uBPD almost worse than dBPD? Looking for a friend to talk and share stories

[Our abuse recovery guide]

Hi everyone (sorry that this is lengthy)

My mom has uBPD, and in many ways it is even more frustrating that she does not have a diagnosis to confirm her problem. My mom is very deflective. She manipulates, abuses, degrades, and diminishes her family members (me especially) time and time again. When anything is said to bring this to her attention (and trust me, I've tried to say things in every way imaginable) she either denies it, calls me a cry baby, or blames me for it. I sincerely wonder, if she knew how sick she truly was, and I had a medical doctor telling me she had this disorder, would I be more equipped to accept it? It just drives me to the brink of insanity to know that she has no insight into the damage she has caused in my life. She has no introspection or self awareness- I cannot imagine a life lived this way. I am scarred FOR EVER and to this day I am living in hell each second. One minute it is pure ecstasy- we are laughing jovially, and the next minute she is screaming at me. She puts me down and makes me feel like I am absolutely nothing. When I try to tell her what she is doing to me, she screams "boo f***ing hoo" or calls me a "cry baby" and to "get a life". It hurts so bad and I try to wear a happy face but I am a pot close to boiling over.

Just a quick example, she called me yesterday (while I was at my dads house, I hadn't seen her in 4 days) and she was nice, sweet, and we had a regular conversation. She was not mad at all. The next day, I returned back to her house and she walked in and scowled at me immediately with pursed lips and slammed stuff on the counter. I said, "hi, how are you?". She answered back with such hostility and sarcasm "oh just great." I was like oh sh** here we go. I continued to be nice and asked her if she wanted help bringing in some groceries. She cackled in the corner and gave me a look of entitlement and went "you are a fraud". ? I don't get it? What did I even do to make her treat me like this? Also, I don't even know how I was a fraud because she did not elaborate. She ran around the rest of the night screaming out into the air and yelling at people while I silently sat in my room and cried.

When I'm around her I get so scared and nervous. My hands start to shake and my stomach tangles. I'm starting to cry even typing this up. She treats everyone poorly don't get me wrong, but she has a special tendency to put the wrath on me in particular. I am her adult daughter (age 23) and I am so sensitive. I get so upset when she treats me this way. Sometimes, I start to doubt that she is the one who has the problem and start to consider that it may actually be me, she may actually be right in her accusations! That is how truly mind f***ed I am by her. I want her to love me so badly but she has hate in her heart for me. I think she may be jealous but I can't live in this agony anymore. Does anybody relate?

I talk my boyfriend's ear off about this and although he is sweet and sympathetic, there is no way he can fully understand. Not to mention I feel awful for burdening him with things that seem so minor but are magnified in my eyes due to years and years of abuse. Does anybody want to make friends and share stories about mothers with uBPD? I am 23 years old and a graduate student studying psychology (go figure). I just really really need some support and I hope that there is somebody out there that I can confide in and you can confide in me too. I am a great listener.

[GreatListener]

Hi everyone (sorry that this is lengthy)

My mom has uBPD, and in many ways it is even more frustrating that she does not have a diagnosis to confirm her problem. My mom is very deflective. She manipulates, abuses, degrades, and diminishes her family members (me especially) time and time again. When anything is said to bring this to her attention (and trust me, I've tried to say things in every way imaginable) she either denies it, calls me a cry baby, or blames me for it. I sincerely wonder, if she knew how sick she truly was, and I had a medical doctor telling me she had this disorder, would I be more equipped to accept it? It just drives me to the brink of insanity to know that she has no insight into the damage she has caused in my life. She has no introspection or self awareness- I cannot imagine a life lived this way. I am scarred FOR EVER and to this day I am living in hell each second. One minute it is pure ecstasy- we are laughing jovially, and the next minute she is screaming at me. She puts me down and makes me feel like I am absolutely nothing. When I try to tell her what she is doing to me, she screams "boo f***ing hoo" or calls me a "cry baby" and to "get a life". It hurts so bad and I try to wear a happy face but I am a pot close to boiling over.

Just a quick example, she called me yesterday (while I was at my dads house, I hadn't seen her in 4 days) and she was nice, sweet, and we had a regular conversation. She was not mad at all. The next day, I returned back to her house and she walked in and scowled at me immediately with pursed lips and slammed stuff on the counter. I said, "hi, how are you?". She answered back with such hostility and sarcasm "oh just great." I was like oh sh** here we go. I continued to be nice and asked her if she wanted help bringing in some groceries. She cackled in the corner and gave me a look of entitlement and went "you are a fraud". ? I don't get it? What did I even do to make her treat me like this? Also, I don't even know how I was a fraud because she did not elaborate. She ran around the rest of the night screaming out into the air and yelling at people while I silently sat in my room and cried.

When I'm around her I get so scared and nervous. My hands start to shake and my stomach tangles. I'm starting to cry even typing this up. She treats everyone poorly don't get me wrong, but she has a special tendency to put the wrath on me in particular. I am her adult daughter (age 23) and I am so sensitive. I get so upset when she treats me this way. Sometimes, I start to doubt that she is the one who has the problem and start to consider that it may actually be me, she may actually be right in her accusations! That is how truly mind f***ed I am by her. I want her to love me so badly but she has hate in her heart for me. I think she may be jealous but I can't live in this agony anymore. Does anybody relate?

I talk my boyfriend's ear off about this and although he is sweet and sympathetic, there is no way he can fully understand. Not to mention I feel awful for burdening him with things that seem so minor but are magnified in my eyes due to years and years of abuse. Does anybody want to make friends and share stories about mothers with uBPD? I am 23 years old and a graduate student studying psychology (go figure). I just really really need some support and I hope that there is somebody out there that I can confide in and you can confide in me too. I am a great listener.

[Harri]

Hello and welcome.  You are in the right place as we can all relate to having a relative with BPD traits at least.  The good news is that you can make friends with a lot of people here on the board.  We do encourage you to keep conversation on the board so we can all pitch in to help, give different perspectives and strategies.  That way everyone benefits from the conversation.  We are all at various stages of coming to terms with our family members and on our own healing so you get the benefit of the collective wisdom on the board!

The good news is that things do get better.  You can't change your mother but you can change the way you interact with her and you can learn about the disorder.  I don't recommend learning about BPD behaviors to help her, but to help you.  Understanding what drives her behaviors is important so that you can depersonalize them.  Recognizing that, for example, pwBPD (people with BPD) often project their bad feelings on others can make a huge difference.  Projection is a defense mechanism where the pwBPD can not tolerate their own negative feelings and rather than deal with them, they project them on to someone else, often someone close to them.  Based on what you wrote, it sounds like this may be happening with your mother.  My mother did that a lot with me and I would wonder what was wrong with me, why she hated me, and what I did to her for her to treat me like she did.  It turned out that most, if not all, of that sort of behavior was projection.  Learning that freed me.  What she said still hurt but not as much and I felt less crazy around her.  I felt less despair.  What also helped was to know that when she said hurtful things none of it was really about me, it was all about her and how she felt about herself.  Does that make sense?  When she is raging like that she can't even see you.

So when you ask if any of us can relate, the answer is yes, unfortunately many of us can relate.  It is terribly painful and confusing to have our mothers treat us this way.  Knowledge and understand and getting support her can make that pain more manageable.

I hope to see more of you on the boards.  And I really hope you read about projection.  I think understanding it can help a lot in your situation.  If you have any questions, just ask. 

[Fie]

Hello GreatListener  


Welcome !

Yes, of course a lot of people here can relate. Including me, I have a lot of BPD / NPD in the family. My mum is BPD like yours (undiagnosed).

Sometimes, I start to doubt that she is the one who has the problem and start to consider that it may actually be me, she may actually be right in her accusations!

I recognize this. You are young, only 23, and you have figured your mum out. It took me 38 years to do the same. And still, up till now, I sometimes feel like 'Really, is it not me who's the problem ?'. I have to remind myself that I have read the same from different people posting here. So I have to tell myself sometimes : 'no it really is not me'. It's hard, because some of the memories I have somehow blocked out. In therapy I told my therapist that my mum used  to yell a lot. Now when I try to recall the yelling, I don't have memories of it anymore. It's so strange, because before I had them.

A possible explanation might be the gaslighting that we were subjected to throughout our growing up. The constantly being told that we were the problem, the projecting, ... .

When I'm around her I get so scared and nervous. My hands start to shake and my stomach tangles. I'm starting to cry even typing this up.

I am so sorry.    I know how that feels like, because I have had the same. After I moved out I had several dysfunctional relationships, one with someone with NPD. He made me feel that way, and in the end I was exhausted. A psychologist asked me if I had thought about the possibility of complex PTSD. Would you think that's something that could be the case for you, too ?

You are studying psychology and you are 23. Is this you final year ?
Do you still live with your mum ?

I guess you have or almost have exams. That's always a very stressy period. I am sending you lots of positive energy. When you find the time, please come here to talk, there are always people who listen, even those who don't reply. We are exchanging stories, and people can also be helped by reading yours.

x

[Woolspinner2000]

Hi GL,  

Welcome to our family! I'd like to join Harri and Fie with their warm welcome.

I'm really sorry for all the drama going on in your relationship with your mom. I can tell you feel so hurt by it.

When I'm around her I get so scared and nervous. My hands start to shake and my stomach tangles. I'm starting to cry even typing this up. She treats everyone poorly don't get me wrong, but she has a special tendency to put the wrath on me in particular... . I want her to love me so badly but she has hate in her heart for me. I think she may be jealous but I can't live in this agony anymore. Does anybody relate?

I remember when I was 21 and 22 years old and my uBPDm would come to visit me (I was married). My back would start to hurt and sometimes my stomach would cramp so badly that I didn't know what was going on. Our bodies often tell a story that our minds are slow to pick up on because we have mentally told ourselves that "it's no big deal" or some other belief.  Your body is telling you that it's stressed.

Are you in any kind of T to help you through this? How long have you suspected that she has BPD?

So glad you are here!

 
Wools

[GreatListener]

Hello GreatListener  


Welcome !

Yes, of course a lot of people here can relate. Including me, I have a lot of BPD / NPD in the family. My mum is BPD like yours (undiagnosed).


I recognize this. You are young, only 23, and you have figured your mum out. It took me 38 years to do the same. And still, up till now, I sometimes feel like 'Really, is it not me who's the problem ?'. I have to remind myself that I have read the same from different people posting here. So I have to tell myself sometimes : 'no it really is not me'. It's hard, because some of the memories I have somehow blocked out. In therapy I told my therapist that my mum used  to yell a lot. Now when I try to recall the yelling, I don't have memories of it anymore. It's so strange, because before I had them.

A possible explanation might be the gaslighting that we were subjected to throughout our growing up. The constantly being told that we were the problem, the projecting, ... .

I am so sorry.    I know how that feels like, because I have had the same. After I moved out I had several dysfunctional relationships, one with someone with NPD. He made me feel that way, and in the end I was exhausted. A psychologist asked me if I had thought about the possibility of complex PTSD. Would you think that's something that could be the case for you, too ?

You are studying psychology and you are 23. Is this you final year ?
Do you still live with your mum ?

I guess you have or almost have exams. That's always a very stressy period. I am sending you lots of positive energy. When you find the time, please come here to talk, there are always people who listen, even those who don't reply. We are exchanging stories, and people can also be helped by reading yours.

x

Thank you so much for your reply. As for PTSD, it is a possibility. I have developed severe severe anxiety that is one thread away from ruining my life. I am the only thing pushing to keep going because my anxiety is literally crippling. I sometimes cry thinking that she has ruined my life because it is so hard.

As for college, I finished my 4 year degree, then took a year off- I start my masters degree (2 year program) at the end of August. I feel sick over the thought of working 40 hours a week, attending graduate school, and dealing with my mom's unpredictability of mood and abuse. It is just that I feel trapped in my living arrangement. I do still live with my mom. The situation is tricky because my parents recently got divorced. I have a 13 year old sister that falls under a custody schedule where she is with my mom 60% of the time and my dad 40% of the time. So I basically follow my sister to which house she stays in order to protect her.

I have the financial efficacy to move out- I just don't feel good leaving my sister behind to be alone with my mom. The guilt eats me alive because I know that with me gone, the harassment and abuse will transfer and increase 10 fold to the remaining people in the house (brother and sister). I can not bear to live with the guilt of doing that to them so I am trying to stick it out because my sister also has anxiety and is at risk for mood disorders, low self esteem, thoughts of suicide, etc. (Being 13 is hard especially when your mother berates and degrades you day after day).

I honestly think at times that my mom could potentially be dangerous, especially during the last 6 months where her stress has been magnified and many episodes have been triggered. She has been found standing in a dark room staring at a wall for 5 minutes holding a hammer. All while having a dissociated look in her eyes... .last time I checked that is considered psychotic behavior. I am fearful for the future. BUT OF COURSE... .NOBODY SEES IT? Not to mention she has rekindled relationships with her very mentally ill family members lately that only enable and support her erratic behavior.

Do you have any advice? My T says that it is not my responsibility to worry about my sister but honestly I couldn't imagine leaving her knowing what I know all while considering the fact that my mom drinks a lot and may hurt somebody one day.

[GreatListener]

Hi GL,  

Welcome to our family! I'd like to join Harri and Fie with their warm welcome.

I'm really sorry for all the drama going on in your relationship with your mom. I can tell you feel so hurt by it.

I remember when I was 21 and 22 years old and my uBPDm would come to visit me (I was married). My back would start to hurt and sometimes my stomach would cramp so badly that I didn't know what was going on. Our bodies often tell a story that our minds are slow to pick up on because we have mentally told ourselves that "it's no big deal" or some other belief.  Your body is telling you that it's stressed.

Are you in any kind of T to help you through this? How long have you suspected that she has BPD?

So glad you are here!

 
Wools

I appreciate your support. This group is incredible. It's crazy that other people, including you, have had similar symptoms. I am sorry that you had to go through this.

For as long as I could remember, my mom has been absolutely insane for lack of better words. She would incessantly check my phone, storm into my room in the middle of the night to sneak to read my text messages... .one time she literally almost banged down the bathroom door to get my phone. She'd ground me for indefinite periods of time- keeping me on edge so I'd never know when my punishment was officially over. Sometimes weeks on grounding would pass by for the smallest offense and I'd weakly ask her "can I please be ungrounded now. Can I please have my phone back" and she would rage and revert the conversation back to herself in one way or another. Those years felt hopeless.

One year, she would not let me wear these certain shoes to homecoming because they were "too high" (they WERE NOT). They matched my dress perfectly and everybody thought they were so cute. I could not understand why she felt such a strong need to control me. She was absolutely hell bent on me not wearing them, even though they were more than appropriate for a 16 year old. I begged and pleaded my case to wear the shoes, and she still said no? So what did I do? I changed into them after she left because the shoes that she insisted I wear were absolutely ridiculous and embarrassing (I think she knew they were ugly).

After homecoming, she showed up at the party I was at- the party that she had not only given me permission to attend, but that she had spoken to the parents on the phone for a half an hour that day about. She stormed into the basement unnanounced (no phone call, no warning) and started raging and screaming. It was so f**** embarrassing I could have died. She ripped me to her car and accused me of being high, drink, a slut (for changing out of my dress into sweat pants and a tshirt, just as everyone else at the party had done because who can be comfortable in a fancy dress in a small basement?). By the way, I was not drinking or smoking, but I had wished I was at that point.

I remember being grounded for an entire month after that incident. AN ENTIRE MONTH. I just couldn't understand.

It has always been this underlying aura of "nobody is allowed to have private thoughts or feelings" or "I must control my children and husband" I thought that she was just being over protective but as time went on her behavior became more and more controlling and erratic. Now, I barely tell her anything. I do live with her so I have to speak to her but I treat the interaction like a cordial acquaintance. It's funny because every now and again I tell her something a tiny bit personal to test her, and she throws it back in my face the very next day. For example, I told her that I went out with my friends and she was nice about it, she seemed happy that I was sharing something with her. Well, the very next day she was raging at me completely unprovoked and screamed "you have money to go out drinking all night with god knows who, but can't clean s*** or pay any f**** bills". I regretted even sharing the smallest sliver of my life with her because she uses it as fuel.

So, extremely long story short, she's always acted this way but I think I've known about her being borderline for only about 8 months.

[dalmatian]

Hi there!

I actually relate to many things you said. I'm 22 and I'm only just getting used to the idea that my mom is probably a uBPD.

My mom and I can have a great time together, she is a really funny person and we joke around a lot, but then in the blink of an eye she yells at me and is so increadibly angry for reasons I don't even understand or have nothing to do with me - although somehow, she will make them about me. For example, when she's angry at my dad she will yell at me to, accusing me of always siding with him (even if I haven't even spoken to him about about anything) and start bringing up other things I did wrong or can't do and how useless I am.

Still, like you said there's still many times when I feel like she's right and I am bad at everything so she has a right to be mad, and I do silently side with my dad even when I don't say anything just because I have sympathy for him and know how he feels in those moments.

My mom is very controlling, too. I moved out when I was 18 (I don't have any siblings, so in that case that's probably an advantage) but I live in a small student home now so many of my things are still with my parents, and she has no sense of privacy there. Sometimes she will "tidy" my room while I'm not at my parent's house, sometimes completely rearranging everything (and going through some very personal stuff) and even throwing stuff out she says I don't need anymore. When I say I don't like her doing that, she either gets angry and claims it's her right since she needs to clean my room while I'm away (she does much more than she would need for simply cleaning though) or makes me feel guilty by saying it helps her dealing with the fact that I'm rarely home anymore. When she comes to visit me at my new place, she always wants to tidy and clean everything too, even though it's my place, and when I say no, she will keep arguing against it until I give in.

In general though I rarely contradict her cause I'm too scared of how she will react, I think you're really brave for doing that! I very much relate to that whole "crybaby" thing, my mom would always get SUPER mad when I DARED to start crying during our arguments (even when I was only, like, 12) and "act" like a victim by "exaggerating". Usually, when I was younger, I would believe her that somehow it was my fault for being so "sensitive" (although really, her yelling was just way too much for a child to handle).

I'd love to talk more with you and exchange stories, I think it might help both of us understand that the abuse is real and happening and know that there is someone with similar experiences