Looking for Encouragement Please--time sensitive

[Furbaby Mom]

Hello all,
After about one year of not really speaking, we are meeting with SIL 2 tomorrow.  When I say not really speaking, I mean that there have been a few attempts at resolution following many of her harmful words/actions, but they did not end well.  The most recent situation is one I posted about at Christmas.  She had her boyfriend (who we met once) reach out to my H and accuse me of setting her up by getting a blank gift card.  I exchanged a few texts with her, but am very upset that she would a. let him talk to my husband about it and b. even believe I would do that.  I know that this is her finding validation for her narrative about me.

Since then, we saw her once at a family party and I did my best to avoid her and the boyfriend.  It was awkward to say the least.

Last week, she reached out to my husband on instagram (very odd choice of communication, but ok).  She asked him if they could get lunch.  Two years ago, they used to grab lunch all the time.  Since we got married, she has distanced herself from my husband which I know hurt him.  On top of that she had made it clear she was not happy with us getting married.  Since then, they rarely speak.  My birthday situation where she was not invited created space for her to reach out, but she got nasty again because she just wanted an invitation which she did not get. 

My husband now wants to meet with her, but feels like he will not hold her accountable.  We played through what we believe could happen and it would involve her crying, and wanting to move forward.  I am all about moving forward, but with her, there is usually a catch.  My husband asked if I would come with him to make sure we discuss the Christmas incident.

I agreed to go and he told I would come too, which she said she was fine with but that she has no interest in discussing the past.  She wants to "live life to the fullest in love and light."  Bizarre words but that is how she can get sometimes when she is happy. 

I am glad she is happy.  I have a lot of reservations about opening up this door again and I know that I cannot sit through lunch without saying anything about the past.  I feel like we have to address some of the issues to move forward. 

Reservations:
-opening the door now could create an influx of messages and wanting to get together (has happened in the past)
-opening the door can create space for us to be her back up plan if and when the current bf fails her (includes finances and living situation)
-opening the door may encourage SIL 1 to reach out again which would be a lot for me to handle (right now we are no contact with her)
-opening the door now puts us at risk... .more like me at risk of getting hurt.

I have a hunch that her bf wants to propose and that may be why she is trying at this time to get us to meet together.  I don't like him based on how he has been with me, but it's her choice.  Where we could possibly come into play is financially.  I would not put it past her to ask us for money for a wedding. 

I need some encouragement here.  Am I making a bad choice by going?  I know it is important to my husband and I also know we cannot go with no contact forever.  Some situations with others... .yea that choice is available, but not with this situation for us.  I think I have to go to get some resolution, but also know with her mental illness that probably won't happen.  I am trying to be zen about this whole thing and just think to myself, "it's an hour.  I can just ask her a million questions about herself."  I just have reservations.  Thoughts?  Tips? Do I acknowledge the past or just try to move forward?
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[zachira]

The best tip I can give you is to work on having healthy boundaries with self and others.  It can be easy to have healthy boundaries with healthy people, as they respect the boundaries of others, and let others know in a respectful way what their boundaries are. Most borderlines just don't seem to have any boundaries, and I never know what is going to offend them or set them off. I try to limit my contact with borderlines, and if the contact is necessary, I try not to reveal too much about myself, as borderlines use the vulnerabilities of others to dump their own self hatred on others. My main question is can you really avoid this person or do you end up hearing about them or seeing them because of other connections you wish to keep? Also, could you explain the initials you are using to refer to this person, as I do not know who we are really talking about?

[Panda39]

I agree with zachira Boundaries are key particularly regarding your "Reservations".  I think you and your husband should talk about those things and how you want to handle them when they happen (because if they have happened before you are right to expect the same again).  You both need to be on the same page and create a united front.

I have pulled several different things that might help at your meeting... .

Validation
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=81442.0
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=124001.0

SET (Support, Empathy, Truth)
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=143695.0

Don’t JADE (Justify, Argue, Defend Explain)https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=139972.0

Arguing Don’t Engage
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=106107.0

Hopefully you will find some tools from the above material that you can use when you get together tomorrow.

Good Luck 
Panda39

[No-One]

Hi Furbaby Mom

Zachira gave some good advice about boundaries.

I think I have to go to get some resolution, but also know with her mental illness that probably won't happen.

I used to think that I needed resolution as well, but I was coached to give that up.  To be able to talk through issues and specific behaviors would never happen in any way that I might find beneficial.  The best thing to do is to move on, with boundaries and limited contact.  Keep yourself out of situations that invite conflict. (i.e. if there is a wedding, don't get involved with the drama)

The truth is that you will never have a normal relationship with any of them for any extended period of time.  So protect yourself, protect your emotions, hold your boundaries (which others don't have to like or approve of).  Stay out of the drama triangles

Hopefully, you and your husband agree to NOT lend SIL money for a wedding, if she should ask.  Anyone who needs to borrow money for a wedding either needs to not get married or scale down the wedding.  I recently heard a statistic that stated the people who spend the most money on weddings are the most apt to get divorced.

The decision to go to lunch is yours.  Some BPD's just ignore the past and act as if nothing ever happened.  That is one possibility (about the gift card), since she seems to be in a good mood.  In that case, no value added to discuss the gift card and the needless drama. It's a "no win" situation for you.

If she brings up the gift card, best to have one statement ready, such as:  "I had no way of knowing the card was bad.  I can understand how unpleasant the situation must have been for you when you tried to use it. We replaced the card and hope you are able to buy something you like.  I don't want to discuss this further."

It's never going to be a normal relationship with your in-laws.  There may be periods of time, with given individuals in you husband's family, where things seem normal.  It won't last.  

Zachira's advice to NOT reveal/share too much about yourself is good advice.  Share as little as possible.  Just be pleasant and have no opinions.  :)evelop a strategy to eliminate or minimize sharing social media, emails, texts, etc.  :)on't initiate anything (let your husband handle it), be brief with responses that are necessary.

Contact can vary between NC, LC or full contact at times.  Reality is that you can't change them and won't likely ever get any conflicts resolved to your satisfaction.  The best defense for you is to NOT engage.  It won't help to JADE (justify, argue, defend, explain).

The decision is yours to go to the lunch or not.  Going with the hope of gaining some resolution to your satisfaction about past events will likely bring you disappointment.  Going with the expectation of nothing and possibly saying very little and smiling is realistic.  Hopefully, you and your husband are on a united front about loaning/giving money for a possible wedding.  If it's approached as a loan, consider it a gift that will never be paid back.  Prepare what to say in advance, if your husband will give a "no" response.  Let your husband do all the responding about a loan and be prepared with a statement, perhaps a SET statement:  i.e. "I really want you to be happy.  I can understand that you might want a wedding to include (fill in the blank to describe what the money applies to: dress, food, location).  I'm just not able to provide the money.  Perhaps you could postpone a wedding, or perhaps get married at City Hall and then celebrate at a later time?"

[Furbaby Mom]

First of all,
THANK YOU.  As usual, this group pulls through for me.

To address a few of the questions: I am using SIL 2 to describe my husbands youngest sister.  He has two younger sisters who I have written about before, both of whom I believe to have BPD traits.  My husband and this sister were close, but now he understands it was in an unhealthy way.  She is the product of an affair and unfortunately, her bio dad wants nothing to do with her.  She has turned to my husband who is 10 years older than her to take that role.  In her defense, their mother has really enabled this relationship for many years.  When I came into the picture, SIL 2 was 20 and living with my at the time boyfriend.  As our relationship grew stronger, SIL 2 dug in deeper.  In retrospect, I get it.  She would beg to come on our dates, etc. and my husband saw me as a good female figure for her as she seemed pretty lost.  All hell broke loose when my husband announced that we were moving in together.  At that point I became public enemy number one for her.  We were still paying her bills, however because my husband felt she had no one.  Their mother was busy living her own life (totally different topic for another day).  After one tyraid, I decided I was done funding her life and said we need to stop enabling her.  Needless to say, that damaged my relationship with my husband and his relationship with her.
Therapy and some craaaaazy situations later, my husband is now in a much more accepting place of the idea of how unhealthy his sister is.  His breaking point was her going to various friends of his telling them stories about me (untrue of course) in an effort to break us up.  She texted him many many times about how we shouldn't get married and he should be scared of me.  She then created a story of being stalked, of having her underwear stolen, of going to the hospital, all of which we discovered were not true in an effort to get her brother's attention emotionally and financially.  We cut contact, but she had a boyfriend so that was okay with her.  Boyfriend handled her finances and breakdowns.

So here we are.  My husband wants to try to get back to speaking terms.  I admit, it is hard to read that I should not bring up the past.  I know what everyone is saying is true and that in the end it is the best route for me to take.  I am going to read through the literature to really stay focused.  Thank you all.

[Panda39]

My husband and this sister were close, but now he understands it was in an unhealthy way.  She is the product of an affair and unfortunately, her bio dad wants nothing to do with her.  She has turned to my husband who is 10 years older than her to take that role.  In her defense, their mother has really enabled this relationship for many years.  When I came into the picture, SIL 2 was 20 and living with my at the time boyfriend.  As our relationship grew stronger, SIL 2 dug in deeper.  In retrospect, I get it.  She would beg to come on our dates, etc. and my husband saw me as a good female figure for her as she seemed pretty lost.  All hell broke loose when my husband announced that we were moving in together.  At that point I became public enemy number one for her.

Remember that at the heart of BPD is the Fear of Abandonment.  What I see here is her fear that she would loose her brother to you. It doesn't make her poor behaviors good or acceptable but it is understandable. Black and white thinking is also part of BPD behaviors.  She can't see that he can love you both, she sees it as he can love you or her.

That is the horribly sad thing about BPD these folks fear abandonment but all of their dysfunctional behaviors have the unfortunate effect of pushing everyone away.

Panda39

[stormy seas]

Prepare your hubby if possible! Ask him questions such as, “if she asks us for money for the wedding what are we going to say?” With you there it will be easier for him to stick to your plan.

All the best and please update us on how it goes!

[Furbaby Mom]

Update:
We just met, and I am alive to tell the story... .just kidding... .humor helps with this situation. 

It went okay.  Despite her wanting to leave the past in the past, she brought up some situations that she wanted to clarify for us.  The situations she brought were from a long time ago and it confused me because that is not at all why my husband and I had to go no contact with her which is what she thought was going on.  My husband and I did our best to explain to her the root of some of the things that have been going on.  She did get defensive as we anticipated so I kept going back to the idea that we do want to move forward and that this is a piece of moving forward... .understanding each other and wanting to be better. 
I caught myself a few times trying to defend myself, but as I get better at these interactions I was able to stop the conversation from going there.  I have found that in talking with both of his sisters that they are really good at switching topics very quickly.  I was intentional in slowing down the conversation in order to be heard and to understand her side. 

The main sticking point was this idea that she has a tendency of bringing others into situations.  I know from studying about BPD that this is a way of making herself feel like a victim and it makes her feel like someone is really showing her love and affection by stepping in on her behalf.  I feel like she heard what we were trying to say in how that changes how we view those other people and her. 

I am scared a little because my husband said after the meeting, "I don't want to get too excited but I am feeling good."  I do think it went well, I just am hesitant to believe it.  No issues of money came up during the conversation and she even offered to pay for herself which is a huge difference.  Even better was my husband allowing her. 

This was a baby step, but it was very hard for me.  I want things to get better, but I can only control myself. 

Thanks for all the support!  I am nervous this will open the door for the other sister, but we will cross that bridge if we get there.

[stormy seas]

Small victories are all we can ask for - nice job!