I don’t feel like people with BPD suffer as much as we think

[tiki]

I have been trying to soak in a lot of information quickly in an attempt to get out of this. And I spent some time reading the perspective of people with BPD to get more insight.

I found it interesting that they seem to deal with a separate set of issues. I just I didn’t get a huge sense of suffering. I have felt from my own experience that they put their pain on others and then don’t have to deal with it.

I’m not sure they suffer as much as we think they do. I’ve seem far more suffering here. What are the suicide rates for family, and friends and partners of psBPD?

They all flit away in the end don’t they. After wrecking havoc. They just fly to another flower.

We take for granted it’s an incredibly painful disorder. Is it? Is it as painful as the pain they bestow?

[tlc232]

Tiki --

Good question -- I read some interesting information on the site (I apologize for not being able to quote which one) that they do not think the way we do.   As we sit here wondering logical things (are they sorry for their actions... .do they wonder what we are doing... .) --- they don't... .and they simply aren't having the same thought process that we would expect in any manner.    It helps to explain to me why some nights when I was so overwhelmed with his issues in the relationship... .he would be quickly snoring away.   As you alluded, he shoveled them over to someone who had a sense of responsibility and slept away.  Very common.

i didn't realize that part of the mental illness, but it seems they are off on their own journey not at all having the same thoughts that you would rationally think at the end of a relationship so suddenly.   In some sense - we probably all suffer.       

[tiki]

Tiki --

Good question --

I read some interesting information on the site (I apologize for not being able to quote which one) that they do not think the way we do.   As we sit here wondering logical things (are they sorry for their actions... .do they wonder what we are doing... .) --- they don't... .and they simply aren't having the same thought process that we would expect in any manner.    It helps to explain to me why some nights when I was so overwhelmed with his issues in the relationship... .he would be quickly snoring away.   As you alluded, he shoveled them over to someone who had a sense of responsibility and slept away.  Very common.

i didn't realize that part of the mental illness, but it seems they are off on their own journey not at all having the same thoughts that you would rationally think at the end of a relationship so suddenly.   In some sense - we probably all suffer.       

Thank you! I thought I sounded like a monster and would get reprimanded. Thanks for that insight. It’s hard to accept but also explains things.

[SlyQQ]

It's in a don't get mad get even sort of way they are always suffering/grieving so they don't suffer more in a break up if that's what you mean,

[tiki]

It's in a don't get mad get even sort of way they are always suffering/grieving so they don't suffer more in a break up if that's what you mean,

So you’re saying they suffer more generally just not as much when ending a relationship? But then just if that makes me feel better? I think they just use people to soak up whatever pain they feel. When do they feel this bad?

I just read some of your posts. So enlightening. You’re like Jedi level.

[enlighten me]

If its hard for you to comprehend their emotional suffering then look at where a pwBPD ends up.

A higher majority of pwBPD commit suicide than nons. Most either end up alone or with someone they settle for but don't really want to be with. Due to their recklessness they are normally just getting by and wont amount to much financially i.e. own their own house.

As a non we can control our own future to a much greater extent. We can plan ahead and work towards our goals.

Try not to look at it as their life is one big party. Look to the morning after the party and the hangover they will have.

[MyBPD_friend]

I have been trying to soak in a lot of information quickly in an attempt to get out of this. And I spent some time reading the perspective of people with BPD to get more insight.

I found it interesting that they seem to deal with a separate set of issues. I just I didn’t get a huge sense of suffering. I have felt from my own experience that they put their pain on others and then don’t have to deal with it.

I’m not sure they suffer as much as we think they do. I’ve seem far more suffering here. What are the suicide rates for family, and friends and partners of psBPD?

They all flit away in the end don’t they. After wrecking havoc. They just fly to another flower.

We take for granted it’s an incredibly painful disorder. Is it? Is it as painful as the pain they bestow?

I don'r really agree to what I've learned. I do think they suffer a lot and at times stey can't handle anything, because they feel lonely, not understood, emotionally unstable, stey feel pure pain, emptyness in them, even when in a rs with someone who cares.

Sometimes they're completely lost... .

[JustNeedToTalk]

My therapist told me that the reason he hates me and painted me black is because he is defending his emotions, he won't be able to handle accepting that he loved, loves or even likes me because then he would have to accept what he done to me.

I don't think they feel the pain when they have painted black.  I think they suffer bouts of pain that we have never felt, but not the constant pain we feel when we discover their betrayals.

I don't think my ex is in pain anymore and it's only been two months.  I think he's happy.  So perhaps I do agree they don't suffer as much as they lead us to believe.

My ex once told me he finds it very easy to just cut people off or just not think about certain situations.  Hence, why his life personally and professionally is a complete mess, because he doesn't face anything like an adult.

I was told to think of him as a 5 year old child and not even try to put my head on his shoulders because he doesn't think the same as me and never will.

My therapist also told me that these people are rarely cured, they pretend, but even when in therapy they tell lies and normally only attend one or two sessions, they become distracted with something and never go back.

[spero]

I found it interesting that they seem to deal with a separate set of issues. I just I didn’t get a huge sense of suffering. I have felt from my own experience that they put their pain on others and then don’t have to deal with it.

I’m not sure they suffer as much as we think they do. I’ve seem far more suffering here. What are the suicide rates for family, and friends and partners of psBPD? They all flit away in the end don’t they. After wrecking havoc. They just fly to another flower.

We take for granted it’s an incredibly painful disorder. Is it? Is it as painful as the pain they bestow?

Hello there Tiki,

First, let me address your heading... .Now if i may.

I hope to present to you as much as i have understood what BPD is in my own experience.
First off, i would think it is better to reframe the question about suffering instead of presenting suffering in a comparison of BPD vs NON BPD suffering. It may seem like there is alot of suffering here, in the forums... .simply because we talk about it. However, for individuals who live with the condition of BPD, they are less likely to talk about it. Here i would like to say, everyone's pain, everyone's story is important. I won't diminish one's experience in a comparative sense to say this person suffered for or less than me. But, in the human experience of suffering, we feel hurt, we feel pain, we all want to make some sense out of our suffering and have others commiserate with and in our suffering.

If i may Tiki, i'd say individiuals with BPD suffer more than people without the condition. This is what Marsha Linehan, the psychologist who developed the gold class treatment for BPD, DBT (Dialect Behavioural Therapy) has to say "“People with BPD are like people with third degree burns over 90% of their bodies. Lacking emotional skin, they feel agony at the slightest touch or movement.” That badly burned “emotional skin” means people living with BPD lack the ability to regulate their emotions, behaviors and thoughts. "

Citation for the quote is here https://www.nami.org/Blogs/NAMI-Blog/June-2017/Understanding-Borderline-Personality-Disorder

Marsha Linehan herself, has had BPD, is professionally trained as a Psychologist, and i think that gives her even greater credibility in treating this condition. You can read more about her in the link below

https://psychcentral.com/blog/marsha-linehan-acknowledges-her-own-struggle-with-borderline-personality-disorder/

With this understanding, i'll tell you that people with BPD probably suffer equally, if not more than people who do not have the condition. What an indivdiual with BPD does during a black and white split, is that they attempt to sweep all the pain under the carpet. Don't look at what he / she is trying to present to you. Such individuals do not process pain the way we do, I would say they have an impairment of dealing with grief and loss. I can tell you that it might reach a critical point, where pain and loss is overwhelming for such individuals that they experience meltdowns... or they even take their own lives. So what you see presented before you, Tiki is more of a perception, they want to look well. My ex certainly did, but i knew that her makeover was telling of her personality. It didn't feel right at all. They can only keep it in for so long... .and when it reaches that point, they will cave. Sure they don't think about it. But i am very certain in the recesses of their sub consciousness, it will ooze out.

Inversely, Tiki, what you see on this forum as a collective sharing of suffering is because we are more vocal about our hurts and pains. And infact, most people get better by talking. But, for individuals with BPD, majority of them don't because of shame and guilt, or if they are co morbid with NDP, they'll think that they are fine. I don't know about the suicide rates of individuals or family members subjected to abuse caused by BPD loved one. But, is that important?

I'm not being cold or indifferent about your situation, Tiki. We would all ruminate about our ex loved ones, it is a natural process. And to do that is to be human. It's just that individuals with BPD have a different worldview, a different common language, most of us don't have the tools to deal with such individuals by ourselves. Caring for an individual with BPD requires an entire support structure involving family, friends and professional therapists.

I hope that kind of answers your question...

Spero.

[Sabinochka]

I'm in no way knowledgable about the subject but I can speak from my own experiences. My ex bf with BPD also never had any troubles falling asleep after having a hysterical rage. He would during the rage say how much he suffered but as soon as he got what he wanted it was like his suffering ended suddenly. And I would be laying in bed in total confusion for a long time while he was peacefully sleeping.

Also there was once a situation where he friend who had a sleepwalking problem once jumped out of the window (it was not very high, 2 floor building she broke something but everything is healed now) so when he found out about it he was acting all shocked and was crying and shaking and I was trying to comfort him but then he just fell asleep because he was tired and drunk while me and other people took his friend to hospital. Later on he told me he didn't really care much about that friend so all this pain was empathy was just a performance I guess. And lots of situation that also make me highly doubltful of their posibility to even remember things long term or feel long term consequences of anything

[tiki]

My therapist told me that the reason he hates me and painted me black is because he is defending his emotions, he won't be able to handle accepting that he loved, loves or even likes me because then he would have to accept what he done to me.

I don't think they feel the pain when they have painted black.  I think they suffer bouts of pain that we have never felt, but not the constant pain we feel when we discover their betrayals.

I don't think my ex is in pain anymore and it's only been two months.  I think he's happy.  So perhaps I do agree they don't suffer as much as they lead us to believe.

My ex once told me he finds it very easy to just cut people off or just not think about certain situations.  Hence, why his life personally and professionally is a complete mess, because he doesn't face anything like an adult.

I was told to think of him as a 5 year old child and not even try to put my head on his shoulders because he doesn't think the same as me and never will.

My therapist also told me that these people are rarely cured, they pretend, but even when in therapy they tell lies and normally only attend one or two sessions, they become distracted with something and never go back.

They can’t think of us because then they would have to think about the pain caused. That is helpful.

And the fact that personally and professionally it’s not a good thing to be able to cut feelings. That is might catch up with them eventually. That helps too.

And yeah the fact that they can’t plan because you probably can’t plan around crazy that helps too.

It’s great you have a therapist like this who understands this so well. I would love to find a therapist like yours. Thank you!

[tiki]

If its hard for you to comprehend their emotional suffering then look at where a pwBPD ends up.

A higher majority of pwBPD commit suicide than nons. Most either end up alone or with someone they settle for but don't really want to be with. Due to their recklessness they are normally just getting by and wont amount to much financially i.e. own their own house.

As a non we can control our own future to a much greater extent. We can plan ahead and work towards our goals.

Try not to look at it as their life is one big party. Look to the morning after the party and the hangover they will have.

That they can’t plan and work steadily toward a goal that helps.

I do see their life as one big person-wasting party.

I mentioned suicide because I know their rate is said to be 8%.
But for all the suicide threats I’m now the one who has been somewhat going there in my mind.

[toomanydogs]

That they can’t plan and work steadily toward a goal that helps.

I do see their life as one big person-wasting party.

I mentioned suicide because I know their rate is said to be 8%.
But for all the suicide threats I’m now the one who has been somewhat going there in my mind.

Are you safe, Tiki? Do you have a T or someone to talk with re: suicide? Am I reading this correctly that you ruminate about suicide?
 
TMD

[tiki]

Are you safe, Tiki? Do you have a T or someone to talk with re: suicide? Am I reading this correctly that you ruminate about suicide?
 
TMD

Well sure. But I think feeling it and being it are two different things. There are too many built in things to prevent it.

But yeah I need to work to find a counsler. A good one. Who understands.
Is there any information on here about how to find a good counsler?

[enlighten me]

Hi Tiki

I never went to the suicide idolisation but I did think if I died then things would be better for everyone.

Let me tell you they wouldn't have been. No matter how bad you think things are theyre not that bad that the world would be better off without you. At the moment your in a slump ( Not to diminish how your feeling as I know that it feels a lot more than a slump). Slowly but surely you can pull yourself out of this. Anger is a useful tool. You don't have to be raging at your ex but you can use it to motivate yourself. Get up each day and say to yourself "I'm going to show you how worthwhile I am". Use this anger to improve yourself. Do something you've always wanted to do. A course, learn to scuba dive, start running etc.

[toomanydogs]

Well sure. But I think feeling it and being it are two different things. There are too many built in things to prevent it.

But yeah I need to work to find a counsler. A good one. Who understands.
Is there any information on here about how to find a good counsler?

I don't know if there's information on here about how to find a good T. I've been in and out of therapy for over 40 years, and I've found excellent therapists and some really bad ones.

About 30 years ago, I used to wish I could die to get away from everything. A good T I was seeing at the time explained that what I was feeling was much different than being suicidal. I'm wondering if that's how you're feeling.

Good luck on finding a therapist. One idea might be to look at Marsha Linehan's site (don't know it offhand) as there might be a list of therapists who are familiar with BPD and other PDs.

TMD

[JustNeedToTalk]

Tiki, for weeks after I felt suicidal.  It was one of the things that prompted me to seek therapy.  You are not alone in these thoughts.  My therapist told me in my first session that to have these thoughts are common, it means you have feeling.  You need to accept that these BPD suffers don’t feel like us.  My exBPD BF would threaten suicide all the time, usually when situations weren’t the way he wanted them to be, now I realise it was his way of controlling me and others around him.

The fact you are talking on this forum is positive.  I would really advise seeking therapy.  I’m forty and it is something I never thought I would need.  But this past relationship has triggered things from my childhood and who I am as a person.  My therapist is working on my loneliness (despite the fact I have great friends), my co-dependency, why I don’t like myself, and this built in foundation that I live with fear.  All of these have caused panic attacks which have worsened since my break up.  For years I have been tolerant of bad behaviour in relationships.

Exercise too.  I know it’s hard and I wanted to punch anyone that said it to me but if you have a friend you can go to the gym with go.  The endorphins and release of pent up adrenalin works wonders and it also helps you sleep.  I know you will feel you don’t have the strength, I didn’t I had to force myself but please try.

I read on here once, and it helped.  “Imagine what you are feeling right now and times that by 100, this is how BPD suffers feel EVERYDAY of life”, I believe this, I really do.  This is why they react and do certain things, because they won’t release their inner self, it’s easier to hate and blame and seek solace in new partners, these new partners, are rebounds, a distraction, don’t believe for one minute it’s love, it’s obsession.  You will know deep down inside if you were loved.

Stay safe, stay true to yourself.

[MyBPD_friend]

Speor,

You really hit the point here - I agree with all you say.

I'm a man who suffered 3 degree burns in my face and a little on my body (hands, arms), I'm not BPD, but I do have a close female friend with BPD and I know how much she suffers.

She an't talk about it with me, perhaps once we get to know each oter better and she may develop more trust, she might open a littel, I just wait.

[tiki]

Tiki, for weeks after I felt suicidal.  It was one of the things that prompted me to seek therapy.  You are not alone in these thoughts.  My therapist told me in my first session that to have these thoughts are common, it means you have feeling.  You need to accept that these BPD suffers don’t feel like us.  My exBPD BF would threaten suicide all the time, usually when situations weren’t the way he wanted them to be, now I realise it was his way of controlling me and others around him.

The fact you are talking on this forum is positive.  I would really advise seeking therapy.  I’m forty and it is something I never thought I would need.  But this past relationship has triggered things from my childhood and who I am as a person.  My therapist is working on my loneliness (despite the fact I have great friends), my co-dependency, why I don’t like myself, and this built in foundation that I live with fear.  All of these have caused panic attacks which have worsened since my break up.  For years I have been tolerant of bad behaviour in relationships.

Exercise too.  I know it’s hard and I wanted to punch anyone that said it to me but if you have a friend you can go to the gym with go.  The endorphins and release of pent up adrenalin works wonders and it also helps you sleep.  I know you will feel you don’t have the strength, I didn’t I had to force myself but please try.

I read on here once, and it helped.  “Imagine what you are feeling right now and times that by 100, this is how BPD suffers feel EVERYDAY of life”, I believe this, I really do.  This is why they react and do certain things, because they won’t release their inner self, it’s easier to hate and blame and seek solace in new partners, these new partners, are rebounds, a distraction, don’t believe for one minute it’s love, it’s obsession.  You will know deep down inside if you were loved.

Stay safe, stay true to yourself.

Thank you for all your kindness in that response. This was a close friend of 10 years so they knew enough about my mind and self to hurt me. I feel completely pooped on by a person who I thought had this huge regard for me. It stings I guess. 

There is a lot of confusion to work out. The person really let me have it like a couple weeks ago and it feels like a bat was taken to my mind. Not to sound dramatic but I felt like a bomb went off in my soul and mostly I felt confused because there was so much to sort out.

The person also completely doesn’t care if they have damaged my mental state. In fact I think they may have used it to provoke me to act out so I could serve as a catalyst for sympathy and future relationship bonds.

That’s a dark reality that someone would use my poor mental health, cause poor mental health just so they could use it for themselves. It’s the no empathy and the callousness that I have a problem with.

Also they’ve taken up the last three years with holding me hostages via suicide threats in subjecting me to this abuse. And then when I’m down and out they clearly have zero regard. But I had at least enough regard that I was held hostage. Interesting how when they get the upper hand and don’t need you anymore they waste no time in showing you they don’t care.

But the reason I feel suicidal is because of the mental harm in a way. Because theee years ago I had five bad years and I barely crawled out of that hole. Then I was doing well and this person being aware of my state went ahead and was reckless with my mental health (despite various well laid out pleas from me telling him why it’s important he not do that which he ignore and steamrolled over). It’s the fact that I’m suffering again and I don’t know that I’m going to make it out I guess and that I don’t want to do another five years of that.

I feel like he very purposely reverted my mental health back to where it was when I was in a bad place. If he didn’t do it on purpose then he sure didn’t show much regard in any case and it’s not like he couldn’t have known because I was pleading with him. But then the final kick is that when it actually works he completely doesn’t care. It’s a cold reality I guess because I had to fight to get better.

I could never be that cold to any single person no matter who they are.

It really makes you feel like a person doesn’t care about your actual life. It’s just such a cold feeling.

[tiki]

About 30 years ago, I used to wish I could die to get away from everything. A good T I was seeing at the time explained that what I was feeling was much different than being suicidal. I'm wondering if that's how you're feeling.

Good luck on finding a therapist. One idea might be to look at Marsha Linehan's site (don't know it offhand) as there might be a list of therapists who are familiar with BPD and other PDs.

TMD

Hi,
Yeah it’s that living with a bad mental state is hard work so therefore death seems easier. That’s where suicide idealization stems from but you know it’s not a real option.

The name you mention I’m not familiar with but I will have a look. Thanks.

[tiki]

Sorry for being intense. I’m also really hopeful that with 60 day NC I might pop out of where I am at and go back to good mental health when the sourse of bs is no longer in my life.

[tiki]

Hi Tiki

I never went to the suicide idolisation but I did think if I died then things would be better for everyone.

Let me tell you they wouldn't have been. No matter how bad you think things are theyre not that bad that the world would be better off without you. At the moment your in a slump ( Not to diminish how your feeling as I know that it feels a lot more than a slump). Slowly but surely you can pull yourself out of this. Anger is a useful tool. You don't have to be raging at your ex but you can use it to motivate yourself. Get up each day and say to yourself "I'm going to show you how worthwhile I am". Use this anger to improve yourself. Do something you've always wanted to do. A course, learn to scuba dive, start running etc.

Thank you.

[Skip]

Sorry for being intense. I’m also really hopeful that with 60 day NC I might pop out of where I am at and go back to good mental health when the sourse of bs is no longer in my life.

The reason we struggle goes beyond the other person. Getting space will help in many aspects, but you will most likely have a road of healing ahead of you even when your ex in far in in the rear view mirror.

Hang in there. We're here with you.

Next time you feel even a little suicidal, please come talk it out here.

[spero]

Hi there Tiki,

There is a lot of confusion to work out. The person really let me have it like a couple weeks ago and it feels like a bat was taken to my mind. Not to sound dramatic but I felt like a bomb went off in my soul and mostly I felt confused because there was so much to sort out.

I'm really sorry that this isn't working out for you, and you're feeling hurt and confused after all the accumulation of what's been happening over the many years. This is where i'll try to be objective now Tiki, i take suicide and thoughts of suicide very seriously. Please don't go down that route. Your well being is the utmost concern, so as much as you want to, do whatever it takes to extract yourself out of this toxic situation which does you no benefit to you at this moment.

The person also completely doesn’t care if they have damaged my mental state. In fact I think they may have used it to provoke me to act out so I could serve as a catalyst for sympathy and future relationship bonds. That’s a dark reality that someone would use my poor mental health, cause poor mental health just so they could use it for themselves. It’s the no empathy and the callousness that I have a problem with.

Tiki, there is an expection on our end that they would have empathy. Unfortunately, as hard as it is, I must say that is only an assumption that they've developed to a healthy state of being able to empathise with others. My uBPDexGF was preoccupied with her own pain and it becomes the focal point of trying to deal with it. She didn't care about how others felt, even if it meant using me to make her feel better in a way which would hurt me. So i don't know if your friend has the capacity to even empahtise like we do. In short, it is likely that you've been caught in cross fire, or just used as a source to sooth his pain.

Also they’ve taken up the last three years with holding me hostages via suicide threats in subjecting me to this abuse. And then when I’m down and out they clearly have zero regard. But I had at least enough regard that I was held hostage. Interesting how when they get the upper hand and don’t need you anymore they waste no time in showing you they don’t care.

Tiki, at this point it isn't selfish to think of your well being as a priority. I go as far as to say, if the person cries wolf or threatens suicide, call the cops and do nothing else. If calling the cops is not an option, you are not responsible for what he/she does. This sounds more like an act of FOG (fear obligation and doubt). If he/she has taken such repeated actions, their actions will remain consistently inconsistent as such. Don't let it get to you.

But the reason I feel suicidal is because of the mental harm in a way. Because theee years ago I had five bad years and I barely crawled out of that hole. Then I was doing well and this person being aware of my state went ahead and was reckless with my mental health (despite various well laid out pleas from me telling him why it’s important he not do that which he ignore and steamrolled over). It’s the fact that I’m suffering again and I don’t know that I’m going to make it out I guess and that I don’t want to do another five years of that.

Clearly, has you have stated, this relationship/friendship serves you no benefit. I'll repeat it again, this is clearly toxic and staying won't do you any good. Infact, stay will only allow him/her sustained control over you as a source of supply. I do suspect that he/she displays a certain level of NPD traits from how you've described your predicament. I've tolerated my uBPDexGF for about a year and could no longer deal with her actions. So please, Tiki find support IRL, friends. etc. You are not responsible for another persons life as much as you care. This is where i draw my own limit, ( which i didn't have before ), i know it is difficult because you care, and when our emotions are still attached, we don't always do the best, logical, rational thing.

I feel like he very purposely reverted my mental health back to where it was when I was in a bad place. If he didn’t do it on purpose then he sure didn’t show much regard in any case and it’s not like he couldn’t have known because I was pleading with him. But then the final kick is that when it actually works he completely doesn’t care. It’s a cold reality I guess because I had to fight to get better.

Tiki, i doubt trying to rationalise how he thinks would help. This is true for your current situation, i doubt he might have intentionally caused schemed and plotted the demise of your health. But rather, he leaves a very large scale of destruction as he treads along, and he'll take anyone down or use anything to make himself feel better, which also includes trampling on you. It is reasonable for me conclude that you're infact dealing with a Narcissist.

This is a summary of what a Narc is, which i quote from Psych Central."They lack empathy and don’t seem aware that you are a whole person with your own needs. In fact, you’re only a useful tool, something to extract admiration from. The narcissist believes they’re entitled to everything, including your time, your emotions and your self-esteem. The dramatic attempts to hold your attention make your life seem tragic and fraught with anxiety. Being perpetually cut down so that the narcissist can be “better than,” destroys self-confidence and eventually leads you down a spiral of gloom."

Here is the citation to the referenced article. https://psychcentral.com/blog/3-reasons-you-cant-win-with-a-narcissist/

Tiki, im gonna stop here cause i think explaining further may overwhelm you especially in your current mental state. We're here for you. Talk to someone you trust and can relate to, if not. Keep posting and expressing how you feel, it helps! At this point, further understanding a BPD/NPD does you no benefit from my pov of dealing with your immediate needs.

You're not alone, Tiki and i believe you are certainly loved and are certainly more valuable than someone to be used. Your kindness isn't a weakness, your capacity to give and be generous isn't a weakness either, its just that people take advantage of such generosity and kindness. People do care, at least take it from the members of the community here who have been responding to your posts. As for your friend, in all honesty, just leave him be and focus first on your recovery.

Take heart and takecare.

Spero.

[tiki]

Hi Spero,
I had of course wondered about the narcissism but no. He always claims to hate himself (though I’ve never seen any observable proof of this). He has body dysmorphia. He also doesn’t do the inner/outer circle. He twice weight 400 pounds according to him.

He is however self grandiose. He thinks he is this great self righteousness person but I read there can be overlap? 

With regards to my mental health I’m not sure you understand the circumstance. He was my friend back when I was working through issues. Understood very well what I was going through. It took me five years for me to get better. I would say to him directly these are my triggers. Things like verbally striking out at me. I would be like please don’t do x to me . Please don’t do y to me. If you must do x please do it under these circumstances. I would say my mental health is the most important thing to me. Please stop crossing my mental health boundaries etc. so it was this thing and topic that loomed large in our lives.

And when I would say these things he would answer back what about his mental health? Which is no way to respond to someone else. When you say hey stop doing this to me they shouldn’t say what about me. If you want to talk about your needs that’s a separate conversation. And by the way when he said what about my mental health they he really meant is that I’m hurting him because I’m not acquiescing to his needs. Like being with him so I can fill every void ever in his life.

He was extremely reckless with my mental health. Would just layer ridiculous outlandish criticism always in the spirit of anger. And when I would ask him to stop he would say I can’t help it and made no attempt to ever stop.

If someone just emerges from poor mental health that you even helped them through and they just feel lucky to be alive and then to level layer upon layer of verbal and psychological abuse upon them I would say that is pretty purposeful. Because I was so aware of my mental health and so afraid for it the whole time.

He never acknowledge my fears as valid or worthy of listening to.

So yeah it does feel purposeful.

And understanding the various things has kept me alive as much as it has probably.

[toomanydogs]

 

With regards to my mental health I’m not sure you understand the circumstance. He was my friend back when I was working through issues. Understood very well what I was going through. It took me five years for me to get better. I would say to him directly these are my triggers. Things like verbally striking out at me. I would be like please don’t do x to me . Please don’t do y to me. If you must do x please do it under these circumstances. I would say my mental health is the most important thing to me. Please stop crossing my mental health boundaries. Etc. so it was this thing and topic that loomed large in our lives.

And when I would say these things he would answer back what about his mental health? Which is no way to respond to someone else. When you say hey stop doing this to me they shouldn’t say what about me. If you want to talk about your needs that’s a separate conversation.

He was extremely reckless with my mental health. Would just layer rediculous outlandish criticism always in the spirit of anger. And when I would ask him to stop he would say I can’t help it and made no attempt to ever stop.

If someone just emerges from poor mental health that you even helped them through and they just feel lucky to be alive and then to level layer upon layer of verbal and psychological abuse upon them I would say that is pretty purposeful.
Because I was so aware of my mental health and so afraid for it the whole time.

He never acknowledge my fears as valid or worthy of listening to.

So yeah it does feel purposeful.

This sounds similar to the way I bonded with my H, and it sounds similar to what transpired later, when I'd flat out ask him not to do such and such. Asking him not to do such and such because it triggered me was a sure way to get him to do such and such. :/

I agree it feels purposeful. My T worked with me for the past three years to depersonalize what my H was doing; however, depersonalizing it resulted in depersonalizing the entire relationship, and it couldn't sustain itself.

I am really sorry you're hurting. I totally get it, and although it's probably not particularly PC, I think the title for your thread could really be, and maybe should be: "I Don't Feel Like People With BPD Suffer As Much As They Should."

I am so down on pwBPD. I don't read anything they write about how they see their relationships or how they see the world. Nothing. I think pwBPD are as close to evil as I ever want to get. I base that on what my H did, including chasing my elderly dog around until she defecated.

I also base my perception of pwBPD on what I've read on these boards. As that saying goes, if they were on fire, I strongly doubt I'd even pee on them.

TMD

P.S. It's been a bad day.

[Harley Quinn]

tiki how are you feeling today?  Has talking about this been helpful for you?  You've mentioned a couple of times about feeling lucky to be alive after you recovered from your past difficulties.  Have you felt suicidal in the past and if so, did you have a crisis plan in place?  We are here for you and care about your well being.

Love and light x

[Husband321]

I see what the OP is saying.

A day after my ex and I broke up she was at the hair salon. I saw her walk out , (she doesn't know I was there) and she was just looking all smiles and normal. We talked and she was just in a completely normal state.
While I was dying inside.

Next days she did some shopping, etc.  like life was completely normal.

I have no idea what is going on inside of them, but I didn't get the feeling my ex was in deep pain, ever. 

I still get random calls how she misses me, yet she was optimistic about finding a home across the country.

[enlighten me]

Hi Husband321

This may sound odd but the initial thing you saw could have been relief. A lot of the time a pwBPD has decided the relationship is over long before the other person knows it. Once the break up happens then the pwBPD doesn't have to deal with their guilt for their behaviour. A weight is lifted off of them.

I'm not saying this lasts but the initial behaviour could be down to this. Hence them seeming footloose and fancy free.

[tlc232]

Hi Husband321

This may sound odd but the initial thing you saw could have been relief. A lot of the time a pwBPD has decided the relationship is over long before the other person knows it. Once the break up happens then the pwBPD doesn't have to deal with their guilt for their behaviour. A weight is lifted off of them.

I'm not saying this lasts but the initial behaviour could be down to this. Hence them seeming footloose and fancy free.

So it isn't (typically) one last incident that has them say "enough" and walk out... .it's a planning thing?   I agree -- I feel like the last year was trying for both... .but I still don't get it.   Honestly.