Filing Protective order with children involved. Need feedback please. Part 2

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

Mod Note:  Part 1 of this thread is located here: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=345434.0;all

Frankee,

I want to start by saying I completely understand why you let your h see S4.

I also want to tell you, from the perspective of someone who has been in your shoes, that it is not a good idea. I'm being blunt and I'm sorry, but I feel it on my heart to tell you that.

Think back on how he has handled this situation before. Has he ever not used the child as a way to get to you? To talk to you, to try to win you back, emotionally manipulate you and try to get you to feel bad for leaving him when it is his behavior that made that a necessity?

Please reconsider any visitation for your son with your h until you have something court ordered in place.  

I responded before I had read this, but yes, I agree 100%.  I admit, I was weighed with guilt.. a lot.  I felt like a bad mom, being vindictive.. all that nonsense.  Something just finally snapped me awake.  I knew he was using manipulation before, but the last day, he has increased by 10 fold.  I do regret letting him see s4.  I will take the hit for making a stupid choice on that.  I realize it so much right now.  I have been openly communicating with my parents and I have found out more to it than I even thought I knew.  I figured he was saying things to s9 while he was talking to him, but when I talked to my dad, it became crystal clear.

[Frankee]

Mod Note:  Part 1 of this thread is located here: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=345434.0;all

Frankee,

I want to start by saying I completely understand why you let your h see S4.

I also want to tell you, from the perspective of someone who has been in your shoes, that it is not a good idea. I'm being blunt and I'm sorry, but I feel it on my heart to tell you that.

Think back on how he has handled this situation before. Has he ever not used the child as a way to get to you? To talk to you, to try to win you back, emotionally manipulate you and try to get you to feel bad for leaving him when it is his behavior that made that a necessity?

Please reconsider any visitation for your son with your h until you have something court ordered in place.  

I responded before I had read this, but yes, I agree 100%.  I admit, I was weighed with guilt.. a lot.  I felt like a bad mom, being vindictive.. all that nonsense.  Something just finally snapped me awake.  I knew he was using manipulation before, but the last day, he has increased by 10 fold.  I do regret letting him see s4.  I will take the hit for making a stupid choice on that.  I realize it so much right now.  I have been openly communicating with my parents and I have found out more to it than I even thought I knew.  I figured he was saying things to s9 while he was talking to him, but when I talked to my dad, it became crystal clear.

[Frankee]

I really appreciate all the feedback, and this is going to be the first time I have said this.. but I'm going to take a break from the site.  I'm feeling heavy negative vibes about what I decided a couple days ago.

I get it.  I screwed up.  Yes he is an a$$hole, but I'm not.  My baby was asking to see his daddy and it was breaking my heart.  So yes, I said okay.  I regret it now.  I can't change the past, but I d@mn well learned my lesson.  

I can't deal with this cr@p right now, I need support, not making me feel like I am being stupid right now.  If that offends anyone, whatever.  Kick me off the site for saying that, but I need to figure out what to do from here forward, not feel like $hit for messing up.

[I Am Redeemed]

Frankee,

I made many mistakes in all of my attempts to leave my abusive marriage, including the aftermath of the final time I left my relationship.

I assure you, I am not judging you in any way. In many ways, I made lots of worse errors than you.

I let my husband have my son unsupervised even after a protective order was issued.

I let my husband watch my son when he was using drugs.

I let my husband talk me into resuming the relationship after CPS took custody of my kids for domestic violence.

I sent my husband money while he was in jail, over and over and over again, after seven years of domestic abuse, when he was serving nine months for assault on me which included strangling me, chasing me and threatening me with a hatchet while I held my son in my arms, and drugging me not once but THREE times.

I promise you that I am not here to judge you. I'm just here to share the painful and expensive cost of my experience to perhaps save you from more of the same.

It's perfectly understandable Why you have made the decisions you have made. We don't have judgment in mind here. I assure you we are saying what we say out of concern for you.

Please stay safe and know that we are here waiting for you on your time.

[formflier]

Frankee

Let me join I Am Redeemed in assuring you of the thoughts below.

I assure you we are saying what we say out of concern for you.

Please stay safe and know that we are here waiting for you on your time.

 

Best,

FF

[ForeverDad]

Please keep in touch.  For my part, I apologize profusely for any misunderstandings.  I/we do care about you.  We didn't know the terms of your protective order nor the local advice from professionals and so we were only looking out for your interests out of concern.

Frankly, I made some decisions in those early days that had me laying in bed at night wondering in the middle of the night if the police were going to bang on my door.  Never happened of course but I was catastrophizing.  At the time I hadn't yet registered here and so didn't have the support here until months later.

[Frankee]

Thank you.  I think I just become too overwhelmed with everything and I needed a minute to get my head straight.

I panicked the day he was meeting me to drop him off.  He was bombarding me with questions about s4 and when he would see him again.  I wasn't planning to let him see him again so I panicked.  He said he was taking work off so I could have more time to myself.  I lied.  I said Wed Noon at such and such place.  ended up sitting on my bed, crying, rockin myself because I was freaking out.  My girl friend talked to me and calmed me down.

I have done no contact since I picked up S4.  He messaged and called today, begging to see S4.  I didn't reply.  After the anxiety and stress I was dealing with, I'm cutting visits until the PO comes through.  I felt strongly he used the time to coarse me into talking about things in fear that I wouldn't get s4 back.  It also bothered me he wanted to use a babysitter on Friday nights.  It doesn't make sense for s4 to go there if he's just going to be at a sitter's so he can do whatever he is doing at night.  S4 has only been away from me when I have been at work.

It was extremely stressful and after I got S4 back, I knew I couldn't go through that again.  Yes, s4 loves his dad, but he doesn't understand.  I can't remember who said.. is he really a good dad is he abuses the mother?  Is he a good dad is he uses the kids as a guilt trip?  He had all the chances in the world to be a good dad when we were there and he threw it in the trash.  He couldn't even be bothered to watch them two days so I could go to work and all of sudden he wants the kids three days?  Now he can't live without them?  He barely saw them when they were literally there 24/7 and now he wants to spend all this time with them?

I have been digging up old emails and texts for the DA.  I have one from 5 years ago, some from 2 to 3 years ago.  In black and white.. the same promises everytime he hurt me.  Same pleads.  I gave him way more chances then he ever deserved and it was all there for me to see.  I don't feel bad for him.  Not anymore.

[Frankee]

Sorry for the long post.  Just realizing that I think the last built of guilt I had is gone.

[I Am Redeemed]

It was me that said that. I had to look at behaviors, not words, because the guilt of keeping s4 from him was tremendous.

I had to look at the well-being of s4 and how his dad's behavior was affecting him. My ex would cry when we left visitation and tell s4 (who was then not yet three) that he wanted him to stay with him but mommy wouldn't let him. Then his behavior escalated into tampering with my vehicle so I couldn't leave, next thing you know he sexually assaulted me and that was the last straw. I decided I was not giving him any more opportunity to hurt me or my son and it didn't matter how guilty I felt. I dealt with the guilt in therapy. He made no attempt to be a better father.

[RolandOfEld]

It was extremely stressful and after I got S4 back, I knew I couldn't go through that again.  Yes, s4 loves his dad, but he doesn't understand.  I can't remember who said.. is he really a good dad is he abuses the mother?  Is he a good dad is he uses the kids as a guilt trip? 

Hi Frankee, this is some really excellent FOG-dispelling. I've also come into the habit of keeping a few key memories and facts close at hand every time I feel myself softening up when I shouldn't. Another thing I've found very helpful for these kind of situations is creating a mental "fight mode" for myself. It just so happens I take boxing classes, so when I enter a situation with her when I know some confrontation might be imminent, I just think to myself "gloves up", and my fight mode clicks into place. It helps to have a clear idea of when to be kind and when to be tough.

Nice work on collecting the old emails and texts. Have you identified your "star evidence"? Its good to have a lot of recurring things to establish a pattern of abuse, but I found when applying for the PO that it helped to have a few big ones, too.

~ROE 

[formflier]

 

You've got this.  Please be extra kind to yourself!

Best,

FF

[worriedStepmom]

These kinds of relationships aren't easy to exit.

Your goal really is to do the best that you can, and, when you learn better, do better.

We'll be here to provide support and a little kick in the pants if we want you to think a little.  But in the end, no matter what, we're on the side of you and your son.

[Frankee]

I wanted to share some messages I have been getting.  I haven't responded.  I almost blocked him, but I decided not to.  My rationale for that is.. the DA wants me to send her any and all harassing/threatening correspondence.  While these aren't really harassing/threatening and I haven't sent them to the DA, I'm sure most on here can appreciate the irony of the extreme manipulation and guilt trip he is trying to pull.  I also know that he will lose his composure.  He's got his mask up right now and he will eventually get tired of holding it up.

Message I received this morning.  Your hurting him by not letting me see him.  I don't understand why your doing this.  I told you I wouldn't fight you leaving.  I said I understand.  You know I'm a good father and I would never do anything to endanger the welfare of our children.  So why are you keeping them from me?  Does this mean your not going to let M be my son anymore? What am I supposed to tell him?  What about school?  We need to talk about it.  Please let me see our son.  Have him call something, anything just so I know he's safe and can tell him I love him.  Please don't hurt him for our mistakes.

Message received a week ago.  People keep telling me I have to "keep fighting for the kids", "you can't give up".  But I don't want to fight you over the kids.  I don't want to hurt them and I don't want to use them against you.  so thank you for keeping your word so far.  Thank you so much.  Please tell s4 I love him.  And you, but I know you don't want to hear that.  So I won't say it.  
I won't say anything else, but it seems like your having a really hard time.  I understand you have to get away from me.  You don't want any help from me.  I really get that, and I'm not going to try to convince you to come home because that's just going to make it harder on you.  But I am here to help, just help.  You cannot be with me, it's no good for you.  But I am still here for you.  If you need anything.  I'm here.

On the 17th I don't know what that means.  You don't need to hear that I'm devoted to our son?  Or you don't need to hear that he's mine? You don't need to hear that I want what's best for him?

I know you don't care what I have to say.  But I want S9 to come home.  If I'm really his father, I should have a say.  He just broke down crying on the phone saying that he didn't want to be there anymore, he just wants to see his family.  I didn't tell him anything, he just wants to come home.  I thought you should know that.  This is hurting the kids, and me, maybe even you.  You don't have to come back. Please just try a little harder to work with me.  For them.  Not for me.

I have denied visitations.  I talked to legal aid about state laws.  I took him out of the daycare he didn't like, had him going to the babysitter and starting a new daycare Monday.  Every now and then, S4 says he likes daddy, or he wants to go to the boathouse.  It pains me a little, but I just smile and say maybe another day.  He just says okay.  Then I divert his attention by acting silly, playing with him, or talking to him.  Exbph has it built in his head that S4 and S9 are crying and devastated that can't see him.  I feel that he doesn't realize is that his absence while we were literally there 24/7, is probably why they aren't as devastated as he imagines.

I also forgot to disclose the fact that my parents helped me get a used car with low miles and great gas mileage.  That has been a saving grace.  Having that separation from depending on an old gas guzzling truck or trying to trade off and on and having him guilt me about not having transportation has been completely eliminated.

The difference I feel from last week is the crushing guilt I felt keeping the kids away has gone.  I've been reading over old texts and emails.  It's all right there.  In black and white.  His patterns, his lies, his threats.  He knows the kids are my biggest weakness.  He has made both of the kids cry and I can still see the heartbroken look on their faces.

It was me that said that. I had to look at behaviors, not words, because the guilt of keeping s4 from him was tremendous.

I decided I was not giving him any more opportunity to hurt me or my son and it didn't matter how guilty I felt. I dealt with the guilt in therapy. He made no attempt to be a better father.

He is making no attempt to be better, just using guilt to get his way.  I once said, he's a better father when we aren't together, but I know I was wrong.  I was still in FOG back then, I'm not anymore.

[I Am Redeemed]

Some of those messages could have been sent by my ex. He would also send old pictures of us and the kids.

I believe my ex saw the kids as extensions of himself, so he believed they felt the same way as he did.

I think you are doing good by not responding. And anyone who knows anything about the tactics of abusers can see clearly what he is trying to do here. He's applying pressure to you emotionally, and IMO it crosses into harassment.

Non harassment would be respecting your boundaries and being proactive about finding out how he can gain legal visitation through the courts. Instead, he's harassing you and applying emotional blackmail tactics to get what he wants.

I would send them to the da. If she can't use them, she will tell you. But it clearly shows that he is not giving you space and is attempting to cause you distress.

[I Am Redeemed]

Also, take note that he refers to his abuse of you as "our" mistakes. That's important.

[Frankee]

I believe my ex saw the kids as extensions of himself, so he believed they felt the same way as he did.

Non harassment would be respecting your boundaries and being proactive about finding out how he can gain legal visitation through the courts. Instead, he's harassing you and applying emotional blackmail tactics to get what he wants.

I would send them to the da. If she can't use them, she will tell you. But it clearly shows that he is not giving you space and is attempting to cause you distress.

I'm glad I posted that.  I was trying to decide if they were harassing.  I have been sending her the conversations that were the most impactful first.  I will send all of this to her.  I felt like it was emotional blackmail, but since I haven't been impacted by it, I wasn't 100%.  This is just why before I was heavily guilted.

Also, take note that he refers to his abuse of you as "our" mistakes. That's important.

I saw that too and I rolled my eyes at how he kept saying "our" mistakes.  Only mistake I made was to keep giving him chances.

The thing I have noticed about him and probably a lot of other people with these issues is that they will wait it out.  They will keep pushing as long as they have to before we crack and give in.  I did drop a lot last year and I did go back after.. 5 months.  So.. knowing that track record, I have at least 5 months of dealing with this.. yeehaw.. 

[formflier]

What would you guess is the timeline for protective orders, custody orders, child support, divorce filing and all that?

Will they all be done at about the same time or staggered out?

Offhand I would think moving towards those as quickly as possible is important because it will get everyone to realize "this is a new path", versus having and idea they can "wait it out".

Best,

FF

[Frankee]

What would you guess is the timeline for protective orders, custody orders, child support, divorce filing and all that?

Will they all be done at about the same time or staggered out?

Offhand I would think moving towards those as quickly as possible is important because it will get everyone to realize "this is a new path", versus having and idea they can "wait it out".

When I spoke with the DA about the protective order, she said normally it takes about a month, but due to the whole COVID19, the courts are running slow, so it could be expected to be two months.  The whole custody/visitation/divorce, I'm expecting a long drawn out ordeal. My phone interview was on the 14th.  I am hoping that he will get at least served before two months and that maybe the first court hearing is two months.  I will email her to get clarficiation on the time frame.

I spoke with the legal aid and sent the applications and all the requested documents to her to get the process of visitation/support/custody/divorce.  I am also going to check in with her on Monday to see if she has received everything she needs.

I had a meeting with the housing woman on June 29th and she said that could take 3-4 months on average, but I am willing to wait however long I need to so I don't end up in the same situation I was last year.

I feel a lot more centered dealing with all of this.  I feel less rattled and frazzled so it's making me feel better.

[livednlearned]

Hi Frankee 

I'm new to your situation, but recognize the hardship when leaving an abusive relationship. These are tough exits when kids are involved, on top of everything else we have to manage (your family sounds familiar...).

It's great you have a DA. Isn't it frustrating when they can't give you hard/fast answers (especially about legal advice)? It seems like she is explaining what she can/can't do, so she's communicating straight-up.

Most DV survivors make so-called mistakes when we leave. A good lawyer knowledgeable about cases like ours will help explain our choices and why we made them. We are forgiven for what courts know are considered periods of extreme volatility after leaving violent relationships. They know that abusers can flip and appear caring, too.

What I found (reading between the lines) is that court professionals have less patience for those who repeatedly return to abusive relationships, or who violate their own POs.

Mainly what the courts want at the outset is for mom and dad to cool their jets and sometimes that means limiting contact, exactly what you've been doing. You tested the waters to see what things would be like post-separation, trying to piece things together in the muddy waters between advocacy and legal representation.

I have a good friend who is spent decades as a DA and she said that it's really common for abusers to behave like yours after the separation: capable of showing restraint, appealing to family members, doesn't take full responsibility for the abuse, professing to care for you (I'm here for you, etc.). It also sounds like it's often a matter of time before the dam breaks and the abuse shows up in one form or another.

My n/BPDx was a former trial attorney and knew how bad it would look to send hostile angry threatening abusive texts and still he couldn't contain himself. During the initial separation, he depicted me as unstable, tried to form an alliance with my family, and professed an urgent need to talk to our son but only if I did the heavy lifting to make it happen. You might recognize the moves 

You mention that your ex was largely absent. Mine was like that too. If it's any consolation, the BPD dads discussed here seem to spend more time fighting for the thing they don't really want, which is to show up and parent. I don't think my ex could take care of himself much less a kid who had his own needs.

I don't have much advice except to say that it takes a ton of strength to do what you're doing, and I'm glad you're here getting support while you get your separation sea legs. 

I hope you're finding some peace in your safety, and loved reading that you are still able to laugh and goof it up with S4 despite the hardship you are navigating through.

[Frankee]

Mainly what the courts want at the outset is for mom and dad to cool their jets and sometimes that means limiting contact, exactly what you've been doing. You tested the waters to see what things would be like post-separation, trying to piece things together in the muddy waters between advocacy and legal representation.

It also sounds like it's often a matter of time before the dam breaks and the abuse shows up in one form or another.

He depicted me as unstable, tried to form an alliance with my family, and professed an urgent need to talk to our son but only if I did the heavy lifting to make it happen. You might recognize the moves.

You mention that your ex was largely absent. Mine was like that too. If it's any consolation, the BPD dads discussed here seem to spend more time fighting for the thing they don't really want, which is to show up and parent.

I don't have much advice except to say that it takes a ton of strength to do what you're doing, and I'm glad you're here getting support while you get your separation sea legs. 

I hope you're finding some peace in your safety, and loved reading that you are still able to laugh and goof it up with S4 despite the hardship you are navigating through.

I am hoping that me chilling out of the texts will benefit me.  It is really hard not to get sucked in, but that's where I keep thinking of JADE.  It didn't help much when I was with him, but it is now.

I went over my texts from last year when I tried to leave and he is doing the exact same thing now.  He's going to snap.  It's coming.  Especially when the PO shows up.

My parents forwarded me the texts he sent and I busted out laughing.  It was amazing how delusional and crazy he was acting and completely stupid he thought my parents would believe him.

My ex threw such a fit when I wanted to go back to work for even two days and he would have to watch them for a few hours twice a week.  Now he wants 2-3 days without help to spend time with them.

Thank you for the words of encouragement.  I have a support system this time that is genuine and it has made a huge difference.

What I have tried to remember is that my boys didn't ask to be put in the position.  They didn't choose who's their mom and dad.  I want them to see the change as a good thing.  That I am a better mom when I'm away from him.

[worriedStepmom]

Your boys will absolutely see the difference in you, and they will appreciate the structure that you'll be able to provide for them.

I'm so glad that you've found a way to look at the situation and his words more objectively - that reading through the old conversations is giving you a good perspective now.  Keep looking for those kinds of tools to keep you in the right frame of mind, to keep from getting sucked back into their disordered reality.

My H and I were really susceptible to the child-centered guilt ("SD is devastated not to be with me; SD really wants to live with me 50% of the time", etc).   SD wasn't able to tell us what she wanted (either too young, or too afraid of uBPDmom's moods to be honest).  We didn't understand then that uBPDmom couldn't differentiate SD's emotions from her own, and so we believed uBPDmom for much too long.  It meant we gave mom more time with SD than was healthy for SD. 

You are doing well right now.  Keep it up.

[RolandOfEld]

My ex threw such a fit when I wanted to go back to work for even two days and he would have to watch them for a few hours twice a week.  Now he wants 2-3 days without help to spend time with them.

Thank you for the words of encouragement.  I have a support system this time that is genuine and it has made a huge difference.

Hi Frankee, even though our partners are different people maybe my situation can be a heads up for you. When I moved out, my BPDw, who had neglected most childcare for around two years, suddenly insisted they stay with her 24-7. When the PO* went through, she respected it but said she wouldn't let me see them unless I removed the order. Then the next day she threw them at me and said I was taking care of them full time. Four days later (today) she wanted them back. We can see that none of the above behavior has the kids' best interest at heart.

So happy to hear about your support system and how you are getting the situation under control. You are nailing this and seem to have made huge progress from the beginning of this thread. You are your kids' superhero and they will always know it.  

~ROE

*My current PO is temporary and I discovered doesn't cover the kids. My long term PO is in process and should be finalized by Nov at latest. I am living in Asia if I didn't mention and the legal system here is different and not affected by COVID-19 at the moment.

[Frankee]

My H and I were really susceptible to the child-centered guilt ("SD is devastated not to be with me; SD really wants to live with me 50% of the time", etc).   SD wasn't able to tell us what she wanted (either too young, or too afraid of uBPDmom's moods to be honest).  We didn't understand then that uBPDmom couldn't differentiate SD's emotions from her own, and so we believed uBPDmom for much too long.  It meant we gave mom more time with SD than was healthy for SD. 

You are doing well right now.  Keep it up.

Thank you for the encouraging words.  I found myself sucked into that black hole of child-centered guilt too.  I still feel it sometimes, but it's not overruling the reality.  It seems I keep hearing that parents with bpd have difficulty separating their emotions from what the children are actually feeling.  I really want to block him, but the DA wants me to keep the line open so they can show how many times he contacts me, what he's trying to contact me about, and if he is trying to be threatening.  She wants to build the protective order case as much as possible.  It is hard not to say something back.  I have been observing my S4 and he hasn't cried like he use to.  He doesn't get as upset as he use to.  Overall, he's very happy.

When I moved out, my BPDw, who had neglected most childcare for around two years, suddenly insisted they stay with her 24-7. When the PO* went through, she respected it but said she wouldn't let me see them unless I removed the order. Then the next day she threw them at me and said I was taking care of them full time. Four days later (today) she wanted them back. We can see that none of the above behavior has the kids' best interest at heart.

So happy to hear about your support system and how you are getting the situation under control. You are nailing this and seem to have made huge progress from the beginning of this thread. You are your kids' superhero and they will always know it. 

Thank you for the encouraging words.

I am trying my best to keep consistent with my S4, even with the craziness going.  I have found that I am able to keep myself calmer overall to deal with all of this.  My S9 comes back on Sunday and it's going to be whole different situation.  S9 is old enough to argue and question the situation and be more resistant to things, so I'm going to have to prepare for that. 

That's how my exbpd is.  When I was there, his version of spending time with the kids was for a short period and then disappear for hours upon hours.  Even when I went back to work, he carried on about he didn't want to watch the kids on his only days off.  He's been laying it on real thick with the guilt and I've been keeping my composure on a whole new level.  I am sending all screenshots of the text messages of his harassments.  He's been dragging my parents into it and I tell them to forward me all the messages.  When S9 comes back, he will how no more excuses to message my parents, he will have to deal with me directly and I'm not budging.  I'm keeping communication open with the DA and my legal aid and the local PD. 

I am feeling pretty good overall.  I have been able to keep myself from just falling apart, even with all the nonsense he messages.  I see the texts and I let myself feel whatever emotion I feel and let it go.  I don't respond, I don't instigate, I don't bit the bait to get me to respond.  It's extremely hard, but it's the only way I can keep myself centered.

[Frankee]

I cracked.  He was harassing my parents and I got fed up with him doing that and trying to slander me.  My parents know he is crazy and don't respond, but he was dragging them into it and to me, that is going after my family.  I told him to leave them alone.  Then, his mother called!  I didn't have her number in my phone so I didn't know it was her.  Even she knows what kind of person he is.  He hasn't talked to her in months and she was abused by his father.  He doesn't talk to his mother unless something is wrong.   

He mentioned S9's bio dad and I said, Don't you dare talk about that person.  What does he do? Has mentioned him three times since I said that.  I see it now.  The way I got sucked in before to argue.  I would say what I didn't like and what I wanted him to stop doing and he would do the opposite.  Use that one thing and bring it up to antagonize me into an argument.  It's hard.  When someone is outright spouting lies and accussing you of doing things you aren't doing, you want to defend yourself.  Who wouldn't?  It has taken an extreme amount of self discipline not to JADE.  Especially with a person who is well aware of what buttons to push and what they know is desirable bait.

I want to block him in every fashion, but the DA still wants me to show how much he is contacting me, what he is saying, if he's being threatening.  So I try to turn off my notifications for texts so I don't see them, but when I do, It's just annoying.  As I go along, I'm still learning.  It's almost like kicking a habit "cold turkey".  I was in the cycle of fighting with him, trying to defend myself constantly and it's sometimes hard to remember that I don't have to do that anymore.  I am getting better at it and I have only said those couple things.

I have even felt that my exbpd has narcisstic traits.  I never really looked into it, but it seems clarity has brought me new insight with his personality.  It's almost as if he needs attention.  Good or bad.  I have this energy, I have put up with his nonsense, reassured him of his doubts, validated his feelings, felt sorry for his past.. like he would feed off of it.  Now that I'm not giving any of it, he is trying to create these situations where he knows that normally I would do these things.  He's trying so hard and it's not working.  It's only going to get worse.

[ForeverDad]

The descriptive word for a person having two or more PDs or other illnesses is co-morbid.  That's probably what many here suspect about their PD person.  So if there is ever a diagnosis it may also add that there are traits of other PDs.

We all have traits.  The difference is that our traits are usually within normal range or sometimes "acting-in" (impacting ourselves) and at least not "acting-out" (impacting others).

There's a saying here I read a few years ago and repeat sometimes... "The person behaving poorly typically seldom gets consequences and the person behaving well typically seldom gets credit."

What that means is your stbEx believes he can do just about anything with impunity.  And frankly, courts do allow too much bad conduct, as though the bar for consequences is quite high.  On the other hand, we are often held to a higher standard and we worry that even the least misstep can ruin us.  The reality is that you'll get a hall pass for momentary lapses.  Frankly, don't be too critical of yourself and that your stbEx knew how to push your buttons.  Learn from this and move forward.  Recovery is a process, not an event.  Similarly, learn from your small mistakes and continue moving forward.

When you wrote that you had cracked, my first worry was that you'd given in to a big demand.  That you reacted to his goading, that's human and fixable.  Live and learn.

[CoherentMoose]

Is there a way you can have someone "filter" your communications?  A trusted friend or family member who reads through everything first and determines if there is anything other than word salad and attacks on you?  Someone on this site used that method and her friend (or significant other) would forward, or call attention to those things that required a response.  Also, consider someone who is familiar with BIFF responses and use them to quality control your responses to be sure they meet the BIFF criteria.  Using BIFF is a learned skill and necessary when dealing with high-conflict people IMHO.  Food for thought.  Be well.  jdc

[formflier]

I cracked.  

You can use this day as an example of why you want it put in your "order" or "custody agreement" that you will only communicate via a parenting app where everything is visible to a GAL or other court appointed person.

Probably a way off to actually implement this...but some good can come from this day.

Also put in the order that all communications flows through you in the app, none goes to your parents or others.

Best,

FF

[formflier]

When you wrote that you had cracked, my first worry was that you'd given in to a big demand.  That you reacted to his goading, that's human and fixable.  Live and learn.

I had the same worry.

I'm relieved.

Frankee

You have come so far.  I think in this instance you are being too hard on yourself.  Self care self care!

It is wise to structure and limit communications as best you can...but being goaded is not nearly as bad as "cracking".  You bent...you reacted...

It's ok.


 


Best,

FF

[Harri]

This thread reached the max post limit and has been split and locked accordingly.  The discussion continues here: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=345721.msg13118842#msg13118842

Thank you.