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Author Topic: PART 3: Heartbroken and needing urgent help, is it really over this time? Continued.  (Read 602 times)
Sufferingsoul34
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« on: June 01, 2019, 03:10:04 PM »

Mod note:  this thread is a continuation of https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=336006.0

Ok had a few messages from my wife today. Not responded yet just wanted abit of advice on how to reply. Not sure if she was drunk sending these late last night but this is what she said, usually a 20 minute gap between each message:

‘Wanna go to Vegas?’ (We’ve been many times before and had a good time)
‘This weekend’
‘I can take time off, let me know. Thurs to sun or fri to tues’
‘Let’s try’
‘My name’

I’m obviously in England so Vegas for a weekend trip I don’t know what she’s thinking by this but any advice would be great if anybody has an idea of what she is thinking by this. I think she finds it very hard to communicate her feelings so maybe this is her way of doing that...
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« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2019, 03:50:10 PM »

have you replied yet or has she said anything more?
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Sufferingsoul34
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« Reply #2 on: June 03, 2019, 02:17:54 PM »

She sent me another.

‘What do you think? I’m flexible’

I replied saying ‘let’s try for what? Vegas?’ Mainly just to hide myself abit of time but responding properly.

She replied saying ‘if you want to’

No idea what to say, this has happened before and I’ve gone running to her and she knows we have a great time together in Vegas. No idea how to respond. I know it’s not a good idea for me to see her yet and getting drunk in Vegas for a weekend definitely wouldn’t help the situation, but how do I word it so that she doesn’t feel rejected? I still care and love her, in just not ready, partly because I have 4 months left on my apartment lease, and partly because I know she hasn’t been working on herself so the same cycle and probably worse would happen until she gets help. Such a difficult situation.
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Sufferingsoul34
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« Reply #3 on: June 04, 2019, 10:45:14 AM »

Any suggestions for my response?
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Sufferingsoul34
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« Reply #4 on: June 04, 2019, 11:57:58 AM »

I was thinking to reply with:

Why do you want to go to Vegas with me?

Or

I enjoy going to Vegas with you but at this point in time I have commitments and won’t be able to go in the immediate future.

Any thoughts? I don’t want her to feel rejected but also she can’t click her fingers and I go running every time for eh same cycle.
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« Reply #5 on: June 05, 2019, 11:38:50 PM »

Excerpt
I enjoy going to Vegas with you but at this point in time I have commitments and won’t be able to go in the immediate future.

is this true?
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Sufferingsoul34
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« Reply #6 on: June 06, 2019, 03:00:54 AM »

Yes it’s true. I have a commitment with my apartment in England for the next 4 months and also with my work, I can’t jjsg up and leave for a weekend and also financially can’t really afford it at the moment.
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« Reply #7 on: June 06, 2019, 09:50:40 PM »

i think thats a reasonable truth to tell her.
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Sufferingsoul34
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« Reply #8 on: June 07, 2019, 01:22:34 PM »

Ok thank you. She’s just replied: ‘are you done with us?’ Sorry I’m asking for advice for all questions she asks on here just my head is scewed and I want to ensure I don’t rationally respond to her
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« Reply #9 on: June 07, 2019, 01:40:58 PM »

i would reiterate what you said previously, about how you have always been committed to the marriage.

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« Reply #10 on: June 09, 2019, 03:00:38 PM »

Ok I reiterated to her that I want to be with her and work for the marriage. She sent a message back saying ‘I want kids’ I asked her if she wants then with me and she responded with this:

‘With someone who will be responsible financially, physically, and emotionally with me and them. And shows they are financially stable long term. I’m 26, I want a career and if I have kids I don’t want it to be later, I’d rather get it over with now. But I want it to be with someone who I know will take care of me. So far that hasn’t been you. If you showed these things, it could be. But you haven’t.’

Any thoughts on this?
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« Reply #11 on: June 10, 2019, 06:15:21 PM »

Any thoughts on this?

what are your thoughts on it?
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« Reply #12 on: June 11, 2019, 05:49:24 PM »

My thoughts are that during the marriage I have paid for everything. Both sides of the rent, bought and cooked all of the food for us all the time, kept the house clean, went on numberous holidays all paid for by me and also ate out all the time all paid for by me. She is obviously still holding it against me as I didn’t tell her how much money I had, and still not appreciating the things I’ve done for her, which for me shows it would be the same cycle...I feel as though I’ve been a very patient and caring husband and her parents have also told me numerous times that she will never find anybody like me. Yes I’m not perfect but I’ve been so patient and done everything I could for her.

I didn’t respond and she sent me another message saying ‘the tenants That I’m living with are moving out so you should rent both rooms so we can rent the place together, it’s really nice. I didn’t reply and then got another ‘shall I come to visit you in england’

This is exactly the same cycle as last year when I left and she thought I’d stopped caring so she was trying to get me back. Only this time I have more commitments here. I love her to bits but what I know for certain is that the way her mindset is now, it would just be the same cycle next time and the time after, until she gets help or starts to appreciate me. So I am really lost on how to respond to her. Knowing previous cycles if I don’t respond after a few days I will get a random call too.

No idea what to do, part of me wants to respond saying why would you want me to live with you after 3 months ago we were abit to move in together somewhere new and you changed your mind. My mum says she’s using me like a puppet to go running whenever she feels like it. Of course my mums education on borderlines isn’t as vast as mine. I know I can’t respond and put her in her place but it’s really tempted to say this is the same cycle like last year. You need to figure out what you want, appreciate me, get help then we can work on our marriage. I just have a gut feeling she wouldn’t take that the right way...
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« Reply #13 on: June 12, 2019, 11:21:16 PM »

Excerpt
I know I can’t respond and put her in her place but it’s really tempted to say this is the same cycle like last year. You need to figure out what you want...

without "putting her in her place" so to speak, it doesnt seem unreasonable to say that youre confused as to what she wants and doesnt want, that you very much want to save the marriage, but that you think it would require long term work from both of you, and a new approach...that you dont want things to just go back to the way they were.

what do you think?
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« Reply #14 on: June 12, 2019, 11:44:11 PM »

My immediate questions...

1) Does she have a Life Checklist that she is trying to accomplish? The phrase relating to having children, i.e. "get it over with" is a red flag.

2) Related to above, are you an end, or are you a means to an end?

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« Reply #15 on: June 13, 2019, 10:31:06 AM »

Ok have you asked yourself the hard questions. 
Do you really want to stay married to her?

If so Are you willing to set the boundaries you need to have a stable life?  To me it sound like the "I hate you!  don't leave me" that many of us see. 

What it she never gets beyond/better than she is now.  Can you do this for decades? 

What will having children do to the relationship?  What will the parenting stresses add to the dynamic?  Can you envision what the long term effect will be if there is no improvement but children are added?


These are some of the "if I would have known then" things I wish I would have thought through...

B
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Sufferingsoul34
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« Reply #16 on: June 15, 2019, 05:44:10 AM »

@onceremoved great advice as always so thank you. I replied quickly last night saying this weekend won’t work for me because it’s fathers day. She replied saying ‘why do you take days to respond’ I was thinking to tell her this ‘I’m very confused as to what you want and don’t want. As I have always said, I am committed to the marriage but it takes long term work from both of us. I think we need a new approach as we had this exact same cycle last year and I don’t want things ending up how they’ve ended up this last time.’ Do I send this? Or add in, I think it’s important for both of us to get individual therapy to work on ourselves before committing to each other? I have committed to an apartment in England for the next 4 months as when you went to sign a new contract on your own, I had to find another place for myself so the rooms you have available at your building won’t be appropriate at the moment.  Or leave that out? how does this sound?

@grgrl I don’t know about the life checklist. She goes through phases of wanting kids and never wanting them... now she seems to be wanting them again.. pretty unstable but she had a miscarriage a couple of years ago so I think that’s partly do do with it. Deep down she’s always said I will be an amazing father, maybe she feels like she needs to nurture a baby and I’m the one to do it with, I don’t know, it’s really tough.

@COLB I am willing to set boundaries and it’s definitelt the hate you don’t leave me, but I left yet again and she’s trying to get me back yet again.
That’s a very good question, could I do this for decades... I love her too bits and j know all relationships will have issues. It’s a tough one and something I really need to think about and kind of why I’m trying to find myself in England at the moment away from her to figure out what I reallt really want but still my heart gets drawn to her after 3 months apart now.
Children could help or her hormones could be everywhere and she could be worse... that’s what a therapist warned me, it’s such a tough one as I know we would both make amazing parents but then she has her outbursts it changes everything...
Are you speaking from previous experience that you wish you’d have thought these through in the past?
Thank you for your advice and help.

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« Reply #17 on: June 16, 2019, 06:15:31 AM »

Excerpt
‘I’m very confused as to what you want and don’t want. As I have always said, I am committed to the marriage but it takes long term work from both of us. I think we need a new approach as we had this exact same cycle last year and I don’t want things ending up how they’ve ended up this last time.’ Do I send this? Or add in, I think it’s important for both of us to get individual therapy to work on ourselves before committing to each other? I have committed to an apartment in England for the next 4 months as when you went to sign a new contract on your own, I had to find another place for myself so the rooms you have available at your building won’t be appropriate at the moment.  Or leave that out? how does this sound?

i think these are three different messages.

"I am committed to the marriage. I also think that rebuilding it will require a lot of effort from both of us. I'm open to discussing what that would entail if that's something that you want to do.

PS. I have committed to an apartment in England for the next 4 months so moving out won't be logistically possible at the moment.

Love,

-your name"

you might want to personalize it a bit. what do you think?

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« Reply #18 on: June 17, 2019, 10:06:19 AM »

I am speaking from 30 years of being married to a BPDw.  When she is on it is great.  When she melts down, the damage has been long term and in some cases irreversible. 

What has torn at me is the damage to our children.  I have seen the fragile teens unable to cope and deal with moms hurtful and damaging words. I have seen her need to control drive a wedge into her relationship with her children as they age.  I have seen family relationships destroyed over outbursts and an inability to take responsibility (every one else is guilty/the BPD is always a victim). 

I have tried to enforce boundaries but being human I am not always successful.  I was given a rock by a counselor and advised to be a rock for my children.  I have weathered much and  try to be a calm and stable part of their lives.  I try to show them that FOG is a choice they do not have to buy into.  I have not always succeeded.

I have lived with the heartbreak of my oldest son not wanting his mother at his wedding because he did not trust her to control her emotions which of course led to her not being able to control her emotions and attacking everyone...I know that choice will be the same for at least one other of our children as well and am trying to prepare myself for that. 

These are some of the realities of living with a BPD who cannot or will not accept treatment...sorry for the downer reply.  But these are the branches you need to know may be out there on this journey if you chose to have a life with a BPD. If I would have known then what I know now would I have made the same choices/decisions?  I honestly do not know. 

B
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« Reply #19 on: June 21, 2019, 10:10:34 AM »

@COLB thank you so much for your message. You have definitely given me so much to think about and to ponder and also a reminder/wake up call so I thank you so so much for sharing that.

@onceremoved.

She sent me a message a couple of days ago saying ‘ I can try, but I don’t want our finances mixed at all, I’ll do 50/50. I’ll pay 50% of everything. I don’t want any expectations because that’s when I get disappointed.’ Then another saying ‘Honestly I don’t know what I want. I don’t feel sad about us and I feel like I should be. It would be nice to see you to talk more regularly and it’s weird that we have to either be married and live together or apart and never talk. There’s no middle ground. I like where I’m at right now and it would be nice to have that middle ground to talk and figure you out but also myself. I don’t know what you’re doing there if you’re dating or what. But if you want I can stop talking to you and just keep everything to myself.’

 I replied with something similar to what you suggested. Seems she has blocked out the first part of whag I said and said to me ‘ nice to know that you can commit to apartments now’ (she means this as we were living in her mums basement apartment for a couple of years to save money.
Then she sent another message ‘I wasn’t asking you to move, I have an apartment contract aswell’.

Not sure how to respond to this one... tempted to say well I didn’t really have much choice as you had found a room in a shared female house away from me when we were supposed to be finding somewhere together... but need to not message with emotions everywhere so that’s why I’m here again asking for advice...?
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« Reply #20 on: June 21, 2019, 11:31:17 AM »

its a difficult message.

my own interpretation of it is that she struggles with the distance between the two of you, is uncomfortable with it, and these impulsive reach outs are efforts to soothe that. it doesnt leave much indication that she is prepared to do the hard and difficult work that would be necessary to rebuild the marriage.

i would listen, and ask questions, for clarity.

id ask her if shes saying that she is struggling with the distance and would like to speak more, but unsure if shes interested in rebuilding the marriage.
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« Reply #21 on: June 21, 2019, 04:16:21 PM »

Did you mean you ask her now? Or wait and not say anhtbing and wait for the next time for her to reach out?
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« Reply #22 on: June 25, 2019, 04:37:13 PM »

Excerpt
Did you mean you ask her now?

yes. i meant reply to her message.
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« Reply #23 on: July 15, 2019, 08:54:16 AM »

Update:

We have been getting on well lately. Chatting and planning when we will see each other. She said she wants transparency in our marriage which we’ve never had before. I fully agree with that as we’ve both had to hide things and we both suffer anxiety which doesn’t help matters at all. We were going to meet this weekend just gone but she says she still doesn’t know what she wants and isn’t sure if this is a good idea. I told her it should best to wait until she figures out what she wants. She has a new puppy and has been showing me lots of pics of it and the puppy.

This weekend she has gone to visit her dad. I still have a phone contract with her dad and he says I owe him 3 months payment as my direct debits weren’t going through. I told him I would transfer this week. I thought that was the end of it. Of course he dad mentions it to my wife when she’s there and now she’s sending my a load of abuse stating ‘this confirms to be the person you are’ ‘why haven’t you been paying him’ I have no idea why her dad feels the need to say this to her daughter as financial issues are her main trigger. Now she’s messaged me to say good luck with whatever you’re doing in your life and I’m stumped to what to do. I’m actually annoyed at her dad as we talked about it and it was solved. He’s a doctor in Psychology so he should know his daughters reactions, unless he says these things to create a closet bond between them as they are never close...

I don’t know... any suggestions in what I should respond or just wait? I was hoping with our recent chats we were finally communicating about what she wante. She says she’s been dating other guys, and she wishes she knew what she wanted. I told her I hadn’t and that I hope that her dating other people will help her realise what/who she actually wants. She said last week she is so happy in life how, has everything she wants, car puppy house. Everhtbing I never gave her apparently... but still if she’s so happy I don’t understand why she’s wanting to see me and ask for me back...

Anyway, any idea how I should respond to this? She told me to cancel the contract with her dad so I told her I would do and get a new number.
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« Reply #24 on: July 15, 2019, 06:41:19 PM »

Excerpt
Anyway, any idea how I should respond to this? She told me to cancel the contract with her dad so I told her I would do and get a new number.

is that how you responded?
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« Reply #25 on: July 16, 2019, 09:24:43 AM »

Yes I responded to that. I spoke to her brother yestserday and it turns out she’s been seeing other guys who are the supposed love of her life. Then she all have used her and moved on so that’s why she’s coming back to me. I knew this would happen when I thought about it in the past. It hurts to hear it, but I don’t know what to do now. She keeps saying she really wants me to move in with her (maybe codependent) but that we would have to get divorced first as she doesn’t trust me with money and has life goals... no idea what to respond to this... maybe I will just show empathy and understanding?
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« Reply #26 on: July 18, 2019, 12:55:56 AM »

Excerpt
maybe I will just show empathy and understanding?

toward what?

how do you feel about the prospect of moving in but getting divorced first?
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« Reply #27 on: July 18, 2019, 10:53:48 AM »

Obviously it’s not what I want... but I think she is getting despearate for me to move back in with her.

Her latest message today was that my car is on her mums drive and they need it out of the way so a truck can come in. (Not sure if it’s the truth or not). But anyway she’s saying they cannot open it as the battery is dead, and she says I need to go and move it. She knows I am 1000’s of miles away in England. I asked her politely if she can try the regular key and jump start it and move it. She responds with ‘is that my families responsibility’ I guess this shows how far I’ve come as in the past I would have responded and caused a fight, but now should I respond? I am waiting a while to think about this.

My plan is I want to go back and live with her in America, we have differences we need to talk about and I’m not sure if she even means that divorce thing, I very much doubt it but who knows. But I need to make sure she is willing to put effort into the marriage. Until I hear that from her and use it as a base to work towards then I cannot go back.
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