Understanding their scapegoating

[pursuingJoy]

I've been reading a lot about scapegoating after observing it in my H and BPD MIL. It's second nature and they use it in a host of settings and for various reasons.

Cement Alliances
My H was the golden child. His scapegoated brother committed suicide in his early 20's. When I set boundaries with MIL, H jumps in as rescuer and they both scapegoat me. I guess allying themselves against an enemy provides a measure of perceived protection for their relationship?

To Connect
Early on, my MIL would put H down in an effort to connect with me. She would critique him in front of me, then look at me and say, "Ugh. Men.  We get it, don't we?"

Protect Themselves from Shame
H perceived that my D16 rejected him, which somehow justifies his abysmal treatment of her. Instead of talking about his hurt feelings, she is now lazy, doesn't care about anything but herself, is selfish, etc. 

My H also scapegoats randomly when he's triggered by something internal, usually to do with his mom or kids. Suddenly the boss he loves is out to get him, or the lady from HR that has always helped him is trying to undermine him.

Really great threads I've been reading...

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=210977.0

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=324448.0

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=121218.0

Do you see scapegoating playing out in your relationships?

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[zachira]

You are hitting on a topic I know really well: scapegoating and making certain children the golden ones in families. On both sides of my family, there is a long history of scapegoating and golden children, and on my father's side I have seen it play out for six generations. I think what is key in understanding the scapegoating and golden children dynamics is it is almost all about the emotional dysregulation of the perpetrators, and there is little substance and truth about what is said about the scapegoats and the golden children.
You are understandably frustrated with listening to your MIL and husband scapegoat you and others. I have listened to hundreds of hours of my family members scapegoat others and me. I used to think that if I listened enough, maybe I could help them. I realize now, it is best for me to just walk away and let them return to baseline on their own. Emotions are contagious and I don't need to have mine influenced by how unhappy and upset they are. What helps you to not take personally how your MIL and husband are talking about others? It sounds like there is little you can do with your MIL,  though I am under the impression that maybe your husband is open to some feedback  about how he talks about others affects you.
Thank you for all the links to the articles. I will read them later, as I find this type of information very helpful, particularly when I realize that the scapegoats are often chosen because of their strengths and questioning of the unhealthy family dynamics. When I am down on myself, I often remind myself how strong I was to fight for my life, and not consider suicide. It hurts my heart to hear that your BIL killed himself. It is possible that his suicide makes it even harder for your MIL and husband to face how scapegoating can do tremendous harm.

[2Loyal2Long]

I love this from Zachira:  “The scapegoats are often chosen because of their strengths and questioning of the unhealthy family dynamics.”

Yes, exactly, my therapist said it’s the healthier one in the family that is outed for questioning the unhealthy dynamics and the family scapegoats them to marginalize them so they can hang onto their homeostatic dysfunction.

A minister drew out a triangle for me.  On each corner of the triangle was a role each person plays, persecutor, victim, rescuer (enabler).  He said the roles can be fluid and people in the family can temporarily change roles based on the situation but the roles are otherwise fairly set.

And that’s triangulation in a nutshell.  Someone is always the bad guy.  There’s strength in numbers.  And the scapegoat is odd man out.

The only way to stop the triangulation is to step off the dance floor and watch the instability as the other remaining members struggle to find homeostasis again.  Not easy when one person steps out and refuses their role.

I was trying to get my uBPDh back on his feet after abandoning his job (everyone was out to get him, of course) so he became the victim and his parents became his rescuer against the mean wife (me).

That’s why I was suggesting keeping your MIL from becoming your enemy, she can easily drive a wedge between you and your H (you already know this).

Thank goodness for your MC.  Steady as she goes, hang in there PJ!  Hugs!

[pursuingJoy]

I think what is key in understanding the scapegoating and golden children dynamics is it is almost all about the emotional dysregulation of the perpetrators, and there is little substance and truth about what is said about the scapegoats and the golden children.

Emotions are contagious and I don't need to have mine influenced by how unhappy and upset they are.

I realize that the scapegoats are often chosen because of their strengths and questioning of the unhealthy family dynamics.

zachira these statements are truth nuggets to chew on. You've mentioned the intensity of scapegoating in your family. Thank you for sharing your hard earned wisdom. 

What helps you to not take personally how your MIL and husband are talking about others?

Good question. Thanks for asking!

Observing curiously.
Not validating the invalid (ie, not pursuing conversations that are scapegoaty).
When MIL would put my H down, I would counter and say, "No, I think he's pretty wonderful."
If H is going on about D16, I can ask questions about how her behavior makes him feel.
When H is jumping on to his mom's emotion boat, I learned to acknowledged her feelings then I ask, "But how do you feel about it?"

I think he scapegoats in part because he hasn't individuated...and it's closely tied to splitting, isn't it?

I used to get baited into JADEing but learned quickly how ineffective that was. More than anything I am trying to figure out what they get out of scapegoating.

It is possible that his suicide makes it even harder for your MIL and husband to face how scapegoating can do tremendous harm.

So true! An aunt told MIL that she was to blame for her son's suicide because of her treatment of him. MIL never spoke to her again, and out of loyalty, my H has also cut his aunt off. In many ways the entire experience cemented their loyalty to each other.

The only way to stop the triangulation is to step off the dance floor and watch the instability as the other remaining members struggle to find homeostasis again.  Not easy when one person steps out and refuses their role.

So how do you step off the floor? How did you do this?

I was trying to get my uBPDh back on his feet after abandoning his job (everyone was out to get him, of course) so he became the victim and his parents became his rescuer against the mean wife (me).

I'm so sorry you had to deal with this. I have a friend whose son is currently on opioids, in and out of jail, refuses rehab. She loves him but he wants enabling, not the love she is offering, just like your SO. It's heartbreaking.

That’s why I was suggesting keeping your MIL from becoming your enemy, she can easily drive a wedge between you and your H (you already know this).

The MC insisted that I should keep making efforts towards MIL. In the end, she was right - my effort, and MIL's lack of it (pointed out carefully in counseling), created a teeny tiny crack in H's armored defense of his mom.

[SadtimesAZ]

www.nicolamethodforhighconflict.com/ex-girlfriend-bpd-projection/

Not always scapegoating, projecting is a big thing. This is a good article about it.

[2Loyal2Long]

Hi PJ, I love seeing your updates!

Stepping off the dance floor . . . it’s interesting and not too terribly hard.  It just means doing the opposite of what comes naturally!  

And it sounds like you’re already doing it!

You’ve got a great MC who is practicing it herself from what you’ve shared.  Situations easily get triangulated.  I’m not a psychologist by any means but I do a lot of reading.

Think of three grade school friends playing together.  Two will align for a while, one is on the ‘outs’.  The roles continually change.  It’s a natural instinct in the animal kingdom for us (or animals, even ant colonies or bee hives) to group together, there’s strength in numbers, the odds of survival increase.  Chances of survival are lessened when we’re alone.  Survival of the fittest.  For obvious reasons, your MIL is threatened on a level of survival.

Your MIL lost her H.  She’s also lost a son as well and from what I read that’s a horribly sad situation that led up to it, my condolences to you and your family.

If the three of you are ‘dancing’ (you, H, MIL) on a dance floor you all know your steps.  It’s the same dance over and over again.  When you step off the dance floor and watch from the sidelines the two remaining dance partners are off balance without you, they’ll step all over each other’s toes until they create a new dance..  They’ll try to get you back on the dance floor to recreate the script they know.  That’s where it gets hard.

You have to stand firm and refuse to dance your part.  You’re doing a new dance now (healthier) and the two left on the dance floor have to change their dance steps to match yours to get in sync.  I’m essence, your refusal to participate in the unhealthy dance causes them to shift their steps.

I’m involved in Alanon, the entire program is about me focusing on myself and maintaining boundaries that are respectful to me without harming others.  It’s to keep me in my own ‘yard’, it’s not to keep others out.  What I’m learning is that when I stop rewarding bad behavior it will go into remission or become extinct.  I start rewarding the behavior that’s good, the change I want to see, with affirmation.  Reward the improved behavior consistently for a while, then vary the reinforcement schedule.  Behavior that is intermittently rewarded becomes the new norm and is virtually impossible to extinguish.

Look up the Skinner Study from the 1950’s.  I’ve spent thousands of dollars sitting in a therapist’s office the last 20 years getting NOWHERE.  I happened to remember studying intermittent reinforcement during a psychology class in college.  Then I began to suspect that’s what my uBPDh was doing to me and it’s exactly what my mother did in my childhood.

One thing lead to another and I found “Stop Walking on Eggshells”, look at page 98 in Chapter 5 (see also top of Page 100).  It discusses intermittent reinforcement schedules.  When I flipped through the book and found that I just about fell out on the floor.  I bawled.  Years upon years of horrible abuse came flooding back and I realized I wasn’t crazy.

Next time I saw my therapist I asked her why I had to be the one to figure it out what I was being subjected to was intermittent reinforcement, I wasn’t a trained therapist.  She shrugged her shoulders, sipped her coffee, said “I don’t know,” and just stared at me.

I no longer see her.  Nearly a year later I’ve found a DBT therapist (on a team) who treats BPD’s and family members.

Pages 93 and 94 of “Stop Walking on Eggshells” read straight out of Alanon.  It’s all about detaching with love and respecting our limits.  We teach others how to treat us.  If we have no (loving) boundaries there’s no limit to the weeds the BPD loved one will traipse into our ‘yard’.  And I recently learned that BPD’s actually crave boundaries.

I learned a lot about changing the dance from a book by Harriet Lerner, Ph.D., “The Dance of Intimacy.”  She also wrote “The Dance of Anger.”  I believe you can easily locate both.

Hope this helps, go Ginger Rogers!

[pursuingJoy]

Not always scapegoating, projecting is a big thing. This is a good article about it.

I enjoyed the article, thanks for sharing! I will save to reread later. Reading about insecurity projection was an aha moment. My MIL once told me she and her son (my H) had agreed she would move in with us. I said that wasn't what I'd discussed with her son. I was angry that both of them had violated a pretty significant boundary and as I left the room to cool off, she yelled after me, "You're just insecure!" I always thought this statement was really odd.

I think her abandonment hurts were triggered by my statement and she was projecting her own feelings of insecurity onto me. Very interesting behavior. I am learning to observe instead of react.

For obvious reasons, your MIL is threatened on a level of survival.

Your MIL lost her H.  She’s also lost a son as well and from what I read that’s a horribly sad situation that led up to it, my condolences to you and your family.

It is a sad situation, 2L2L. I married him many years after all of this happened, but to them, it's like it happened yesterday. I can feel their pain. I believe pain should be honored and recognized and given space. It's frustrating to watch his mom use pain to manipulate him - she abuses pain. I don't think she's doing it from a malicious place, it's simply a technique she uses because it works, but it destroys him. Considering your dance analogy, which is super amazing, btw, I need to resist involvement and the desire to rescue him. I do not have to feel their feelings and I am not responsible for their behavior.

If the three of you are ‘dancing’ (you, H, MIL) on a dance floor you all know your steps.  It’s the same dance over and over again.  When you step off the dance floor and watch from the sidelines the two remaining dance partners are off balance without you, they’ll step all over each other’s toes until they create a new dance..  They’ll try to get you back on the dance floor to recreate the script they know.  That’s where it gets hard.

omg this makes so much sense! Setting a boundary with her created major discomfort for both of them as they stumbled around and tried to figure out what was going on. For a very miserable 6 months they tried to get me back on the floor but I refused. I did good!  If it happens again, it won't be easy but I'll be more prepared.

You have to stand firm and refuse to dance your part.  You’re doing a new dance now (healthier) and the two left on the dance floor have to change their dance steps to match yours to get in sync.  I’m essence, your refusal to participate in the unhealthy dance causes them to shift their steps.

So, dance solo if need be?  I can do that. I am able to maintain a boundary. What I'm currently struggling with is not getting drawn into or distracted by their emotion, anger or accusations. They can really throw me off. I don't JADE with them anymore, but nasty comments still bother me.

It’s to keep me in my own ‘yard’, it’s not to keep others out.

If I step in and rescue, I'm stepping out of my yard. This analogy really makes sense!

One thing lead to another and I found “Stop Walking on Eggshells”, look at page 98 in Chapter 5 (see also top of Page 100).  It discusses intermittent reinforcement schedules.  When I flipped through the book and found that I just about fell out on the floor.  I bawled.  Years upon years of horrible abuse came flooding back and I realized I wasn’t crazy.

Ugh. It's feeling 'crazy' that brought so many of us to that turning point.    Soo glad you did learning on your own and took a different turn, AND found a good therapist team. Wow it sounds like you hit the jackpot with them.

It is crazy that intermittent conditioning is so powerful. I will check out the Skinner Study. I'd previously highlighted pg 99 in SWOE. "You are intermittently reinforced when the BP is in a good mood." - then - "If you feel addicted to the BP despite his/her harsh treatment of you, consider whether intermittent reinforcement is playing a part in the relationship." Thanks for reminding me about that part. My H exhibits addictive behaviors.

Pages 93 and 94 of “Stop Walking on Eggshells” read straight out of Alanon.  It’s all about detaching with love and respecting our limits.  We teach others how to treat us.  If we have no (loving) boundaries there’s no limit to the weeds the BPD loved one will traipse into our ‘yard’.  And I recently learned that BPD’s actually crave boundaries.

Love. This. Part. So true about BPD's loving boundaries. I've tried to explain to my H that his mom would know exactly what to expect each time, there's no question about the line. That has a calming effect.

Hope this helps, go Ginger Rogers!

hahaha I do not mind that nickname   

Thanks for the referrals and sharing this analogy. It is really, really helpful to visualize some of this. I'll be rereading your post.   

[2Loyal2Long]

Ginger doesn’t have to dance solo, she just changes her dance steps to a more fluid, neutral, dance with loving detachment done respectfully with new steps (ways of communicating).  Sounds like you’ve been doing a great new dance for quite a while!

If you show empathy and validation of your MIL’s feelings maybe she’ll become more connected in a healthier way?  Your H will change as you change.  It’s virtually impossible for one person to stay the same when their partner is changing and holding loving yet firm boundaries continually (I should take my own advice, see my updated post for details).

I can’t say strongly enough, based on my own experience, do everything possible to forge a loving connection with your H and not, eh hem, offend the MIL.  My in-laws poisoned my uBPDh’s mind but I was so sick of their interference in our marriage that I called them on the carpet years ago.  Damage done.  And guess who’s the villain now?  Me, of course.

Sounds like you’re doing a great job and your T is not getting seduced into the triangulation.  If we could all have T’s so healthy and professional!

[pursuingJoy]

Thanks for this, 2L2L...ugh, just left counseling. As we were walking out to the car, we were commenting how we've been in a better place recently and he said, "Yeah, because you finally calmed down."

UGH.

Initially I came back at him and said, "And you started to make different decisions." It was a weird funny, not funny moment.

I want to respond, "Yes, staying calm always helps. Although I sensed that you and your mom blamed me for everything, you've assured me that you and she carried responsibility in what happened. When you make statements like that, it makes me question what you said, and it makes me feel again like you blame me for everything."

What do you think?

[Longterm]

 

  I love this from Zachira:  “The scapegoats are often chosen because of their strengths and questioning of the unhealthy family dynamics.”

Me and my daughter were actually discussing this very topic today. She has been in therapy for a while now and I see a pattern with her where she will want to discuss with me her sessions. I'm obviously all ears as I'm hoping she can gain some acceptance from it all.

Recently I have seen things happen that frankly dont surprise me. She is becoming increasingly frustrated with her moms side of the family and I feel she is at a bit of a crossroads in trying to figure out what to do next. She sees the dysfunction as clear as day and finds it very difficult to talk to them. She feels like she is being pushed out solely for her views on various topics. I of course know why and it was no surprise when she told me her therapist said it's because they are trying to protect the dysfunctional dynamics within the family. Hence my daughter is pushed out and labelled trouble maker, scapegoated. It has been happening too with my other children where other grandchildren are placed on pedestals for short periods of time depending on who is supplying nans needs at any specific time. Systematic scapegoating and rejection.

I too suffered this as a child, but that's a whole other story.

LT.

[Longterm]

  I think what is key in understanding the scapegoating and golden children dynamics is it is almost all about the emotional dysregulation of the perpetrators, and there is little substance and truth about what is said about the scapegoats and the golden children.

Yes, it is fickle and superficial. It has nothing to do with the victim. My youngest was his moms golden child until he came to live with me, all communication since (not much) has been attempts to manipulate him into feeling guilt, really very little to do with him, all about HER needs. Once she realised he meant business he turns into a scapegoat, hes a horrible little boy apparently? She didnt buy him a birthday card, his punishment for not meeting HER needs.

LT.

[2Loyal2Long]

PJ, you did great!  Not surprised at his comment, they intuitively blame us.

I can promise you if I’d said to my H what you wanted to respond with (if I’m understanding correctly) it would have started a fight with my H.  It’s really hard to take it on the chin and be the bigger person.  At least your H is going to MC with you.  Maybe table his comment until next session?

[pursuingJoy]

LT I know it's so hard watching your kids go through that. I'm sorry. Do you try to explain it to them? How do you respond? 

Blended family issues are so complicated. We have similar issues with my H's ex, who has traces of BPD and NPD. Right now her golden child is fighting back and she is having an absolute fit, triangulating H. It's interesting that misbehavior from the scapegoat child is assumed, there's no overreaction, just a sigh of disapproval and more medication. Misbehavior from the golden child is causing a huge, huge emotional reaction. It's hard to watch. Is this normal? I would have thought it'd be the other way around.

2L2L, thanks again friend. I soo appreciate your understanding, all the more because I know you're going through a lot right now. You're exactly right, they've been conditioned to blame...and blame us, or anyone other than FOO. I don't need to be surprised when it happens. I was pretty proud of myself for keeping a level head and I feel like I used a version of SET - support, empathy, TRUTH. Maybe I could have injected more empathy.

Dance, inner Ginger, dance!