faith

[Our abuse recovery guide]

I just finished reading a book about Medjugorge in Bosnia-Hercegovina where supposedly the Virgin Mary appears...it makes me wonder about my own beliefs...I think the idea of a mother to pray to appeals because of my childhood...I was raised Anglican...but have always been interested in Marianology.

Are there Catholics here who could help me understand Her better?

[Zabava]

I just finished reading a book about Medjugorge in Bosnia-Hercegovina where supposedly the Virgin Mary appears...it makes me wonder about my own beliefs...I think the idea of a mother to pray to appeals because of my childhood...I was raised Anglican...but have always been interested in Marianology.

Are there Catholics here who could help me understand Her better?

[Sylfine]

Hi Zabava!  First off, it seems to be a common thread among children of BPD mothers.  I too have been drawn to a spiritual path that reveres a Mother.  You are not alone.

Second, I was raised Catholic and so might be able to help.  What questions do you have about Mary?  Don't know the Anglican faith too well.  Do they teach the "Hail Mary" prayer?

[Zabava]

Hi Sylfine,

Thanks for responding.  I have to admit that I feel a bit embarrassed by my spiritual urges sometimes.  My husband was raised Catholic but is now an atheist.  My kids view Christians as intolerant (my daughter is part of the LGBT community)  and I am afraid they will feel betrayed.

Anglicans have the same rites as Catholics except for the veneration of Saints and the  Virgin Mary. 

  I feel drawn to Mary and to prayer because I think I am searching for forgiveness and peace.  As a feminist I have researched Goddess worship and feminist Catholic theology but it has always been an intellectual exercise.  The supernaural part of Christianity scares me because I am afraid of going crazy.  I feel intrigued by Christian mystics like Hildegard von Bingen and Theresa of Avila but I am scared too.

In terms of Mary, is She an intermediary or intercessor to Christ?  Is she Divine? 

I guess I also wonder if prayer or faith helps heal the wounds of the past.

Thanks.

[Sylfine]

Nothing to be embarrassed about   I think many people find themselves drawn to the idea that there is something out there bigger than themselves.  For me, it helps make sense of tragedies (life after death). 

For your daughter, if she is interested, she might like the Episcopal's.  They are very embracing of LGBTQ. 

Your husband's view is also very understandable.  If he came from a "drill into your head" kind of background, it's easy to eschew all religion.  His choice does not have to be yours though.  One of the great things about this community is that it reminds us to separate our choices from the choices of others

Regarding your questions about Mary, she is not Divine in the Catholic faith.  She is Holy, but not on the same "level" as the Trinity.  We pray to her for intercession and ask for her prayers to God/Jesus for us. "Hail Mary, full of Grace, the Lord is with thee.  Blessed art thou among women and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus.  Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death.  Amen". 

Full disclosure - I consider myself a Catholic Wiccan.  I have taken the parts of both spiritual paths that I resonate with, and combined them into my own "thing".  Just because you believe in one part of a religion doesn't mean you have to go head long into believing everything.  You can find what works best for you. 

I'd love to hear more about what you find in your path.  And yes, I believe prayer/spirituality can help work through my past traumas.  Only you can figure out what works for you though.

[zachira]

I think for many people, it is of great comfort to have a spiritual parent that is loving and kind whom you can trust to love you no matter what you do and who you are. I know a lot of Christians who see Jesus as the one whom they can trust to always provide unconditional love. I think Jesus was a very special person in that he was a kind caring man who wanted a better world for everyone, and he particularly cared about the less fortunate. I have been to the house in Turkey where many pilgrims go because they believe the Virgin Mary lived out her final years there. I find myself drawn to people who are kind, loving, and respectful to their children both in public and in private. I do not have any particular spiritual figure that I am drawn to, though open to that idea for the future. I admire my friends of all spiritual and religious backgrounds who find love and solace from their practices and beliefs.
I do think exploring how you to can connect to the Virgin Mary as a loving caring mother could be healing and a life long comfort.

[Zabava]

 Sylfine and Zachira,

 Thank you so much for responding. I have also been drawn to Wicca and believe that belief in a feminine divinity is ancient.  I see the faith and comfort of devout Catholics who pray to Our Lady and  I  want that too.  At the same time  I feel alienated by the misogyny of the Catholic Church.

I am sorry if I cause offence.

[Notwendy]

Please don't let your concerns about what your kids might think stop you from exploring your own spirituality. Seems like you are interested in some different approaches but I think it is fine to take the time to learn about them and then see what feels right for you.

God doesn't have a gender. Religions express both male and female attributes of God in different ways but I think it is humans trying to make sense of what is greater than us. God is male, female, generous, loving, giving- the better part of us as we try to grasp and describe something that really can not be contained by human descriptions.

Judaism and some aspects of Christianity consider the Shekinah-a female attribute of God. For Catholics, Mary personifies female attributes. Hinduism has male and female incarnations of Gods. Personally, I think the different religions are an aspect of the different ways cultures try to connect with the divine, which is infinite and not restricted by gender or other human attribute, but it's the best we can do to describe it.

You love your children unconditionally and infinitely. A spiritual path won't change that- be it Christianity, Catholicism or something else. If the connection helps you, then it will be a good thing for you and for them. I think every religion is practiced on a spectrum and many are inclusive and accepting. I can't imagine you would be attracted to a path that was not accepting of your children.

[Zabava]

NotWendy,

Thank you for your kind response.  I really appreciate and resonate with your assertion that God has no gender.  I think I am searching for community and I feel like Christianity could provide that. 

[Notwendy]

I think community is important, and yes, a religion can provide that and Christianity certainly can. Hopefully the restrictions around Covid -19 will abate soon and churches can start having more social and religious events and you can find one that fits you best.

[JNChell]

Hey, Zabava. This is a great topic. I’m curious about Wicca. When I was playing music years ago I heard a lot of different angles and beliefs. One of my band mates girls practiced it. It’s about nature, isn’t it? I was raised Catholic. Sunday school. Fortunately, I was never forced into Catholic schooling. I couldn’t accept being forced into a school by my parents. Home life was bad enough.

Expressing your religious/spiritual beliefs is not offensive. It was so weird to go into a booth and make things up to tell just to feel forgiven if I went out and kneeled and whispered my sins. And said the prayers in the cadence that they were given to say. Well, the abuse didn’t stop, and I never once witnessed either of my parents going into the confession booth.

[Notwendy]

Religion is a topic in ACA groups. This is because a child forms their own concept of God through observing their parents, and dysfunctional parents can practice religion in dysfunctional ways, even using it as a vehicle for abuse. Sometimes a child develops a concept of God as a "gotcha God" if this is what they saw with their parents.

Part of recovery is changing our  ideas from our family patterns.  if this included religion, God as well. Growing up, we formed ideas according to how our parents told us and now, we seek to make our own decisions.

Over time in groups I have seen people do this in all different ways. Some embrace the religion they were raised in and change their God image to a more mature and realisitic one, some reject all religion, some change religion. Some try several- before they decide.

I don't think this is unusual Zabava- I think it's part of your own growth and also a part of self care- to embrace our own human spiritual side. Religion can provide both- spirituality and also community.  This is part of taking care of you- if you wish to seek it out.  

[Sylfine]

Over time in groups I have seen people do this in all different ways. Some embrace the religion they were raised in and change their God image to a more mature and realisitic one, some reject all religion, some change religion. Some try several- before they decide.

Bingo!  This is a great way of looking at it.

Zabava - you are not offending at all!  This is a great discussion

JNChell - Yes, Wicca has a lot to do with nature and the natural way of things.  The main symbol, the pentacle, represents the 5 elements: Earth, Air, Water, Fire, Spirit. 

[JNChell]

Thank you, Sylfine/b]. Those symbols can be misunderstood. That’s the thing. We all need to come together. It’s heartbreaking what is currently happening.

[JNChell]

I believe that there is a “higher power” out there. It simply makes sense without going into a novel of reasons why. I have to admit that I’ve never seen Wicca and Catholicism intertwining. That is interesting. I understand that you’re taking principles from each and putting them into practice in your own way which is great. I’ve been realizing that a relationship with God is a very personal thing and that it doesn’t have to be constrained.