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Author Topic: Childish Behavior/Tantrums  (Read 487 times)
hopeful1073

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« on: September 17, 2019, 06:07:53 PM »

The childish behavior and tantrums are driving me crazy.  No matter what I do to set boundaries, he fights me on them to the point of pure abuse.  I am guilty of eventually giving in - after being berated and bullied for days at a time, I sometimes cave because I have a busy job/life and literally cannot spend time dealing with his antics.  He keeps pushing me to the edge and I do not know how much longer I am going to deal with it.

I have provided resources for him to receive treatment and work on skills to help improve things on his end.  His lack of full commitment to working the program is disappointing and, quite frankly, is why I do not know how much I can stay in it.

This is all so terribly frustrating...and my compassion well is starting to run dry...
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RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING
This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

Radcliff
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Fond memories, fella.


« Reply #1 on: September 18, 2019, 02:22:46 AM »

I'm sorry to hear that you're experiencing so much frustration.  Can you tell us about a couple of the most important boundaries you're trying to set?

RC
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RBGE

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« Reply #2 on: September 18, 2019, 02:51:58 AM »

I have provided resources for him to receive treatment and work on skills to help improve things on his end.  His lack of full commitment to working the program is disappointing and, quite frankly, is why I do not know how much I can stay in it.

This is all so terribly frustrating...and my compassion well is starting to run dry...
Hey there, I completely understand your frustration and compassion well running dry. I have felt those exact same sentiments with my wife for a few years now.

If you don't mind me asking, has he been diagnosed? Does he give lip service to getting treatment and learning coping skills or is he refusing to even acknowledge that he has a problem at this point?
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hopeful1073

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« Reply #3 on: September 18, 2019, 05:58:21 PM »

Thanks Radcliff and RBGE for the responses.

Radcliff, the boundaries I have been trying to set involve money and lying.  I support him 100% and have for quite some time now, but he does not want to limit spending and often lies to me about how he spends the money I give to him.  He has a very poor sense of what it means to live within a budget, is often wasteful with money (which mostly is due to impulsiveness and lack of planning), and does not care about credit card debt because he does not have to pay it.  I have gotten to the point where I refuse to give him cash, which infuriates him.  He hates the idea that I know where he is spending money.  Unfortunately, that is necessary because he hides things from me that are not ok.  And if I say no, he does everything he can to push my buttons and make me miserable - and his reasoning behind why I should just do what he wants is not in touch with reality.

RBGE, he is seeing a DBT therapist.  He told me that she did not feel it would necessarily be helpful to label him at this point and that would come later.  However, she evaluated him for the DBT program/skills course she oversees and determined that it would benefit him.  I view this as a diagnosis in the sense that she feels DBT will help treat his symptoms.  He specifically agreed to participate in this program several months ago, but he has stalled starting it.  He also misses appointments with his therapist, so his commitment is spotty at best.  In moments of clarity, he acknowledges he hits most of the criteria for bpd and needs/wants help, but once those moments pass, he is defiant.  Honestly, my sense is that fear is holding him back.  He is petrified of giving in and trusting the process to see how it goes.

In my view, therapy and the DBT program are necessary if we have any chance of surviving this.  He is simply not going to break through on his own...

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Radcliff
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Fond memories, fella.


« Reply #4 on: September 18, 2019, 07:38:13 PM »

It sounds like he has a lot of unhealthy behaviors that impact you.  It has also got to be very frustrating to have DBT available but him not following up.  You may find it valuable to look at this link on how to get a borderline into therapy.  It can be very difficult to get someone with mental illness into therapy.  The most promising approach is for them to have a key person in their life who gives unconditional support and expresses a sincere belief that the therapy will help them, without forcing them into it.

Boundaries are critical.  Sometimes we fail to set boundaries and get run over.  Sometimes we set them ineffectively and just worsen the conflict.  Your concerns about money and lying are valid and important.  Boundaries are likely to be successful in some places and not in others.  Take a look at this page on setting boundaries.  How does the approach advocated there compare to your current approach?

RC
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hopeful1073

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« Reply #5 on: September 20, 2019, 06:27:53 PM »

Thanks for the links, Radcliff.  I watched the video on how to get someone into therapy and it was very helpful and made a lot of sense.  I am hoping that his therapist will be able to convince him that DBT will be be helpful if he starts and sticks with it.  Time will tell...

I am still working on setting boundaries effectively and hope with practice I will have my own breakthrough so that things become easier on my end.  I did set a new boundary for use of the credit cards and lying about using them, which he immediately violated.  The consequence was loss of use of the credit cards.  It may seem harsh, but it has been an ongoing issue, I was clear about what the consequences would be, and he still went there.  His reaction was to stop communicating with me.  So at the moment I am dealing with the silent treatment.  We'll see how long it lasts...
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Radcliff
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Fond memories, fella.


« Reply #6 on: September 22, 2019, 01:33:58 AM »

I'm impressed you watched that video.  It's a long one!

Take a look at this page on setting boundaries.  Can you give us some more background on the credit card situation?  Are you both working?  

RC
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hopeful1073

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« Reply #7 on: September 22, 2019, 07:12:08 PM »

Radcliff, it is a great video so it did not feel that long!  I am very interested in learning everything I can about anything that may help improve the situation I am in.  I only wish I had realized sooner that he may have bpd - it was not something I was familiar with and it would have helped if I knew earlier on how I could try to do things on my end to make things better.

I am the only one working - he has not worked for more than a year.  I have supported him because I wanted him to focus on getting better.  (He experienced significant losses several years in a row that would be hard for anyone to recover from.)  He is not functioning at any real level day-to-day and things have been getting worse rather than better since he started seeing his DBT therapist.  This is why I was hoping he would begin his DBT skills classes soon.  The last several months have been particularly brutal.

Despite asking him to work with me on keeping expenses down, he will not cooperate.  He wastes money on an impulse.  (Lottery tickets, purchases at gas stations, things that he does not need but just wants in the moment.)  He will not stick to any type of budget - his food and gas expenses are outrageous if I am not involved with the shopping.  He buys things - gift cards usually - for other people even though we are living beyond our means and many of the people he helps are using him.  (Some of these people are quite shady and take advantage of the fact that he is unstable.  It's actually quite disgusting, but that is a whole other tangent.)  He lies to me about purchases.  He gets himself into jams and, instead of talking with me about it, he uses the credit card to clean up the mess and I only find out about it after the fact.  (A recent example is that he broke someone's phone, gave the person his expensive iPhone that I paid for, and then bought himself another iPhone without discussing it with me.)  Overall, it is all very bad behavior.  There are short periods of times (maybe a week or so?) when he has does a bit better, but it never lasts.

In his view, I should just trust him to do whatever he needs to do and everything will be ok.  Of course he thinks that - he has zero financial responsibility and does not want to be accountable for anything.  He accuses me of being controlling, when in fact he is the one trying to control me by harassing me into letting him do whatever he wants.

He does not respect my boundaries.  I have read about boundaries and am continuing to work on my skills in this area.  I have not been perfect in setting them and following through with consequences, but I am trying very hard to be better about this because I know that any progress made is then thrown out the window if I do not stick with it.  Again, I was hoping he would be in his skills course by now so there would be a chance for things in this area to improve.  I realize they may not - and I know it will take time, but I at least would feel like things are moving forward in some type of way rather than me feeling like things are just stuck.

Thanks for listening and for the resources and feedback!
« Last Edit: September 22, 2019, 07:25:34 PM by hopeful1073 » Logged
Radcliff
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Fond memories, fella.


« Reply #8 on: September 25, 2019, 01:28:53 AM »

Thanks for all of the detail.  That helps us understand your situation much better.  Some of the things you described as boundaries sounded more like "limits" you'd set on a child (where there's a power imbalance and you can impose your will effectively sometimes) than "boundaries" like we teach them.  But it helps to understand your situation, with you being the sole wage earner and him having such irresponsible spending.  It sounds challenging to figure out how to honor your need for financial security in an effective way!

It'd be great to hear from other members who've faced situations like this and hear how they've dealt with it.

Though I can't say I have the solution, I think that the fundamental boundaries principle that we can control our behavior, not the behavior of others is something that is going to be important.  You may be able to protect yourself somewhat by depositing your paycheck in an account only you have access to, then paying the bills first from that, depositing some into savings from that, then putting the remainder in a joint account.  But that arrangement would likely feel pretty controlling to him.

Have you tried doing a monthly family budget and going over it with him?  I'm not suggesting that's going to control his impulses at all, but perhaps out of a family budget discussion you could agree on a discretionary allowance that you each get.  I'm imagining a discussion where you both brainstorm expenses.  In the brainstorm mode, you don't criticize anyone's input.  Just write it down.  Later you can pick off things from the brainstorm list in priority order (rent, utilities, etc.).  Making a budget work could potentially be helped by an account arrangement like I described above, but getting buy-in could make it feel less controlling.

OK, I went out on a limb by trying to propose solutions.  A better approach may have been for me to ask, how do you think you might approach finances in a way that incorporates his feelings and needs while also taking into account his limitations and your need for financial security?

RC
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hopeful1073

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« Reply #9 on: September 25, 2019, 08:59:50 AM »

Thanks, RC, for the feedback.

I understand that it sounds more like limits.  I have grappled with that issue quite a bit.  But I honestly only reached the point where I am after trying everything else.  Despite these efforts, the financial abuse and lying has remained pervasive and severe.  Hopefully, some of our members have ideas that may help here.  I remain open to listening and evaluating this situation from all angles!

I tried the budget route.  He refused to talk with me about one.  So I sent him a budget to review and then get back to me.  He never responded even with gentle follow ups from me.

I talk with him about the importance of financial security to me and how I go about minimizing expenses on my end.  In response, he accuses me of being too wrapped up in money (in a very derogatory way) and placing money above love.

I tried giving him a set amount of money.  It does not last and then he engages in what I believe are drastic measures to find money, which ends up costing me even more money.  Most recent example - he pawned an expensive item of mine to get cash behind my back.  If I did not want to lose that item, which has meaning to me, I had to pay to get it back.

My main goal recently has been to avoid more financial problems while he started the DBT program with the hope that the program would allow him to work with me on these issues in more constructive ways.  In the meantime, however, I cannot continue to allow him to create situations that ultimately become incredibly stressful for me.  I have given him a lot of time to work through his issues and at some point it either needs to improve or end.

If I sound frustrated, it is because I am.  When someone is paying all expenses with no help on the other end, and the person who is not contributing will not work with you even in the simplest of ways to contain costs and lies to you repeatedly to take advantage of you, it may be that you just sometimes need to say no, not anymore.
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Radcliff
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Fond memories, fella.


« Reply #10 on: September 25, 2019, 10:44:48 PM »

I'm sorry to hear that he pawned something of yours.  That's a pretty big breach of trust, and I imagine may have left you feeling pretty upset and vulnerable.  One of the things that helps me the most when I'm feeling a lot of pain from my unmet expectations about unhealthy behaviors of people close to me is to remember that I can invite them to healthy behavior, and they will choose whether to accept the invitation.  It helps me feel in control because I've done everything I can do, and it keeps me from feeling out of control because I'm letting go of expecting myself to be able to get them to "do the right thing."  I'll do OK with this for a while, then forget and get upset about something, then remind myself and get back on the bandwagon.

One thought is to improve your boundary skills in other areas.  You may then find with lower overall frustration and new skills you're more ready to tackle the tougher issues eventually.  Are there any other boundary issues you think might be good ones to try tackling next?

RC
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