Ran into Ex 5 months later and called a stalker - PART 2

[Seekinganswers30]

Mod Note:  part 1 of this thread is here:  https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=337237.0;all

Thank you again for taking the time to help me. I wanted to share the article below on gaslighting and how making radical acceptance that I had no chance with my ex is improving quickly today. The fact that she would accuse me of gaslighting when she has done all of these things and I have not even come close to any of them is a huge wake up call. She accused me of #1 fraud last month, I went through the three stages of abuse #2, she projected her behaviour onto me #3 and when I finally fought back with the comment I shared on Monday she did #4 and called me crazy. It is surreal how this article matched my situation so accurately.

ARTICLE:
People toy with someone else's memories to make them feel like they are going crazy. It's called gaslighting.

Gaslighting is not when somebody has a different opinion to you. For example, you can't accuse someone of it just because they vote for an opposing political party. It's a severe manipulative tool people with dark triad personality traits use — but not exclusively — and it is seen a lot in abusive relationships.

It's mainly used as a power tactic, to make the victim question their reality, and become more subservient. it is when someone "screws with your sense of reality to manipulate you, causing you to distrust yourself and trust them instead."
Everybody is different, and everyone has different experiences, but people who are controlling, abusive, and narcissistic often follow the same pattern. For this reason, there are several techniques that the people who tend to gaslight others follow.
Here are some of the signs to look out for.

Sign #1: Lies
A gaslighter's main objective is to confuse you. Because of this, they don't really care whether their lies are blatant and obvious. When they say something that is obviously untrue, they will still say it with a straight face.

Even if you have proof, they will often stick to their guns. This is all a tactic to keep you off-kilter. Eventually, they will attempt to make you believe that everything they say is the reality.

It will start off with something as simple as: "I didn't say that." But over time it will turn into something more disturbing, such as threatening to expose you as a liar or a fraud, when really you are neither of those things.

The more sure you are that they are wrong, and the more frustrated you get, the more they will persevere with their lies.

Sign #2: Positive reinforcement
One of the most confusing — and effective — things a gaslighter can do is be nice to you. If someone was truly nasty and insulting towards you 100% of the time, the relationship probably wouldn't have gotten very far. However, when someone starts gaslighting you, they've already established a relationship with you that you believe is meaningful.

When a relationship starts with someone abusive — often a narcissist, a sociopath, or a psychopath — they will "love-bomb" you. Love-bombing is a tactic when somebody showers you with affection, and makes you feel like the luckiest person in the world.

However, the love-bombing, or idealisation, stage is quickly followed by the devaluation and discard stages, where you start to be insulted and wonder where on earth things started to go wrong.

The idea is that when they take this love and affection away, you will do anything within your power to try and get it back. You blame yourself for them changing the way they acted towards you, and you compromise yourself time and time again to get the perfect partner back again. You can't though, because that person never really existed.
Gaslighters will throw in the odd compliment, or the rare gift, to make you believe that it's the real them, and whenever they are angry at you, or abusing you, it's because you did something wrong.

Sign #3: Projection
If the gaslighting partner is a drug addict, that's what they will accuse you of being. If they cheat on you, they will say you are the one being unfaithful.

It's a distraction technique, because it keeps you on your toes, and makes you feel like you should be defending yourself. You're so busy doing this, the gaslighter gets away with whatever they want to.

Sign #4: 'You're crazy'
This is one of the most important tactics to look out for. If someone ever dismisses your point of view as "crazy," you need to really consider why they are doing it.

It's dismissive and patronising, and it doesn't take your feelings into account. It makes you feel like you are not being heard. Worst of all, the more often the gaslighter calls you crazy, the more likely you are to finally believe it.

[Gemsforeyes]

Hey SA-

Good article.  I believe the term “gaslighting” comes from the 1938 play, made into the 1944 movie “Gaslight” starring Ingrid Bergman and Charles Boyer.

If you want to see gaslighting come to life, download and watch that 1944 black & white film.  I saw it years ago, and it holds a whole lot more relevance to me now.

IMO, NARCs are pros at this (my ex-H) to try and put you, keep you at a “disadvantage” and off balance in the relationship.  My uBPDbf’s lies are less harmful to me and are more to protect himself.  He’s gotten much much better at truth telling; because I became better at carefully pointing out the damage he was doing to trust.

At any rate, I truly am sorry for all the pain you’ve gone through trying to show your ex-gf who you really are.  You now know... none of that matters to her.  She’s consumed with trying to prove to herself and the world how she wants to be seen.  And that is NOT your problem.  It’s beyond your control.

Radical Acceptance.  Catch and Release...

Warmly,
Gemsforeyes

[LoveOnTheRocks]

Hi Seekinganswers:  I've been reading your thread and posts, and I really do intimately understand what is happening with you, because in so many ways, I went through it, too.  The fact that in the face of so many people telling you to let it go, because "solid" closure cannot happen with the BPD person, almost never, doesn't seem to deter you from continuing your personal quest to find a way, in YOUR case, to change that "inferred stereotype" of the BPD breakups (and the wake of it's destruction, least of all is how tragically hurt those of us without it are left feeling).  When you get ready to accept what you can't change, and you actually help yourself...you will begin to heal rapidly, and accept that some truths of life are what they are...simple as they are,  we refuse to accept them, and it brings us pain.

When I got tired of having limbs broken on my body, and feeling stalked, I still found this intense "love" inside myself, and nowhere to put it, and noone to understand that it was eating me alive on the inside. My BPD ex love bombed me constantly, and would then turn around and steal my money and car, or some other dastardly form of betrayal, then, refuse to own his actions, and also refuse to let me go.  I found out years later that he was also with one or two other women during the same time (public records went online and I saw he was having legal issues with other women at the same time he was with me, and over periods of years).  It's a mess...it really is...all that was going on, but that isn't the reason I am writing you...

At the time, all I had were the facts that I had.  He would have continued with me to this day had I allowed it, but I had to get away to keep from being literally killed by this dangerous man.  True, my circumstances were different from yours, but what you and I have (I had) in common was that "feeling" that results from someone love bombing you.  In spite of how much he did wrong to me, there were lots of really great days together in there, and I grieved tremendously...TREMENDOUSLY...for THAT...(not the other, but the good stuff all mixed in there).
Noone could begin to understand that was going on with me, because from their objective place (and rightly so), they saw the results of the bad stuff and wanted me to save my life...so, I couldn't talk to anyone who knew "us" about how I was feeling.  So...one day, I quit "thinking" I had to make it stop, and I just worked to make it stop.  One day at a time until I was through the process, just me, myself and I.  I remember how I did it and will share it here, fwiw, and if it's worth anything to you.

I would sit on my bed and look at the wall above the door frame in my bedroom.  I would imagine a clock.  I didn't know why (didn't know what was "wrong" with him was BPD, but knew something was terrible wrong with a person who could display such intense love and emotion for and about me, then do these terrible deeds he did, then literally could not understand why I would be upset about said crimes against me...again...what a mess).
Anyway, I would imagine a clock on the wall that sat in the space above the door frame in my bedroom.  I saw my time as 12:00 and I saw his time as 12:15.  I told myself that regardless of anything and all things, and nomatter what, I would always see the clock reading noon, and he would always see the clock reading as 12:15, and I had to teach myself to accept that fact...that nomatter what, we would never see the same time on that clock.  Day after day, as I yearned and longed for the good part of us, I would bring up the imaginary clock and remind myself that there was nothing on the planet that would enable him to see it was noon, a fact I readily saw, and everyone else around me saw, but a fact that he was literally, wholly, completely and sincerely unable to see.  After 8 long years in that relationship, fraught with all that really does come with a person whose mind can't read the actual time that literally the entire rest of the planet can read, I can assure you that I tried everything under the sun, because I so badly wanted the good part of us, and this man literally and wholly rocked my world...but nothing was ever going to fix his brain, especially in light of the fact that he was not particularly convinced that it seriously needed fixing. 

This is not about her anymore.  This is now about you.  If you read all of your posts, it objectively does come out that while you say you want closure, what you really want is to win her back with some form of reasoning and logic.  That might work with someone who could be reasonable and see logic, but nothing you say or do is ever going to cause her to see the sense in what you say (which is that you were nothing but a gentleman and true knight in shining armour to her)...and you're right...you were, I am absolutely convinced.

I will leave you with this.  YOU are denying some great gal out there the man of her dreams while you pine away for what never really was...I know that from your perspective, the interactions with your bpdx were genuine and the experience should have been enormously satisfying and rewarding for both of you, based on the facts, but there is another fact that makes it not so, and that is the fact that she is incapable of experiencing things the way you, I and the majority of us are.  They mean completely different things to her.  I was told by one of the Psychiatrists I saw when I was seeing my x that "...these people adapt and become extremely good at painting a reality that simply does not exist, because they know they are different, and that they have to draw people into them.  They manipulate reality to snare a victim."  It's not sinister, as in, they seek a victim, but ultimately, without sincere and honest interaction, that's ultimately what those who love them can end up being sometimes...not always...and certainly in your situation, that is the case.  Accept that sometimes there is no "last word" or "final response or answer"...and I know you're a smart and good man...and there is something worse than this abrupt ending after a short and intense time spent with her...the worse is, you do this for 8 years, like I did, and end up in the same boat, only with 8 more years shed, and no further along...I am sure you want the "fix" back, but you will never have just that without all the other bad stuff...let that sink in...deeply...and honestly count your blessings, ...you were "saved by the bell" as it were...and you're not being stalked to come back to more and more of this and having to save yourself from a long string of pain and misery.
You got your shirt back...put it on, run your hands down your chest to press out the wrinkles...and heal your heart with truth so that you can get out there and meet the girl who really is yours...You won't get the blonde until you let go of the brunette...and the blonde is the one who is really going to rock your world...slower, but with much more surety...I've been where you are and am the voice of experience in the wilderness.  You can hear me if you want to.  Read and reread my words and work on accepting the truth in them...for you.
Said with love, this is my experience and opinion.  Thank you for hearing me out.  I realize that how you proceed from here is your choice, but I appreciate that you've given me an opportunity to share my experiences with you.

[Seekinganswers30]

Love on the Rocks that was an amazing post.
I thank you very much. One of the no win situations I have been in lately that I have not talked about on here is the dating I have been doing since she left me. My very first girlfriend was the love of my life and I met her in the army but every single other woman I have dated in the 20 years since have been from the internet. I do not have friends, family, or work that can set me up and talking to women in random places I've never seen work for me or anyone else. I live in a big city and for some reason it is very difficult to meet someone from here. Everyone that wants to meet me is from a bigger city an hour away. I have had a long distance relationship for over a year from that city but I was never fully connected and hated the drive all the time. Another year and half relationship with a lovely filipino woman was my best experience from the internet but she was not marriage material as she sent most of her income home to her family and I just couldn't see myself paying for us both for the rest of my life. I've met so many women trying to find the one so I am extremely experienced but also jaded and fed up. Some lasted a few months, most not long at all. So the lovebombing really took me over from my ex. Plus she lived ten minutes away from me. I couldn't shut down my profile and commit to her fast enough when I knew she wanted the same.

Since she left, after a break, I have met approx 10 more women from the internet and only 1 worked out. I really don't want to be on the internet I just want one woman to love and that has kept me stuck wanting my ex back longer than it should because she made me feel safe and I trusted her and then it was just gone and I was back in the dating world which is really not fun to me anymore. The one woman I dated for a month was a nurse and everything about her was better than my ex. She was smart, didn't live at home, had a real job and she loved kissing me in public. My ex had a fear of public displays of affection and would not let me kiss her outside. Eventually she started complaining about holding hands as well which was another one of her changes after the love bombing.

The nurse worked a lot and we took things slow, just a couple texts each day and just lots and lots of kissing. She got a phone call from the humanitarian agency she volunteers for and took a posting in Haiti for 4 months. She came and visited me at my house and told me she couldn't date anyone when she was leaving in a few months. I did take notice though that in only a one month relationship she came to see me and tell me as opposed to the hit and run text bomb my ex laid on me. I know I didn't get rejected by the nurse, it was just fate and bad timing, but again I was alone and my need to be happy in my ex's love bombing stage did actually get worse. Every time something goes bad with internet dating I want back what I had which was awesome, until it was a nightmare. If I don't date though I feel worse and more hopeless because I am getting older by the day and I realized with the ex for the first time that I really want to give myself to one woman for the rest of my life. Until she took that away from me too.

So yes I did want closure and yes I just wanted her to come back to me the way she used to be.. Your clock metaphor is excellent. That's is exactly what I've been doing especially after Monday when she called me the liar and the gaslighter. It's ridiculous and I know she is not seeing the same reality I am and even if she did come back to me she would be a time bomb waiting to go off. Next time it could be worse if we had children or she took my house. She can't see reason once her feelings take over and I don't want to think about that in divorce court.

I guess I have to not put as much hope into dating and just try to be my old self who just had fun and then maybe the right woman will come when I least expect it. Again, I know my ex is mentally not well but for her to change our time together from 4 months to 3 in order to keep telling me our time together meant nothing to her and I'm lucky she even wrote me another text after she broke up with me is hurtful. I'm hurt bad over something she says was a fling. She was the one who created the relationship in the first place in the lovebombing stage. I was still very independent but all her texts, compliments, time together, sex, etc. made me deeply attached. Then she pulled the rug out from me. Funny thing is if this happened 5 years ago when she started devaluing me I would have kicked her out of my house without hesitation especially when she insulted me for giving her those strawberries. After reading the research I think I might have actually been dating another narcissist about 6 years ago. When she started going through my closet and dictating what I should wear I told her to f... off faster then she knew what hit her. She was gorgeous and I still never hesitated for a second which probably ended up helping me avoid the devaluation and discard stage in the future with her. This time I was older, lonelier, and more vulnerable to the love bombing and I got hurt really bad. The best thing I could have done was not even respond to her break-up text and I'm guessing she would have come crawling back in a couple weeks as that would have devastated her ego. But I never expected she was ill and would not talk to me in person again so I chased but still politely. And she still threatened me with the police even though I was nice. I would never hurt her or anyone else for any reason and she is calling me a threat. Unbelievable. If I had not found the research of BPD and NPD, Cluster B, etc. her behaviour might have killed me so I'm grateful I was able to protect myself with knowledge and with your support.

[Longterm]

Love on the Rocks that was an amazing post.

Beautiful 

[LoveOnTheRocks]

I worried all day yesterday that my blunt honesty with you was too much.  I am really happy that you accepted my truth (and basically it is just some observations of my experience), and I hope that anything I said will help you find the ultimate peace that you really want...peace with what happened, and acceptance about what it really was...and was not. 
I've read your response and, again, from a more objective place, I see several things that I wanted to point out.  I keep saying objective, because now with my BPD child, I get all worked up and others, who objectively read what I wrote, seem to easily see what's happening, while I struggle because of all this "stuff" that I have...guilt, fear, blah, blah, blah.  So, I get a lot out of objective feedback and am trying to give that same thing to you.

You are tired of the dating scene.  Own that, man!  Take the pressure off.
Figure out what you like and do that, with yourself!

You are getting older.  Translated, you are putting unnecessary pressure on yourself with this self talk you do when you are alone and thinking too much.  See that, man.  ...and stop.

More of my story, if I may:
During this "clock" phase, and actually (for me!), it was 3 years...
When I stopped actual contact with my BPDx, I was a mess.  I had been seeing doctors, because I had extreme PTSD from all the actual abuse.  I had physical abuse, and worse, my BPDx would show up at my house, my job, when I was shopping...just everywhere...he stalked me, and it became a thing of interact with him (even if I didn't want to), or suffer the physical consequences of rejecting him, which translated into him backing me into corners and screaming at me for hours.  I didn't want to date him after 4 months, but it took 8 years to play out completely, and I'm not sure what saved me, probably he met some other woman he wanted more than me...who knows...but, I used to walk out the door of my house and look all around to see if he was anywhere before I would get to my car and immediately lock the doors.  It troubled my father that the instant I entered any building (my house, their house), I would immediately lock every single door.  This was my life...fraught with fear and dread of him showing up.  He would call my cellphone 20 times in a row until I responded...at work, the people around me were worried sick and saw all this...it was so unreal...he was also a heavy drinker (and I don't even drink), so the alcohol would intensify his emotions...I was truly abused by him...I am filling in this info to lead into the next.
After I actually got away...he finally stopped the stalking...

I was EXTREMELY shaken up.  I tried to date, and found that being alone with a man caused me to shake uncontrollably, even though nothing was going on.  I met really great guys, too...a Cardiologist, a Psychiatrist...these were solid men I was trying to date, but I was so internally insecure with men that I just had to put the subject of dating down for a time and find something else to do...I literally had no choice.  So...I figured out what I wanted to do with just myself so that I could enjoy my life and not focus on the fact that I was physically alone.  I figured out I liked gardening, so I took on my yard (I owned a nice house with a big yard and lots of potential).  I focused on learning things about that subject...hours reading and planting and planning garden scenes, etc...I LOVED IT! 
I also enjoyed looking at physically toned people's bodies...they just were so beautiful to me, so I started with the gym, wanting what they had...for myself.  That meant learning lots about nutrition and how the body worked...hours into this hobby.
I also owned my own legal business...and that consumed many, many hours.
Plus, my BPDx and I, the very last time he gave me the option of rejecting him or having sex with him (at this point, I didn't want to, but neither did I want to reject him outright, so I chose sex over getting beat up) and I got pregnant.  It was the last time I saw him...so, I had this tiny baby, which also took a lot of my time...
I was a busy girl. 
Two and a half years passed, me doing all my things...being content to do what interested me, and I figured out what a big world it was and how many options there were out there.  I didn't think, really at all, about dating, because I thought it wasn't really an option for me.  I was starting to get a little lonely though...started disliking the weekends, because I was a little too lonely, and along comes this guy.  We laugh now that the day I met him, I actually told him that I could not date anyone, because I had so many irons in the fire, and so many things I enjoyed doing that it wouldn't be fair to try to date someone, because I really didn't think I'd have enough time for him.  LOL...looking back...but this very smart and coy man told me that a friendship would be great and he would make no demands of me...so I thought this friendship thing would be alright...no pressure!  Problem...every time this man came around me (he worked in the courthouse where I often worked and we literally ran into each other often, because he had a contract there)...I would get physically hot every time he came into the room.  At this point, we were just "friends'" and never saw each other outside of the workplace.  We did take breaks together from working if we ran into each other, and we did talk.  He also called me on the phone.  Well, I discovered this getting physically hot and having all these physical reactions to him every time he came around me...it was a problem...I mean,

Anyway, after a month or so, we did end up going to lunch together...and the phone calls turned into phone marathons, and neither of us was getting any sleep anymore...believe it or not, I was shedding my reluctance, but it is amazing to me, looking back, that I really had decided no more dating EVER!...and accepted it and got my life up and running and even when prince charming came along, he had to wait it out, because I literally was serious when I told him how much I liked my life...without the complications of another person.
Of course I married this guy...literally 3 months after he met me, he asked me to marry him, and I knew he was the one...and as jaded and whatever else I was, it was made super easy for me...and a year almost to the day after first meeting him, we married and we are still married and we will always be married...it's just right in almost every way (and the ways it's not dont matter, because the good outweighs the bad like a hundred to one, so it's a no brainer!).

If you will only OWN the facts you present about yourself (jaded/tired of dating/unsatisfied with so much of that scene), you can begin to enjoy your life with yourself...and you'll be amazed at how great it really is.  Looking back to that time, when I literally couldn't date...even though I thought I wanted to at first...it was AWESOME.  I really got into some things that, for me, were so fun...and when you are at peace...and minding your business...and genuinely happy to just be alive and enjoy your life and all the fun stuff you can get into in this world...along will come an amazing girl who will see a man who is full of life, or you will meet someone who is amazing and she will see how amazing you are...in plain terms...it's gonna happen...ITS GONNA HAPPEN...There actually is a woman out there somewhere who is perfect for you and I call it God...but whatever anyone wants to call it...when you both are ready...it will absolutely happen...I've seen this a million times by now, with my own self and with all the people in my life...and the one thing I know is, most always its when someone is just merrily living a life and when they least expect it...destiny makes it happen.

OK, you're jaded...so, I'll give you this.
My husband, this great guy who worked in the same courthouse I worked in...get this...HE WORKED THERE THE ENTIRE 3 YEARS I NEEDED TO SETTLE DOWN...you heard me right.  The entire time I was doing my thing, and he was doing whatever (and whomever, because he didn't need "space"...but what did happen is none of those women satisfied him or whatever, because the one that was right for him wasn't quite ready for him)...point is...even if you're a skeptic, I want you to hear that my husband and me actually crossed paths in that same building for almost 3 years and never once saw each other...destiny, my friend...do you believe...can you believe?

Its hard to accept my words at face value, but there is a lot of value in them.  Don't sweat your age or anything else...embrace life, ...engage in YOUR life...and settle down with the truth that is when you and she (the right one) are both on solid ground and ready for each other (I suspect you have some matters of the heart to still attend to, so it might not be later today, or even tomorrow)...but what do I really know...I just trust...now...

[LoveOnTheRocks]

PS:  I've been married to this great guy almost 20 years now...so, no question, as in, we've been together 2 years now and I call him my destiny...20 years...and we're getting old now (because I didn't get married until 35 years old)...but that was when it was right for me...and him.

[LoveOnTheRocks]

One more thing, because I can never leave well enough alone.
When you do meet the one, you will know what the wait was all about.  It could be her, you know.  It could be any number of things...this is hard to see until retrospect happens, but you'll get it, one day or another...
I dont recall my husband using the actual words that I was worth the wait, but I can tell you this.  He went around telling everyone at the courthouse that he was going to marry "that girl" starting the day he met me.  It became this big thing around there that I actually knew nothing about... All these people he worked with that I didn't even know would smirk when they walked past me, because I barely would even give my husband the time of day, for almost 3 months...but my husband was just the right guy to accept the "friendship" even though he had already established, day 1, I was the girl for him.
So, whomever she is, she is worth the wait.  you are worth the wait...and all this running around people do to search each other out...it's the stuff of needle in a haystack.

Relax...BE THE COOL GUY YOU ARE...and trust this girl here, because I would not be so persistent if I wasn't trying to tell you something...I can't seem to let it go I need you to understand so much...no telling why it hasn't happened YET...it's gonna happen...and it may have already happened (the nurse might be coming back with a new attitude, who knows, and she might not, because she cut it off, and the right one would have had to "feel" this was wrong)...I dont know, you don't know...
but what I do know is EMBRACE LIFE and you have let the universe know you are lonely and want her (or God, you pick)...
She's well on her way and will be here before you know it, and you will NEVER have a chance to expand yourself...just you...again...because you will be busy then being "us"...
Can you hear me, friend?  I'm trying to tell you something.
Said in love and the very best intentions.  hehe...you know it, right?

[Seekinganswers30]

Yes, everything you wrote is what I've been hoping to happen, but meeting people in person seems almost mythical in this city for the last 20 years but I'll keep hoping. My goal is to continue to meet people off the internet and enjoy their company and if I never see them again at least I had someone to have dinner with. Had dinner with a great woman just last night but I feel like I may be getting the I didn't feel the chemistry comment again from her in a couple days. We will see but I'm slowly returning to my old self who takes things as they come.

Your comment about knowing the right one has come along is something I have been talking to myself about as a worry because that is what I felt with the ex. I thought she was the one. Ironically my very first impression when I saw her was not attraction. Her father is 6'7 and she has his bone structure and her face would not be considered attractive at all. But we sat down and started talking and 3 hours later the restaurant is closed and I'm captivated by her charisma. I even complimented her how impressed I was that we could lose track of time talking like that and instead of taking the compliment about us she says that's no big deal for her because she can talk like that to anyone. So a little jab right at the beginning and I just kept missing them.  We go out a second time and eat and walk. She texts me within five minutes of getting home and tells me she wants me to know that she really wanted to kiss me and thinks I'm attractive. She had me right there. I didn't even consider looking at another woman from that day forward. I have never had any woman compliment me so openly and honestly and leave themselves vulnerable like that. Then the texts kept coming with compliments and she actually apoligized for living at home and going to church and she hopes I won't think less of her. I didn't know anything about mirroring, or love bombing, I just thought I could finally stop worrying about mind games and mind reading and I found my soul mate who would be honest with me no matter what. She always wears sports bras and loose clothing so I thought she was very thin. Third date she shows up in this tight dress and she has an amazing body that I had no idea she had and I thought again it was fate rewarding me. I was not superficial with her at all about not being attracted to her face and I just really came to admire and fall for her personality and suddenly I get this surprise.
So I was convinced about a month into dating that I loved her and I had 2 different dreams about how I would propose to her in a year or so. I honestly can tell you that if someone told me that it would end with a text dumping and her threatening to call the police on me I would have said this was impossible.

So the next time, hopefully there is a next time, I feel like I met the one, I'll just slow myself down and listen better and remember this experience and how I acted. The scariest thing I read in Cluster B research is that the majority of idealization lasts about 3 months but some can continue until you do marry them. If what I seen in month 4 with her had not happened until a year later I would have been married and ruined. So I certainly hope to never meet someone capable of hiding their true selves for over a year.

[LoveOnTheRocks]

Yep...I know...I experienced some of the same things with my x that you experienced with yours.  It's typical fare for the personality, I think.  
I don't think you will have any of these troubles you fear with the one who really steals your heart (and you hers).  My husband and I knew after several months...and things were solid/stable...none of these "strange things happening" that would have to happen to go a year with someone and not know you were dealing with a personality disorder.
My mom recently made the comment to me that there's something wrong with all of us when we were talking about mental illnesses.  I sort of took offense, a little, but upon further thinking, you know, I think she's about right on with that one.  That said, there is this much (picture my thumb and index finger showing you an inch) and there is that much (picture my arms far out to my sides and my hands showing you a distance of about 5'7")...I think you get it...
The thing is...healthier people attract healthier people and desperate or needy, etc. attract less healthy people.  I'm not in the mental or scientific profession...Im in the legal field...so, I have no right drawing these conclusions...but honestly, I think I've seen enough to say this is spot on...So, you goal, for yourself, is to not NEED like that, so you can be the most objective about what you see and don't see.
That said...we all give off vibes, too.  It's unconscious.  We all are attracted to certain physical or other attributes, and when we see them in others, we warm considerably and even give off non spoken language, via our eyes, our attentiveness, etc.  It will blow your mind how easy it was to spot your girl when you do.  Not a lot of thought involved or needed from my experience...and if, like me, you are hesitant, or even deep into your head set against it (, but true)...you wont miss the chance when she comes around...because you will get all the chances you need for both of you to get it right.  I've lived it, so I have a lot of confidence in what I am saying to you.

I think I need to back off, because I've overtaken your thread (your process), in your journey of working thru your stuff with the "x"...and I never meant to do that...but I got inspired...and just wanted to encourage you, as like all of us, I saw you "in your head" with some stuff, and I wanted to share my thoughts on some of your comments.  Fact is...just from your writing and story, I KNOW you are going to be absolutely AOK...and you will get the girl, too...but I want so much for you to have more right now...and to love yourself and the life you've got, here and now, because what's not to love?  Im serious...
The truth is, even if you don't try at all, when a genuinely interesting someone comes around you (physically), you are going to be so inspired in the moment that you make some sort of move that is going to lead to another one. We can't help ourselves...and I absolutely do believe in divine providence.  How could I not?  If you read my story, my husband and I, who do not work 9-5 at the courthouse, but are in and out as our careers deemed, literally did not see each other for a full 3 years of being right there...then, when I was ready (and didn't know it), I saw him and all of a sudden, I saw him there all the time.  (OK, it's fair to say he probably made that happen by taking the tasks at that particular building more readily than he had in the past so he could be there, I have never actually asked...), but certainly, how could we, for 3 years, be doing our jobs there, and neither one of us never have seen or noticed each other one time? (fyi, we are both people who would have noticed each other, because when I did notice him, he looked like a dang model...super fine, if I might say so myself, and I just don't see me missing someone that fine if we actually did pass by each other).  Fact is, we had help from somewhere...is my opinion.  Either blinders or interruption of our schedule so that until the time was right, it was ensured that we didn't meet is my best thoughts.  I might sound totally crazy saying that out loud, but tell me how this happened, and then once we met, I literally saw him all the time from then on (at least 2 or 3 times a week).

So, this is my testimony.  You CAN trust God (or fate, or karma or whatever you are comfortable with at this time).  ...and until then, you can thank Him (or the others) for giving you such good insight into what happened so that you didn't make the mistake of making ms. right now out to be ms. right, and living out a nightmare...You can trust that somebody up there likes you, has your back, and will make absolutely certain that when it's time, it will be on!
(I hope I am not getting on your nerves.  I want you to smile and be happy and feel better...I certainly do, just writing my story out and remembering it all.  Even IN what brings me here now...I have no business worrying...I am now remembering how it really is and that I can trust God, work on me, and be ok...because it really is going to be ok!).
All the best, Seeking!  LOTR

[Seekinganswers30]

Saw a couple making out today and it hit me in the gut like a hammer that I'll never do that again with my ex and the thought of doing that with me again to her is out of the question and possibly horrifying. Had to call my friend and he calmed me down by saying all the plans and compliments she gave me at one time were based on her feelings for that day. The next day she could tell me the exact opposite or forget she had said the previous things because every decision she makes and things she says are based on her current feelings and that is not someone I want in my life as it is dangerous.

[Seekinganswers30]

I already have a vampire novel published on Amazon and I've been thinking about using this experience and writing another novel based on it called the Borderline/Narcissist I met Online. I will change the names and her family business obviously but the things that were said from the first date right up until now would be accurate. I'm wondering if anyone knows if that would get me in trouble? Can I get sued if she happened to come across my book on Amazon once it was published. I don't expect to sell many, it would be more of a purpose/goal. my life just fells empty right now and writing a novel would kill a lot of time, but I don't want to deal with being sued for character assassination, invasion of privacy, fraud, etc.. Please let me know if I could get in legal trouble for writing about this.

[Wicker Man]

Please let me know if I could get in legal trouble for writing about this.

You had are coming down from a disastrous relationship found online... I would not crowd source legal advice.  If you are going to spend the time and energy to write a novel then go spend an hour with a contract lawyer -it is a good investment^*. 

^* My father lost a year of his life developing a show without proper rights.

Further, if I may, you should write about something else.  I am not sure that level of rumination would help you on your path to healing.  Further you and your ex are in an acrimonious state -writing about your relationship could be seen as an open declaration of war with someone who may have a serious mental illness. 

'Ground on which we can only be saved from destruction by fighting without delay, is desperate ground.'
                                                                               --Sun Tzu

Never put an opponent on desperate ground they will have no choice but to commit to total war.  If backed into a corner we can all be dangerous -never put someone in that situation -you may find out exactly how dangerous they can be at your own peril.

--just walk away.

[Cromwell]

if the objective here is not so much to make money, just go ahead and write it. By the time you finish it you might be in a different place of healing and may decide at that point if it is something you want to market or not. Get some legal advice and consider it a first draft that may have to be revised for legal reasons, or not.

From just my own personal journey, im inclined to agree with Wicker Man here, I found it worked better to spend time on new hobbies completely unrelated to BPD or what id been through. I once thought about painting and what she might look like on canvas, then scrapped the idea. I think it was therapeutic to write out a lot of emotional tension here, but for writing books etc, it feels too much like cementing the pain into a solid form and making a relic out of it, rather than just a transient evaporation of emotion heat into vapour, life goes on and little to no trace of what happened.

Many (often very good) books are written in anger. but think forward a bit, there might come a point where you might regret having something so personal made open to the mass market.

I think youd be ok to write it as a work of fiction, it might be hard to discern the two for the lay reader anyway.

As an aside, Harry Potter makes more sense to me than my ex ever will, you could be on to something profitable there... good luck either way.

[Seekinganswers30]

So after being extremely stubborn I'm finally trying to listen to everyone and have been in no contact for almost a month. I'm still doing way too much ruminating. Been caught up in victim syndrome far too much as well. One of my problems is that my brain has been so taken over by this for so long that I'm bored thinking of most other things.

The last couple days I've been trying a few new things and it has helped a little bit. I have had a lot of memories lately of things that she really seemed interested in/enjoyed the first 3 months and then suddenly when her mask fell she didn't like them. I can see for sure that she was doing mirroring now and this woman I miss so much really wasn't her, just an act to idealize me in the beginning. It's a little frustrating though to know that the first woman I truly bonded with in 20 years was acting. Makes me feel hopeless for the future. I've done a lot of dating the last 6 months and only 1 woman even came close to what I had with my ex. So I'm focusing on no contact by reminding myself the woman I want to contact is not actually alive, the woman insulting and threatening me is the real her and a future with her even if she wanted it would be torture. How can you raise children with someone who contradicts themselves on a regular basis? I was walking on eggshells and losing my mind after just a month of being devalued.

I am being very careful with thoughts of her with someone else as well as focusing on that feels like death. I am reminding myself that my mind has been hell for the last month together and the 7 months after. I'm the strongest person my friends know, very type A and I've been turned into jelly by her psychological abuse so when I think of her with someone else I have to immediately think she is toxic and almost destroyed my mind with her behaviour.

Any other advice to help me heal would be helpful though. That first 3 month woman I wanted to marry and grow old with and I miss the potential so much even though it was a fantasy. I know we can't control the way people act, I just wish she had stayed the same even though it's not rational.

I'm also very conflicted over the way things ended between us. I tried so hard to be polite and explain to her why I wanted to see her again and she turned what I said into me causing discomfort, lying, gaslighting and stalking. So if she is going to be irrational when I'm the one who has been hurt and abused then I'm going to call her out on the way she treated me. It was a no win situation, I could slink off into the night with her slander or I could defend myself and call her out on how terrible she treated me. I was truly attached to this woman and never even looked at another woman while we were together. I would have given her my everything for the rest of my life and she ends up telling me I'm the worst experience of her life. The dozens and dozens of hours we spent happy in each others arms turns into the greatest nightmare of my life and I'll always regret how this got so ugly.

[Seekinganswers30]

I know i am working on providing my own validation but I would really like some comments from others who have experienced this type of thing before. I wanted to show you the message I sent a month ago that led to my ex completely exploding on me and ask how that message below could possibly lead to these nasty remarks from her a day later. This is what finally woke me up to stop tying to contact her as it is hopeless and just makes me more confused. Please let me know that I am not out of line. My friends and family have been on my side through all of this and they don't understand where she is coming up with this either.

Her comments:
"Your justification for things is completely inaccurate and fabricated and to the point of psychological manipulation (the professional term is called gaslighting)!  I feel you are now to the point of being verbally abusive, a threat and stalker and causing great discomfort (which is also a form of abuse of power)!"

This is my message the day before that led to that outburst.
"Yesterday I thought of the conversation you had with my mom about how relationships are hard work. We were making plans together right up until things blew up so I didn't see it coming. With your compassion for others and how religion is high on forgiveness and second chances I am stuck trying to think what I could have done to make you leave me without a conversation in person or on the phone. I don't blame you at all, you leaving woke me up that there was work to be done to better myself, but I see no reason why we could not have talked again to see if we could build a stronger bond. We had one disagreement in 4 months that's a pretty healthy relationship. I broke down when you left and chased you further away because I was attached to you, I felt safe with you and I trusted you. You are the first woman who let me spend Christmas with her family and the first to tell me she thought she was pregnant. I intended to spend the rest of my life supporting you. I can't take my mistakes back until I find that time machine and stop myself from sending you that text which is one of the greatest regrets of my life.
I get paid to fix mistakes. I improve my weaknesses, that's actually one of my strengths. I wanted you to at least know about the improvements I  made. If I refused to watch the news when you asked then you should leave but I fixed that immediately. I wanted to go on road trips and plane trips anywhere with you. My dream is to travel with the woman I care about. It's what I have been waiting for and when I found it with you we didn't get to do it. You were unhappy with me for not going enough places and i wanted to take you places. Tragic miscommunication! It was truly magical when you were in my arms and how I could give you goosebumps with just one kiss on the neck. I couldn't walk away from you in silence. There is research on how the brain is overdosed with chemicals when facing the loss of someone you love and I was not strong enough to stay calm and give you space to rethink your decision, I panicked.
If you saw me we don't have to talk about the bad feelings of the past, just get to know each other again like when we first met. We had a rare connection together. I've dated enough to know when I found someone special. I will accept whatever plan the universe has for us but we need to at least make the effort to see each other in person. I hope that helped explain why I have been slow to move on from you. You have always been more than just another woman I dated for awhile."

[LoveOnTheRocks]

I know i am working on providing my own validation but I would really like some comments from others who have experienced this type of thing before. I wanted to show you the message I sent a month ago that led to my ex completely exploding on me and ask how that message below could possibly lead to these nasty remarks from her a day later. This is what finally woke me up to stop tying to contact her as it is hopeless and just makes me more confused. Please let me know that I am not out of line. My friends and family have been on my side through all of this and they don't understand where she is coming up with this either.

Her comments:
"Your justification for things is completely inaccurate and fabricated and to the point of psychological manipulation (the professional term is called gaslighting)!  I feel you are now to the point of being verbally abusive, a threat and stalker and causing great discomfort (which is also a form of abuse of power)!"

This is my message the day before that led to that outburst.
"Yesterday I thought of the conversation you had with my mom about how relationships are hard work. We were making plans together right up until things blew up so I didn't see it coming. With your compassion for others and how religion is high on forgiveness and second chances I am stuck trying to think what I could have done to make you leave me without a conversation in person or on the phone. I don't blame you at all, you leaving woke me up that there was work to be done to better myself, but I see no reason why we could not have talked again to see if we could build a stronger bond. We had one disagreement in 4 months that's a pretty healthy relationship. I broke down when you left and chased you further away because I was attached to you, I felt safe with you and I trusted you. You are the first woman who let me spend Christmas with her family and the first to tell me she thought she was pregnant. I intended to spend the rest of my life supporting you. I can't take my mistakes back until I find that time machine and stop myself from sending you that text which is one of the greatest regrets of my life.
I get paid to fix mistakes. I improve my weaknesses, that's actually one of my strengths. I wanted you to at least know about the improvements I  made. If I refused to watch the news when you asked then you should leave but I fixed that immediately. I wanted to go on road trips and plane trips anywhere with you. My dream is to travel with the woman I care about. It's what I have been waiting for and when I found it with you we didn't get to do it. You were unhappy with me for not going enough places and i wanted to take you places. Tragic miscommunication! It was truly magical when you were in my arms and how I could give you goosebumps with just one kiss on the neck. I couldn't walk away from you in silence. There is research on how the brain is overdosed with chemicals when facing the loss of someone you love and I was not strong enough to stay calm and give you space to rethink your decision, I panicked.
If you saw me we don't have to talk about the bad feelings of the past, just get to know each other again like when we first met. We had a rare connection together. I've dated enough to know when I found someone special. I will accept whatever plan the universe has for us but we need to at least make the effort to see each other in person. I hope that helped explain why I have been slow to move on from you. You have always been more than just another woman I dated for awhile."

Too bad I'm already married and aging.  I would snag you up in a heartbeat.  Whew, what a great and sweet letter.  You asked for us to respond to what, in your letter, caused her to react the way she did.  Here is my response...not a thing...not one thing...your letter is poignant and beautiful and I wish I could get one of those for myself.
Chin up, fella...and it's too bad you're pining away for this girl...she's a whit and doesn't know how special you are, imo.

[Seekinganswers30]

Thank you so much. I'm happy to hear as she turned something so beautiful into something cruel.

[LoveOnTheRocks]

Agreed.  We know this of the borderline personality.  Now, you have the experience, and that, sadly, is your major takeaway, which hurts deeply, but reality dictates.  Listen...my friend...from where I sit, if it means anything at all, I continue to say that a sweet and special young man such as yourself won't have too much trouble with finding and keeping true love.  I join you in sadness over the events of what has occurred, but again, chin up, as you have much to look forward to.  All the best.  LOTR

[Seekinganswers30]

Saw her at the gym a few days ago and stayed away. She had a look of shock when she saw me on the way out. I was actually surprised to see that she had gained some weight in her bum and legs but I didn't take any pleasure from it. She was on a starvation diet when she broke up with me but had periods of binge eating in her past so who knows what has happened since she left me. I still so desperately wanted to just go have a conversation with her like we used to so I guess even though I've been in no contact for almost 6 weeks I was kind of getting rejected again.

I have been seeing more and more how she was mirroring me the first 3 months. She was fascinated by everything we talked about and what I was up to each day. I know it's a rabbit hole but it bothers me that she said she lost interest in me because she was bored and we had nothing in common when I was praised for the very same things in the beginning. It wouldn't even matter how irrational her answers were but I really want to talk to her about what exactly it was she was bored with and what she thinks we didn't have in common, because her favourite thing to do is travel and I would have went anywhere with her. When she had a rage/anxiety attack I could wrap her in my arms and clam her down in 30 seconds. She said I was the best ever at playing with her hair and relaxing her. Then suddenly we have nothing in common. Those are a couple of extremely huge benefits that she threw away and seems to have erased from ever happening. I do realize I have to stay away and not justify her delusions of me being a threat and a stalker who causes her discomfort but it is so frustrating to lose someone so important by her hiding behind a cell phone. She wrote me 5 times in the span of her leaving me from December to July and each message actually made me more confused and each of her messages grew more hostile and negative as they progressed.

It's funny how my mind is so sure that if I had married her or even just dated her for a year or two she would have still snapped on me for something else eventually and probably still left me with a text break-up. And that would have devastated me far worse. Yet I still am so sad and frustrated that she would blindside me with a text dump 30 minutes before a shopping trip together and then cut me off cold turkey from ever being able to see her again in person. I've never encountered this before in my life. All my other breakups made sense while this one seems like it could be fixed so easily yet still impossible to do as she insults me more and more with each communication.

Called my friend last night to talk me down from a texting her urge and writing here today for further help. Thank you.

[LoveOnTheRocks]

Choose you!  That is my advice.  YOU are so worth it!