So Confused If Wife Has BPD Or Not

[Jonwow]

 

Quick backstory, meet my wife on match.com in 2015.  Gorgeous woman, had pretty good job, was sweet, caring, funny,and outgoing.  Had some things that I may have just over looked as I was falling in love.

1.  Dad completely abandoned family of 6 when she was like 19, sure her upbringing was awful as he called her fat and other names. She was a girl that was kind of ugly duckling, then by 21 was beautiful.  To be fair her sisters did say how bad the dad was.
2. She had sexual relationship with a female one time for a cpl months.
3. She had already had a marriage get called off, said after a few years that guy just played video games and they basically barely spoke while living together at the end. As I saw pics of him she was much more attractive. Chalked it up to guy was kind of a dork.
4. Had talked about a huge fallout with her best friend, she was crazy and turned her back on her etc etc etc. Called her and her mom names.  So seemed normal as she did have other friends.
5. Smokes
6. Does occasionally bite nails and does pick her finger skin.
7. First cpl fights she seemed to cry a lot more than other girls I had dated.  Just said she is emotional and can’t help some of the crying.

After a year of dating she moved into my place, she had a cat and I had dog so it was hard as they didn’t get along. I also do binge drink once a weekend and once living together I feared some of my hangovers or being blacked out would ruin all this. Shortly after living together she started pushing marriage soon, as she made no secret she wanted 3 kids and at 31 she felt like 15 months of dating should be enough as I was 36. I felt the pressure, but again had a lot of amazing qualities so u decided she prob is best I am getting and I want kids too.  With the wild hangovers and guilt from drinking I think I did have a low opinion of myself. I had slept with a lot of women in my day and I think I thought marriage and kids could really make me a better person.  She had to have a fall wedding so we had a 3 month engagement. Wedding planning seemed a touch crazy, but all my friends said that’s normal.
Wedding was amazing, but two things bothered me, one freaked out on my wedding party for smelling like booze before cermomy and told her sister her bf of 5 years wasn’t family so wouldn’t be in family pics. Went on to honeymoon were she just got off birth control as she wanted to start trying and doc said may take a few months as been on pill for years. I got drunk as all heck last night of honeymoon. Told me regretted marrying me and was a big mistake. Shortly after honeymoon her abuse continued saying I better change, took off and threw wedding rings after what seemed to be minor fights.  She started acting a lot different, but because I would binge drink 2-3 times a month I thought I prob deserved it. She never loved drinking as her dad was a drunk.  I never touched booze durning the week, just loved to go out with friends and tie one on in social settings. Month into marriage I was having real doubts as I had never seen or heard her talk like this. I am awful, maybe her ex wasn’t as bad as I thought, should of trusted her gut on not marrying me.  

Then of course she ended up getting prego on the honeymoon  .  The pregnancy was awful and she did gain weight and say she felt horrible.  Her verbal abuse I started attributing to hormones.  Like what kind of good person goes to bar and watches sports while prego wife is sleeping.  Kept honestly thinking I am a bad person.  Fast forward to birth of my son, which is such a blessing and will always be best thing in my life. She had always said she wanted to be a stay at home mom and I had the resources to make that happen. Shortly after my son was born she started getting weird with my mom who she previously had a great relationship with.  Took offense to buying baby certain gifts and after about month in set a rule that my mom could only come over 2 times a month. My mom is amazing person and was really crushed by this.  I started not going out much anymore and only drank 2 times a month tops now.  Tried to help with son as much as I could.  I had a ton of financially stress going on in my mind and felt guilty for my drinking durning her pregnancy.  Now fast forward 6 months, she really doesn’t like my mom around the baby and is very very controlling of my son. Again seemed normal for first time mom. The fighting continued and now I was being called a bad dad and dead beat father anytime i did anything involving my friends or drinking. I work 6 days a week prob 70 hours. I helped her in morning and tried to get home last hour before my sons bed every night.  I also will watch him late morning when she has her workouts. Make all doctor appts and do provide financially.

Her new thing was locking me out or telling me to go to my moms anytime I would touch booze at all. She did this a few times were I couldn’t get in my home, unfortunately one night I finally snapped and kicked back door in and freaked out yelling for her to leave and we were done, she called the cops, but no charges were pressed.  That leads me to where I am now.  My son is a year, I have been practicing a sober living since late May with 2 slip ups in that time.  Her verbal abuse of me has continued and now some pyschical, light pushing and throwing my stuff.  Started marriage counseling and she did blame most of her behavior on me and my drinking. Took really no ownership and after 3-4 sessions she said I should go to counseling and fix myself.  So I have, recently the counselor has told me she thinks my wife has BPD traits. She won’t go back to counseling and says I need to grow up and be family man:  So this is what she is willing to do;

1.  My mom is allowed to come over once a week
2. I am allowed one night a week to spend with friends
3. She Will not wait longer than 3-4 months to start trying for another baby or will leave me.
4. Threatens to not let me see son when fighting now
5. Verbal abuse and light physical is validated by my past and me being selfish.
6. Won’t let me take my son out of houses to friends house or my moms. Only like target or in neighborhood.

So I am at a cross roads here, it really seems like she has BPD, but I keep blaming myself for my drinking and active lifestyle.  As blacking out is also not acceptable. I just feel lost and trapped any advice or help is much appreciated.

Thanks!
 
 

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Cat Familiar]

HI Jonwow,
Welcome to the family. We're sorry you're dealing with this, but the behaviors you describe are familiar to us and we can help you make things better.     First of all, have you read the sidebar? There's lots of information on this site and you will discover very similar stories when you read other people's posts.

So she pressured you to get married and to have a child right away. You used to use alcohol as a weekend escape from the pressures of your work, but after the wedding, she began shaming you for getting drunk. You already felt some guilt for binge drinking and the resultant hangovers, but her words stung.

When your son was born, you supported her as a SAHM but were alarmed at how she prevented your mother from being around your child. You backed off drinking with your friends and tried to help out as much as you could with your son.

She adopted a zero tolerance policy for you drinking and would lock you out, until one night you snapped and kicked in the back door and the police were called Since then you've been sober, but her verbal abuse has continued and she has began acting out physically.

She has blamed all relationship issues on your drinking, refused to look at her own issues and has quit marriage counseling. She demands that you try for another baby and threatens to take away access to your son.

Is this about right?

You've made some major lifestyle changes, but she has not budged from her position. And she is using your past behavior to justify her own abusive behavior toward you.

How do you feel about her demand for a second child? And how do you see some of her restrictions about your son working out as he gets older?

Cat

[Jonwow]

Thanks for responding, yes I have been far from perfect and I think this is why I have allowed this behavior. What you said sums it up.  I know I don’t want another kid in this current situation. I would work on us and then if after months if things got better I would consider it. I want more kids, but this just doesn’t seem right. My mom is crushed and my friends are telling me her limits are not standard. I am very active and prob a little more selfish than most.  For some odd reason I keep blaming myself and I know a divorce will be an outright war with her... Just trying to really make sure this is what she has before I react.  Thanks

[Cat Familiar]

It seems that you have been far too willing to shoulder more than your share of the blame in this relationship.     You've taken responsibility, changed your habits and that's all you can do. If she's not willing to forgive you--that's on her.

Over and over I've seen people with BPD (pwBPD) play the "selfish" card when they aren't getting what they want. I've fallen prey to it myself with more than one BPD individual.

A very typical pattern with pwBPD that you're experiencing is that they tend to isolate their close family from outside influences (such as your mom).

And you're right, divorce with a pwBPD can truly be awful. (Been there, done that.) There's two ways you can go with this relationship. If you put in the work to learn the tools, you can turn down the temperature. That said, it will always be different than a relationship with a "non" but many members are successful at having a pleasant marriage, but it will take a lot of work on your part to change the way you communicate with her. (It took me a long time to get over the "unfairness of it all" since my husband (have had 2 with BPD) is the one with the "issues".)

Even if you do decide to divorce, it will be good to know how to deal with a pwBPD because you will be coparenting your son.

[Cat Familiar]

Something I should add about your question in the title of this thread. BPD is a spectrum disorder and some people can have extreme cases and be rather disabled as far as being able to hold down a job or behave in socially acceptable ways. Others can be employed in high level and professional capacities and no one, other than the immediate family, would observe these dysfunctional behaviors.

Some members here have received a professional diagnosis of their partners or family members. Most haven't. What is noticeable are the repeating patterns of behavior that pwBPD engage in. The inappropriate anger, verbal and physical abuse, isolating behavior and the fact that your counselor has pointed out BPD traits are all signs that it is highly likely that she does fit the category.

[formflier]

:
3. She Will not wait longer than 3-4 months to start trying for another baby or will leave me.
 

I'm so sorry... .       


She obviously has traits of BPD.  For your purposes... it really doesn't matter is she is "diagnosable" or not.  You base your actions... .of her actions... not her diagnosis.

Listen... it appears you are on the right track.  Get sober... stay sober... .get counselling for you.  Even if you wife doesn't cooperate... you can make your relationship much much different.

Will it be enough?  Only time will tell.

Look at what I quoted.  Please... handle birth control yourself 

She is obviously controlling and not open to compromise or agreement.  This will take a while to calm down.  I just can't imagine another kiddo helping out the situation.

Thoughts?

FF

[Jonwow]

Thanks for response! It’s spiraled so far out of control.  I would of loved to have another kid, but now my aniexty and confusion is an utter nightmare. Luckily I have God in all this over the last few months.

[Radcliff]

Did the topic of your wife's physical abuse come up in counseling?  If so, what did the counselor say?  What did your wife say?

Kudos for deciding to practice sober living.  Do you have support to help you with that?

WW

[formflier]

  Luckily I have God in all this over the last few months.

No rush... .but what does this mean to you?

Full disclosure:  I'm conservative Christian (Baptist variety).

The reason I ask... there is a wide variety of understanding of PDs in "the church".  Also... personally... .PD issues will "test" your relationship with God.

FF

[isilme]

A very typical pattern with pwBPD that you're experiencing is that they tend to isolate their close family from outside influences (such as your mom).

Outsiders can criticize and comment.  People with BPD prefer to bypass this by isolating people.  This way, you have no outside voices backing up if they are being reasonable or not.  No one to judge them, or for them to perceive as judging them.

A mother in law is especially someone who can judge.  She's been a mom.  In your W's mind, your mother might think your W is a bad mom.  Her picking curtains are seen as controlling, invalidating, etc.  Advice or offers to help with baby care are seen as the same.  Attempts to see the baby are interpreted as an attempt to control or take the baby's affection.  Affection and attention as Zero Sum items.  Love is not an overflowing well.  It's a half empty cup from which even a teaspoon is going to be missed. 

BPD involves a lot of shame and blame avoidance.  If they are ever wrong, less than perfect - you might leave them.  They see it as far better to drive you away from that you leave on your own, or for them to leave first. 

She is looking for validation and unconditional love that she thinks will come from the child, the love she did not get from dad.  She wants backups, just in case.  This is sad - I am an only child of two BPD parents, their demands on me for love and validation were very hurtful and confusing. 

She is projecting a lot of her fears of abandonment and of alcohol based on her dad on you.

Many BPD mothers (I assume dads, but I see it a lot from mothers on here) will use children to control their environment. 

She is also still postpartum - this seems like it can last until she is done nursing or about a year or so after birth.  My sister in law had a drastic mood change after having her first baby, like all veils of self-control were stripped away, and the needy, emotional mess underneath was laid bare.  Sorry, but lady-hormones make normal-crazy even worse. 

BPD makes them need YOU to feel as off footed as they do.  They will shake you, poke you, try to provoke you into anger, sot hey can retcon why they are angry - now it's your fault even if they started the fight. 

Also, my H has very little capacity to work through things without borderline (ha) yelling about them aloud.  He has no internal monologue.  Where you and I can sit here and wonder, internally, silently, "did I make a good choice in this relationship?  Do I want to stay, gosh I feel so bad about it right now."  They can't.  All these thoughts, even if they are temporary, will be said.  Aloud.  To you, the target.  Try your best to not internalize them.  They will throw ping pong balls of anger and shame and even temporary hate at you.  You don't ahve to catch them, and certainly don't ahve to keep them.  Just let them fall.  Throwing them abck does no good for either of you.

I told someone else to look at the relationship like the stock market.  Day by day the ticker is all over the place - highs low, huge valleys, etc.  Over years, you can (usually) see an upward trend.  There are some steps backward, but overall, the trend is hopeful things will tick upwards.  But day by day it can feel like it's going nowhere.  But for us, feelings do not = facts.  For BPD, yes, facts = feelings, but we have this sad great power, the ability to marshal our own emotions, and control them somewhat, and look beyond them.  And with this great power comes responsibility.  Not to control our SO's emotions.  But to be mindful of them, to see if we can deduce more about the REAL cause, not the one currently be yelled about.  Like this - Sure, it sucks it's raining, but why is my H REALLY mad?  Oh, he wanted to walk, because one walk in a month will make him skinny and this was the magic night that was going to happen.  And now he is doomed to fatness forever (he's not even fat). 

So you are in a conundrum.  First, see the tools and lessons.  See what boundaries you can set about yourself to protect you -a boundary is not to control the other person (though when used consistently, CAN result in a positive behavior modification as a side effect).  Start small.  Get comfortable.  Read about validating the valid, and how to talk to her about the invalid (or determine what you can just ignore.  Not all comments need a reply). 

Making small changes to how you react to her barbs and demands, in time force her to try other methods to communicate.  She is just usign what she knows, and what she knows is not healthy.  She will always have this condition.  But her skills can be improved simply by you improving and changing yours.  She's tethered to you on a ladder going up - if you climb a few steps, she will dangle below you, but will be a few steps higher, too. 

We are more emotionally prepared for life.  Somehow, someway, this is how we are, this is how they are.  Its really often not about us - we are just the person closest to them.  If they did not care at all, we'd see the same mask everyone else sees.  Sadly, they are abusive and need us to learn to validate, not JADE, to use SET instead (sorry, it's all in the tools and lessons), and things CAN get better.

One word of caution, as the man, you may want to have a quick, informal meeting with an attorney, and mention the BPD concerns and the counselor's comments, to protect you should she get worse before she can get any better.  Since kids are prime tools for pwBPD, I don't want her having a carte blanche to defame you as a method of control or try to fight for custody.  This is NOT to strat seperation - only you can determine if that is what's needed, and I think its pretty early.  This is just one kind of boundary to rpotect you and the child.

[Jonwow]

Thanks, we have both decided that 4-6 months of trying to work on this is fair to our son.  I have been far from perfect and I have taken the proper steps to fix myself.  I will update this post as needed.  Thanks so much for your time, thoughts, and info. 

[pearlsw]

Thanks, we have both decided that 4-6 months of trying to work on this is fair to our son.  I have been far from perfect and I have taken the proper steps to fix myself.  I will update this post as needed.  Thanks so much for your time, thoughts, and info. 

Okay! We're here anytime!

[Radcliff]

Thanks, we have both decided that 4-6 months of trying to work on this is fair to our son.  I have been far from perfect and I have taken the proper steps to fix myself.  I will update this post as needed.  Thanks so much for your time, thoughts, and info. 

Definitely keep up updated.  Your chances will increase substantially if you become a regular participant here and start working the coping tools.

WW

[Jonwow]

Thank you, it got a little better for a few weeks. She refuses marriage counseling and has set a dec date to start trying for a another baby. The pressure of all this is very difficult, after 60 days sober I got drunk at a buddies wedding last weekend and it has started all over again.  I agreed to go to aa this week, first meetings were actually very calming, then tonight she forbid me to go to my men’s church group or will
Leave me. Now transfered a large sum of money from our joint account to her personal saying she is filing.  I just feel like only reason I am hanging on is for my son. The threats of not letting me see him are just so awful in my head.  With her getting zero help I don’t see BPD getting any better?  I keep thinking is it me it’s gotta be me. Thanks again

[OffRoad]

I don't post here often as I am now divorced, but her moving that money sent up all kinds of red flags. That cannot happen again, so imo it may be time for you to open your own bank account and leave the joint only for certain  bills and whatever money she should have (define an allowance for each of you). Pay everything else online. Otherwise she could take all of the money. Set a boundary that since she has moved joint money without joint consent, you will be dealing with financials in whatever way moving forward to insure there will be money to pay for bills... You can also say if she will put what she moved back, you can renegotiate joint funds, but that would have to be worded very carefully. And yes, go see an attorney right away. I don't know where you live, but very few won't give joint custody. Know what your options will be should it come to that, but you might never have to act on it if you can change the dynamic. After all, do you want your son to think your marriage dynamic is normal?

If you decide to stay, you will need to find the tools to make this work for your family.

Is there some reason why your men's church group might be a problem for her? Too many nights in a row gone (aa and church group) maybe?

Congratulations on your work getting yourself alcohol free. Addictions are hard, even when they might only be social addictions (everyone else is drinking, I should be able to, too). Kudos to looking at changing you where you feel you need to change.

[Jonwow]

Thanks for the response, I did retain an attorney today just in case.  She is saying she needs to protect herself and our son in case I were to freak out if she filed for divorce, which I would never do.  She does the "I feel for our safety".  She really believes a family man has no need to be doing things at night more than once a week, regardless if its productive or not!