Is this part of why it's hard to get over them?

[l8kgrl]

Here's a weird thought...wondering if anyone else has felt this?

One of the things that I both loved about my ex and at times annoyed me - that I now realize was likely part of BPD - was how childlike he was. He had total boyish charm and energy, was into reading comics, loved going out, was just fun. He didn't care much about rules and I can't explain it, but just had such a young, vulnerable energy. I can be somewhat serious, so I loved being with someone who was so carefree (when he wasn't intensely angry or anxious about something or other, that is!).

Anyway, I understand so much better now that this was likely part of his arrested emotional development.

What I'm wondering, is are we partly attracted to and attached to them because it appeals to our own "inner child" (hate that term, but you know what I mean) that never really got to experience the love we were looking for?

Like, as much as I want to point the finger at him for being so emotionally immature and selfish, maybe I was operating from the same emotional age in seeking that love and validation that I didn't get from my parents.

And then, when the relationship ends, it's even more intensely painful because it's impacting that already-vulnerable younger part of ourselves that thought we were finally going to be "saved" by this person and their love?

Don't know if this is making sense...curious what others make of this idea

(And I also see that there are LOTS of other things that make the whole experience intense - the extreme highs and lows, the manipulation and crazy-making, etc etc...this may just be one other part?)

[JNChell]

I think that you ask a very good question when asking if these folks appeal to our inner child. Personally, my answer is a big yes. Perhaps coming to that understanding can allow us to dig a little deeper into why our inner child was/is attracted to someone that hurt us. What do you think?

[l8kgrl]

I think that you ask a very good question when asking if these folks appeal to our inner child. Personally, my answer is a big yes. Perhaps coming to that understanding can allow us to dig a little deeper into why our inner child was/is attracted to someone that hurt us. What do you think?

JNChell, for me, I think it's a couple of things - one, I don't feel like I fully got to experience being a kid because I had to be independent and responsible at a young age. So, being with someone who had that child-like energy was refreshing to me. I liked being able to just have fun instead of be such an adult.

Second, my exbf with uBPD had some crazy mix of qualities of both my mom and my dad. My mom in that he was very moody, often made me feel guilty or responsible for stuff that was really his, and was passive aggressive. Everything was about him, his feelings were hurt so easily, etc. He was like my dad in acting distant or distracted, and in making me constantly feel like I had to compete with his ex and his kids for his attention (I grew up always feeling like I had to compete with my sister for my dad's attention).

But when things were good, the affection he gave me, and the way he made me feel needed, felt SO good.

It was like he triggered all of my old stuff, all rolled up into one person.

And I knew that my own issues from childhood caused me to get into a very codependent role, it just hadn't occurred to me that his own very childlike nature might have created some of the attraction.

When I can get past the emotional pain of the situation, it's really pretty fascinating to psychoanalyze how all these things interact.

[Answerseeker333]

I don’t know if inner child, but they definitely have something about them that keeps us attached. My ex did not have that child in him, he was actually a business man, always working and had very little time for fun. What I liked about him was that we were able to have fun with anything. A piece of paper if that was what we had. So in my case, the small things were what made me feel so connected and the fact that he would always describe our interactions the exact way I felt. And he used to say our souls were intertwined and it really felt that way. That’s why for me it was so hard to understand the “personality switch” and the I don’t see a future with you, I enjoy our moments but when we are apart I don’t want to be with you thing. It’s just sad

[daze507]

the small things were what made me feel so connected and the fact that he would always describe our interactions the exact way I felt

This is an interesting point. My pwBPD used to describe how she felt all the time, sometimes saying the same things several times, for instance, something like "I like to be with you because I don't feel I must to talk all the time" could come back three times during the course of a day. For some reason, it did not feel that weird at the time but looking back, I never had women who explicitly told me why they were happy and what they liked about me, at least not compulsively and in that special way.
I'll add that to the red flags list.

I personally miss the intensity of the bond, I already had that kind of intensity with other women but only months in the relationship, not only after a few days. It was like if everything unfolded at super high speed with her. Basically, she took me very fast to the top emotionally and suddenly took back everything like if nothing had happened at all.
I think that this sudden severing of the bond out of the blue is why it's also so hard to move on because it's not natural, your brain can't understand it.

[DiscoDave]

I personally miss the intensity of the bond, I already had that kind of intensity with other women but only months in the relationship, not only after a few days. It was like if everything unfolded at super high speed with her. Basically, she took me very fast to the top emotionally and suddenly took back everything like if nothing had happened at all.
I think that this sudden severing of the bond out of the blue is why it's also so hard to move on because it's not natural, your brain can't understand it.

This.

Completely understand. I felt at times the endless list of problems and complaints in her life were sucking the life out of my soul, yet for some reason I always felt duty bound to help take care of things for her. When she recently severed the ties (This time forever she says) I just felt like a discarded carcass left to rot after all the flesh and blood had been consumed. A shell of person, far removed than the confident, more upbeat & enthusiastic (at least by my standards I was before I entered it).

The child-like 'quality' yes I could see that too. Though in my case I would find it pretty off-putting, I always longed for her to just grow up a bit. The anger tantrums, throwing things, smashing things then crumbling into a heaped mess of tears is toddler like, and extremely distressing to see in an adult. But most of the time, rather than being a young child her persona just reminded me of an angsty teenage girl, who liked to come across as 'all-knowing', generally quite cynical, hadn't really achieved much in life but still felt superior to others. Not being able to drive even in her late 30's bothered me as I had to drive us everywhere, pick-up various things all the time, make time on work commutes to do various things, I just kinda felt like my parents must've when I was a teenager without a licence. I remember offering to pay for lessons as it's a good life skill to have and would give her more independance (and me a break) but she'd go beserk at the idea. Other general life skills / finance, didn't want to know, didn't care.

One thing she did do exceptionally well though was house-hold chores, cooking, cleaning, laundry etc. This was pretty much ruthlessly ingrained into her as a young child by her mother (quite domineering & over protective) to prepare her for her future 'role'. Now I'll admit she took care of these things to greater level of competency than me, I have experienced living on my own for a number of years and could take care of those things myself just not to her same high standard, however she would always use it as a stick to beat me with. Saying, 'I do everything for you!' and that I 'can't cook or clean or look after myself'. A total nonsense, she would just never let me do these things aside from occasionally cleaning, saying 'I couldn't be trusted', I think she liked to treat ME as a child in that regard. She really did make feel like a defenceless child sometimes who would starve to death if it wasn't for her.

On the flip side, the angsty teenage girl persona, made me feel like a care-giver in more complex 'adult' roles / life administrative tasks. Looking back at the relationship and post-analysing things I do wonder if some part of me / my ego took advantage in a way, knowing that she was vulnerable she was less likely to leave me as I was needed. When I first met her, she dressed in quite a fairly 'teenager/young person' way, trainers (sneakers for US members) casual clothes, short/shaved hair, piercings and in time began to dress more like a women of her age, nice flowy dresses, grew her hair out, smart jackets, nice leather shoes / boots, hand-bags etc. Not through me telling her to dress / look this way, she just developed that style on her own. Towards the relationship ending to now, she's reverted back to cutting all her hair, piercing her ears with studs, buys loads of Dr Martens boots, it's like she's reverted back to looking like the person I first met. I don't have any negative thoughts about that, it's her choice, I just thought it was an interesting observation.

[l8kgrl]

DiscoDave, I can relate to a lot of that. So interesting that your ex didn't even want to drive.

For me, it's definitely co-dependency issues on my part, that feeling of somehow being obligated to take care of him and help him with all kinds of stuff that he should be able to do for himself as an adult. But also the comforting sense that he wouldn't leave me bc he "needed" me.

And yeah, the behavior and attitude of acting immature can definitely be very off-putting as well, not always "cute". There were so many times my ex and I were together with our kids - I wanted to feel like a couple, but he was always off playing with the kids, wanting to watch cartoons or read comic books or whatever. I realize in retrospect that he really was at that level with them.

He was also so into stuff that was much more like a teenage or young adult guy - heavy metal, drinking beer, going out to clubs, living like a total slob. This is someone who is 51. None of those things in and of itself is so unusual, but looking back I can see how totally overwhelmed he was by so many "adult" tasks and it was so strange to me because he is SO smart.

There was so much that he did that seemed so incredibly selfish and self-centered. It makes so much sense to see it through the lens of how a child or teenager would perceive things or act rather than trying to understand how an adult could think that way.

[Lucky Jim]

my exbf with uBPD had some crazy mix of qualities of both my mom and my dad.

Hey 18kgrl, Yes, I think there is often something familiar from childhood that we recognize in our BPD SO's, perhaps on a subconscious level.  In my case, my BPDxW shared qualities with my mother, who used to blow her stack in frightening fashion from time to time.  So for me, it seemed normal to be married to a woman with uncontrollable rage, because it was all part of my childhood.

It took me a long time to figure it out!

LuckyJim

[JNChell]

I don't feel like I fully got to experience being a kid because I had to be independent and responsible at a young age.

my exbf with uBPD had some crazy mix of qualities of both my mom and my dad.

It was comfortable, reassuring and allowed you to explore outside of the house, for lack of better words.

(I grew up always feeling like I had to compete with my sister for my dad's attention).

I’m not being harsh here, simply objective, but these things wired you to seek out partners that don’t work. I’m the same way, but I’ve done a lot of work on it.

It is really something, but at the same time it just makes sense. We learn from our parents, as we should. Unlearning, accepting and reparenting ourselves is a much bigger obligation than our parents could’ve handled.

[l8kgrl]

I’m not being harsh here, simply objective, but these things wired you to seek out partners that don’t work. I’m the same way, but I’ve done a lot of work on it.

JNChell, it’s not harsh at all, it’s just the truth. We all get wired a certain way based on what we learn and experience. Some of us just have less healthy experiences than others.

I’m trying to relearn as well. What has been effective for you in that process?,

[JNChell]

Understanding what happened to me and accepting that it wasn’t my fault. Therapy has helped and I recommend it. This community has been paramount because I’ve not been able to speak as openly as I have here, and see others doing the same and supporting each other. Taking in as much “credible” information that I can. Books and internet, just be careful when it comes to doing that. There’s a lot of misinformation out there. This site has a great library of books that have been vetted by experts. Some of those folks are members here. Mental health professionals, authors and the like. This place is a great resource.

Looking inside of myself has been the most effective thing that I could’ve done for my own healing. It took a while to get there, but, on the way, I realized that everything that I’ve described can work in a synergistic way. This is what has helped me thus far. I still I have a ways to go, but I’m way better than I was when I first showed up here. I hope that my ramblings make sense to you.

[Cromwell]

One of the things that I both loved about my ex and at times annoyed me - that I now realize was likely part of BPD - was how childlike he was. He had total boyish charm and energy, was into reading comics, loved going out, was just fun. He didn't care much about rules and I can't explain it, but just had such a young, vulnerable energy. I can be somewhat serious, so I loved being with someone who was so carefree (when he wasn't intensely angry or anxious about something or other, that is!).

Anyway, I understand so much better now that this was likely part of his arrested emotional development.

Hi L8kgrl

Just curious before I can answer, what do you mean by emotional arrested development, you suggest that your ex had this and these behaviours (energy, fun, reading comics, etc) are indicative of it. Thanks.

[l8kgrl]

Hi L8kgrl

Just curious before I can answer, what do you mean by emotional arrested development, you suggest that your ex had this and these behaviours (energy, fun, reading comics, etc) are indicative of it. Thanks.

Hi Cromwell, I don't think I stated that very well. Being fun, reading comics, etc is obviously not a sign of arrested emotional development. I think it was part of a bigger picture with him that's hard to explain, but he was very kid-like in a lot of ways, in his energy, his attitude, his interests, etc. Not to mention his response to stressful situations. And what I've read about BPD suggests that there is an emotional immaturity involved (which is certainly not limited only to people with BPD) - I may not be saying this the right way, but basically they were maybe stunted at a certain level of emotional development.

I just felt like maybe something that was very kid-like about him was appealing to me on some subconscious level, even if certain aspects of his kid-like behavior were not always appealing to me as an adult woman. Not sure if that makes more sense.

[Calcite]

Yes, L8kgrl, I was so happy to see your post here because his childlike perspective on the world was a huge attraction for me. I'm a visual artist and he made me see things in an entirely new, more vivid way - just like I was a child again. I loved the way he expressed joy at really seeing things - the sky, the spring swifts, a star which seemed to follow the moon. It sounds so sappy now, but I fell hugely in love with his child's eyes. I felt that he was my muse. And this perspective and joy made him seem even more vulnerable, which in turn made me love him more. It allowed me to be a child too 'look! Look at the colours in the sea!' and gain a validating response... Which made the moments seem magical. And like many of us here I think, in my own childhood  I'd had to be a caretaker, so had grown up too fast. I have never fallen in love so hard.

Of course it all went crazy. I left a marriage of 10 years (15 years of faithful relationship) with three amazing children because I couldn't imagine returning to life without him. Everyone was hurt. I knew my childlike muse had serious problems because strange situations and obsessions had been there from the start. But I thought I could be strong enough to weather any storms. I didn't realise how big the storms would be, and how outside reality. It culminated in him physically assaulting someone asking about my new studio, then getting drunk, turning off all the lights and hiding from 'the Chinese mafia' while shouting at me that I'd encouraged them to take over his country because I support immigration. I moved out of his just before lockdown a few weeks later as he was becoming increasingly erratic (I stayed with him after the mafia night!) . Then read everything I could on BPD as I'd seen it for the first time in a book, and my muse scored exceptionally highly on all the traits. I still thought I could manage his moods with validation of his emotions, and reassurance that I am faithful and I love him. But this relies on an adult response to situations like our separation through covid-19. Instead, he is of course reacting as a child in a 52 year old's body - taking tranquillisers and alcohol, then calling to accuse me of cheating or not helping him in some way. It's different every evening. He is lately incoherent, repeating himself, cursing everyone and everything, saying terrible things, then doesn't remember or chooses not to remember anything the next day. His response is 'it's OK, I love you'. I still very much love him, but it's not OK. I can't weather it, and still function as a person and mother to my own boys, rather than to him. So with enormous guilt I ended it yesterday evening. This is my first evening without speaking with him at this time. So I'm here!

[Calcite]

And, re comics as a reoccurring theme in these posts... My BPD muse was an animator and comic book artist! Maybe comics should be in the list of flags for male BPD. He was also fabulous with young children. Totally on their wavelength. But he was never a part of my own children's lives as I early on knew that I couldn't trust his moods.

[l8kgrl]

And, re comics as a reoccurring theme in these posts... My BPD muse was an animator and comic book artist! Maybe comics should be in the list of flags for male BPD. He was also fabulous with young children. Totally on their wavelength. But he was never a part of my own children's lives as I early on knew that I couldn't trust his moods.

Yes - we should definitely add comics to the list! Lol. And my ex was the same. We did spend a lot of time with our kids all together, even taking a few trips, and he was always very into doing stuff with them whether it was splashing in the lake or watching animated movies.

The events that precipitated the end of your relationship sound similar to mine in that it was a fight my ex got into with someone else that really was the last straw for me. It was very scary.

I sent you a pm