Another holiday blowup

[Parents! Get help here!]

I'm new here but really need a safe place to turn right now. We adopted my daughter and her siblings when she was 6. It's been a very rocky road that included a group home when she was a teenager and when she turned 18 she ran from there. She is almost 24 now, and my husband and I have been on pretty good terms with her for almost a year now. She is on her own with two toddlers with two different dads. No driver's license, so we have been transporting one grandson to and from visits with his dad every week and I have given up countless days off and taken off work for court dates and various errands. We had planned to have her and the kids spend Christmas with us. My husband took the day off work for the 3 hour trip to transport our grandson from his dad and her from her place, but there was a miscommunication about timing picking her up. That was the last straw for her and now we are on the outs - again. She doesn't want to be part of "our" drama and blames us for everything "wrong" in her life. Says we are sneaky and uncaring and favor our other daughter. She wants us out of her life and that of our grandsons. She is demanding we bring some toys that someone donated to her and the kids (that she was supposed to pick up today when she came). I want to do it because I don't want her behavior to change who I am and my following through on commitments. I want to be steady and reliable and true to my word - partly to prevent opportunities for her to say, "see? you're never there for me!" I am debating, do I give her the gifts we got for her and the boys? I'm thinking she will probably just toss or destroy the ones for her. We are thinking we will give the gifts for one boy to his father since we have been on good terms with him... My husband disconnects more easily than I do and says we should let her find a way to come get everything. I don't want to be petty. I love her and miss those boys, and I'm angry with myself for letting my heart get broken over and over and over and over again. Thanks.

[Momnotmom]

I'm new here but really need a safe place to turn right now. We adopted my daughter and her siblings when she was 6. It's been a very rocky road that included a group home when she was a teenager and when she turned 18 she ran from there. She is almost 24 now, and my husband and I have been on pretty good terms with her for almost a year now. She is on her own with two toddlers with two different dads. No driver's license, so we have been transporting one grandson to and from visits with his dad every week and I have given up countless days off and taken off work for court dates and various errands. We had planned to have her and the kids spend Christmas with us. My husband took the day off work for the 3 hour trip to transport our grandson from his dad and her from her place, but there was a miscommunication about timing picking her up. That was the last straw for her and now we are on the outs - again. She doesn't want to be part of "our" drama and blames us for everything "wrong" in her life. Says we are sneaky and uncaring and favor our other daughter. She wants us out of her life and that of our grandsons. She is demanding we bring some toys that someone donated to her and the kids (that she was supposed to pick up today when she came). I want to do it because I don't want her behavior to change who I am and my following through on commitments. I want to be steady and reliable and true to my word - partly to prevent opportunities for her to say, "see? you're never there for me!" I am debating, do I give her the gifts we got for her and the boys? I'm thinking she will probably just toss or destroy the ones for her. We are thinking we will give the gifts for one boy to his father since we have been on good terms with him... My husband disconnects more easily than I do and says we should let her find a way to come get everything. I don't want to be petty. I love her and miss those boys, and I'm angry with myself for letting my heart get broken over and over and over and over again. Thanks.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[twojaybirds]

Merry Christmas.  I am so sorry this has happened.  I am waiting for my Christmas explosion but it is early here so there is a whole day for it to happen.

Your scenario and feelings are so familiar.   I am glad you and the dad have a connection.  Perhaps keep the contacts with the grandchildren through him.   I would also give him the gifts for the grandchildren.

My experience when it is in the heat of the situation no matter what I do is 'wrong' and will fuel her fire thus I have learned to wait and do nothing. I can only imagine with grandchildren  (my dd is having twins in April)
how can you support them and show them you love them without enabling your dd to attack you, or at least not have you feeling victimized through your self care.

[Blueskyday]

I may be wrong but think if you take the toys that's a signal to her to mess with you. If you draw your boundaries now then she knows what the consequences will be.

There are no easy choices sadly

[Juki]

I tend to agree with your husband's stance.  I would not deliver the gifts and keep the arrangement as it was - that she picks them up when she comes by.  Delivering the gifts and buckling to her demands would be positively reinforcing bad behaviour.  You and your husband are clearly very giving and doing a lot to support her, but unfortunately your kind heartedness is not winning you any brownie points and she is not displaying any appreciation or understanding. I have the same situation with my 25 yo daughter.  Myself and her grandmother do far more than we should because we are forever trying to avert conflict.  The problem is that no matter what or how much we do, she will always find something that upsets her which will trigger an abusive tirade.  It's like trying to feed a monster that has an increasingly insatiable appetite - the more you feed it, the more it wants.  I had a situation recently where my daughter was trying to get me to wear a lanyard with my phone around my neck 24/7. There is a bit of a back story to this but it basically evolved because I was trying to help ease her abandonment anxiety issues by giving her the assurance that I was always there for her.   My daughter took it to the extreme and demanded that I wear my phone at all times to prove that I really loved her and was available at all times.  I said "No.  I will not be wearing a lanyard" and stood firm with this.  The word "No" was like throwing acid at her.  She dissed me, abused me, told me she was "completely done" with me, dragged up every piece of dirt she could, made me feel like a neglectful parent, blocked all contact with me, gave me the silent treatment, etc, etc.  That lasted for approx.1 week. She is now speaking with me again and has not mentioned the lanyard or anything related to it and I don't think she ever will.  My daughter also plays the victim card and blames me for all her issues which is because she fails to take any responsibility for her own behaviour.

It's a tough journey trying to manage a child with BPD.  As a parent we inherently want to do anything and everything to avert conflict, repair our broken relationship, help make their life easier, and support them as much as we can.  However, it is imperative that we maintain healthy boundaries otherwise we are merely feeding into the dysfunctions, perpetuating helplessness, absorbing blame, and positioning ourselves for future abuse and ongoing conflict.

Whatever you do make sure that you and your husband are solidly on the same page and present as a united couple.  All the best and I hope you have a peaceful Christmas 

[Momnotmom]

Thanks so much for the thoughts! I really don’t want to buckle to her demands. The only thing leaning me that way is those innocent boys of hers. One of the things we do still have along with the toys is a winter jacket left in our car after the most recent pickup/drop off. I can just hear her saying how we withheld it from him.  I haven’t heard a word from her in two days and she doesn’t get him back for another couple of days, so I wait it out. Whatever I do, it will be on my terms and not hers.

[Resiliant]

Hi Momnotmom,

This is not easy, and you are going to get different answers here.

I completely value all of the responses that you received.

If it were me, I would keep the relationships with the children separate from the relationship with their mother / your daughter. 

They are individuals, and they are caught in the middle. 

If you can find a way to get them their things aside from her I personally would try to do that.  If you value your relationships with the children then go direct or through the fathers if your daughter is standing in the way.  At least they might realize that you care for them.

All the best
 
R

[Iyamdun]

It is the never ending damned if you do and damned if you so not.  I am so sorry that you are feeling this push and pull.  I empathize completely.  I am glad that Christmas is over at this point.  It feels like it is always too filled with unnecessary drama.  Take care.

[Momnotmom]

Guess I’m settling for damned if I do. She started another text tirade this morning demanding the donated stuff and threatening to tell on me (to the coworker who donated it). She’s posting lies on social media and rewriting history. So my other daughter and I will bring the stuff to her tonight just to grt her off our backs. I can’t even concentrate at work today. Grrrr. I guess my question is do I just dump and run (having given in to pressure and manipulation)? Or is there something I can say or do that makes it clear I’m doing this for the kids? I feel so weak and worthless.

[Juki]

I'm so sorry to hear about this ongoing situation with your daughter.  I am very, very familiar with text tirades and also not being able to concentrate at work.  Thankfully my daughter has never posted lies on social media or has re-written history - although she does have a contorted viewpoint on the past at times. However, in keeping with a BPD's splitting I am continuously being viewed as all bad or all good and that roller coaster is exceptionally hard to live with. The smear campaign that your daughter has embarked on is something I experienced with my exNPD husband in his attempt to absolve himself of any wrong doing and I fully understand how deeply hurtful this is.  The untruths that he concocted were his version of reality and to this day (years later) he sticks by this story and rehashes it according to need.  The scary thing about it is that he truly believes his own lies, as I imagine your daughter does.  Often you'll find that they do this to justify their own behaviour or life circumstances because they cannot take responsibility for their own actions/behaviour. I fully appreciate buckling into demands in order to get peace and how that can make you feel.  If it makes you feel better you could indicate that you have done it for the kids (the poor victims in this) and leave it at that.  I don't think you will ever understand why your daughter has scapegoated you but what you do understand is that her behaviour is very destructive, manipulative, malicious and hurtful.  You need to protect yourself from this as best you can because it is psychologically and emotionally very harmful to you.  Regardless of what is going on for your daughter, whether she has BPD, NPD, PTSD or whatever, her behaviour is completely unacceptable and I would recommend distancing yourself in order to preserve your sanity.  Setting some realistic expectations in relation to your daughter and how you interact with her will also help. My exNPD husband did a lot of nasty, manipulative and abusive things, but the one thing that shredded me completely was when he took to our friends and acquaintances with his vilification campaign which was full of lies and filled their ears with a story which portrayed me as being the unhinged, abusive, mentally disordered perpetrator.  Fortunately, not everyone believed his BS and in some cases his story did nothing but reflect poorly on him, however, there are always those who will buy into their victimhood and unfortunately there is not much you can do about it other than get comfort out of knowing that it is not the truth of who you are and those that are important and count in your life know the truth.  I hope you manage to get some "time out" after you've delivered the gifts.  Take care xx

[Blueskyday]

Its usual to be lambasted on social media. The best defence is to say nothing, do nothing to defend yourself.

Given the circumstances had rapidly deteriorated I too would probably have dropped them off.
If it helps short term pocket the insult.

This is a journey. You will learn how to cope as you go..I have changed so since finding this forum. I am stronger and happier.

It is OK to change your mind or play things by ear..You owe her nothing but civility.

[Momnotmom]

Thanks so much again. I left for my errand with my head and heart in a good place. My younger daughter came along and it was a good opportunity to explain to her what I know about BPD - that she is hurting and that we can’t engage with her and need to set boundaries and to each make up our own minds how much we will take/accept. I was prepared to talk civilly to her if I had the opportunity but she didn’t answer the door or respond to my text. So that’s the end of this chapter. Thanks again for the support and for the perspective and the language I needed to have an important discussion with my other daughter.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Juki]

Don't despair - no contact at times is better.  BPD people will always disappoint because we judge them according to our own values, morals and ethics.  Unfortunately they don't think like us, or posses the moral compasses that we do.  That is not to say that they are wrong and we are right, but that we simply are not the same. A BPD's behaviour is foreign to us and rubs against all that we know and this is where our pain comes from.  I know this feels like a major blow, and it is, but it only feels like this because your expectations were not met.  If you set lower expectations, such as expecting that she will not communicate with you, then you will protect yourself from the pain of disappointment - very much like "hope for the best and expect the worst".

Unfortunately, BPD permeates the entire family and creates a lot of tension. It's complicated to say the least.  I have a 90 year old mother that lives with me and is subject to my daughter's BPD behaviour. She is stressed out to the max because this is something she's never encountered in her life and she doesn't have the emotional intelligence to deal with it.  My son deals with it from a different perspective - he is quite intolerant and has very strong and healthy boundaries.  I'm glad that you have broached the BPD subject with your daughter and put it on the table.  That's an achievement.  Strangely, I have had some of my best conversations with my son whilst driving   Seems to be very conducive to non-confrontational and open discussion!

Please read widely about BPD and stay connected to support.  The more you can relate to what you are going through and get validated the better. 

I'm sorry that things panned out the way they did.  Stay strong and understand it's not you xx

[BoyMom]

Boy do I understand the "text tirades", I call them rage texts. The other day after we had to ask our son to leave the house, I went through my entire camera roll on my phone and made a folder of all the rage texts I'd screen capped. I would say you wouldn't believe the hateful things he texted but I have a feeling you would absolutely believe. I don't know what I'm going to do with that folder of texts yet, but I have them in case I ever need to show examples of his raging. In one of the texts he threatened to take pictures of the "messiness" in my bedroom and post all over social media to "show how trash you are and maybe people will start realizing YOU are the dumb one".