She Calls Me Cheap...

[Depression = 72% of members]

... .then she doesn't.

I don't know if I can attribute this to BPD, or if that matters.

I recall her first calling me this well before the break up.  She told then S3, "daddy's cheap!" I was in the room. 

I bought the family (her) a $40k SUV in 2013 just before she left.  $43k in 2018 dollars.

She was gentle on CS. She gave up $200/month so I could put it into the kids' 529 college plans.  It didn't mean anything to me,  I was still obligated.  Yet it was below guideline support. Courts don't care about college funds, but rather how the kids are being supported in real time. 

Last week when I invited her to lunch with us the day before D6's surgery (adenoidectomy) she asked,  "do you want money?" I paused. She said,  ":)addy's cheap!"  $10 is no big deal to me and I invited her but it bugged me.  I replied. "Says the person who owes me a thousand dollars for S8's therapy and $450 for the kids' summer camp." The lady and the next table gave me a dirty look.  Whatever. 

The next day I took D6 home to take care of her after post OP. I invited her mom to come back to our home and hang out.  She stopped and got groceries since D was only on soft foods.

Three days later I gave her the CS check and I added $40, which was a little more than what she spent on groceries. She demurred and said that I didn't have to give her more money.  She was sincere at the time,  I didn't sense and agenda.  She was OK with buying the groceries and she also brought over a pizza the next day. 

I did pay the $100 out patient copay for D's surgery. We are supposed to split co-pays (I pay for their medical insurance per the custody stipulation).

What bugs me is she calling me "cheap" still. What's confusing is her inconsistency, and me reminding her that she still owes me money I'll never see. 

The money isn't the issue.  It's her calling me "cheap" which I suppose is more about her rather than me.  It isn't that big a deal given the stories of others we see here,  but it still bugs me.  I suppose this is more about my feelings.  She taking the kids on another expensive vacation in August. Earlier in the year, when she called me cheap again,  she told me I was "the responsible parent" while she was the "fun parent." 

I'm enabling.

[Turkish]

... .then she doesn't.

I don't know if I can attribute this to BPD, or if that matters.

I recall her first calling me this well before the break up.  She told then S3, "daddy's cheap!" I was in the room. 

I bought the family (her) a $40k SUV in 2013 just before she left.  $43k in 2018 dollars.

She was gentle on CS. She gave up $200/month so I could put it into the kids' 529 college plans.  It didn't mean anything to me,  I was still obligated.  Yet it was below guideline support. Courts don't care about college funds, but rather how the kids are being supported in real time. 

Last week when I invited her to lunch with us the day before D6's surgery (adenoidectomy) she asked,  "do you want money?" I paused. She said,  ":)addy's cheap!"  $10 is no big deal to me and I invited her but it bugged me.  I replied. "Says the person who owes me a thousand dollars for S8's therapy and $450 for the kids' summer camp." The lady and the next table gave me a dirty look.  Whatever. 

The next day I took D6 home to take care of her after post OP. I invited her mom to come back to our home and hang out.  She stopped and got groceries since D was only on soft foods.

Three days later I gave her the CS check and I added $40, which was a little more than what she spent on groceries. She demurred and said that I didn't have to give her more money.  She was sincere at the time,  I didn't sense and agenda.  She was OK with buying the groceries and she also brought over a pizza the next day. 

I did pay the $100 out patient copay for D's surgery. We are supposed to split co-pays (I pay for their medical insurance per the custody stipulation).

What bugs me is she calling me "cheap" still. What's confusing is her inconsistency, and me reminding her that she still owes me money I'll never see. 

The money isn't the issue.  It's her calling me "cheap" which I suppose is more about her rather than me.  It isn't that big a deal given the stories of others we see here,  but it still bugs me.  I suppose this is more about my feelings.  She taking the kids on another expensive vacation in August. Earlier in the year, when she called me cheap again,  she told me I was "the responsible parent" while she was the "fun parent." 

I'm enabling.

[CryWolf]

hey buddy.

My ex did the same thing. called me cheap, and only spent money on frivolous things. Dont let her get to your head. You know what you did, and her perception of you is not who you are. 

[Turkish]

She's taking herself and the kids on another multi thousand dollar vacation.  A year ago, in the spring, now again.  I know upper middle class couples who only go on vacation like this. 

[MeandThee29]

Let it go, let it go... .(do you hear me singing?).

It's hard and rotten all around, and I'm living there too. We are living like I did in college, scrutinizing every expense. We have a few luxuries like a "fast casual" meal once a week and decent cell phones, but that's it. We invite people here for soup-and-salad meals and stay at "Super 8" when we travel now, which is rare. And we're always doing things with friends that don't cost much if anything and are enjoying life.

By all reports, mine hasn't changed his lifestyle at all from what we had.

So there it is.

[Cromwell]

HI

Seems like from your other thread as well, a bit of a pattern at showing you up in front of the kids. "cool mom" in the personality sweep stakes.

When you called her out at the table about the money she owed you, does that not go against this "dont JADE" thing?

[Turkish]

HI

Seems like from your other thread as well, a bit of a pattern at showing you up in front of the kids. "cool mom" in the personality sweep stakes.

When you called her out at the table about the money she owed you, does that not go against this "dont JADE" thing?

You may be right about the JADE. It wasn't a situation that could turn into a dramatic argument, however. 

[Insom]

She likes to needle you, doesn't she?  Alas, this is a behavior I've seen a lot of long-time married couple engage in, though it's probably a lot worse when there is NPD/BPD.  How do you feel when she does it?

[Turkish]

Bickering like an old married couple? Horrified... .

Possible responses:

1. "knock it off."
2. "Please don't say things like that in frontof the kids.  It's not healthy for them." (Kind of JADEy)
3. #2 with,  "I'll own cheap.  But how would you like it if I went around saying,  'mommy's crazy'?" 

It bugs me more than makes me feel badly. 

[CryWolf]

I know how you feel Turkish. You give so much and want to feel appreciated. You probably feel like nothing is good enough and you wonder if you actually are cheap. But you’re not my friend. You do so much for the kids and her. Don’t let her words affect you.

Simply “let it go” like the song from frozen .

She will say things here and there that will berate you and degrade you. It’s not who you are.

[Turkish]

It's kind of her FOO dynamic among the siblings I've noticed.  The boys kind of do it like guys do.  Good natured ribbing.  I may be too sensitive as a PSI and only child.

[Insom]

Bickering like an old married couple? Horrified... .

I know, right?   

It's kind of her FOO dynamic among the siblings I've noticed.  The boys kind of do it like guys do.  Good natured ribbing.  I may be too sensitive as a PSI and only child

.

Don't swallow your feelings.  It's OK to find this stuff annoying and it sounds like she aims at tender points.

As an also-sensitive person, I'm not good at giving advice in this category but agree 100% not to JADE.

The that that defangs this type of teasing is confidence: owning your strengths and weaknesses, not caring that it's criticism because you know you are a valuable, whole person with normal, lovable, human flaws.  (I wish I could teach that.)

[zachira]

Turkish,
The only way to keep yourself from being so negatively affected by people who know how to make you feel bad, if you still have to associate with them, is to realize that what they say about you is all projection. She is indeed the one who is cheap and feels so badly about herself that she has make others feel terrible. If you are not affected by what she says, than she has to deal with her feelings. The kids know the truth, or at least at some point, they will likely figure it out. The big challenge of dealing with borderlines, and I have three borderline family members I have to deal with on a regular basis, is to not get upset by how badly they treat you, though sometimes we are all just human and do get upset by how mean these type of people are. Take care and keep us posted.

[No-One]

Turkish:
I heard a recent discussion about a study that said women find frugal men sexy.  I'm thinking the statement probably applies to a relationship that is likely to last.(as opposed to short-term relationships with women looking for a man to spend money on them)  Being responsible with finances, with a long-term plan, is smart.

Don't let it bother you, when she calls you "cheap".  People who live beyond their means, or don't save for the rainy day, can end up broke.  A lot of people are vacation and car poor, haven't prepared well for retirement and aren't prepared for a period of unemployment.  They might live it up for a short period, with expensive vacations and costly cars; but, for most, there is a day of reckoning.

Be who you are, and be proud that you are a responsible adult for both yourself and your children.

[Turkish]

Thanks No-One. Our overlords from Texas headquarters are visiting Monday. Mandatory roundtable Monday afternoon.  Last summer when they came out they indicated that they had the choice to lay off 17% of our group but chose not to (others at our site weren't so fortunate). Layoffs happened earlier in the day and if you made the afternoon meeting,  that was the "all clear."

I could hack a layoff and being unemployed for a while. Precisely because I worry a bit about money,  I don't really worry about money.  My ex at the beginning of our r/s commented after a while that guys who typically drove luxury cars in her age range (mid to late 20s, I was 36 when we met) didn't have money because they plowed it into their cars  I drove a 10 year old 4x4 when I met her.  It was a compliment to me from her.  I bought my 2009 when I knew we were likely going to start a family.

I was thinking about it further today and was reminded of what my ex told me before what she struggled with.  Though her mom was a victim of DV and serial cheating, she indicated that both parents tore each other down and it must have been often in front of the kids or my ex wouldn't be aware of it,  in addition to the fact that her mom made my ex her emotional partner.  She struggled with the fact that she often repeated their dynamic and wanted to change. Switching partners didn't help as she treated her husband worse than me after a while. Poor bastid.

I think I might bring it up to her the next time,  in a nice way.  My T observed a few years ago that he thought that she respected me,  despite it all,  and that I could use that while remind I reminding me not to overdo it.  No one likes being talked down to, BPD or not.  

[GaGrl]

Turkish, a couple of comments... .

1) I believe the research is correct re: the valuation of financial thriftiness. At least my experience validates that. My father would always say, "I'm not cheap. I'm thrifty!" Of course, he and my mom were Depression babies, so life was pretty extreme. ... the families were land rich and cash poor. You grew your food and raised the meat, and first-frost slaughter and smoking was a big deal because the meat had to last all winter.  Dad came home from WWII wanting only to provide security for his family. I am now with a man who ended up as a financial advisor after a career as as Army infantry officer. Obviously, I have a "type"!

2) You ended up the same place I did after considering your situation... .it is entirely appropriate for you to express your feelings and position on this to your ex.  "I want to revisit your comment last week that ':)ad is cheap. ' I don't see that positioning me as cheap and you as the fun parent is helpful or healthy to our children. I work hard at providing stability to our children. I felt disparaged for doing what I consider to be the right thing, and I would appreciate being acknowledged for what I do."

[Turkish]

I like your #2 Gagrl! SET may not be necessary given that overall we get along now. 

My mom was born in 1942, the baby of the family,  so she was aware of Depression Era struggles, and her family was poor (her dad was likely BPD but more likely NPD or even ASPD). So in the 70s and 80s, I grew up with the mentality of barely surviving.  A decent house, not worrying about the car breaking down or running out of gas and being able to eat out when I want rather than eating cold food out of cans is good enough for me. 

My ex was an immigrant at 11 and their first home here was a studio with 6 of them packed in.  But unlike me they had indoor plumbing and electricity. I didn't get that back until the latter half of my high school senior year. That said,  I won't disparage her experience. The ways we burgh approach life given poor childhoods is interesting. The difference might be that she desires validation whereas I don't.  It likely comes down to conflicting values, which have nothing to do with BPD or anything else like that. 

My mom was a whole other story, fully intelligent enough not to live like a person continually on the edge of poverty, but didn't.  I think she got validation by "surviving" even if she sent her son at 12 dumpster diving for produce   

I might need a mid life crisis car now 

[GaGrl]

Pro-life crisis car might be fun... .fast, sleek, with just enough room to strap the kids in back.

[Turkish]

Honda R-Type. Kind of immature looking for a guy my age (almost 47),  but that's what I've got my eye on.  Currently drive a Mazdaspeed3, which doesn't look fast, but it is.  Bright red, yet no tickets in 9 years *knock* on wood.

[GaGrl]

Honda R-Type. Kind of immature looking for a guy my age (almost 47),  but that's what I've got my eye on.  Currently drive a Mazdaspeed3, which doesn't look fast, but it is.  Bright red, yet no tickets in 9 years *knock* on wood.

I like it! Continue with the red.

Confession... .last time we drove to Florida, my DH managed to get a Super-Speeder ticket (was trying to pass a truck)... .in a RAV4. How does THAT happen? Thirty mph over the speed limit means the local ticket, then another from the state for $300. Ouch.

[Enabler]

The day after I foolishly announced that I thought my uBPDw might display traits of BPD she sent me a long whatsap suggesting I had a peculiar obsession with money when we first met when we were 18. At the time I took this seriously and in fact my research yielded some positive fruits about understanding myself better. "Delayed Gratification" is a skill that people learn from childhood to become adults. By the time we're adults we can delay gratification for greater gain later on... .something I might add that Mrs Enabler has never grasped. I was a mature 18yr old and whilst my friends spent all the money they had and more, I squirreled money away to buy big ticket items such as a car, windsurf board, expensive bikes, a drum kit. I spent most of my money, but I didn't squander it... .I was far from "cheap" yet because I didn't flit it away on small insignificant tat I was labelled cheap, tight and a miser. ':)elayed Gratification' makes up part of ones executive thinking, something pwBPD fail to learn.

It was a nice attempt at deflection by her though and sent me sniffing elsewhere for a day.

[CryWolf]

turkish:

"if it aint a type-R, it aint a tight car"  get one man. they are so beautiful

[Turkish]

turkish:

"if it aint a type-R, it aint a tight car"  get one man. they are so beautiful

So tempted... .wants vs. needs though. I'm feeling the same as I did in 2009 deciding between the Mazdaspeed3 and the WRX. MS3 needs some suspension work, but the powertrain is still strong at 143k miles.  I still do the factory interval services,  synthetic for the engine and transmission. 

I still don't know what my ex's deal is with her husband but today I went with her and the kids to her brother's birthday party, over an hour away on the valley. 

I sensed some tension when they arrived; the kids stressing her.  They did act up a free times,  especially D6 (The Princess). Overall it was OK and I talked to my ex for a bit.  I spent 7 hours with them today. It was OK. 

Everybody on the other side still accepts me as Tio (uncle). It's just their culture.  She's still married,  but her H wasn't invited. I don't know what's going on with them and I didn't ask. 

I guess what sucks for me is determining my role. She and I will never get back together. She's still married, yet separated. But still has some kind of r/s with him.  Despite a good day today, I can't forget how she can be, getting her H arrested, cops later, DV towards him. I felt some fondness towards her today. I guess that's ok if that's all it is. 

[Clearmind]

I could easily and happily spend $120 on a massage but I would never deem it ok to spend $120/head on a dinner. My mother can spend $500/night on a hotel but wouldn't spend a cent on a massage. We all place different value (monetary or otherwise) on an experience.

No two people are a like and some love to make a point on what we value - do they have a right to comment? Yes! Should we care? No! But we do - put it down to "some love to tear us down to make themselves feel good". You can love and care without spending a cent.

[Turkish]

"some love to tear us down to make themselves feel good"

Succinct and wise way to put it Clearmind, especially about where different people may put value.  

For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.