Never Realized What Was Causing the Bad Behavior

[coolspring]

This week marks our 37th wedding anniversary and it’s sad to admit that all of the fighting and turmoil during our marriage has probably been caused my husband’s BPD and my inability  (and ignorance) in how to deal with it.
 Now that we are retired and spending lots of time together, his behavior is really driving me insane. The love/hate cycles, jealous of time spent with my new friends and activities, silent treatment if I do something that makes him feel ignored, i.e. talking on the phone with my elderly father for more than 15 minutes and the fact that our social activities should just be the 2 of us.

I always felt that while he is extremely intelligent, he has low Emotional Intelligence. He is awkward in social situations if he senses that  people are better than him and says inappropriate things that turn people off. He was terminated from 7 high level professional positions that were always someone else’ s fault. When he is in the “love” cycle, he cannot do enough for me, when the “hate” cycle starts I usually respond with angry outbursts which does not help the situation.

I am thankful that I found this website today and I look forward to learning from the members of the group.

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[once removed]

you love a highly sensitive person, thats for sure.

ive always believed that every person has a special way/need to love and be loved. and highly sensitive people, all the more so.

he may especially struggle with feeling left out. all of us do...and some of us react more irrationally than others when we do.

tell us more about whats going on lately. what was the last big fight the two of you had about?

[Kayce123]

Wow, I feel I could have written this. Our relationship was a year and a half, not 37, but everything you described feels so familiar.

I didn't know either how to deal with it. It wasn't until the most recent breakup did I connect things with BPD.

You learn a script growing up for what is acceptable and appropriate interaction behavior and how to interpret social cues in response to your behavior. BPD turns that upside down and inside out.

My ex is also extremely smart but it's as if he has the emotional intelligence of a six year old.

I look forward to learning from this site. I  also want to learn how to handle things... if a future presents itself to us to work on things. My friends want to chalk it up to he's just a jerk, using me, and says the things he does as some game or joke on me.  I have gone in circles with explaining that it makes no sense  for him to expose weakness or do things that most people would be too prideful to do if that was the case.  I don't think it does anyone dealing with someone with BPD any favors to not put things in the proper context. That doesn't mean you excuse everything, but I feel it's being fair to yourself to make informed and honest choices for what you are or aren't willing to tolerate. It seems as if  people on this site understand and can offer insight.

Have you come across any information you think may help your situation?  I hope you find a way that is fair to you and brings peace so you can enjoy your marriage. Best wishes and take care.

[coolspring]

This group has been a lifesaver for me and I have utilized many of the coping skills others have posted. Trying not to engage and stay calm. One of the issues as mentioned in my 1st post was my H reacts very badly if I answer a phone call or see my 86 yr old recently widowed Dad. ( who I only see one or two times per week.) Tonight as I was getting dinner ready, Dad called to see if our daughter was ok because of the hurricane. He jumped up and screamed, “it’s 7 o’clock and I’m hungry, I need to eat”, and had a fit. If it was anyone else I know he would not have reacted that way. I finished cooking, served his dinner and went into the other room. He just stormed out of the house and who knows when he will return.

[JaneWrites]

I'm 17 years into my marriage and just figured it out. It's calming to finally understand and read so many parallel stories here. Now, there's a reliable predictability to so much of what happens. I probably find myself less engaged on one level and more engaged on another with specific strategies. But it's all just managing this beast of a cruel illness. And in my case, I feel it's more cruel to those around the pwBPD. It's dealing with a partner who is not a partner, not a safe confidante, not even a real friend, not anything I had believed and it's crushing. People describe it as a rollercoaster, but it's not for me. It's walking on a plateau and falling off of it, looking for a way out and mysteriously finding yourself on the plateau again and waiting to fall again. Is it ever joyous? But the knowing gives me a little power and sanity and understanding and more empathy. I've been called a cold and cruel person, and I knew I wasn't, but I didn't understand how it could be that life was turning out the way it was despite my best efforts. Now I know.

I'm saying I hear you and I get it. And so do many on here. I'm so sorry you are experiencing it too, but maybe we can give each other a little comfort and sanity.

[coolspring]

Thank you for your response. When we go through a “calm” period, I feel relieved and happy.The past few days and especially tonight, I cannot keep it together. I am having a very hard time trying to see the BPD side vs. what I am feeling, which is sad, depressed and tired of dealing with this behavior for so long.

[once removed]

He just stormed out of the house and who knows when he will return.

what happened when he came back?

[coolspring]

When he returned 3 hours later, he slept in another room. We had another argument the next night over something stupid. Fast forward a few days, he is now in the “loving” period. Bought me flowers, being extra kind, etc...
It’s great, but I am walking on egg shells and feeling very anxious.

[Abazaba]

This week marks our 37th wedding anniversary and it’s sad to admit that all of the fighting and turmoil during our marriage has probably been caused my husband’s BPD and my inability  (and ignorance) in how to deal with it.
 Now that we are retired and spending lots of time together, his behavior is really driving me insane. The love/hate cycles, jealous of time spent with my new friends and activities, silent treatment if I do something that makes him feel ignored, i.e. talking on the phone with my elderly father for more than 15 minutes and the fact that our social activities should just be the 2 of us.

I always felt that while he is extremely intelligent, he has low Emotional Intelligence. He is awkward in social situations if he senses that  people are better than him and says inappropriate things that turn people off. He was terminated from 7 high level professional positions that were always someone else’ s fault. When he is in the “love” cycle, he cannot do enough for me, when the “hate” cycle starts I usually respond with angry outbursts which does not help the situation.

I am thankful that I found this website today and I look forward to learning from the members of the group.

This is very typical. My exBPD would act out intensely in social situations if he felt like those around him were “superior,” I.e., really inappropriate cursing in conservative company, being disruptively loud or making really out there comments that would leave people hoping he was joking. In 5 years he had 5 different jobs. Four of those jobs had really “evil bosses” and terrible “vindictive” coworkers. He abruptly quit his 3rd job overnight with no warning because of a comment his boss made. He quit his 4th job after 3 months because he felt that the entire staff and his boss were evil mean people. He was at his 5th job when we broke up, and he was absoutlty at his breaking point on that job as well.

The love and hate cycles are tough too - one minute you’re a saint, the next you’re evil and selfish.

[coolspring]

Thanks for your response, I feel comfort knowing I am not alone, sad to know how many are dealing with this. I am working hard to incorporate the techniques outlined on the site and shared by members.

We have a dinner gathering tonight and he has exhibited some very bad behavior with these friends on prior occasions. Guess I am surprised that they still include us. My anxiety level is quite high right now.

[once removed]

dont get caught up in cycles.

thats the definition of walking on eggshells.

you love a very difficult person. at the healthiest level this relationship can reach, he will still be a difficult person. you will have bad cycles.

the key to these relationships is thinking more in terms of long term fire prevention than putting out each individual fire. building a loving, validating environment, that fosters trust. you will still have the same problems. ideally, they will be fewer and further between, and youll be better equipped to handle them.

any update?

[Diddle]

coolspring

How was your evening with friends? and how are you doing this week?

[coolspring]

dont get caught up in cycles.

thats the definition of walking on eggshells.

you love a very difficult person. at the healthiest level this relationship can reach, he will still be a difficult person. you will have bad cycles.

the key to these relationships is thinking more in terms of long term fire prevention than putting out each individual fire. building a loving, validating environment, that fosters trust. you will still have the same problems. ideally, they will be fewer and further between, and youll be better equipped to handle them.

any update?

[coolspring]

coolspring

How was your evening with friends? and how are you doing this week?
 
H had an huge argument with the host regarding the number of Covid deaths, shouting and being extremely rude. The other people were uncomfortable, I was once again mortified. This lovely group of neighbors are new friends as we retired and moved here a few years ago. When we got home, I know I shouldn’t have, but I asked what he thought he would gain by being so belligerent. Well as you can imagine, that didn’t go over well. Suggestions please on how I should have handled while it was happening.

[Diddle]

Suggestions please on how I should have handled while it was happening.

Oh no, so sorry you sat through that. I've been there, our neighbours are good friends of ours, but have also been on the receiving end of my H.
To the point where they have told me that they are only staying friends with us because of me. This was before I knew about BPD.
Our relationship with them is now very up and down, and even the last time we got together my H was rude and inconsiderate and loud, this usually goes hand in hand with too much wine, which he has acknowledged this needs to stop.

I tried very hard in the moment last time, to steer the conversation onto something else, change the subject without belittling him, in a "moving on" kind of way and you know glare at the others to follow suit if possible. it works for a while but H went back to the subject time and time again, making our neighbours feel confused.
I wish I could explain to them why he behaves this way, that he doesn't have the ability to consider other peoples feelings before speaking and is easily angered, but the other part of me thinks he's a grown adult and I shouldn't be doing that for him. He has to take some responsibility. Particularly when in situations that matter to him (like work calls and meetings) he can control himself.
I quite honestly feel like his mother sometimes.
I have often apologised to my neighbours for my husband. I would be tempted to do the same still now if I were you, let them know that you don't agree with his actions but didn't want to ak either worse in the moment. if they're true friends, they understand.

[coolspring]

Thank you Diddle for your response and support.

[Chosen]

Hi coolspring,

37 years- wow.  I can image how difficult it must've been, and all the while not knowing about BPD.  I know about BPD and suspect my H has it, but still, it's "only" been 8 for me.  The walking on eggshells thing is tough, and I think we must try our best to learn ways from this site so we don't walk on eggshells all the time.   I mean, when he's raging, of course we're going to be walking on eggshells.  There's this "damned if I respond, and damned if I don't" dilemma.  

What I really, really need to learn is how to not be invalidating.  I know I am, by nature, pretty invalidating (selfish?).  And I guess if I was invalidating but catch myself in time, things usually will be ok.  But things add up and if I keep on being invalidating, then at one point his rage meter go straight to 100 and it's all downhill.  At this point, I usually lose control of myself too and it makes things much, much worse.  But I find that you need to be quite calm and stable in order to use the tools properly.  I hope you're more stable than me emotionally because at a lot of time I only remember the tools after things go really bad...

[coolspring]

I haven’t posted for a while because I didn’t want to rant. HBPD behavior has spiraled out of control, all due to my elderly widowed father.  I usually meet my father for breakfast once a week and MAYBE H and I have dinner with him once a week.At Sunday dinner, we FaceTimed with my daughter and my Dad asked her to choose a bike for our granddaughter’s birthday in Oct. After Dad left, H went into a tirade that he should be the one buying the bike. He said he would disown our daughter if she wouldn’t let him buy the bike.He left the house and didn’t one back for 2 days. (We have a rental property that we are in the process of selling and it is vacant). After he calmed down, he came back and all was good for 2 days. Then another issue regarding my Dad, too stupid to even mention the details. He left again, came back unbeknownst to me at 2:30 am and moved my car out of the driveway and parked it around the corner. Came back 2 days later.
2 more arguments led up to my trip to see my daughter for 2 weeks to help her with childcare while she works. H is to join me after 2 weeks. On the morning of my flight, I was scheduled to have breakfast with Dad and he said he would bring me to the airport since the place we have breakfast is close to the airport.We discussed this the night before my flight and H flipped out in a manner that was ridiculous. Left the house for hours, called me and screamed at me. Came back to the house and slept in the other room.I canceled breakfast thinking it would make peace, however when he dropped me off at the airport, I lost it and told him I couldn’t deal with his behavior any longer. Called him after 24 hours and he didn’t answer. Now I will play the waiting game.
Sorry for the rant, I don’t know how much longer I can deal with this.

[Carruthers]

That sounds really hard.  My BPDH has similar issues with my elderly widowed mother...I guess it's sharing the attention... Weirdly, he has similar issues around the bicycle my mother bought my daughter, too - ie he hates it and sees it as an emblem of my (hated) family.

I'm afraid I haven't any advice, but lots of sympathy.

[coolspring]

Thank you Carruthers. Just knowing that someone listens and can appreciate what we are all going let’s us all know that we are not alone.

[once removed]

people with bpd traits will struggle when your attention is elsewhere...a job, a health crisis, a family member, a friend.

i know that this is kind of a hindsight thing, but going forward, it can help to have a heart to heart ahead of time, in order to prepare them, and to reassure them.

you can still have that conversation, but it may look a bit different: youll need to get across that you love your father and he requires your love and attention, but that it doesnt mean you love him (your husband) any less. you may want to offer something tangible to reassure him, like (just for example) a once a week date night. and you likely will want to do more listening than talking...let him blow off steam, ask questions, get a sense for how he feels about it all.

[coolspring]

Thank you Once Removed for your advice. I find myself anticipating a bad reaction when I tell my BPDH that I am going to see my Dad and then everything blows up.
 I have taken a break  and have been at my daughters house for 2 weeks. When I go back, I will have a better attitude. Spending time on this site and going through the lessons have been very beneficial.
I appreciate your support.

[once removed]

Thank you Once Removed for your advice. I find myself anticipating a bad reaction when I tell my BPDH that I am going to see my Dad and then everything blows up.

something i wanted to add:

it will probably not be as simple as "plan ahead, have a conversation beforehand", and things will go better.

youve been married for 37 years, and this dynamic is pretty well established. it isnt easy to change the dynamics of a relationship. in fact, when you try, things often get worse before they get better. to put this in context, it will help to do some reading on extinction bursts:  https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=85479.0

but if you dont try, they stay the same, and may get worse.

you will need to try new things, you will need to know that a strong negative reaction is not necessarily an indicator that youre "trying the wrong thing", but you will also need some trial and error, and some time.

[coolspring]

Thank you Once Removed,

I read the info on extinction and I believe the 2 weeks away from each other helped to give HBPD space for a while. We had brief, polite conversations every few days. It gave him time to “self soothe”. Now that we are back together, trying to give him space, take deep breathes and non-aggressively disengage.
From the article-
“So what do we do?  When the person with Borderline Personality Disorder becomes dysregulated or depressed, bpdfamily.com recommends that you give them the space to self sooth - not try to do it for them.  Take a deep breath and politely and non-aggressively disengage. It’s not easy to block out the distraction and emotional pleas for our attention, yet it is only with a critical pause that we can really stay on a constructive and healthy pathway.”