How has having a parent with BPD affecting your relationship with your siblings?

[zachira]

As I struggle to get along with my siblings on going abuse of me after the death of my mother with BPD, I have been reading articles on the internet that the relationship that children have with their parents determines how siblings will get along. It seems that having a disordered parent that mistreats the children, often results in siblings competing for the love of that parent, even after the children have become adults. Often times, the siblings that make their own lives with partners capable of having healthy relationships, let go of needing the love of the disordered parent, while other siblings will continue to compete to be a favored child, by doing things like becoming a caretaker for the disordered parent, stealing the other siblings inheritance, etc., How has having a parent with BPD affecting your relationships with your siblings, both in positive and negative ways?

[Longterm]

  zachira.

I never once thought about this topic until you bought it up, it's very interesting and has the cogs turning 

I think dysfunctional parents made my relationships with siblings very difficult. I dont think any of us have competed for a parents love but my brothers have always wanted their children to be the favourites. They also compete against each other, who has the biggest tv etc. I am very different from them and have never competed with them. I'm a very simple guy who is easily pleased by the smallest things. Superficiality is not a part of who I am. I have however continuously been a caretaker for them, emotionally, morally, financially etc. They have always treated me as though I was invisible most of the time, I do not matter to them unless they want something and our relationships were one sided, they did not put effort in. The caretaking was learned behaviour, something I still do now although not with my siblings as I have been in NC for several years.

I found humour in you mentioning stealing siblings inheritance, one of my brothers actually did this.

LT.

[TelHill]

My bpd mom plays us off each other. She will badmouth him to me. I know she says bad things to him about me. Everything is all about her keeping the upper hand.

I think she's definitely ruined things between us. She's created the rivalry and made us villains to each other. These are great things to think about for me as my parents are very old & nearing the end. Thanks for posting this.

[Notwendy]

I think it can have different effects - family members tend to take on different roles to keep the family in a sort of balance. These roles have been described- "golden child, scapegoat, etc".

Dysfunction is also learned and so siblings can grow up to have dysfunction in their relationships and that includes with each other.

But other factors can have influence. I think the gender of the child and the BPD parent can have influence. As a female child, my BPD mother perceived me as some sort of competition for my father's attention. She didn't feel that way with a male child. I'm the scapegoat, the golden child is male. This may be different if a father has BPD.

There isn't much friction between the sibs now thankfully, but growing up, it was obvious that my mother preferred the golden child. If I said anything about it, she dismissed it as sibling rivalry but even family friends would remark that she has a favorite.

It was obvious that my parents ( at BPD mother's direction) were more invested in him than me.

Although this bothered me as a child/teen it doesn't now, because the GC is also enmeshed with BPD mom and I am not.

Being the scapegoat can feel hurtful, but I don't feel as much FOG when it comes to my mother ( there's some FOG but not as much as if she actually was interested in me more). There really isn't much competition between us for her affection, as who she preferred has been clear.

[zachira]

The child less affected by the toxic family dynamics has the best chance of becoming a person in their own right. The healthier child hopefully decides at some point : I am a worthy person. I can't get my family to see me for who I am, so I will have to make a life for myself by choosing the right people and actions to take. As the healthier child takes the first step of seeing his/her worth, he/she attracts more of the right people and situations which builds self esteem and the ability to be less drawn into the toxic family dynamics. Meanwhile, the members more enmeshed in the toxic family dynamics will continue to try to get the healthier member involved in the Karpman triangle by switching between the roles of persecutor, victim, and rescuer.The healthier child, has to constantly remind him/herself of his/her value regardless of how badly the family members are acting, and are more able to do so as they continue to build a strong foundation by creating healthy relationships and situations for themselves.
Siblings can choose either to be like their parent with BPD or choose to do what it takes to be the best person he/she can be while knowing that we will never be perfect. Choosing to interrupt the toxic family dynamics, means the family members will make war on the one who does not want to participate in the game. The challenge is not to see ourselves as a victim, due to all the cruelty inflicted on us by family members, and to instead see ourselves as a person who makes the best choices most of the time, and that all choices have consequences, both good and bad. There are definitely some advantages to being liked and favored by the family, and those advantages have long term negative affects when there are toxic family dynamics. There are definitely some disadvantages to being disliked by the family for refusing to participate in the toxic family dynamics, yet in the long run, choosing to be a person of value, who treats self and others with respect and kindness while having healthy boundaries helps us to create the kind of life we want for ourselves and others, especially our children and future generations.

[TelHill]

It's hard to know what to do as a helpless kid with a raging parent. You do what you can considering what role you have. We do our best now to be psychologically healthy adults and step out of the roles.

[Harri]

Hi everyone.

I have a brother who is 3 years older than me.  We were both abused and we were both split by my mother.  In some ways I think my brother had it worse than I did.  In other areas he was favored.  He was split white more frequently and for longer periods than i was.

He got away from my mother before I did and got involved with friends and had hobbies and activities that I never did.  He is happily (mostly) married with a wonderful son.  He struggles with anger and is not aware of the fact that he was abused; complete denial there.  My mother played us against eachother.  I was more mean to him when we were kids than he was to me.  Not sure if that can strictly be blamed on the family dynamics or how much of that was me being a bratty little sister though.

As we got older, we fought less though I would not say we were friends (and not now)  and there were a lot of resentments on both sides.  I resented him for painting me the same black my mother did and he resented me for treating him so poorly and causing so much pain for my mom.  It was all twisted.

The fact is that he was far more enmeshed than I was ... yet I was the one who stayed in the abusive home until my mid to late thirties and never really had a life of my own.  Once I moved out my brother was quite angry with me and let it be known he thought I should stay with my parents.    I stood firm against all of them.

When my mother died and then later my dad we had our struggles but not in terms of their estate thankfully, not that there was much to fight over.  I don't think either of us would have fought about it anyway.  We were both exhausted and I know I was too relieved and just did not have the energy to put up a fight.  It has taken some time, but we are about as good as we can get with each other I think.  Actually, I think we are doing damn well given everything that happened and I feel proud of the both of us. 

[TelHill]

Harri, My brother was split white mostly. I’m 6 years younger & was split black. Mom treats him with respect - she put him down only a few times before if she liked the present I bought better or I was better at an activity she valued. Now, it’s that he doesn’t visit or say much on the phone.  No raging like with me.

He’s shy but puts people down a lot. He has to be the best & have the best - he makes sure I know it.  I’ve heard him treat friends like this. They don’t stick around. He acts entitled. It’s hard for me to be around him too.

Am not as materialistic as he is.  Although I could use some friends, I try hard to build people up or joke with them.  I smile and do my best to get along like that person is my equal - which they are.

I am a harder worker than my brother. I don’t know if he has fear of failure or it’s entitlement poking through. He takes the easy way.

He’s passive aggressive where I’m I will tell the truth and try to reach a compromise.

The one thing that’s different is I’m a daddy’s girl. My poor brother was hit a lot by my dad & blamed for things he didn’t do. Dad never hit me. He treated me with a bit more kindness. My brother is still the obedient child to dad. Me, not. Am not a rebel but stand up for myself with persistence. Our personalities are similar. Dad stands up for himself with other people (sometimes with mom but she abuses him too.) But no real, emotional support from dad for me or brother.  Mom gets some emotional support from him.

I’m hoping this makes sense. Am at home but forgot my laptop at my parents place. Not easy typing on a phone!

[Longterm]

 
As we got older, we fought less though I would not say we were friends (and not now)  and there were a lot of resentments on both sides.  I resented him for painting me the same black my mother did and he resented me for treating him so poorly and causing so much pain for my mom.  It was all twisted

I think this is incredibly sad. Both of you surviving in your own way but not forming a close bond through shared trauma. I'm guessing your brothers denial of the abuse even happening is a somewhat insurmountable obstacle here.

Once I moved out my brother was quite angry with me and let it be known he thought I should stay with my parents.    I stood firm against all of them.   

Excuse me being nosy, tell me to sod off if you want  why would your brother think you should stay with your parents? You word it as though it was expected of you.

  We were both exhausted and I know I was too relieved and just did not have the energy to put up a fight.  It has taken some time, but we are about as good as we can get with each other I think.  Actually, I think we are doing damn well given everything that happened and I feel proud of the both of us. 

Did you argue quite a lot then, I'm guessing the resentment must of been huge?

LT.

[TelHill]

I think this is incredibly sad. Both of you surviving in your own way but not forming a close bond through shared trauma. I'm guessing your brothers denial of the abuse even happening is a somewhat insurmountable obstacle here.

Excuse me being nosy, tell me to sod off if you want   why would your brother think you should stay with your parents? You word it as though it was expected of you.

Did you argue quite a lot then, I'm guessing the resentment must of been huge?

LT.

Same as my entitled, golden child older brother— he doesn’t want to deal with bpd mom. My brother expects service his way. My mom waited on my brother like a servant.  I was pressed into service but declined in first grade. Sometimes I have more ill will towards my brother than mom. I remember my parents & their crazy behavior. Haven’t repressed.  I barely have any memory of my brother. I remember him hitting & teasing me. I’d kick him in the shins or go through his dresser drawers to get back at him.  Meals, hanging around the house, going to the library with him don’t come to mind. It’s a big blank.

Harri, were you expected to cater to your brother too?

[Harri]

I'm guessing your brothers denial of the abuse even happening is a somewhat insurmountable obstacle here.

Well, it just means we don't talk about the elephant only I see in the room.    It has been an exercise in both acceptance and self-differentiation for me over the years.  Acceptance of who he is and where he is at in terms of his life and healing.  Differentiation in terms of recognizing that we are two separate people who had similar but also different experiences and who have made different choices.  he gets to be him and I accept him.  I get to be me and he accepts me.  We still clash on some things and he still reverts to treating me like his stupid wayward and flighty sister... and I snap back at him.  Not often but it does happen.  I can see that he is learning to let go of his need to control me though.  haha, at one point, after our parents died and he was stressed about making sure I was okay and he was 'taking care of me' properly he had a three ring binder with my name written on the spine with different sections that had lists of things he wanted to know, check and advise me on.    I put an end to that pretty quickly.    I laugh now but at the time it set every nerve on edge and my left eye would twitch when I saw it.  Now my SIL and I laugh about it.

why would your brother think you should stay with your parents? You word it as though it was expected of you.

It was expected of me.  Both of my parents expected it and thought I would take care of them and support them until they died.  It was not so much what was said but what was not said.  My mom kept me pretty isolated and made having friends and boyfriends in particular very difficult and awkward.   They never talked about typical stuff like 'when you have your own family' or 'when you live in your own house' or things like that.  I don't think my brother went along deliberately to hurt me it just never seemed to occur to anyone, including me, that I would ever have my own life.  Getting away by having a boyfriend was never really viable... I could not quite wrap my head around how to explain what was happening between me and my mom never mind being terrified to bring any guy around my family.  My mom always threatened to expose the real me to anyone I might get involved with.  She saw it as her duty as a Christian... what with me being possessed by demons and all.    Lots of twisted mind games went on there. 

Did you argue quite a lot then, I'm guessing the resentment must of been huge?

Actually, we did not.  I was very sick at the time, we were both shell shocked, my brother was out of work, my bf of 7 years dumped me, my SIL had a miscarriage at 4 months, work was threatening to let me go as I was out due to medical reasons, I found out I had a serious and rare genetic disease and sure enough so does my brother and nephew, I had moved back in with my dad after my mom died, I lost all my life savings on medical bills, on top of all of lifes usual stresses all in a three year span of time.  It was insane and I haven't even told all of it.  So when I say we were exhausted, we were and way too tired to fight.  That said, there were conflicts but we still pulled together and we always resolved things.  We are all we have, no cousins, uncles, aunts etc.

Harri, were you expected to cater to your brother too?

Thankfully, no.  I am sorry that you are expected to do so.   One of the things my mother did well was to make sure my brother and I were able to function and take care of ourselves.  Cooking, cleaning, work ethic, education etc.

Sometimes I have more ill will towards my brother than mom.

I feel this way about my father, the so-called non.    He was the 'healthier' one.  Pffft.

When we were kids, my brother and I used to beat the heck out of each other but it all stopped once one of us got hurt.   I think I said earlier, I was mean to my brother.  He was less mean to me.  Always very protective of me. 

[TelHill]

Well, it just means we don't talk about the elephant only I see in the room.    It has been an exercise in both acceptance and self-differentiation for me over the years.  Acceptance of who he is and where he is at in terms of his life and healing.  Differentiation in terms of recognizing that we are two separate people who had similar but also different experiences and who have made different choices.  he gets to be him and I accept him.  I get to be me and he accepts me.  We still clash on some things and he still reverts to treating me like his stupid wayward and flighty sister... and I snap back at him.  Not often but it does happen.  I can see that he is learning to let go of his need to control me though.  haha, at one point, after our parents died and he was stressed about making sure I was okay and he was 'taking care of me' properly he had a three ring binder with my name written on the spine with different sections that had lists of things he wanted to know, check

My brother tried & is trying to control me. He hadn’t done much for me. What you are both doing sounds healthy considering your shared pasts. I am happy to hear that for you. This stuff is not easy to deal with.

 It was expected of me.  Both of my parents expected it and thought I would take care of them and support them until they died.  It was not so much what was said but what was not said.  My mom kept me pretty isolated and made having friends and boyfriends in particular very difficult and awkward.   They never talked about typical stuff like 'when you have your own family' or 'when you live in your own house' or things like that.  I don't think my brother went along deliberately to hurt me it just never seemed to occur to anyone, including me, that I would ever have my own life.  Getting away by having a boyfriend was never really viable...

That’s quite a burden to carry if it was expected but not wanted by you. I’m sorry.  You always have a right to your own life choices.

 Actually, we did not.  I was very sick at the time, we were both shell shocked, my brother was out of work, my bf of 7 years dumped me, my SIL had a miscarriage at 4 months, work was threatening to let me go as I was out due to medical reasons, I found out I had a serious and rare genetic disease and sure enough so does my brother and nephew, I had moved back in with my dad after my mom died, I lost all my life savings on medical bills, on top of all of lifes usual stresses all in a three year span of time.  It was insane and I haven't even told all of it.  So when I say we were exhausted, we were and way too tired to fight.  That said, there were conflicts but we still pulled together and we always resolved things.  We are all we have, no cousins, uncles, aunts etc.

That’s really hard to have a genetic disorder. Again am sorry.

Thankfully, no.  I am sorry that you are expected to do so.   One of the things my mother did well was to make sure my brother and I were able to function and take care of ourselves.  Cooking, cleaning, work ethic, education etc.
 I feel this way about my father, the so-called non.    He was the 'healthier' one.  Pffft.

Sorry, I meant things like serve him meals, wash his dishes when he didn’t do the same for me. It may have been more subservience for me if I didn’t complain. I made a scene in front of my parents constantly. They gave up. I got out of it but now that I’m back at my parents place pt, I feel the pressure from mom and bro to serve. I’ ve said if you want a slave go buy one. Mom is out of it - slight dementia - doesn’t get it. My brother gave me his she’s exaggerating and overreacting look. I’m learning to engage less with him. I may revisit but am doing gray rocking & NC. It is a way to set boundaries since it’s impossible to have an adult conversation where he treats me politely.

Again, you’ve done a lot of work to reach out to your brother. That’s a big deal & shows you have good character.

[zachira]

The more I think about how having a parent with BPD affects our relationships including with our siblings, the more I realize how the parent with BPD schools their children in how to have a life time of dysfuctional relationships, especially the relationships with siblings. I am admiring all the replies here, how those who post here became aware at some point that the relationships with their family members are highly dysfunctional and have made the choice to not continue the dysfuntional dynamics by making better choices about what kinds of relationships to have.

[Longterm]

 I am admiring all the replies here 

Me too, but I cant help feeling really sad about it. I think "tragic" is the word that I truly feel.

I think that these dysfunctional dynamics have created relationships that were maybe always destined to be difficult. Siblings should be there for one another, I think we have all lost out in many ways, and so have they.

LT.

[Harri]

It is sad.  Tragic really.  The dysfunction is so far reaching.  I do get angry knowing there is little I can do to change the inherent limitations in our relationship.

My last T, when I talked with her about my relationship with my brother, said "it is too late for you both.  there is too much history between you".  That is so true. 

I hesitate to use the term golden child for my brother as he got his share of the more overt abuse as well.  Maybe that is why we can be the way were are with each other now, as limited as it may be.  If he were the golden child 100% I can imagine being more resentful of him even though intellectually I know that being the golden child carries with it some very serious abuse and a much harder road to recognition that things were wrong. 

Golden child
Scapegoat

Neither get off without being damaged.

[Longterm]

  The dysfunction is so far reaching.

That statement is so true, even for future generations. I see it in nieces/nephews and in my own children. The dynamics between me and my siblings have impacted their relationships with the respective uncle(s). I'm sure you mentioned Harri that you have a good relationship with your nephew, I think that's a huge positive you can take from this.

  My last T, when I talked with her about my relationship with my brother, said "it is too late for you both.  there is too much history between you".  That is so true.  

I can relate, I bet many here can.

  Golden child
Scapegoat

Neither get off without being damaged.

Dysfunction is dysfunction, there will always be aspects of negative consequences no matter how its rationalized I guess.

It's not the most desired outcome but I think it's good that the two of you can at least be civil and accept each other as you are.

LT.

[Libra]

Hi Zachira,

I am sorry to read – in this thread and others – that your siblings are still on the war path. I hope you will be able to find some peace in the near future 

Siblings can choose either to be like their parent with BPD or choose to do what it takes to be the best person he/she can be while knowing that we will never be perfect. Choosing to interrupt the toxic family dynamics, means the family members will make war on the one who does not want to participate in the game. The challenge is not to see ourselves as a victim, due to all the cruelty inflicted on us by family members, and to instead see ourselves as a person who makes the best choices most of the time, and that all choices have consequences, both good and bad. There are definitely some advantages to being liked and favored by the family, and those advantages

This is so true. It doesn't always result in war though. For me, it seems to end in total exclusion/non-existance.

I am still not certain my mother is BPD. I know she is emotionally limited, has no boundaries and has a very negative self-image and mindset. Having been emotionally exhausted from trying to please and getting raged at every 6 months or so, I took a large step back and have been LC for more than a year now.

My relationship with my brother is non-existent. I used to hear how he is doing through my mother. Attempts for direct contact were always cut short by my brother. He is still enmeshed with my mother. He calls her daily (out of a sense of duty?). I strongly suspects he functions as an emotional regulator and outlet gauge for my mother.

Last Monday was my birthday. I got a text message from my mother early in the morning ‘Happy Birthday Daughter’, it read. I thanked her and said I was enjoying breakfast with the children. She sent a weird Minions animated gif to which I did not respond, and that was it. In the afternoon, probably right after he had called with mum, my brother also texted me: ‘Happy Birthday’, it read. Those 2 words did me more grief than I can express. They are empty. I felt sad and angry at the same time. I would have been happier if he had not texted at all. I debated within myself whether it would be better not to respond, but I did in the end: ‘Thx Bro’, I texted. And that will be the extent of our communication till his birthday next June, when I will try to call or chat with him, but will fail to get though.

I think my brother is incapable of seeing me as a separate being from the organism that is our family of origin. Maybe he cannot forgive me for being LC with my mother, maybe my mother is black-mouthing me to him, or maybe he is angry at me for pushing the caretaker burden to his side after years and years of carrying it on my side. I will probably never know. I have accepted this. That – apparently – does not take away the sadness, nor the hurt.

Zachira, always remember your own values. Keep your bearings, keep your anchor in reality, and try to accept. That is all we can really do.

Harri, I am sorry your relationship with your brother is so sadly damaged by your shared past. You have had to deal with so much, and you both go about it very differently.  Cudos to both of you though for learning to differentiate and to respect one anothers’ boundaries, and for trying to keep in touch. I hope you can enjoy some of the times you are in the same room, despite having to share that space with a huge elephant.

 
Libra.