One marital affair winding down, am I about to start another?

[Ltahoe]

RF,
I'm also late to your story and I'm under the impression that you've somehow managed to keep your romantic exploits concealed from your wife. You may think you've "gotten away with it" but I'm wondering if she somehow senses that you've been up to something. Women have this interesting thing often called "women's intuition" and if indeed her's is active, she might very well know more than you think she does--or at least sense that something is up with you and feel that you're a rather untrustworthy mate.

If so, it's no wonder that she has no juice for you romantically. Why would she for a man about town? It comes down to an innate self-protection mechanism that we women often have. If a man seems duplicitous and untruthful, why would we want to invite him into our bed?

Couldn’t agree more with this either. I actually thought about this in addition to some of my other thoughts. Your wife probably knows something is up and has actually withdrawn. I’m not trying to scold anyone but just observing if the effort that went into a 10 year affair went into your wife your marriage may not be sexless. In trying to reinstigate sex your sexual advances probably will have to be more than generous and selfless, with her reaping the majority of the benefits.

I believe you said in a prior post something about cuddling with your wife. Your wife is then open to some form of affection. If your wife is open to cuddling how hard would it be to advance this to more subtle things and taking it slowly and thoroughly?

[RomanticFool]

Thank you all for your input. I have carefully considered everything that has been said to me. These  points ring true:

Isn't time to start therapy with you wife and have the therapist help you end the marriage and make the the divorce as respectful and painless to her as possible? Starting over at her age will be hard, but it will be much harder 5 or 10 years from now. You have said many times that she is a good person and doesn't deserve the infidelity that has been present through your entire 12+ year marriage.

I think I have realised that my marriage is over.

The new prospect is single and local. This one (or another) will likely become a discovered affair and/or the women you leave your wife for. The could easily lead her or her lawyers to discover phone records and credit card bills that show a her the length and intensity of the other relationship... .she could spend years in recovery and possibly never recover at all. Finding out the the entire marriage was a lie is a magnitude of injury that is hard to fathom.

You have been lucky/good in that you haven't gotten caught. You can end this thing now and spare her a lot of pain.

I think part of me wants to get caught.

Clearly you like your wife and think she is a good person. And yes, getting a divorce with be a financial blow, but these are selfish reasons to stay married. I know this is hard to hear, but you have abused your wife at the highest level. You can set some of that right.

Yes, I have abused her and for that I will carry guilt for the rest of my life. I currently hate myself.

Getting out if the dual affair was good for your partners family. A good thing happened there - painful but good.

I am glad I am out of that for both of our sakes.

A good thing now would be to gift your wife an exit that doesn't destroy here. You can atone for what has happened. That will be a good thing - painful, but good.

Going this next step will open the door for you to find what you are really looking for.

I agree. I don't think going to a therapist is going to help. I already know the marriage is over. I need to extricate myself before my strength falters.

[Enabler]

Betrayal is, I have come to understand, worse than a death in the family -people are supposed to die, they are not supposed to cheat.  It will break your wife on a root level.  Her identity, world view --all of it will be shattered.

I would like to suggest another possibility -the possibility you do not know how much your marriage actually means to you.  It is human nature to take for granted all that we know and all which we have.  You have been using your marriage as a foundation or safe place to run to when you affairs get rocky. 

My guess is none of your affairs would survive in the light of day -they are generally speaking not built to last.  Further... .without a safe harbor, your marriage, I should guess your dating would take on a darker tone in your current mental state.  You are, in my opinion, emotionally unfit for a relationship at this point in time.

ASTOUNDINGLY WISE WORDS - having witnessed my father die in front of me and finding out my W was having an affair within the space of 12 months, I can confirm the affair revelation was orders of magnitude more emotionally harrowing. 

[formflier]

RF

Thoughtful answers... .keep up the good work.

I would encourage you to go to a therapist, with your wife to discuss the relationship.  I hope you will be open to going down multiple pathways.

It very well may be true that your marriage is over, yet I wonder what happens if you actually did pursue your wife... .consistently with guidance of a therapist... .for several months.

You have been very open with many parts of your life on these boards... I commend you for that!  

That being said... .I don't have a good understanding of the lack of pursuit of your wife.  (I realize there is a bed issue and a bedroom issue... .not minimizing those, yet they seem solvable)

Thoughts?

FF

[Wicker Man]

Romantic Fool,

... .I will carry guilt for the rest of my life. I currently hate myself.

You cannot change the past, but you can change how you treat your wife and yourself now and in the days to come.

Sometimes divorce is the best answer for an untenable marriage, but I am for people exploring their options before divorce.  My concern --you have either been in limerence or grieving the loss of a lover since you arrived on this board. 

I remember clearly being out of emotional equilibrium several times over the last couple years as a result of my affair.  I was making some decisions which now, in the light of day, seem tragic to the point of comical. --I wish I had been able to emotionally sober up before doing some of the things I have done.

My thought is, once again, begin therapy for yourself and see what you learn.  Even if you decide to divorce you should spend quite a bit of time with a therapist deciding whether or not disclosing your affairs is a good idea and what is the most beneficial approach for your wife.  --This doesn't change whether you are staying or going.

From my reading this is not a cut and dry issue there are good arguments for both disclosure and not. I.e. it must not be a confession to cleanse your conscience -disclosure must be handled very carefully in order to avoid hurting the betrayed anymore than necessary.  It is a grizzly experience for both parties.


Wicker Man 

[Skip]

I don't think going to a therapist is going to help. I already know the marriage is over. I need to extricate myself before my strength falters.

Help you? Help her?

My suggestion is about helping her, RF. Pick someone she can continue on with and help her work through her grief.

Yes, I have abused her and for that I will carry guilt for the rest of my life. I currently hate myself.
I think part of me wants to get caught.

Don't get caught - that will rock her world.  You can't take back yesterday, but you can do the best you can going forward.

Sometimes divorce is the best answer for an untenable marriage, but I am for people exploring their options before divorce. My concern --you have either been in limerence or grieving the loss of a lover since you arrived on this board... //... My thought is, once again, begin therapy for yourself and see what you learn.  

I agree with Wickerman and others on this. Our #1 mission here is Preserve the Family. The more marriages repaired, the more mother/child relationships reconnected, the more children we help grow up in a loving home, the better.

As I'm sure you have read recently, AA is taking heat lately for its low percentage of alcoholic recovery... .in the single digits. Yet, many of us know alcoholics who went down that path and succeeded. The VA did a study and found a 30-40% success rate in people who made a meeting every week for a year. Those that recover are a small minority at AA that work very hard at it.  The majority are less serious about sobriety.

Do you have the heart to work on it? If you are going to make a marriage work (or even give it a serious try), the first step is to clear the deck of any affairs or female confidants. Zero. There have been very few months in your marriage that you weren't emotionally distracted by seeking, courting, grieving another women. T

[formflier]

 The majority are less serious about sobriety.

This was my experience as well in active duty Navy.  I was in charge of the program that evaluated and treated (if needed) Sailors with alcohol issues.

Sadly, those with serious issues, when we got to the point of choosing alcohol or staying in the Navy... .well, 100% went with alcohol.  (about 10 people total in my experience)

RF

This relates to your situation in the following way.

I recommend that you and your wife work through the question in therapy of what to do with your marriage. Each of you personally needs to work through the issue of "what choice am I willing to make"

I can't imagine this question being worked through successfully without professional guidance.  

Thoughts?

FF

[Wicker Man]

Skip wrote:

Our #1 mission here is Preserve the Family.

I apparently have been inadvertently following the mission statement... .(yay me... .)

My hope is to offer my anecdotal experience and perhaps allow you to avoid some of the devastation I have seen.  To perhaps allow you to avoid being ripped out of a sound sleep with the feeling of 'What have I done'.  My 3am epiphany (romantic way of saying minor breakdown) likely saved me from a terrible decision of life altering magnitude.  I.e. Leaving my marriage and starting a family with my lover in Asia... .  At the time and in my addled emotional state this all had seemed like a wonderful idea -it likely was not.

I work in the film industry and amongst my friends the divorce rate is well over 200%.  Divorce should remain a tool of last resort.

The reason I keep suggesting you find a therapist is out of concern you may be operating in a skewed emotional state. One should neither divorce nor stay married out of guilt. 

If you decide to stay married it will likely be diabolically difficult to find intimacy again with your wife -it has been for us.  However, we are now beginning to have enough stability, since the disclosure of my affair, for us to open a dialogue about intimacy.  If we are able to have a sex life it will not be what I experienced with my lover, but with luck it will be enough.  Life is full of compromise and I believe my marriage offers enough benefits to out weight the liabilities -there is no such thing as fairy tale love.  It all comes down to a cost benefit analysis and a lot of hard work in my opinion.

When my wife asked for reconciliation she asked me point blank if I had been with someone else and I told her yes.  As I mentioned previously whether to disclose or not is a judgement call, but since we were at the 11th hour in our divorce I felt it was best.  We were literally one signature away.  I had already rented 2 apartments (here and abroad) and one of our homes was about to be listed for sale.  Whether you decide to divorce or not seek professional council and do some soul searching before you tell your wife about your affair(s). 

I find it fascinating (horrible) there is nothing written about the difficulty for the betraying partner to return to his marriage on an intimate level.  Everything I have been able to find is from the perspective of the betrayed.  My wife has to deal with the image of my having been with another woman -I have to deal with 25 years of rejection at home and having been with someone who enjoyed my physical companionship.  I took the indulgence of this digression as a case in point.  Marriage is hard work -always.  Affairs are rocky but by comparison 'easy'.

I spent the weekend crawling around in the attic installing lighting fixtures and then cooked dinner for us.  She spent the day doing laundry and organizing the craft room beneath the new lights. -this is marriage as I know it.  Romantic? No -but very warm and in its own way quite lovely.

Wicker Man

[Cat Familiar]

RF,

Can you imagine your life 5 years from now? Let's say you've decided to divorce. How could you have made this process as easy as possible for your wife?

Or on the other hand, let's say that you really took a look at all the positives in your marriage and what you would lose should you end it and you decided to stay and improve things with your wife. How did you do that?

Cat