about how he worried them or didn't care enough about them (moodiness towards them, treating their home as hotel and so on). I never interviened since it was up to my parents to define boundaries, but we often felt like walking on egg shells because he can react intensively and go silent treatment for months.
At first I agreed that he just need some growing up, but in the last years what happened made me realise that he's in a much worse state. As well as my parents and all the dysfunctional dynamic.

It all started with my brother asking me and my husband to help him get a loan. At first I didn't want to because he was already an adult responsible for his own expenses and it was just for a gadget. But my husband convinced me to help him just once.
Things were going fine but during a conflict he mentioned how he forgave me for hesitating to get him that loan. I've told him that I was not responsible for his expenses and the conversation ended badly.
After that episode I worried if he might felt hurt so I've sent an email opening up to him in hope that we could reconcile and show that I care for him. But he ignored it and proceeded to no contact for months.

After a while things were ok again, until he started failing the last payments of the loan. My husband asked him about it nicely and explained that the money would help us with our baby. At first my brother said that he would pay soon, but then proceeded to delay the payments, fail the next ones and even spend money on his things. He also ignored my husband when he talked to him again which upset my husband. In the end he handled him the money without saying a word, showing that he was upset about us "chasing him" for money.
My mother said that knowing how my brother is we could have let him get away, but I've told her that it was not responsible nor respectful.

Then some time after things seemed fine again, just to be short lived again. My husband noticed that he used our baby's photo as messenger profile and he sent him a messege asking him to remove it while he explained that we have been very careful with our baby's online exposure. My brother reacted intensively, saying that he didn't even say 'good morning' or 'hello' in the message and how he was being rude and disrespectful to him and other rants, to which my husband responded with harshness as well.
The next day me and my brother met accidentally and he asked me about it. I've said that my husband was direct but didn't mean to be rude, but my lack of agreement with him led him to accuse me of defending someone who is not family over my own brother. The conversation escalated very quickly despite my efforts to be very careful. In the end I've suggested that maybe we can talk about it later but things were already very sour.

I've talked to my mother about it and her reaction was off the scale. She cried, saying how disappointed she was with my husband despite my efforts to explain the situation. At that point I was upset because my mother and father took my brother's side instead of remaining neutral, and they also got mad at me for not having taken my brother's side. To me it didn't make sense at all because it was a simple misunderstanding and they were forcing me to take sides. My husband was also hurt because he felt left out as family. He treated everyone very well and did many favors for them specially my brother while my parents often treated my brother's exes better (gifts and all) even if they said they liked him.

My brother proceeded to go no contact again and it's been months now. My father also distanced but parents eventually forgave our offense and hopes my brother will forgive us soon. We have been sitting ducks waiting for him to be fine again so that there can be peace in family again.
During xmas he and his gf gave our child a present and I thought he was fine, but I've sent him a message thanking and wishing him happy holidays and it was ignored again.

At new year we went to lunch with my parents but my brother refused to join us.

Then some days ago it was my father's birthday. We all went to lunch together and my brother was finally present even if we didn't talk. I've thought that it was progress but then later at night I came to know what happened.
At midnight before our lunch my brother brought my father a cake and they celebrated without including us. It was really suspicious because all these years I was the one getting cakes for our parents and we used to celebrate together, and they knew I cared for these special events. The fact that he did it right at midnight instead of bringing it to the lunch was really strange and excluded us.
Feeling shocked I've talked to my mother about that and said that if he is really doing that then I would not want to talk to him again. I never thought of him as a bad person, just someone struggling with emotions, but what he did was really too much and malicious. But she said she didn't know anything and what I said had upset my father as he was happy that my brother actually went to the lunch together which was a big step.
I've said that they were not fair and always favored him over, to which she denied it. It felt as if this event was the last drop of water and I had enough. One thing is tolerating silent treatment and unfair accusations, another is to actually get revenged at.

And now I've decided to stop talking to my brother. All these years made me realise that there is a sick dynamic and I don't want to be part of it anymore. Every time an episode happens I feel stressed and I don't want to go through this anymore.
I'm not cutting my parents but as long as this dynamic doesn't improve I have to distance or else I'd be affected.

I guess that I wrote a lot here I apologise for this wall of text and thank you for having read all this! It helped me to process all of this and I hope that some of you can give some insights on how to process this.

Thank you.

[Insom]

 

Hi, psyche!  Welcome.   

It sounds like you're feeling frustrated and left out in your relationships with your parents and brother.  I can relate very much to how seemingly small family issues can escalate into something bigger that feels unfair and very confusing.  Have you heard about the Karpman Drama Triangle?  It's a concept I found helpful that you may also find interesting. 

And now I've decided to stop talking to my brother. All these years made me realise that there is a sick dynamic and I don't want to be part of it anymore. Every time an episode happens I feel stressed and I don't want to go through this anymore.

How are things going with this new boundary?  How does it feel?

[psyche]

Hi, psyche!  Welcome.   

It sounds like you're feeling frustrated and left out in your relationships with your parents and brother.  I can relate very much to how seemingly small family issues can escalate into something bigger that feels unfair and very confusing.  Have you heard about the Karpman Drama Triangle?  It's a concept I found helpful that you may also find interesting. 

How are things going with this new boundary?  How does it feel?

Thank you for the article. I guess that each of us somehow can relate to each of the three roles in conficts. Sometimes I can be a prosecutor when I became critical of them as wrong. A victim when I see them all cornering me. And a carer in the past for my mother (I took this role when we lived together and she had issues).
My brother had mostly been the victim and prosecutor, and my mother all three.

With my family there is this tendency to point out who is right or wrong. But with my husband I can feel safe expressing how I feel as we care for each other’s feelings rather than who’s right. It’s ok to apologise to each other but with my family this becomes a tool of control and is often demanded.

One of the most empowering lessons I have learned in life is that we can’t change others but we can change what we do or decide. It’s true that we are responsible for our own feelings and whT we can do about them.
If I try to focus on empathy then I can stop being a prosecutor. If I take responsiblity of what I can do I can stop being a victim. And if I can ensure boundaries then I can stop being a carer that enables.

About how I feel, it’s a mix. On one hand I feel relief for having made a decision. On the other hand I feel doubt wondering if the decision is right. And then I feel stressed. Also a bit lost and still processing all this. And then sad for what could have been, harmony in the family. Struggling to accept how things are and stop having expectations anymore. Want to move forward and feel closure with my decision.

When I came across BPD I empathised with my brother’s situation as it must be very hard for him. I did resent him for all the instability and lack of maturity, but then it must be hard to live with all the intensity of feelings. His childhood was harder and I have been a bad sister, we fought a lot and I just wanted to be left alone (I’m very introverted).

I do care about him but I can’t face this stress and emotional pressure anymore. Before all hese episodes I still saw him as an equal and refused to agree with my parents that he is just a child, so I always had my boundaries despite walking on egg shells. Now I’m not so sure anymore, I just feel that I don’t want to be affected anymore.
Life has been exhausting recently, and I barely have much energy left, so I want to focus on the good things and enjoy life rather than being on an emotional rollercoaster.

[jnssbc202]

Thank you for sharing your story. Your family dynamic is very similar to mine. I'm still learning how to navigate this crazy roller-coaster, so I don't really have advice. I just wanted to reach out to say that you are not alone and that there are many people on here who understand what you're experiencing. 

[psyche]

Thank you for sharing your story. Your family dynamic is very similar to mine. I'm still learning how to navigate this crazy roller-coaster, so I don't really have advice. I just wanted to reach out to say that you are not alone and that there are many people on here who understand what you're experiencing. 

Thank you for the support. Yes we are all learning how to navigate this craziness, it's great that this forum exists.

Sometimes it can be so hard. I'm not a saint and sometimes I also need to learn to better handle my own emotions and reactions which can contribute to further mess. There is so much to read and I hope that I can learn from you all.

[Insom]

There is so much to read and I hope that I can learn from you all.

I am with you and jnssbc202, psyche!  Here to watch and learn.  If you haven't done so already, check out the links on the right side of this page - they're a good way to get started on this site. 

Also, reading and posting on other people's threads is another great way to learn.  Feel free to jump into the conversation when another post catches your eye.

 

[psyche]

I am with you and jnssbc202, psyche!  Here to watch and learn.  If you haven't done so already, check out the links on the right side of this page - they're a good way to get started on this site. 

Also, reading and posting on other people's threads is another great way to learn.  Feel free to jump into the conversation when another post catches your eye.

 

Thank you. I feel that in the few days of joining I already learned some precious lessons. Karpman Triangle, FOG, JADE, SET, validation and engagement... .I'm starting to realise what I could have done and what I can do better.

I've been thinking about my decision to go NC with my brother and I don't think that I want to cut ties, but rather have my boundaries respected. In this case it is the boundary of being respected and not mistreated by being excluded by revenge. I'm thinking of a way to convey the message without leading to conflicts nor misunderstandings. I'm willing to be ok with him as long as he respects this and I'm willing to stand my ground if needed.

I guess that part of the difficulty to be more empathetic with him in the past was because I did resent him for all the eggshells and family dynamics. I've thought of him as an adult so I expected things from him but it could have been too critical to do so. After learning about BPD I could empathise more, but still need to make more effort to empathise with him.
And then I have to learn how to handle stress during conflicts so that I can keep calm and think clearly.

Honestly this place gave me more resources than therapy . I'm going to keep reading and reflecting on things. Sometimes I also feel caught in the negative patterns I've inherited and reprogramming it is not easy. But taking responsiblity of myself is definitely empowering.

[Panda39]

I've been thinking about my decision to go NC with my brother and I don't think that I want to cut ties, but rather have my boundaries respected. In this case it is the boundary of being respected and not mistreated by being excluded by revenge. I'm thinking of a way to convey the message without leading to conflicts nor misunderstandings. I'm willing to be ok with him as long as he respects this and I'm willing to stand my ground if needed.

Rather than discussing your boundary with your brother and expecting him to respect it, I would just keep your boundary in mind when you interact with him and enforce the boundary when you need to.  You will probably have to do it over and over and things with your brother could get worse before it gets better because you are not doing what you have always done. 

So what will you do if you are not being treated with respect?  What will you do if your brother and family exclude you? How will you enforce the boundaries you want to create?

I guess that part of the difficulty to be more empathetic with him in the past was because I did resent him for all the eggshells and family dynamics. I've thought of him as an adult so I expected things from him but it could have been too critical to do so. After learning about BPD I could empathise more, but still need to make more effort to empathise with him.

 

Empathy is good it will help you understand your brother's feelings but your brother is still responsible for his actions, don't let empathy for your brother let his poor behaviors towards you "get a pass".

And then I have to learn how to handle stress during conflicts so that I can keep calm and think clearly.

Also, be aware of when it might be time to disengage and exit.

But taking responsibility of myself is definitely empowering.

The above is key.  The only person in this situation that you have control over and who you can change is you    And sometimes by changing ourselves the ripples of that change can sometimes effect others too.

Panda39

[Harri]

Hi psyche!  Panda is correct about not expressing your boundary directly to your brother.  Your boundary is for you.  It dictates what *you* will do in the face of disrespect or revenge, not what you require from your brother.  For example, brother is disrespectful, you end the conversation or walk away.  You can state something like 'I feel disrespected when you say/do ___ so I am going to end things here for now" and then end the convo or leave etc.  

Boundaries can get confusing and it is easy to confuse enforcing boundaries, which govern *our* behaviors, with trying to enforce rules that would govern the behavior of others.  Rules are okay but they are different from boundaries.  I think understanding the difference is important to being able to implement them properly.  Too many times people will say boundaries do not work and what has really happened is that boundaries and rules were confused.  Perhaps I am arguing semantics, but to me, the difference is important.

BTW, I also agree with everything else Panda says here    

Anyway, I haven't had the chance to introduce myself to you yet, so I also want to say hello and welcome.  I'm glad you posted and that you too find this board helpful.  

Hope to see you around even more.

[SI4444]

Hi! Just wanted to say you are not alone. I agree with Panda. Set boundaries for you. Set your limit and walk away when you have to, from brother or parents.


I have a sister that has never been medically diagnosed but that I feel is more psychosis vs BPD. I grew up with her doing malicious acts towards me and then my mother defending her or supporting her to try to keep the peace. We haven't shared but maybe 10 words in 10 years. And I'm fine with that, better really.

Now my husbands sister's BPD is what we deal with.
I say all that because I've learned with BPD that they tend to not be confrontational unless they are in a rage. Usually more passive and self defeating. I wonder if your brother has something more than BPD?

I've learned that a good social worker can do more in therapy with you / us in an hour vs them in months.

Give it a go. Good luck! We're all here for you!

[psyche]

Rather than discussing your boundary with your brother and expecting him to respect it, I would just keep your boundary in mind when you interact with him and enforce the boundary when you need to.  You will probably have to do it over and over and things with your brother could get worse before it gets better because you are not doing what you have always done. 

So what will you do if you are not being treated with respect?  What will you do if your brother and family exclude you? How will you enforce the boundaries you want to create?
 

Empathy is good it will help you understand your brother's feelings but your brother is still responsible for his actions, don't let empathy for your brother let his poor behaviors towards you "get a pass".

Also, be aware of when it might be time to disengage and exit.

The above is key.  The only person in this situation that you have control over and who you can change is you    And sometimes by changing ourselves the ripples of that change can sometimes effect others too.

Panda39

Thank you for clarifying the difference!

I don’t know how to answer these questions and it makes me wonder what is better.
That day I’ve talked to my parents on messenger saying that I will cut contact with him as if I don’t have a brother because of what he did. I feel that instead of properly conveying the message that I’m not accepting such behavior, how I said it is not a good way.
But I’m not sure how should I enforce this boundary. Do you have any suggestions so I can do better?

[psyche]

Hi psyche!  Panda is correct about not expressing your boundary directly to your brother.  Your boundary is for you.  It dictates what *you* will do in the face of disrespect or revenge, not what you require from your brother.  For example, brother is disrespectful, you end the conversation or walk away.  You can state something like 'I feel disrespected when you say/do ___ so I am going to end things here for now" and then end the convo or leave etc.  

Boundaries can get confusing and it is easy to confuse enforcing boundaries, which govern *our* behaviors, with trying to enforce rules that would govern the behavior of others.  Rules are okay but they are different from boundaries.  I think understanding the difference is important to being able to implement them properly.  Too many times people will say boundaries do not work and what has really happened is that boundaries and rules were confused.  Perhaps I am arguing semantics, but to me, the difference is important.

BTW, I also agree with everything else Panda says here    

Anyway, I haven't had the chance to introduce myself to you yet, so I also want to say hello and welcome.  I'm glad you posted and that you too find this board helpful.  

Hope to see you around even more.

Thank you for clarifying this! It’s definitely an important detail to understand. I need to reflect more on this as well as what I can do when more situations arises.

[psyche]

Hi! Just wanted to say you are not alone. I agree with Panda. Set boundaries for you. Set your limit and walk away when you have to, from brother or parents.


I have a sister that has never been medically diagnosed but that I feel is more psychosis vs BPD. I grew up with her doing malicious acts towards me and then my mother defending her or supporting her to try to keep the peace. We haven't shared but maybe 10 words in 10 years. And I'm fine with that, better really.

Now my husbands sister's BPD is what we deal with.
I say all that because I've learned with BPD that they tend to not be confrontational unless they are in a rage. Usually more passive and self defeating. I wonder if your brother has something more than BPD?

I've learned that a good social worker can do more in therapy with you / us in an hour vs them in months.

Give it a go. Good luck! We're all here for you!

Thank you for the support!

During childhood it was actually me who was a bad sister sometimes. It wasn’t out of malice, somehow we often fought (and being older I won) and I just wanted to be alone often. Our parents wouldn’t help us learn how to solve conflicts as they would just punish us both with harshness.
When we grew up things got better but we still had some conflicts and he went NC a few times. Our relationship was never great, but we interacted peacefully mostly and I’ve thought that our family was going fine finally.

I’ve never thought that he would do something on purpose to be mean, it was the first time it happened. If it really comes to this then I also need to get away because I don’t want to be part of such dynamics.

There is a link somewhere here that explained two types of BPD if I remember correctly. One more passive and low functioning and the other more active and angry? I’m not sure if my brother have something else, but reading some descriptions about BPD he fits most of them so I assumed he has BPD.

[Panda39]

Hi psyche 

I'm sorry I wasn't completely clear, thanks Harri for jumping in 

There are many tools to help in communication for example but for me the two most important things to start down the road to a more tolerable relationship with someone with BPD are Radical Acceptance and Boundaries once you have those two things going then you can fine tune other aspects of your relationship/communication.

Radical Acceptance

Accepting that your family members are the way they are... .behave the way they behave... .that they are not suddenly going to wake up one morning and be the people you hope they will be... .they are who they are.

More on Radical Acceptance... .
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=89910.0

Boundaries

If you can Radically Accept your family members, then it's time to set some boundaries, that make your relationship with them tolerable for you . 

For example based on your story one boundary could be to not lend your brother any money, that protects you and your husband from financial damage.  You can set a variety of boundaries, maybe you don't see everyone as often, maybe you only see everyone in public (my SO's D17 does this with her mom-her mom behaves better in public), maybe if you are being verbally/emotionally attacked rather than stay and argue you leave, if you recognize you are involved in a Triangle maybe you jump off the triangle.  Think about what your goals are and how you can create boundaries the protect you from those things that hurt.

In terms of your parents and brother excluding you, if this was happening to me what I would think to myself... .This is about them and their dysfunction, this is not about me. 

Yes, this behavior is hurtful, it is also a way to put you on the Triangle... .you are the victim, they are the persecutors, until someone (sounds like your parents) brakes off and become the rescuers and include you again.  But if you can radically accept that this is their dysfunctional pattern and not take their behavior personally the whole thing will be less painful for you. When it is less painful you no longer see yourself as a victim and you have just walked off the Drama Triangle.

More on Boundaries... .
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=61684.0
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=167368.0

I've also pulled another workshop that might be helpful.

US: The Dysfunctional Dance - Self-inflicted Wounds... .
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=66672.0

I hope this information clarifies where I was trying to go for in my last post.

Take Care,
Panda39

[psyche]

Panda39 thank you again for the valuable tips.

Yes even before coming here I have been working on acceptance. Ever since the beginning of the episodes a few years ago was a wake up call and I had to learn how to accept them as they are. It’s kind of like “can I still love them even if they can never be how I want them to be?”
My parents can never provide the level of sensitivity and fairness I want them to. Can I still accept it? It’s been something I have worked on for some time and sometimes it’s not easy.

One thing I’m glad though is that I never took things personally. Even back then when we were young and my mother was abusive, I assumed that she was how she was because of her issues and because she is human. I feel that if I ever took things personally I would have been worse like my brother. There are still some damages like a few unhealthy patterns but I’m glad I can work on them.

Again, thank you for the great advices. I must keep this in mind next time, that it is about their dysfunction so I can see things more objectively and walk away from feeling as a victim. If I do so I would also not expect my parents to be the rescuers and not allow the persecutor to be persecutor.

[Panda39]

I have found "Radical Acceptance" has helped with my relationship with my own mom.  My mom and I are a mismatch.  She is intellectual and not particularly sensitive and I am the opposite creative and highly sensitive.  From my point of view my mother is very critical.  For 45 years I tried to live up to her standards and expectations yet always felt like a failure.  I was never smart enough, pretty enough... .good enough.  And the flip side is that she was never the mom I needed her to be either.

I had a kind of a breakdown... .ended my co-dependent marriage... .and began having breakthroughs.

I realized that I am terrific the way I am and that I had many people in my life that loved me... .the real authentic me.  My mother was not one of those people.  I accepted that.  I realized her criticism is about her... .about her values, about how I reflect on her, about the importance that she puts on appearances.

Her criticism now just rolls off... .it's about her not me.  I accept she is who she is but I no longer accept... .no longer believe her criticisms.

Panda39

[psyche]

I have found "Radical Acceptance" has helped with my relationship with my own mom.  My mom and I are a mismatch.  She is intellectual and not particularly sensitive and I am the opposite creative and highly sensitive.  From my point of view my mother is very critical.  For 45 years I tried to live up to her standards and expectations yet always felt like a failure.  I was never smart enough, pretty enough... .good enough.  And the flip side is that she was never the mom I needed her to be either.

I had a kind of a breakdown... .ended my co-dependent marriage... .and began having breakthroughs.

I realized that I am terrific the way I am and that I had many people in my life that loved me... .the real authentic me.  My mother was not one of those people.  I accepted that.  I realized her criticism is about her... .about her values, about how I reflect on her, about the importance that she puts on appearances.

Her criticism now just rolls off... .it's about her not me.  I accept she is who she is but I no longer accept... .no longer believe her criticisms.

Panda39

Thank you for sharing Panda39, it must have been hard.  My mother can also critical and it was way worse when we were young. As if nothing was ever good enough for her either and there was yelling and harsh words.

A good thing is that she did regret what she did to us. Our relationship wouldn't get better otherwise.

It is so true when it is more about them than us. Maybe their frustration with their own lives were also projected on us. Yesterday I was talking aboutphysical punishment we received and my husband said that for such level of intensity she probably vented her own frustrations on us rather than simply being irritated by us in those moments. It makes sense as someone "normal" wouldn't be so harsh on others specially their children.

As much as we need to accept that they are how they are (empathy can help because we acknowledge them as humans with their own issues) we also need to accept that sometimes it's more about them than us. Of course thought we need to responsibilize for what we decide to do or react about it.

Again thank you for sharing. I feel like I've been learning a lot in these days. Still so much to process but baby steps I guess.