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Author Topic: Is Light as a Fairly approach even possible w/a raging aggressive Non-quiet BPD  (Read 730 times)
PeaceMom
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« on: August 08, 2019, 08:12:15 PM »

I really need some help here. I love the light as a fairly approach. In theory I resonate with it deeply. I’ve been using it with my two sons with BiPolar and it works. However, it is impossible with my raging, threatening, explosive 19DD uBpd.

Everyday is a huge life or death issue for her. Everyday is fraught with interpersonal drama. Anything I say in response to her oversharing and desperate need of help from me on a daily basis is met with a response that is so toxic, shocking, disarming, etc that there is zero way to be light. All she thinks about/talks about are her huge messes and issues. And since we are home together I hear it all. I can’t stand it.

She was upset today and said she prays everyday that I’ll have a heart attack and die. I’m pretty good at ignoring this abuse as I generally see it as coming from one with mental illness, but in between her abuse she’s texting friends, taking selfies etc.
I feel like I’m living in a horror movie. Please give examples of light as a fairly w/an explosive loud BPD teenage girl who lives with you 24/7.  Thank you
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« Reply #1 on: August 08, 2019, 09:56:37 PM »

Mine isn't living with me, but I can give you a great example.  Tonight I picked her up at the halfway house she lives in and we spent a great 4.5 hours together, talking the entire time, about ourselves, our lives, each other...all of it.  She continues to choose to date the narcissistic boyfriend who just a week ago was caught trying to set up dates with another girl, and two weeks ago, the police were called, because he was seen beating her on the side of the road as they walked.
I have expressed my feelings to her about him, then I got light as a feather from then on.  She can talk about him, their plans, the whole nine yards, and I just listen and smile and ask questions if I am able to engage the topic about him.  Its her life and her choice and her decision, and I am light as a feather on the subject.

I don't know how to live with my daughter (or anyone else) who rages their wishes at me to have a heart attack and die.  Mental illness or not, that's over the line and beyond my willingness to engage, and she would be evicted from my house...mental illness or not...if she treated me that way.  It's part of why mine was shown directions to halfway houses, and it's done mine a world of good...humbled her quite nicely.  The best of it is, she is actually engaging in her life now...actively interviewing, setting up school schedule for herself, etc...she gets help with the volunteers, counselors at the halfway house, and others...and is learning how to live with the other girls in the facility...and I get to be light as a feather...listening, asking questions, enjoying her...I am loving this, and in spite all of my fears, I am seeing my daughter growing...finally.  I am not advising you to put yours out, only identifying that for us, this behavior was unacceptable and undoable long term, because it was ripping the life out of me and I was getting desperate and suicidal and hopeless...and it had to change...so we changed it...and I am glad I took the plunge, because come to find out, my daughter can and will get a life when she has no other options...Oh, and she doesn't really want to come back to my house, either...which is fair...it means neither of us was growing and thriving under the circumstances, and when we were living together in such a toxic environment.

A 19yrold is grown, even if highly immature and under developed socially or otherwise, and her focus needs to be on developing a way to take care of herself longer term, be it school or work.  She shouldn't have time to sit around and mope and gripe about her life.  My daughter used to get up at noon and park in front of the television all day...WAY too much time to sit and contemplate how bad her life was, and it really was, because that was all she did and that was no life.  Now, she gets up and out of that place she lives in, goes on interviews then to the library and all through our greater town, and she is active and engaged all day...and it's made a world of difference in who and how she is and feels.  Nothing changes until SOMETHING changes. Change things.
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PeaceMom
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« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2019, 07:18:32 AM »

Starting eviction proceeding feels like climbing Mt Everest to me as I’m exhausted and weak. It will require some miracle of energy as I file papers, post notices, sit with her rage for the required time period, find halfway houses that are safe, pack her, escort her out, etc. She has PTSD from her past behavior -some her fault, some not and is terrified of sex traffickers, abusers, assaulters, etc. We live in the suburb of a huge city where all this goes on and is fairly well known.

I’ll give a little more background to share how we got to this horrible place. DD is logical and rational about 20% of time so we all get confused about her “apparent competence” (this is a clinical term) . I go about trying to help her problem solve using logic (there are always huge problems to solve-job losses, car wrecks, insurance, miscarriages, BF breakups, speeding tickets, identity theft on her credit card, struggle with her online college class, reprimand from boss at PT job-this is DAILY for her —and then me) Shari Manning talks about this as “Unrelenting Crisis”.
I get so into trying to give her logical answers, but then her 80% cognitive dysfunction takes over and she’s pissed and confused and rages. I can’t go from problem solving to validation all day long. I get zero out of our relationship as she gives nothing.
I’ve always wondered “if not me, who?” will help her.

I’ve been to about 4 therapists over 6 years and I truly overwhelm them and get no sage advice-especially when I add in my 2 older sons who
Live her w/BP. They are stable right now and trying to rebuild their lives. My 3rd son lives here too and is in his senior yr of college. Poor kid has extreme anxiety.

LOTR, I liked your example of light as a fairy and could easily play along if DD wasn’t here and if I popped into her world for a few hours-easy breezy. So glad things are better for you

I so appreciate any insight and wisdom from this group.
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FaithHopeLove
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« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2019, 07:23:09 AM »

I don't think there is a "light as a fairy" response to someone wishing you dead. That is where boundaries come in. I just posted this article for someone else. It may be helpful for you too. Setting Boundries
What would happen if you just walked away and refused to engage?
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PeaceMom
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« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2019, 08:02:01 AM »

I’m gearing up now for what will happen today. Yes the boundary is and should be I do not listen to being called stupid and praying I die of heart attack. I suppose if I’m in car driving her somewhere I pull over and calmly ask her to get out. That will be ugly. My H works from home but has had to rent office space which we are not reimbursed for just to get away from her.

I feel like we are a lost cause. Sad when I’ve spent time and money and no therapist can guide me. I honestly feel like I need a life coach to give me a list of what to do daily bc im in quicksand. I’ll tell her I won’t listen to verbal abuse and I will walk away or leave.
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FaithHopeLove
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« Reply #5 on: August 09, 2019, 08:35:09 AM »

This may sound weird but pretend you are your own life coach. What would you say to you today?
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PeaceMom
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« Reply #6 on: August 09, 2019, 08:40:08 AM »

Hm ok I’d say -remind DD of my boundary that I will not engage with her if she verbally abuses me with things like you are so stupid, you’re an idiot, I wish you would die right now.
Clean off patio and make it a respite, go get groceries for a healthy dinner, exercise, make a call about a possible apartment for DD, breathe, be extra extra nice to my inner child.

I typically am my daily life coach but my Wisemind is struggling amidst the abuse. Kind of like a captive being held hostage.
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« Reply #7 on: August 09, 2019, 09:11:51 AM »

We couldn't afford the apartment, plus with my child, she had life habits that would have prevented her from thriving.
The place she is at has other kids her age (17-21)...and many of them are like mine...and they all are learning and working to be capable of living with each other at this place.  There are house counselors, cooks, paid people, who all contribute, and it's helping my daughter to grow up and change.  I can't financially support my daughter for the rest of her life, and even still, if I could, what would happen to her if I was in an accident and no longer here?  

Reading your story, it seems to me that you could be putting a whole lot of responsibility on yourself, and in your heart, you don't really want to have to do all of this for this girl.
What real changes can you make here and what real benefits and consequences can you see if you were to do these changes? As exhausting as it would be to put her out, it sounds more exhausting to live in these conditions to me.
I am being honest. I am not trying to be hurtful...You sound really "over it" and "exhausted"...but also unwilling to change things other than how you talk with her, which isn't going to really fix what I see as at the core of what is bothering you. You want change, but sound fearful and like you would be shirking responsibility.  So, exactly how many more years are you responsible for housing this girl and giving her logical adult feedback?  She really is grown and really does need to take responsibility for herself at this point.  She has to learn how to sooth herself, talk to herself and work through her problems... Is she in therapy?  Is she doing her DBT workbook?  I found the entire workbook online in pdf yesterday.  I gave it to my daughter and asked her to use it so that she can help herself continue to grow and improve and so that she will get new and more skills to work with in her life.  If my daughter wants her daily pain to stop, she must take an active role in helping herself learn skills to handle the things that daily come up in her life. Since this is my attitude, she knows that while I am here, I am NOT here for every little thing, all day, every day, all the time.    
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FaithHopeLove
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« Reply #8 on: August 09, 2019, 09:15:46 AM »

Peace Mom, Your wise mind a.k.a. life coach is right there giving you great advice. Listen to her.
Hugs
Faith
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PeaceMom
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« Reply #9 on: August 09, 2019, 10:24:51 AM »

LOTR-
You are exactly correct in assessing my story. MyDD is so totally different from me, I’ve always felt as if it would be my lifetime mission and responsibility to care for her (like I would a child with Down Syndrome). She’s been in counseling off and on since5th  grade. Almost all of it useless bc of toughlove, swift consequences approach. Last summer I drove her everyday for10 weeks an 8 hour, door to door intensive DBT program 60 miles away. She says the coping skills don’t help her she still wants to die and feels hopeless.

Yes, I’m over it. My empathy is gone and now I’m just sad and angry about her sucking the life out of me and the rest of us.
As sad as I am for her and her disease, I’m worse off than she is. That’s the ironic part of this situation. My H and I fantasize about sneaking away in the middle of night.

What type of programs did you look up for these halfway houses? Ours are for recovering drug addicts and appear very sketchy at best. It seems enabling to put her up in apt, but if it literally saves my life, is that enabling?

Faith, thanks for being a cheerleader from the sidelines. I can usually gain strength to get thru the day, but it’s the exact same thing the next day.  I’m trying to tap into my Wisemind minute by minute.
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« Reply #10 on: August 09, 2019, 11:19:42 AM »

Hi Peacemom,
 Aren't you also trying to help a DS with college and he has hard times in the autumn , etc.?  I believe you have 2 other sons that have BPD but are at home and are stable ( I think I've read that correctly?).You are at your limit, Peacemom.  Plain and simple.  I am actually very concerned for your own well being and mental health, truth be told.  Please remind yourself you are as important as your daughter. 

You have mentioned going through 4 therapists- for your daughter ?  Since she is 19, you probably can't get a lot of information from the therapist due to HIPPA laws, so the next step is do you have your own therapist?   (I can't remember if you stated in the past that you have one for yourself?).   You need a game plan of getting your daughter launched and out , and you need support for this.  I feel the tremendous pain and guilt that you are experiencing.  Peacemom, you have done everything for your DD.  You have left no stone unturned.  I know you have pity that your DD also suffers from other issues in addition to BPD. 
LIfe is terrible at times , laws don't help our kids with mental illness, but within these confines of reality, us parents have to foist our kids out into adulthood anyway.  You are everything to all of your kids at great expense to yourself.  You count, Peacemom.  You are worth the effort you are going to have to take.  You are not alone, though.  We are here walking the walk with you.  I really would urge you to talk to your own therapist about helping you get a game plan ( and stick to it) about operation LEAVE for your DD. 

 Nothing changes if nothing changes. 

 
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« Reply #11 on: August 09, 2019, 11:57:53 AM »

Peacemom, you come first.

Especially when you have special needs kids.

The exhaustion level you describes reminds me of feelings I had married to my n/BPDx spouse. Living with him had become untenable for me and our son, but moving out and getting a divorce seemed equally daunting, if not more, and my cup was empty and filled with holes.

I spent a year preparing to take the next step. Just putting some effort into the plan seemed to put wind in my sails, although that last year was in no way easy. Like your DD19, my BPD sufferer would follow me around the house shouting, calling me names, insulting me -- I can feel my anxiety flare just thinking about that kind of abuse.

Your daughter is likely constantly triggered because having other special needs kids in the family means she is not the center of attention. So she rages at a level that is guaranteed to keep her in the frame. It's working (for her).

Is it accurate to say that your goal is to move her out?

There are ways to stage these things so that you can tolerate the anxiety that comes with change, especially when it's tied up in messy feelings like obligation, fear, and guilt.

Also, if skills mentioned here don't work in your situation, it's ok to try something else. We talk here sometimes about SET (support, empathy, truth). Sometimes, it works best to try SEt. Sometimes it's seT.

I can imagine, from what you've described, that light as a fairy actually triggers your daughter. If she is competing for scare resources (your attention) then light as a fairy might make her turn up the volume. What she might need is to know that mom has limits. When we give in to people with low frustration tolerance, we only decrease that frustration tolerance further. In one book I read, I remember reading that if a child believes her parent cannot tolerate her frustration, when she cannot be expected to tolerate it either.

SD22 becomes so anxious over the smallest things and rolls over everyone with a steamroller to get her needs met. She'll do anything to try and manage that anxiety, there seem to be no limits.

I'm learning to be light as a fairy so that she deals with her frustration on her own. There are other ways to put that responsibility for frustration tolerance back on our loved ones. Light as a fairy is one way. The other might be to say, No. Hold up your hand and repeat it over and over, saying it from the deepest, thickest part of your backbone.

My n/BPDx was 6 feet 2 and an intimidating presence when he was angry, which was often. One day I held up my hand and said STOP repeatedly while he berated me and called me names. I kept repeating it and repeating it. To my total shock, he seemed to turn into a little child right in front of my eyes. He looked sullen and pouted and went into his room and slammed the door, just like a little kid might do.

It didn't fix our marriage but it did give me hope that I could curb unhealthy behaviors. And seeing that skill work gave me confidence and strength to take care of myself.

It's one tiny step at a time, one foot forward, sometimes a few steps back, always in the right direction, finding things that work.
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Breathe.
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« Reply #12 on: August 09, 2019, 02:11:28 PM »

You all are making all the correct assumptions about me and my m.o.  Yes I have 3 struggling adult children at home plus one who is doing fairly well. I had a therapist for years who taught me tough love and kick them all out of next. She never understood how things look different with mental illness . I was always embarrassed by what appeared as my lack of backbone. I’ve consulted with several other therapists who claim to have experience w/BPD, adoption, BP, however after my paying $150 they seem completely overwhelmed and say things like “wow, may I suggest that you DO less”. I’ve had that from 2 other therapist. Professional advice to DO LESS.

My goal has always been to get them all stable and self sufficient enough to not live here. I’m not Co-dependent and get very little out of life here with them. It’s actually brings me physical pain just having you all realize the complete dysfunction and struggle in my family. It’s hard to share about all 4 of my kids huge struggles in the same blog. I typically share about 1 kid/one struggle at a time as It can be so offputting and it scares away helpful wise folks.
I do not know anyone with this level of struggle in their lives so I have no role models or examples. I have a friend group for 40 yrs and with them I am light as a fairy bc that’s my escape.
I’m so sorry to unload like this and I hate to be so needy but I’m gonna try to get a viable plan.
I appreciate your wise insight, friends.
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« Reply #13 on: August 09, 2019, 04:17:32 PM »

Please don't feel shame, Peacemom.  I truly have to think on this properly before answering.  Meanwhile you did mention about getting your daughter an apartment and would that be enabling?  I gently suggest backing up a step right here.  It appears she is / has been dysregulating to the point of verbal aggression. You mentioned she is raging, threatening and explosive.  Are you afraid she will turn physically aggressive towards you?  Has she already?
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« Reply #14 on: August 09, 2019, 04:52:08 PM »

LOTR-
You are exactly correct in assessing my story. MyDD is so totally different from me, I’ve always felt as if it would be my lifetime mission and responsibility to care for her (like I would a child with Down Syndrome). She’s been in counseling off and on since5th  grade. Almost all of it useless bc of toughlove, swift consequences approach. Last summer I drove her everyday for10 weeks an 8 hour, door to door intensive DBT program 60 miles away. She says the coping skills don’t help her she still wants to die and feels hopeless.

Yes, I’m over it. My empathy is gone and now I’m just sad and angry about her sucking the life out of me and the rest of us.
As sad as I am for her and her disease, I’m worse off than she is. That’s the ironic part of this situation. My H and I fantasize about sneaking away in the middle of night.

What type of programs did you look up for these halfway houses? Ours are for recovering drug addicts and appear very sketchy at best. It seems enabling to put her up in apt, but if it literally saves my life, is that enabling?

Faith, thanks for being a cheerleader from the sidelines. I can usually gain strength to get thru the day, but it’s the exact same thing the next day.  I’m trying to tap into my Wisemind minute by minute.

OK, I am talking about me.  I say that because after I respond to some of you sometimes, I feel as though I have been harsh with you when in fact I have only been honest.  Nothing I say here do I expect to be harsh, but you and I are different people, and I am talking about where I got to and what I had to do for me...and it's not advice as much as it's my experience...my journey.

I got to the EXACT place you describe above, and frankly (lets be frank), my child picked up on my emotions and feelings towards her.  Back then, she was literally saying to me "I just want you to love and respect me."  I did love her, but she had worn me out with all the stuff...and like you describe, I wanted out...away from...so...I moved us all in that direction.

First, I identified to her that she was not thriving in our home and in this environment. It was a fact.
Second, I rightfully concluded that if it continued as it was, as a family, we were never going to be happy. At first, it was hard...it really was...my daughter resisted the changes that I insisted on.  ...but I was being honest with myself.  I HAD to see what she could do for herself...IF she could do for herself...because everything I did for her was ineffective for a myriad of reasons, and ME ALONE...I didn't have it in me or enough in me to do as she needed.  I know you are feeling this, because it was pervasive in my life at the time.
I told my daughter that it was time for her to become a productive and responsible member of society.  I also told her that we weren't happy here like this, and that since she didn't have a car and we lived out in the country, she really didn't have access to life...She needed that.  She needed to become a whole person and if she did, she would likely feel much better about herself...and I was right.  The life she was living wasn't a good fit for her and she was unhappy about it, but she has to make her life flow for herself...personality disorder or not...

The story of how it went, as it unfolded is in my posts, which you can read (or you may have read).  I went through everything you are describing and going through.  I talked about it, day by day...but the last 3 times I've seen my daughter we've actually been close...bonded to each other...genuinely enjoying and loving each other's company...that's what I can tell you.  Yesterday was amazing.  I was excited (and she said she was too) because all day long I knew we had plans to meet, just she and me, and I was looking forward to it.  I wanted to hear about all she is up to...and she is up to stuff, Peacemom.

In our area, I googled and talked to people about resources for homeless girls...shelters for young girls...and once I told my daughter that our home was not a happy place and she needed to get access to the rest of the world and start by living in one of these places...because the outbursts and rage were constant (and she was getting physical)...I was sorry, but it was time for her to step out on her own.  I told her these places were available, and that she had to start there, or with a friend or whomever else, and she needed to secure a job and take care of herself. 
I knew these places existed because of the research I had done.  The minimum is 60 days places, where they get food, there are tons of volunteers who donate time, money, resources, you name it to these places...and almost all of them have TRAINED counselors who either help them or refer them on to higher level counselors...then they have college programs for these girls, and where my daughter is they have tons of job placement programs that work specifically with these girls...good money, and the girls have to put in 60% of their check to savings so they can eventually move out.  Then when they move, the place has a program where they pay first months rent and security deposit so the girl takes her savings and all she has to do is pay the next month's rent...

I am suggesting you look up and look outside yourself for the help you know you need here...and the help of the tribe that is out there for her.  She is not thriving...has not thrived...and likely wont thrive if she remains in the  environment all of you are in right now.  It's time...I think...it certainly was for us. 

My daughter and I talked about all the rage she had yesterday.  It was a little tense...but I was able to help her and me heal by telling her how sorry I was for losing it sometimes when she lost it...for the things I said.  I have missed her so much...who would have ever thought I could? She and I are actually bonding now...but it first had to be the hard step for both of us to break out of the cycle we were in, honestly.  No, I don't have BPD, and yes, she does...but I am no savior, and I could not save her or fix her life...and she was not even living a life...
and she was keeping me from living mine by hanging on to my home, consuming and messing and raging and just nothing positive.

These places have rules she has to follow...and she does to retain her spot.
She has to get along with the other girls or risk getting points...and after so many points she has to do community service.
and she knows she cannot move back here because of how bad it was...and she even doesn't want to come here and says so.

...but she is engaged and is engaging.  She's going on job interviews.  Told me about the 3 points she got and that she is determined not to get anymore...

the positives go on and on.  Sure, there could be an issue and I can more readily be there for her if there is one, to listen, talk, share in her pain...

When things at my house were as you describe them at yours, I really couldn't be there for her...not in my heart... I was overwhelmed by her and just so tired of her and her stuff.





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« Reply #15 on: August 09, 2019, 04:55:59 PM »

Start with calls to the womens shelters in your area, first.  From there, you will likely learn about more resources for a young lady her age.  We had several things to choose from here that weren't about addiction and drugs, because in our case, that wasn't the issue.
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« Reply #16 on: August 09, 2019, 05:06:30 PM »

Also, if you read my threads, it wasn't candy, flowers and sunshine when I first told her the change had to come...it was hard for all of us...really difficult...everyone had their feelings to process...and she literally had to do change, too...but we kept the lines of communication open as much as possible and I did not break my will to stand by what my husband and I knew was truth, which was our home was not an ok place to live for any of us.
We've been in a process...and I trust your family can do this, too...if you want to.

I have not abandoned her.  Last night we did Walmart, dinner and spoke about her needs.  This place has all sorts of volunteer doctors, dentists, obgyns, eye doctors...the list goes on and on, but she has her needs and she and I discussed that if, for example, she needs eyeglasses and cant get them, I need to know so I can handle it...
Our family needs these resources, because she has done absolutely nothing to secure her own place, and I am literally unable to meet all of her needs...there are just so many...but using the resources out there, I am still here, and meeting those things that aren't met elsewhere...as she continues to grow into a self sufficient woman...but she is now working on it, and before, she was all sorts of dysregulated and lost.

She wants to go into the coast guard, but has a minor issue keeping that from happening at the moment, so she is working on college in the meantime and getting a job.
Who would have imagined we'de be here?

Chin up, Peacemom...it really is going to be ok.  You will reach your place and know in your heart what you need to do to be ok...and when mom is ok...
smile.
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« Reply #17 on: August 09, 2019, 05:14:36 PM »

Quickly in response to Swimmy-I feel very physically safe. We would absolutely call police if we felt she might harm us.
You guys are absolutely lovely to help me think thru this mess.
LOTR-I need to reread thru your wise response again. Please know, I’m rarely offended by anyone’s observation and/or advice. I’ve not read one post on this site where I believed any poster had anything but good honest intentions. Why would we be here!
You are sharing your story and I resonate with so much of it.
Keep talking, I’m listening!
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« Reply #18 on: August 10, 2019, 08:17:28 AM »

Good Morning Peacemom:
It has taken all this not for me to have boundaries, but for her to honor them. If you revisist some of my posts, I was not "allowed" in my own house to walk away from the volatile rants...she literally refused to allow me to do that and would physically resist allowing me to move away from them.  Also, she would not accept my spoken boundaries, when she felt I needed to provide this or do that for her and I refused to for what I know were my good reasons...and she would begin her abusive rants.
Looking back, and being honest about all the reasons I had to separate from her...they weren't just...Im fed up.  not at all.
Want to clarify this.
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« Reply #19 on: August 10, 2019, 09:08:53 AM »

lotr
Separating from your DD was necessary and your only option. If we had the physical aspect I think it would be easier for me to actually kick her out. Isn’t it odd how we are so much more long suffering when we have no physical wounds, but merely deep cuts on our hearts, souls and minds?

I’m “long suffering” to a fault, not in a martyr position, but in a very quiet way. I also checked with a dear logical friend yesterday to see if she saw any CoDependent tendencies in me. She said absolutely not. She sees me as simply helping my Sick kids with the ultimate goal to get them GONE and requiring nothing in return except their absence and their ability to be self sufficient. She also noted that human nature is basically a selfish endeavor even when cloaked as doing something “for” another. So we summarized my current m.o. as me overdoing for my kids who are struggling with MH issues bc they truly lack so many many skills related to cognitive function. I’ve read that a severe MH episode is like a seizure in the brain and can take months to return to baseline, so here I sit waiting for stability in 3 of my kids. It sucks (pardon my French)
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livednlearned
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« Reply #20 on: August 10, 2019, 09:25:26 AM »

She never understood how things look different with mental illness . I was always embarrassed by what appeared as my lack of backbone.

Having kids on the spectrum and/or kids with mental illness is exhausting. It's absolutely nonstop no break work work work. You have three kids plus a husband with similar traits. The fact you haven't run away to join the circus tells me your backbone is made out of steel, PeaceMom.

My sense is that you feel so worked over there isn't even enough strength to carve out a small oasis in your day. Maybe coming here can be that for you. Imagine this as a source of fresh spring water where you rehydrate. Everyone here is at the same watering hole with you.

I sometimes feel embarrassed with my therapist, too. And with women in my friend circle. Everyone is taking turns hosting a game we all play and I'm too embarrassed to have people to our house because none of them have kids and/or step kids like mine. I have an advanced degree but I can't seem to get my 18 year old son to shower or brush his teeth. I've been in therapy and posting on these boards to help figure out how to feel like the home I bought with my H belongs to me and not SD22.

We live in a house of intense power struggles and I am not someone who wants to fight. The power struggles are not about the topics, though. They are just many different ways for people to say they come first, me second, if I matter at all.

I don't want to be in a power struggle with other people because it's not my way and I feel drained getting into the ring. But conceding doesn't help either. I've sort of reframed it to be about fighting for self preservation. I started to do it under the radar because it was so fragile and now I'm getting better at doing it while it's happening. I can count on one hand times I've fought for something and felt the kind of ease and clarity I was hoping to feel. Mostly, I cringe when a new form of the old power struggles occur and I don't feel ready or prepared. Then, I have to gather the strength to deal with it after the fact, which I find much harder. My therapist compares it to a muscle and while I don't care for the metaphor, it is largely accurate.

By coming here and sharing what you're dealing with, you are in the gym  
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« Reply #21 on: August 10, 2019, 09:41:09 AM »

LNL,
I have an advanced degree too and was well on my way to a rewarding, stimulating career when I had to stop under the pretense of being given the gift of being a “stay at home mom”.

None of my friends truly believe my 3 kids have MH diagnoses because we’ve worked so hard to help them appear “normal”. Now my 2nd DS w/BP 1 has had 4 manic s cycles that have led to over 20 ERs, acute care hospitals, RTCs, PHP IOPs but we’ve done all that quietly and behind the scenes to respect his privacy. Thank you for reminding me about the work work work. I hear you and feel you.

I, too, hate conflict hence my “Peacemom” name. I grew up feeling like I would do my best in life to be self sufficient and burden no one. So I tend to be resentful when my family burdens me and live in perpetual confusion about their “apparent competence”. What can they do, what are they unable to do? This is my life’s work-helping them to figure this out.

I will drink at the well with you all. I love that visual
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livednlearned
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« Reply #22 on: August 10, 2019, 10:01:18 AM »

What can they do, what are they unable to do? This is my life’s work

I live that same question every day, sometimes it feels like every minute. 

If I had to summarize what people suggest, it's "They have to be independent but you should do everything for them so they can be like that."
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« Reply #23 on: August 10, 2019, 10:30:05 AM »

Yes, LNL but what does that look like for us moms? That’s my m.o. every single day and why I keep seeking, researching and looking for answers. I was instructed by my last long term therapist to QUIT researching. She saw it as a type of unhealthy addiction. Ha! I see it as a way to give myself hope and to share that with my kids.

It is also why I do everything in my power to help them with education. I’m starting to feel like I should have pushed for developing a trade instead.

I so understand about not hosting Bunco night. It’s embarrassing and not who you really are at your core. So much of my life is not being true to myself.

Would love some practical examples of how helping them become as independent as possible looks when they are disabled yet appear too functioning for government services, etc. This is a full time job in my house with only tiny baby steps being made here.
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« Reply #24 on: August 10, 2019, 10:50:01 AM »

I was instructed by my last long term therapist to QUIT researching. She saw it as a type of unhealthy addiction.

Do we see the same therapist?  

It's probably a control thing that also happens to be helpful. Until someone comes into my home and offers hands-on help, I will continue to read and learn and research.

Would love some practical examples of how helping them become as independent as possible looks when they are disabled yet appear too functioning for government services, etc. This is a full time job in my house with only tiny baby steps being made here.

This board is all about tiny baby steps! One silver lining I am learning to appreciate -- age matters. What we do matters, but it happens so slowly it's like watching paint dry. The young adult launch is already a nail biter, but having neuroatypical kids plus this new "emerging adulthood" phase that lasts for most of the 20s makes things even harder. Even so, I notice little changes that I never thought were possible and it gives me hope.

Also, it took me years to realize I could not be both mom and dad to my son (before remarrying). I had to choose one -- be a mom -- for my own mental health, and also, trying to be both wasn't working. We've sort of healed that one issue, and now it's almost like we freed up to space to work on the next issue. Except S18 has been in and out of hospitals for the past year, so it's now trying to figure out how to parent a medically ill ASD young adult with anxiety/depression and trauma.  Frustrated/Unfortunate (click to insert in post)

I've been thinking about joining the Aspergers Experts community (it costs money) just to connect with people struggling with the same issues I do: https://www.aspergerexperts.com/plus/

For me, the whole thing is connected. If I am exhausted by S18's needs, it's hard to have much left over for SD22, and vice versa.

SS20 lives with his mom, but he is a lot like my son, except uBPD mom discourages him from pursuing his interests, which I will never understand.

SD25 just finished grad school while living with us. She's neurotypical but deeply affected by her siblings and uBPD mom. Probably in another home she would be considered high needs but in our house she was considered high functioning  
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« Reply #25 on: August 10, 2019, 06:11:26 PM »

LNL,
You make some very investing points here. First I must say how sorry I am that your son is struggling with several things including medical issues. That must be really hard on you to orchestrate the best care for him with so many moving parts.
Will he finish HS?
The Asperger Expert group seems well worth it and I would quickly press the join button before you talk yourself out if it. You might gain insight that we could never provide on this forum.
I’ve hesitated to bring up my boys w/BiPolar here, but I searched the forum and it has come up a lot so I decided to come clean (ha) and share.
You’ve mentioned the Lobel book several times today. I read a year or so ago, but was simply trying to figure out if DD may have BPD (no one had ever mentioned it, but I kept researching). Now I will go reread the book looking for the family dynamic advice. Triangulation, competing for my services, the win-lose vs win-win...
DD has always been the loudest squeaky wheel so she always wins.
I agree about starting to fight for self preservation and taking back the house I own from siege. You’ve inspired me.

Tell me more about the late “adulting”. What the heck is happening? Is the world so stressful that a 19 y.o. If the 1980s  is like a 27 y.o. today? As dysfunctional and embarrassed as I am of my struggling adult kids living here, on my block 5 of 10 houses have adult children in mid 20s living at home (after college!) I’m stumped. Do you have any theories on this phenomenon?
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« Reply #26 on: August 11, 2019, 08:00:44 AM »

Excerpt
What can they do, what are they unable to do?

Excerpt
I live that same question every day, sometimes it feels like every minute

Me too   understanding what they can learn to do in the right environment and recognising emotions that interrupt what they can do.

Peacemom you say you drove your DD to DBT, does DD recognise, accept BPD, her struggles? I recall you saying in another post she was lying on her bed and saying'I need help'...

WDx

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« Reply #27 on: August 11, 2019, 08:54:09 AM »

Wendy,

DD she knows she is emotionally dysregulated. I calmly told her again yesterday that DBT skills can help her regulate. She said “I’ve lied to every therapist I’ve ever had so they don’t think I’m crazy except J” J was the one T who is actually “DBT partially certified”. She would simply remind DD of “DEARMAN”, ice in hand, hot shower.

 DD always signs releases so I can talk w/therapists but DD is unusually difficult to treat even w/DBT bc of the unending, sometimes self imposed trauma loop.

DD is desperate to get help for all her very real traumas, but can’t understand when I explain that until she bolsters her coping skills and gets as healthy as possible, trauma work can push her over the edge. I explained to her yesterday about letting these people who have traumatized her “rent space in her brain”. We did a little exercise where we told them to “leave and get out”. Trauma is a confusing, huge part of her mess.

Before she started having real trauma-physical assaults, arrest for pot, car wreck, a physical fight, 7 job firings-it used to just be she was desperate to find her Birth mom, so we went back to Asia looking to gather info a few years back. We spend time at the orphanage and went to a remote area to the foster family hut and spent a sweet afternoon there.

I hoped that might fill her bottomless well of need, but it didn’t.

 Last weekend she went to a party and a girl was there w/DD’s exBf. They actually got into a huge fistfight, rolling on ground screaming. Mud and blood.

This was new and something she’s never been involved in. So now shes completely traumatized from that. This is my 105 lb weakling.  It’s a vicious cycle. And Dr. Manning calls it the “Unrelenting Crises”. My DD is not a quiet introverted type she is out and about literally dying for friends and socialization.
So taking her dysregulation out into a big city with young adults partying and living big lives comes with its share of big risks.

I’m gonna pull out her DBT card again and put it in front of her and I’ll download the workbook.

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« Reply #28 on: August 11, 2019, 07:29:27 PM »

@Peacemom. I can totally relate to what exhaustion feels like. I hope you find the right way that works for you. I was speaking to a person with something here called The Family Navigation Project who help families dealing with children with mental health or addiction issues. She suggested two things for me - a parent support group here called HOPE and also wondered if I might consider a Parent Coach.

I am wondering if there might be either of those where you are that could support YOU as you navigate this?

I have just last week removed my son from my house via the police and he has said similar horrible things to me. Hugs to you. Even when you hear them and know its rage at other things it still hurts.

Take good care and hope you can find the advice and best support for yourself.
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« Reply #29 on: August 12, 2019, 05:41:37 PM »

Staff only

This thread has reached the posting limit and has been locked. The discussion is continued here: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=338752.0
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