break up advice

[LS]

I've been in a relationship for 7 months with a guy that I'm pretty sure has BPD.  After missing a lot of early red flags, about 2 months in he started being emotionally abusive and controlling.  (Raging at me over insignificant things, long diatribes about all the horrible things I do like leaving my razor in the shower, gaslighting).  He repeatedly threatened to break up with me and finally I had enough at the beginning of January and said I wanted to break up too.  I tried to do it 3 times after he got super angry but somehow he always talked me out of it.  Then about one month ago I learned he lied about so many things that he told me.  Some stuff about his past like playing a sport in college and going on various trips. One lie was that he owned a business (and that he went to work there every day).  He made me feel guilty about a lot of things related to his business, including that he spent so much time having to clean up after me / trying to spend time with me that he was neglecting his business and it was losing money.  He told me he lost $10,000  by going to visit my family for over a week during the holidays (I live very far away).  He said that once his business started doing better he would help with me more household expenses. 

The biggest problem with just leaving is that about 4 months in we bought a condo.  Everything is in my name (title, mortgage, etc.), but he put a significant amount of money down.

I told him I learned of the lie and that we were not a good match and there was no future and I wanted to break up.  He had a response to everything (e.g., people fall in and out of love all the time).  ANd also said he had nowhere to go and would be homeless and his family would reject him for failing in our relationship because they told him not to put money into the condo.  I've offered to pay him all the money back that he put down once he is out (it's all my savings, but I have a good job and can manage).

He cried and was very dramatic and then threatened suicide and tied a noose in our bedroom.  He kept saying he was going to kill himself until I said I would give him one month to prove himself to me and us stay living in our apartment broken up.

The one month is almost over.  I don't want to get back together with him.  Our entire relationship was built on lies and he tore me down like no one ever has.  I know this relationship is bad for me.  At the same time, I care about him and don't want him to hurt himself.  I recognize that I cannot control whether he commits suicide or not.  And I think it's probably a bluff.  I tried to get him to see a therapist during the month but he has refused and only texts with a crisis hotline (said he needed baby steps).  I'm also just scared of the extreme drama and the not knowing what he will do.

Anyway, I'm terrified of the actual break up and not sure how to handle it.  Any advice or thoughts would be great.

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[boatingwoman]

Any time someone vocalizes a suicide threat, you must call 911 because that is what is in everyone’s best interest.

[Harri]

Your thread has been split - you will get different advice on the conflicting board here: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=334208.0

[Skip]

The biggest problem with just leaving is that about 4 months in we bought a condo.  Everything is in my name (title, mortgage, etc.), but he put a significant amount of money down.

It sounds like you have a fair reimbursement plan in place and also have legal remedy to move him out, so you are in a strong position. The question is whether you are really finished (he doesn't believe you are), and if you are, what is the best handle the situation, emotionally, between the two of you.

If the relationship has been rocky and there has been ongoing talk of breaking up, when the actual break up comes, its not unusual for one or both partners to be desensitized to it.

Additionally, I think the best way to say that we are through is to not to make it conditional. When you say I am breaking up because you failed me, it often evokes a desire by the other party to repair the failing.  In a sense, you are hitting him with a double whammy - breaking up and devaluing/shaming him at the same time - for good reason, but from his perspective, he is dealing with a double whammy.

So my advice/question is, are you sure you are done? I know you are mad and I know you feel violated, but if he fixes these things, and you have time to heal, are you still interested? This is a really important question - and maybe a hard one. What do you think.

If you are done, then I think you should try to make him as emotionally whole as you are making him financially whole... .tell him what is good about him and at the same time, that you are no longer in love... .that you really like him, but you are not in love anymore.

I'd also set a firm moveout date, give him some of the cash upfront so that he can get another place, pay the balance when he leave, and let him know that you will use the sheriff if need be, but you don't want to do that at all.

Does this help?

[LS]

That does help, thank you. I am sure that I want it to be over. He continues to tell me detailed lies on a daily basis, will not see a therapist in person, and I just plain hate drama (which I know will inevitably occur).   He is being very nice now and I see glimpses of the person I fell in love with.  That said, when things got really, really bad, I fell out of love with him.  When I broke up with a few weeks ago and tried to make it  permanent, and told him I didn’t love him anymore, he kept saying people fall in and out of love and to give him a chance.  I guess that is part of why I want to also tell him that I know he is still lying to me about things.  I think the other parts are to alieve some of my guilt and because I have a really hard time not telling the truth and that is a big part of why I do not want to try with him.   On the other hand, I really do care for him and want him to be okay.  I understand the point about not wanting him to feel attacked.  But I also think it may be helpful if he faved the reality that he is lying about other things (like the job lie, these are ones that he regularly tells to his friends and acquaintances). 

I guess knowing more details, what do you think on bringing up these lies along with the I don’t love you anymore?

[Q-DawgVFR]

I'm no expert on what to share / not share.

But for any subject, there is usually a way to get a point across: it isn't necessarily WHAT you say but HOW you deliver the message... .

I am thinking to recent conversation with my kids and how wife and I broke the news to them that she was moving out for a while.  A simplified version of the truth did the trick there.  It left out some details that would have been hurtful for them to hear, while getting the important facts to them in a way they could relate to.  I think the message that was delivered was appropriate.

Since a lot of pwBPD have similarities to children with their emotional development, perhaps a similar approach would work?

How much you should tell him, probably you are the best to judge that.  Ask yourself what points you really want to deliver, what is necessary to get the message across.  Does it all serve a purpose? Is it compassionate?  It might be necessary to deliver news they don't want to hear (why you are leaving) but sometimes less information is better.  If he's continuing to lie and not willing to admit those things, then it might not serve either of you to get into it further on that subject.

I always think the truth or some simplified version of it is preferable to giving BS reasons when delivering hard news.

I don't know.  Just thinking aloud and throwing an opinion out there.

[Skip]

I want to also tell him that I know he is still lying to me about things.  I
think the other parts are to alieve some of my guilt and
because I have a really hard time not telling the truth and that is a big part of why I do not want to try with him.  

OK, so you are angry with him (in addition to being done) and you want to express that anger. You also feel that you would feel less guilty because he deserves this based on his behavior and you want him to see that it is his fault. I understand your thought. You could make a list of all the things you don't like and give it to him (include not liking his cologne   ). I only say this to accentuate the point. When we are done, we are focused on the negative.

Leaving a relationship is hard. We can leave with grace... .and so much of what you are suggesting financially is so very graceful. Or we can leave and let the other person know they deserve it, didn't earn the love. It will add to their frustration, complicate the detachment as they defend their dignity,  and eventually make them angry that we put them down at the end.

Think of a state trooper giving a speeding ticket... .how nice he is. He never says, you're lying to me, you deserve this, etc. Why? Because it just makes the driver push back more and complicates the matter with no possible upside.

So, anyway, those are the two sides of this. What is your highest priority? Getting out a cleanly as possible, or establishing cause and accountability.

I understand the point about not wanting him to feel attacked.  But I also think it may be helpful if he faved the reality that he is lying about other things (like the job lie, these are ones that he regularly tells to his friends and acquaintances).  

I guess knowing more details, what do you think on bringing up these lies along with the I don’t love you anymore?

Go take a look on our detaching board at the members who were giving reasons for the breakup (i don't trust you, your not a man, you... .) Some struggle for years with the ego wound... .sometimes it more painful than the loss of the relationship.  The message is... ."I know you love me and want to continue, but I don't love you anymore, because you are defective, and you deserve to have your heart broken and what ever other consequences you face."

You hold all the guns/power here... .the house, the money, the ability to walk away.

Ask yourself what points you really want to deliver, what is necessary to get the message across.  Does it all serve a purpose? Is it compassionate?  It might be necessary to deliver news they don't want to hear (why you are leaving) but sometimes less information is better.  If he's continuing to lie and not willing to admit those things, then it might not serve either of you to get into it further on that subject.

I always think the truth or some simplified version of it is preferable to giving BS reasons when delivering hard news. You sound like you will be fine in the end.

All good points Q-DawgVFR.

There is no single answer. I look forward to what others have to say.

[LS]

Thank you.  I think that it makes sense e less is more and being compassionate. 

I am not really even angry about the lies anymore (I know he has serious issues and is not lying to hurt me), it's more frustrating because he is so focused on the one major lie that I confronted him about and how that one lie was the cause of all his anger/stress/acting out.  He keeps saying with the lie out of the way he will be different (but of course, he is still lying to me).  I think I just need to let this go (apart from reminding myself of why I cannot stay with him).

I guess my number one goal is having a final break with the least damage to him and I need to focus on that.  I have a lot of anxiety with the actual break-up because I know he is going to push hard for me to stay with him,  have a response/counter point to everything, beg me not to do it, and threaten suicide.  Do you think something like the following would be good to try?  "I care about you a lot, but I know deep down that we aren't right for each other.  I'm sorry that we didn't work out, but I have thought about it a lot and I cannot change my feelings and I am not going to change my mind."  Also, what are your thoughts on telling him something along those lines and getting out of the condo quickly (to go stay with a friend for a few weeks while he *hopefully* moves out)?  The problem with last time I tried to break up with him is that he tried to talk me out of it for 2 days, then had a pretty dramatic suicide threat, which ended up with the situation we are now (me saying I would reconsider after a month). 

Sorry for the many questions.  I'll just add that I've never dealt with anyone with BPD until him (and he is undiagnosed as far as I know but he has been on depression meds before) so this all very new to me.  I've been tried to read books and as much about it as I can on the internet, but most of the things I read about break ups is the person with BPD leaving or doing the breaking up.