coming over to the 'other' side

[Woolspinner2000]

On the recommendation of my fellow PSI animals (the beagle Harri and the wolf Turkish), I am putting my llama toes into the waters of the detaching board. My home board is PSI, but I find myself in this place of working to detach from my marriage of 34 years. I took time to read Lesson 1, about the stages of grief, the abandonment cycle, and the 5 stages of detachment.

I see myself in these stages, like I'm sure so many of you do. Let's start with the Stages of Grief. I have experienced the denial, anger, and bargaining, and would say I am in between the stages of depression and acceptance. One day there is a hint of acceptance within me, another few days it is the aching grief of the loss and depression and questioning myself and "what in the world did I do" when I needed to leave to get safe and stay safe? Yet the facts are stronger than my feelings, most of the time, and I did need to leave the emotional, financial, spiritual and verbal abuse. When my emotions flood over me, then I walk once again through the depression of trying to figure out who I am, all over again, separate from my spouse of so long...

I have been separated for about 7 months, and on July 4th my husband said he would prefer dissolution over a legal separation because he said it is as if we are already divorced. I believe that's the best choice for us, yet it is still hard, this ripping away of the structure that has held you together, even though it was so dysfunctional.

I have been greatly helped by reading the book Stop Caretaking the Borderline or Narcissist. While my mom was an uBPD, DH is similar but is more towards the N side. There is so much value for me in the words on these pages. I see who I am as a caretaker and how I got here. I also see the parallels and similarities between a BPD and a N. I always felt that DH reminded me so much of my mom.

Wools

[Ecan]

  Welcome Wools,

34 years is a long time to detach from and I admire your courage to come over to this board and start your official detaching. I'm glad to hear you've started reading the material related to this board and it sounds like the book you've read was a grate help I will have to check it out.

I am also kinda new to this board and depression is mostly where I stay at the moment. I long to get angry that would be nice. I spend most of my time trying to see things from her side still and that keeps me stuck. I blame myself for it all still.

I mainly just wanted to welcome you and even though I'm not experienced enough with all this to help I can cheer you on in your journey.

Your not alone in all of this.

[Harri]

Hi Wools.

This is a big step for you and I know you have the determination and skills to work through this. 

yet it is still hard, this ripping away of the structure that has held you together, even though it was so dysfunctional.

Yes.  What sort of things are you going to use to rebuild that structure that no longer works for you?

 

[I Am Redeemed]

Hi Wools,

I am glad to hear from you but I'm sorry that you need to be on this board, if you know what I mean. 34 years is quite a long time and I'm sure it must feel scary and uncertain to try to discover who you are or who you can be apart from who you have been for so long.

I think you will find that the grief stages can alternate and are not a linear process. I'm sure you have heard or read that before. It is tough, but it does get easier. You're not alone, either, we welcome you here with us.

It's a brave thing to stand up for yourself and to be able to protect yourself when the outcome may not be what you hoped or wished for it to be. Healthy choices sometimes still include painful emotions. The good in that is that we can recover and grow. You're a very resilient llama, and I know you will not just survive but thrive.

Thank you for sharing this part of your journey with us.

Redeemed

[Turkish]

That's a kind welcome Ecan. 

Wools, how did you feel when your husband basically told you that he'd rather dissolve your marriage (this means divorce, yes?) rather than legal separation?

[Lucky Jim]

Hey Wools, Sorry to hear what you are going through.  Many of us have been in your shoes.  I'm glad you are reading up on the issues and taking good care of yourself.  The place to start, I suggest, is with yourself, and you're already doing that.  Let us know if you have any particular questions.

LuckyJim

[Woolspinner2000]

Thank you, Ecan for your warm welcome and reply. I put a link in my first post to the book at our library here if you want to go back and find out more about the book.

I spend most of my time trying to see things from her side still and that keeps me stuck. I blame myself for it all still.

I can relate to this. I find myself saying, "If only..." If only I had tried harder, if only I had done something differently. The truth though is that I know I did try hard, too hard in fact. The caretaking in me was so strong that I didn't realize I needed to stop trying so hard. It takes two people to work on a relationship, that I have learned. Yet, like you, I still feel the weight of the failure so heavily. I can see the facts, for the most part, but the emotions still weigh heavier than the facts for me most of the time. I hope someday that they will balance and reflect reality in a truer sense.

Harri and Turkish, thank you for finding me over here on this board and for welcoming me here.    It's nice to still be in touch with my fellow team mates. One thing I appreciate is that you both each asked only one question and it is enough to give me things to think about. My brain tends to be so overtaxed these days.

Harri, you asked me:

What sort of things are you going to use to rebuild that structure that no longer works for you?

This is actually a really good question because it gently asks me to look at what hasn't worked and then to consider what I can do to rebuild and get stronger. When the floor boards are rotting out, they need to be ripped out and replaced, but only if we can figure out what caused them to rot in the first place and rebuild that, right? I know that one thing I told our MC I want to work on is how to work through conflict: when do you chose to do conflict, what does it look like, and how do you start up a conflict topic in a soft manner when you are so darn mad to begin with? He said he didn't think that working through conflict with DH will work because DH is not able to see my emotions and respond healthily to them. Nevertheless, I told him that I need to learn how to 'do' conflict for the other situations and relationships in my life because the way DH and I did it did not work, and watching my uBPDm fight with my dad ended up with him hitting her (physically) or her hitting him verbally with assaults. So the track record is not good for my learning library to pull from.  I hope this is one thing that I can use to rebuild.

how did you feel when your husband basically told you that he'd rather dissolve your marriage (this means divorce, yes?) rather than legal separation?

Turkish, on one hand I felt relieved. On the other, I felt so sad that it brought me to tears. To think that after 34 years (actually it will be 35 on August 25) he would decide within a few months to be done is rather shocking to me. I know that may seem to be an ignorant statement on my part. Part of me never wants to go back, and part of me can't believe we are giving up. Why does it seem to work that way? Maybe it's part of the bargaining stage still? I do know for certain that the pain of the abuse I lived in and with was worse than the thought of ending our marriage. Yes, dissolution is the same as divorce, only with a dissolution we will have to agree together on how to divide things up rather than having the court decide. It takes a few months vs a year or more, and it is much less expensive. He seems to want to maintain a relationship and not become so bitter from all the fighting that a divorce typically brings (or can bring) about. Part of me is ready to push forward and get this done, but it is hard no matter what.

Thank you for your kind welcome, I am redeemed.

It's a brave thing to stand up for yourself and to be able to protect yourself when the outcome may not be what you hoped or wished for it to be. Healthy choices sometimes still include painful emotions.

Hmm...this is a good thought. Standing up for myself was one of the hardest things I have ever done (besides getting into T for my childhood with an uBPDm!), and it can often feel so wrong to do something so right. I guess it's a reminder that we cannot necessarily trust our emotions. I know I am a person of worth and that I am worth being treated much better than DH treated me.

Also thank you Lucky Jim for your welcome as well! I will find myself soon settling in to my 'newer' family on this board. 

Lastly, for those of you who have followed my story, the 'partner' or 'friend' that DH has invested with was convicted of 2 felonies last month in the court case that came against him last fall. Sentencing is mid August. For me it was validation that the things I had felt all along were correct, even though DH did/does his best to talk me out of those.

Wools

 

[Harri]

   Hi Woolite.

I am glad you are going to address how you handle anger.  I think a lot of us struggle with that especially someone with your history where the affects were so catastrophic and caused deep scars in you at such a young age.   I've done some digging around in articles lately and came across this one:   Topic: 5.08 | Anger and Healing  I think it might help.  Not all of it applies but some of it might.

Anger is healthy and good when done in a healthy way.  Stuffing it, shutting it down, turning it inward are not healthy.  I think you are right when you say you will need to learn to deal with anger in other areas of your life too.  I wish you were here to see the grin on my face when I read that.  If you want a safe friend to practice with, I'm here. 

[Turkish]

He seems to want to maintain a relationship and not become so bitter from all the fighting that a divorce typically brings (or can bring) about.

This is good, especially given your adult kids.  It might minimize unhealthy drama triangles. 

What would you prefer? If you had to dig deep, do you think that a "quiet" dissolution would be invalidating to the pain you've felt for many years, as if your pain wasn't acknowledged?

[Woolspinner2000]

I think you are right when you say you will need to learn to deal with anger in other areas of your life too.  I wish you were here to see the grin on my face when I read that.  If you want a safe friend to practice with, I'm here.

Thanks, Harri. Does this mean I am able to step outside of the marriage drama perhaps and look at other areas besides that?

What would you prefer? If you had to dig deep, do you think that a "quiet" dissolution would be invalidating to the pain you've felt for many years, as if your pain wasn't acknowledged?

Turkish, for sure I'd rather have things be quieter, for DH, for myself, for our children. Even though they're adults, I know what it's like to be an adult when your parents divorce. Painful no matter what the age. Here and there I've read that it's even worse when you are an adult child trying to process the grief of your parent's breakup. That's why I keep telling them that we will get through this together, that I'm not going to leave them to work through this alone. I encourage them to let me know if they are angry, even with me, because we can work on it together. My parents (especially my mom) triangulated BIG time when they were split up. Dad was much more careful, but it made it so much harder on us adult kids when they essentially hated one another.

The question about invalidation does bring up a good point. I would love to be validated! Do I expect it to happen from my husband? No, I don't. I used to, and tried over and over through so many conversations to get him to see my point of view so that he would finally see my pain and validate me. Going through a long and bitter divorce won't fix that, but would rather make it worse, in my opinion. That then brings me to the topic of self-soothing. In our pain and hurt, sometimes going on for years and years, we do seek to find a means to end that pain in some form or fashion. Often we want to take it out on someone else because we want the pain to go away. But this is where JADE comes in too. I don't need to JADE in order to feel better and really it never works to solve the situation anyway. I do need to figure out how to soothe myself because with someone who has BPD or N, they are not about the business of soothing anyone else. Lord knows they struggle to soothe themselves!

So what can I do to self soothe? This goes back to Harri's question, about what things am I going to use to rebuild the structure that no longer works? One of the new things has to be that I continue to learn to soothe myself. That can be by reaching out to safe friends, going to T, exercise, maybe join the local spinners guild? Woolspinners should do that you know.   

Let me leave you with a story to illustrate this. About 2 weeks ago, I had some trouble with my vehicle, and I spoke with DH about it. He had some thoughts and offered me his vehicle for a couple days, and we were able to get mine into a repair place. I thanked him for his kindness. Good so far. When I got the van back, he commented on how surprised he was that I didn't notice the noise in the rear end of the van. Well, I had noticed and had told him, but it never sounded like the rear brakes were going bad to me, more like a loose hubcap, but clearly after the repair shop, it was much much more noticeable. I wondered why he didn't get them fixed, and he told me he wanted to go to someone else who he thought would be more thorough and less expensive. The problem was that I was planning on going out of town on a long trip to visit my aunt in a few days. The grinding got so bad that I asked him if it was safe to still drive, and he said it would be. Not good.

In the end, my cousin replaced the rear brakes and a rotor when I was 4 hours away from home. Then the next day I lost a wheel off the rear end of the van while driving 50 mph down a two lane road near northern Michigan. I don't think I've ever been so scared in my life, and I still don't like to think about it. My 9 year old niece was riding with me at the time, and I was afraid for her safety as well.  We were safe, and that's all that matters. However, my anger was strongly directed towards DH for not getting the van fixed when we had it in, especially when he knew it was bad. What was I to do with that anger? What did I hope to accomplish? Since there really was/is no way for DH to hear me, then it was a decision on my part to chose to repair the van myself and to take that step to let him be who he is, without argument, and to know that I can make my own decisions too, quietly, without putting him on the defensive. I talked with friends and my T about it, to help me self soothe from the trauma of it all, and that has been my healthy way of dealing with something that really I wish I could share the pain with him. There's no point to doing that. I can stop looking to him for the soothing I need, and as I become more healthy in my core of who I am, then I don't have that pull of the dysfunctional bond that has held us together. I hope I'm making some sort of sense.

Woolite