looking for help

[415]

needing help

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Purplex]

Welcome to the family 415! 

Would you mind telling us a bit more about what brought you here?
How can we help you?

[415]

sorry i was just trying to figure out the process here as i am new.  My wife of 11 years has BPD.  Unfortunately she's probably just finding this out now as she is at our therapist.   She left the home/marriage last week after months of basically taking a vacation from the marriage while still living in the house.  Many accusations, angry approaches to almost anything distressing.   Basically classic BPD from what i am now starting to read.  Almost 5 months ago she went to a psychic who told her that she thinks that i am gay (i'm not), and that i was just using her as a cover so my parents wouldn't find out.   Since she's always been suspicious of something, she believed it and hasn't even held my hand since.  Hopefully her therapy appointment went well but still in a state of unknowing.

[Purplex]

Don't worry the site can indeed be a bit hard to navigate sometimes. Feel free to ask questions, technical or otherwise.

It sounds like you have a lot to deal with right now. There are a lot of people on this board who went through similar stuff and can relate. You are not alone.

Almost 5 months ago she went to a psychic who told her that she thinks that i am gay (i'm not), and that i was just using her as a cover so my parents wouldn't find out.   Since she's always been suspicious of something, she believed it and hasn't even held my hand since

This is awful! I'm sorry you have to go through all this.

So your wife is at the therapist's right now? Are you going to meet up afterwards?

She left the home/marriage last week

What does that mean? Does she want a divorce?

[415]

We've only been to 2 therapy sessions together (more separately).  She met me (drove separatey) and in the session disclosed that she felt like she needed to separate and that she had a bag packed in the car.  The therapist supported her knowing she needed some time and told her to take more than a few days, maybe 3, maybe a week.  She didn't contact me for 8 days and i finally reached out after I saw my therapist again where he made the BPD diagnosis and i encouraged her to go see him at least once more (so she could hear the diagnosis).  She agreed.  During the 8 days of no contact she had come to the house without warning and removed some of her stuff, including picture frames, etc.  Since i never have a clear indication of what she is doing i asked her if she had made a decision on working on the marriage or leaving it, and whether she was coming back to get the rest of her belongings.  After a ew accusations of everything being my fault she said that she would meet with the therapist and then maybe we could talk after.   The session ended 4hrs ago.  I'm not expecting her to leave the session and immediately call me, in fact depending on how it went i think she should actually take some time to digest it, or maybe she just took it as an attack (common) and is angry.  As for divorce... .i don't know.  I can only speculate yes because her coping mechanism is to run.   I met her when i was 30 and she 33 and i'm her 4th husband.  To be fair one of those passed away but that one is a whole other story that has contributed to her view of life.

[Purplex]

What do you want to do moving forward? Reach out to her? Give her space?

Until you hear from her I encourage you to take a look at the tips and tools on this site, so that you are better equipped to deal with her once things have calmed down a bit. I find the workshops to be especially insightful. https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?board=36.0

Maybe you come across something that could be helpful in your interactions with her?

[415]

i really don't know what to do/want.  I've been trying to save the marriage but she's off in her own world.  It's a common observation of mine that she never makes herself part of the solution.  A few other common traits she has is that she feels everything is someone else's fault,  that she's being judged, criticized, etc.   She's has an "all or none"  way of thinking so if one thing is bothering her then the whole relationship, job, etc. needs to be discarded.  I'm beginning to see that other people have similar views as i do in the sense that they love their spouse, are trying to make it work but you just can't make them see logic and paths forward.  She works out of our home but she's applying for jobs (had to learn that from my sister) and looking for a place to live, so if we do reconcile it probably won't be for a while.  I don't think she likes therapy because the therapist doesn't just tell her that she's right.   She even said that she didn't want to go back because she felt attacked.  I told her that he has to ask real questions to get the answers he needs to help.  She's also in a duo music group, her and another guy which is now her best friend.  Up until last week, he comes over to our house probably 4x/wk and practices for hours as they are just getting on their feet and booking gigs.  I like the guy but he, like my wife, has a mom that has passed, was bullied as a child, thinks he's ugly, and is also a musician.   Spending all of that time bonding with him in our basement worries me especially since our marriage is almost over (or maybe is).  Strange thing is is that if i ever spent 15 mins with another woman she's freak out.  I've noticed 3x just in the last year where on Friday night she'll say "l love you so much, please never leave me, i don't know what i'd do without you"  by Sunday she's threatened to leave me.  We've been together for 11yrs and up until she saw the "psychic" we'd still hold hands in the car driving to the grocery store.  The hardest part is that my rational brain is trying to analyze what is going on and nothing computes as it doesn't make sense.  She could literally call me today and feel remorse and want to work on the marriage or she could call and say that we're completely over.  I feel frozen, like i don't want to contact her to push her away and i don't want to leave it.  I think i brought in 5pgs of point form examples to my therapist of what she's done that would support a mental illness.  If a friend of mine showed me that same list and told me that's what his wife does, i'd tell him to get out.  Don't know why i can't.  I think of all of the incredible good times and feel like its worth salvaging.  She looks at the few bad times and sees a situation to flee.

[Purplex]

I'm beginning to see that other people have similar views as i do in the sense that they love their spouse, are trying to make it work but you just can't make them see logic and paths forward.

Yes this is something a lot of members here can relate to. The inability to take responsibility and sensitivity to citicism, the black and white thinking , the jealousy issues and the repeated threats of leaving are topics that come up quite often on this board. We support each other, share information and tools and try to put each other into a position, where we can make an informed decision about how to proceed. And sometimes we just need the opportunity to vent to an audience who understands and doesn't judge.

Unfortunately, we have to accept that their brains are wired differently then ours and that we can't change our partner's perceptions, behaviors or thoughts, especially if they are unwilling or unable to cooperate. But we can change how we deal with them and try to clean up our side of the street. This is what the information and tools are for, not only to get a better understanding of what is going on with our partner, but also to identify our own potential contribution to the problem. We can better our ability to problem solve, communicate or set boundaries. And these tools are not only helpful for our BPD relationship but also valuable life skills, that can come in handy at any time.

Are you going to continue seeing your therapist? I think we can only benefit from accepting all the support that is available.

She works out of our home but she's applying for jobs (had to learn that from my sister) and looking for a place to live, so if we do reconcile it probably won't be for a while.

How do you feel about her possibly moving out?

[415]

I am definitely going to continue to see my therapist.  I actually started seeing him a week or so after she told me that she thought i could be gay and that she doesn't know if she wants to be married anymore.   A couple days after something frustrating happened again at work so i decided to take a medical leave(early Sept), partly to get away from work but mostly because i was alarmed at losing my marriage and i decided that nothing would get in the way even my job.  My GP referred me to the therapist to deal with the work leave.  Soon after i met him the "how's your marriage question?" came up.   I don't think I/we have dealt with work since.  Since she has displayed even more confusing behavior lately, hasn't been contacting me (she usually texts me all day long), and is looking for job/new place I have taken the last two days to pack her stuff and move it to the garage.  That's hard to do.  I keep thinking in disbelief that "I am packing my wife's things because she's leaving".  Or that i still remember helping her pack some of these boxes when she was moving in with me 11 yrs ago.  I don't even feel like i'm losing an 11yr relationship because for me marriage is forever, so my thoughts are that i'm losing a possible 50yr relationship.  All the future plans are gone. A lot of memories that i cherish but seems to not matter to her because she can only focus on negative.

Her reasons:  she cites lack of intimacy on my part.  I don't necessarily disagree but i feel that's a symptom of the environment and not the cause.  You can't have constant threats to leave (i've been left before), anger, stress, accusation and seemingly no involvement in any decision, big or small and then expect me to be constantly wanting her sexually all of the time.  She claims that she has a super high sex drive, yet goes to our GP and tells him she has no sex drive which he confirms though diagnostic tests.
She says I pulled away first and that's why she threatens.  That's completely delusional.  Might sound weird but i have a really good memory and she doesn't seem to remember some things at all.  I remember her threatening me in the first couple weeks and me being shocked by it.  She also cites that i have anxiety and depression.   Not arguing but again she's afraid of everything from opening mail, to math/numbers, being judged, criticized, etc etc.  And she's often depressed.

Sorry, i'm obviously still in vent mode

I also tend to think what if i knew about this years ago.   She has a job in the home (hair extensions, hair replacement for women) that makes everyone feel great.  She has hundreds of facebook "friends" and clients that say how beautiful she is and that she's such an Angel.  However the financial management stresses her, the inventory management stresses her, and then she is the counsellor to all of these women that sit in her chair all day talking about their pending divorce, or that they are cheating on their husband, or that they've found out that their husband is secretly gay, etc, etc. and I think that all goes to her head and becomes a possiblity for her.   Had i known what she has i would've gotten her out of that job.  I would've changed how i interact/approach her, i would've gotten her into therapy etc.   It's hard to deal with the what ifs when you only find out that she's BPD after she leaves.

Misc:  While i was on medical leave (mid-sep - Jan 10th) my dog of 17years died (in my arms).  We don't have kids, we had him.   I cried and cried and one day threw a piece of wood in my garage (while by myself) because i was so upset.   My wife told my sister that i have a strange way of grieving.  My dog was instantly loved by my wife.  She loved him like crazy.  For the last 3 years while she's been working at home he's been by her side.  We're those people who will go through the Starbucks drive though and order our dog something, put his name in songs, etc.   When he died she barely cried.  She hugged me maybe twice stating that she was just giving me space because "that's what she does".    But its not about her.  Her dog died and her husband can barely catch his breath from crying and she just sat there.   Same experience when her mom died last year. Her mom was probably THE #1cause of BPD, yet she just went out and got a tattoo to "honour" her 2 weeks ago, while she was still living in our home but didn't tell me.  I told her that "its nice"... .she has that in writing on text but a day later she tells her bandmate that I hate it.  ?

[Purplex]

She says I pulled away first and that's why she threatens.

This is a common behavior for people with BPD. Their fear of abandonment gets triggered very easily and even by seemingly insignificant events. They often cope with that by withdrawing. It's a (dysfunctional) protection mechanism: If they are the first to leave, they can't be abandoned anymore. And their emotions are facts for them, so they act on it. It doesn't matter if you never even considered leaving them in the first place.
These decisions are usually not final though and they often try to reconnect at some point.
Does this make sense?

 

She also cites that i have anxiety and depression.   Not arguing but again she's afraid of everything from opening mail, to math/numbers, being judged, criticized, etc etc.  And she's often depressed.

This sounds like textbook projection. https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=70931.0
Would you agree?

It's hard to deal with the what ifs when you only find out that she's BPD after she leaves.

This is an issue many of us are struggling with.There probably are things we could have done differently. But would that really have changed the big picture? There are two people involved in this relationship and even if you had taken another approach her issues would still have been present in one way or the other. You did your best at the time with the knowledge you had and maybe there will be a chance to reconcile and choose a different path in the future.

I am so sorry about your dog! It sounds like he was a very precious family member and his loss must have been devastating. It's so sad that you couldn't share your grief with your wife. Locking away emotions can be a way of coping with traumatizing situations, not saying that this is necessarily the case with your wife, but it would be an explanation for her detached reaction.

[415]

that makes sense.  i've always thought that she threatens to leave as protection.  i think she's even admitted it.  its just so strange/sad that you'd destroy a relationship due wanting that person NOT to leave you.   I guess that's why its a disorder.

I'm sure that it is projection.  It's difficult to be blamed for something that you feel she does in excess.

I've messaged her about 20 mins ago to see if we can start some kind of dialogue.

I'm still in that tug of war with reconciling.  Still knowing that i really love her and measuring that against awful things that she has done.   I'll need to know if she's had an affair as that's a deal breaker for me.   I'm sure there is something on this message board but in your experience her, what does reconciliation look like?   Do they usually take a while to come back?  Can they get noticeably better with therapy?  Is it more often than not a short term "fix" then regression to old ways?  Not sure what i'm hoping for.  If an affair has taken place then i have a definite answer of what i'll do but only with increased pain.  If she wants to work on it then I have hope with a real fear.

[Purplex]

I've messaged her about 20 mins ago to see if we can start some kind of dialogue.

I'll need to know if she's had an affair as that's a deal breaker for me.

Is this what you want to adress with her in case she is open for a coversation? Is there anything else you want to bring up?
In my experience it can be helpful to have a general idea of what issues are important to you right now and have a plan at hand how to adress them calmly without encouraging additional conflict.

I'm sure there is something on this message board but in your experience her, what does reconciliation look like?   Do they usually take a while to come back?

I'm afraid there is no general answer to that. Every relationship is unique and you are the expert on yours. What do you think? How could reconciliation look like in your situation? Best case, worst case?
When or if they come back is also hard to predict. As a rule of thumb, past behavior is the best predictor for future behavior. If you look at your wifes past behavior, what do you think she is likely to do?

Can they get noticeably better with therapy?  Is it more often than not a short term "fix" then regression to old ways?

This is my personal experience and other members might disagree, but yes, if they are really committed to therapy there can be very noticable long-term improvements.
 

Not sure what i'm hoping for.

Maybe we can help you figure this out. And whatever you decide to do in the end, we can offer support either way.

[415]

thanks for the support.  As for the affair thing.  I agree that not being confrontational right now is important.  I'm also worried that if she did, then there is no more dialogue to have other than when she's picking up her things.   It's now been 3hrs since i messaged her and i've recently sent a follow up.  She never not has her phone by her side.   Since she is the one that threw a bomb into the relationship i'm dissapointed at best that she won't even deal with simple questions.    My question to her was "How did your therapy session go?, How are you feeling? Do you want to talk?".    Nothing back.   Up until the day she left she used to text me all day, even while i was at work.   She'd text me all day everyday but then hardly talk to me at home.   Probably the loneliness/abandonment thing.

[Purplex]

Since she is the one that threw a bomb into the relationship i'm dissapointed at best that she won't even deal with simple questions.

Maybe she is still processing the diagnosis and everything that happened over the last weeks? It's possible that she really has no answers to your questions right now. Still no excuse for the silent treatment of course. You have every reason to be frustrated and angry. Just wanted to throw this out there.

[415]

just curious of your experience on something.  how do BPD's usually react to role reversal so to speak.  What if i were to stop waiting for her to determine our outcome whenever she feels like it and said that I'm done instead.  I'm not there yet, i'm still just learning about this, i still can't even imagine telling the person that i've been in love with for 11yrs that i'm done.  I know from experience that if i ignore her she'd all of a sudden be interested in me, text me, talk to me etc.  That even takes a lot for me to do because treating my wife unkindly is just not me.

[Harri]

Hi!  I want to join Purplex in saying hello.  I also want to say that I am so sorry about your beloved dog.  That is a big loss to deal with on top of what is going on with your relationship.

What if i were to stop waiting for her to determine our outcome whenever she feels like it and said that I'm done instead.

Don't say you want to end the relationship as a means to try to get her back.  Only say it if you mean it.   

I know from experience that if i ignore her she'd all of a sudden be interested in me, text me, talk to me etc.  That even takes a lot for me to do because treating my wife unkindly is just not me.

This is classic with push / pull behaviors.  People will push others away when they fear being engulfed and then when you let up they will try to pull you back due to their fear of abandonment.  I make it sound like it is deliberate but all the fears and emotions that are driving the behaviors are just under the surface.  pwBPD (people with BPD) tend to be fear driven and NPD is a disorder of emotional regulation.

When she is dysregulated like this, step back and give her space and room to try to self soothe.  The harder we try to pull them in, or get them to answer our questions, or even talk with us, the more they want to push us away. 

[415]

my wife finally contacted me.  Kaboom!  It doesn't sound like the therapist specifically told her that she has BPD, but the rest of the note also doesn't make sense so i'm not sure what to believe.  Her comments (italics) and my thoughts are as follows:
1."I am not sure why you booked me an appointment for me with the therapist". I didn't, i had texted her to tell her that he had left 2 messages for her b/c he wanted to see her.

2. "he (therapist) said that he received an email from you that i wouldn't like... .he didn't even really go into the stuff that you mentioned... .but said you were mostly blaming me and you weren't taking any responsibility at all".  I had sent the therapist an email outlining all of the things that she has done to possibly support a mental illness rather that just she and i having different views.   I didn't refuse any responsibility and the therapist even said to me that none of this is my fault so don't think that is it.  If he didn't share the contents of the letter with her then how would she know that i'm blaming her?

3. "I have been extremely devoted to you... .never been a partier... .never a drinker... .never a druggie... .never cheated... .i simply have been feeling empty for years and that our level of intimacy has been off for years... .i just want to move on and find happiness eventually... .i am working on myself because i know that i'm not perfect".   Now that i am educating myself on BPD i notice the victim talk, the projection onto me and the feeling of emptiness.

4. She says "the therapist didn't give her any strategies.   She says that she "has no job, no money, no nothing so if i want to slam her down with asking her for money then i'll probably check myself into a hospital".   She has plenty of money, mostly due to my help.  I'll never ask her for money.  I have more than she and i'm actually in a vulnerable spot for her to take what i have, i.e the house is in my name and was paid off before we met.

5. She tells me to "please understand that i'm not out to get you".  Not only am i not our to get her but i've been the one kicked to the corner of the marriage trying to get her collaborate on repairing it.

We left it with her asking if we could continue the conversation this afternoon which i agreed.  I am grateful for some of the tools that i've learned from this site.  I responded with kindness and reassurance rather than trying to defend myself or trying to contradict what she thinks that she heard.   I do have a therapist tomorrow.   I'm confused at what to do.  My initial reaction is to tell her that she has BPD and try to get her to look at the explanation and try to get her to consider it because i don't believe anyone is going to get better if they don't understand what they are dealing with.  On the other hand i'm not an expert on how to approach someone whose initial reaction might be to get angry, deny and blame.  I really wish that the therapist would've flat out told her what he thinks she has and offered a plan to start support.   My wife still hangs on to the reason that she has pulled away is due to the lack of intimacy.  I disagree and feel like her disorder has obviously been there since childhood and any pull back from me was due to living in constant anger, tension, blame.  

My wife's underlying issues include:
1.Constant critisism by her mom (who passed away last year).   She talked to her mom on the phone 3-5x every day and now she's lost that.  But its a very love/hate relationship
2. Her only sister is 17yrs older and she is afraid of her.  Won't stand up to anything she says and what the sister says goes.  Now they are trying to keep in touch as they were both co-dependent on their mom, which they both lost.
3. She was bullied as a child and called ugly
4. She was raped at 14.  Her mom's reaction was to slap her in the face.   She was also slapped when burned her own hand on a hot pan.
5. She left the house at 17 to get away from her mom
6. She married soon after only to get it annullment (i don't know anything else about it)
7. She was engaged to her high school sweetheart.  He got cancer and ultimately passed away.  While he was sick he used her credit card and ran up gambling debt, leaving her with bills from wedding planning and credit debt.  She had to declare bankrupsy.
8. She had ~ 8 miscarriages with her third husband.  She seems to be able to get pregnant but she has an inverted uterus, and perhaps due to some surgery after rape.  She claims he kicked her out due to her not able to give him kids but she had also said that they were in the process of adopting and stopped it when their marriage broke down.  I'd speculate that it is more likely that she is blaming him and she really just left.
9. I'm her 4th husband, who she is leaving
10. She is a singer that was signed to a recording contract.  They moved her across the country and ultimately misused the money and that opportunity collapsed (however her common problem in my opinion is that she relies on everyone else to create happiness, success, etc for her and she doesn't become part of the solution).
11.  Her dad which was her best friend and opposite of her mom died 15 years ago.  Her mom deserted her (family pattern) and left her to deal with scrubbing her dads blood out of the carpet (where he fell and hit his head), selling their condo, and all that comes with responsibilites after death.

She has a lot to deal with.   I feel so sad for her and us.  If love could fix it she'd be fixed a long time ago.  I want her to embrace the diagnosis as an opportunity to finally have a label, and to understand that this truly isn't her fault, to have the gift of getting rid of 40+ years of toxicity and to live a life of love and peace.  It's almost like building a sandcastle on the beach, but as soon as you get somewhere a wave comes in and tears it down.  Sorry for the ramble.

[Purplex]

It doesn't sound like the therapist specifically told her that she has BPD,

Telling somebody that they have BPD can be a very difficult task to navigate, even for professionals. It has to be done in a way that doesn't come across condescending or critical and maybe the therapist didn't feel like the sitiation was suited to approch the topic without affronting her. I would also advise you to not bring up the diagnosis yourself and leave it to the therapist if possible, for the reasons you mentioned. Here is more information on that in case you didn't read it yet: https://bpdfamily.com/content/how-to-get-borderline-into-therapy .

Now that i am educating myself on BPD i notice the victim talk, the projection onto me and the feeling of emptiness

It can be such a relief to recognize those patterns and finally have an explanation for those irrational and hurtful behaviors. It's the first step in finding a strategy to cope with them in a healthy way.

I'm glad that you find the tools helpful and were already able to succesfully use them. The more we practice them the more naturally they come.

I hope and wish you the best for your conversation in the afternoon. Keep us updated!

[415]

saw my therapist.  apparently he asked my wife 3x what she wants to do and maintains that it is over between us.  I said that i wished she'd tell me that.  He is going to call her to tell her to be honest and let me know.  I don't recognize her.  The therapist says that it is all her fault no matter what she believes but that i'm logical/rational and she doesn't think that way which is why i'm so frustrated.  I feel like i'm watching my wife walk off of a cliff and i can't get to her.  I should be mad.  I'm just sad.  I miss the person that was in between the accusations and anger.   She worked at the same place as where i work for 9 yrs.  Everyone loves her there.  I am closer to her family than mine.  It doesn't help that she's telling everyone that the reason is my lack of intimacy when its not.

[Purplex]

I am so sorry that things turned out that way. Your therapist is right in that for her, feelings are facts and she acts on them, no matter how irrational they are. But I understand that no explanation can reduce your frustration and disappointment at the moment. It's devastating to witness a loved one walk away and unconciously sabotage their lives without beeing able to help. This is an experience many of us are trying to cope with and if you look around on these boards you will find a lot of stories that are similar to yours. We are here if you want to talk, vent or just need a shoulder to lean on. I really hope we can offer a safety net for you and keep supporting you with everything you are going through right now.

[415]

i am also curious about another thing.  my wife constantly had some sort of body pain.   We've been to every hospital in the city.   The doctors rarely ever find anything and if they due it's nothing to worry about, but she always worried about something bad was happening to her.  For example we went to the hospital with her thinking that she was having a brain aneurysm, which turned our to be just a headache.  If it was stomach pain she'd think it was stomach cancer, etc.   She's had pain in almost every area of her body at some point.   I always believed her that she was in pain.  She would always say "don't think i'm lying"... .which i always reassured her that i wasn't.  I think someone in her past questioned whether she truly had anything wrong when these episodes arose... .so fear of criticism again.   My question is, is this in line with other BPD experiences?  Do others constantly have unexplained pain like this.

[Purplex]

Interesting question! My BPDbf is very susceptible to body pain as well. He often complains about head or stomach ache, sore muscles or back and small cuts or bruises are a pretty big deal for him. PwBPD are often very sensitive people in general, so it makes sense to me that not only their emotions are amplyfied, but also their pain perception. It might seem like he is overreacting, but I try to accept his feelings as a fact. I let him lament for a bit, validate his pain, offer my help and carefully propose solutions or try to distract him, depending on the problem. Most importantly I do my best to keep patient and composed, to help him calm down and reassure him that things are going to be fine. This worked pretty well so far.

I'm not sure if this is a common issue with BPD, so I'm very interested if other members can relate to that as well!

[415]

my therapist did say that the constant body pain is due to BPD and also that she very rarely if ever apologizes, but i just haven't come across those 2 issues on this board.  I got together with my wife last night after 2 weeks to talk.   This is the first time we've seen each other since i was told that she is BPD.  I can really see it now.  I got permission from our therapist to discuss BPD with her as i felt like i am used to her reactions and that i could present it in a way that might make her listen.  To her credit she did.   I wrote a letter to her and had her read it while i was with her.  I thought that that way she could re-read it on her own and really consider it rather than me tripping over my words and her feeling attacked.  I included a print-out of the explanation from the Mayo Clinic, an article of how BPD affects relationships and one that was written from the view point of a pwBPD so she had that perspective instead of just receiving documents that look like i'm trying to diagnose her.   I encouraged her to go back to our therapist at my expense and get confirmation, discuss how it affects her and others and his recommendation for therapy... .again just so she didn't feel that it was me diagnosing her.  I did get both blamed for things that i disagreed with and accused of blaming her and not taking any responsibilty for anything.  I was also asked whether i was going to work on my problems.  In the end, she did say that she'll look at what i gave her and i thanked her and left it at that as that is understandably a lot for her to take in all at once.  I went there fully expecting to have her say that we should start the divorce process.  I asked where we were at as she left the house and is not communicating.  She maintains that we're "separated".  I can tell that she's very confused and overwhelmed with every part of her life even if she doesn't know it.  We'll see where it goes.  I feel like i see the "splitting" aspect when she'll throw away the whole relationship without seeking counsellling because she doesn't know how things could possibly get better.   I keep trying to explain that the people that go to marriage counselling go there because they need help and that they often go there feeling similar to what she feels, but more importantly they often get the tools/perspective to create the changes that they want.

[415]

another question i have is is it acceptable to tell other people that she has a disorder that affect her way of thinking and interpreting events.  Understandably people are shocked at her leaving.  Many people know both of us.  I feel a strong push to "defend" myself, especially when her reasons for leaving are in my opinion not correct, or at least not a reason to leave without attempting to work on.

[Purplex]

In my opinion a mental illness or any other illness for that matter, is something very personal that should be disclosed to others only if the person gave her permission or is open to talk about it herself, unless somebody is directly affected by it. I really understand your need to explain the situation but I think without her agreeing this could backfire and might very well be percieved as a breach of trust. I think it would be better to avoid putting a lable on it. Maybe focus on your side of the story,  explain your perspective on the issues like you did in your post and let them draw their own conclusions.
What do you think? 

[415]

sounds good.  I don't even know where we are now.  She took the BPD info to the therapist that she saw a couple times before starting with our current therapist.   She said that that therapist told her she wasn't BPD.   She might be qualified but she's been practicing for 5 yrs vs our therapist's 31yrs.  The therapist said that her own sister is BPD and she is addicted to pain meds, so that and a few other things that didn't make sense tells her that she's not BPD.  I strongly disagree, but now we're back to being my fault and that I'm just blaming everything on something she doesn't have.  I also replied w 2 emails yesterday and she hasn't gotten back.  We literally went from her replying to me within minutes, or more often than not texting me all day, to her leaving the house/marriage and not getting back to me for a week.  It's just too opposite from her behavior of 11 years.

[Harri]

this thread reached the post limit and has been locked.  Please feel free to start a new thread.