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VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?" Parental alienation is when a parent allows a child to participate or hear them degrade the other parent. This is not uncommon in divorces and the children often adjust. In severe cases, however, it can be devastating to the child. This video provides a helpful overview.
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Author Topic: Will I Ever Recover  (Read 391 times)
grumpydonut
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« on: September 16, 2020, 11:45:04 PM »

Hi all,

6 months now since I was left for the person she cheated on me with. She cheated 9 months prior to leaving me, and I assume she never ceased that connection with him.

How does it get better? My self esteem is at an all time low. I'm in therapy, and that's done nothing but make me worse. I suffer from OCD, so that makes any sort of self analysis pretty tough as it results in more negativity and new compulsions.

I just don't see any light at the end of the tunnel. I was replaced, so BPD or not it just feels like I'm not as good as he is and that when I show my true self I'm bound to be rejected (this is the second time a woman I have loved has treated me this way).
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« Reply #1 on: September 17, 2020, 12:01:18 AM »

6 months now since I was left for the person she cheated on me with. She cheated 9 months prior to leaving me, and I assume she never ceased that connection with him.

i didnt have an easy time at six months either.

in fact, i was experiencing some suicidal ideation.

i dont mean to suggest that thats normal, or ideal. just that i know how hard this can be.

How does it get better? My self esteem is at an all time low.

it really depends. i think that running into a "stuck" period, is pretty common; weve all been there.

but what, in particular, are you struggling with?

I'm in therapy, and that's done nothing but make me worse.

tell us more about how therapy is going. what kind of therapy is it? what is the focus?

I suffer from OCD, so that makes any sort of self analysis pretty tough as it results in more negativity and new compulsions.

i have some (strong) OCD traits myself, and i definitely understand. is the self analysis related to the therapy youre doing? what aspect of yourself are you analyzing?

I just don't see any light at the end of the tunnel. I was replaced, so BPD or not it just feels like I'm not as good as he is and that when I show my true self I'm bound to be rejected (this is the second time a woman I have loved has treated me this way).

that was the path i was on.

the turning point came after the breakup that led me here.

i had some things to learn. for example, in high school, i frequently over pursued, or after a breakup, i would wear my heart on my sleeve, kill any chance of reconciling, and then kick myself for doing it, and never really, fully recover from the wounds. i realized none of that made me a bad guy, or unloveable, or fundamentally rejectable. it was just stuff i needed to unlearn in order to navigate my love life.

people will still reject you, for all kinds of reasons; some legitimate, some superficial, some a matter of taste or preference, but that doesnt mean that there is something fundamentally wrong with, or broken about you as a person. the fear of rejection (i know it well) tends to tell us that there is, and it can rule your life.
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     and I think it's gonna be all right; yeah; the worst is over now; the mornin' sun is shinin' like a red rubber ball…
JNChell
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« Reply #2 on: September 17, 2020, 12:04:03 AM »

Try to cool your jets. At least for a little bit. It does get better. It just takes time. I imagine that patience is hard to muster with OCD. Is that clinically diagnosed? I’ve been through relationships that ended awfully. I’ll be 44 next month, and have decided to take some real time off to evaluate myself and everything surrounding me.

It gets better by returning to your hobbies and interests. Reconnecting with the people that you love. Learning more. I know that it’s hard to decipher what happened. Acceptance is a big step in the right direction.

What’s going on with therapy? That should be helping. Do you feel like you have a good connection with your therapist?
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BuildingFromScratch
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« Reply #3 on: September 17, 2020, 12:14:36 AM »

I used to get really obsessive thought patterns, still do once in a while. Most of them are rooted in a strong emotion, or as a means of soothing strong emotions. I find it invaluable to journal out my thoughts and emotions. You don't need to analyze anything to journal, you can literally just spill a pile of crap on paper and it will still be therapeutic. At first you may have trouble identifying what thought/feeling is what emotion, but over time you can learn.

I understand having your self esteem be in the gutter after this relationship, mine sure was after mine. I think it's a combination of things, I had low self esteem pre relationship, so the relationship that was propping up my self esteem was pulled out from under me. I understand how you feel like her cheating on you means you weren't good enough, truth though is she's probably done this to other guys, and the issue is she isn't good enough to act appropriately.

If you're looking to build self esteem, I highly suggest trying to rely on others less for it and try to pat yourself on the back and give yourself compliments. It could be something as simple as doing a chore, or beating a video game, or one feature you can try to like about yourself (physical or mental). The problem with depending on others is you just can't rely on it, where as you can rely on yourself.

Sorry you're having a rough time, hope this helps. I promise you there is hope.
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JNChell
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« Reply #4 on: September 17, 2020, 01:29:29 AM »

Hey. Thank you for saying what you have. This stuff isn’t easy. There is no simple way way out of the mind  Cursing - won't cause site restrictions at Starbucks (click to insert in post).

Self esteem is a big deal. Mine is in and out of the gutter. I was conditioned to have low self esteem. Sounds like you were as well. It doesn’t feel good. How do you fix it? What are three things that you can do for yourself that will put a notch in your confidence belt? It’s very important to do it. Take your time. I hopefully have 20 more years. Lol
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grumpydonut
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« Reply #5 on: September 17, 2020, 09:07:54 PM »

Hi Once Removed.

Excerpt
but what, in particular, are you struggling with?

Self worth and masculinity. I feel weak and emasculated.

Excerpt
tell us more about how therapy is going. what kind of therapy is it? what is the focus?   

Not sure what type, but it's focused on getting to the root of childhood issues. Seems my lack of self esteem comes from never feeling enough for my Mum - especially when she had a new partner. Seems to be where my feeling unmanly comes from, which is triggered when cheated on.

Excerpt
.  what aspect of yourself are you analyzing?
 

Plenty, haha. But my brain is automatically wired to see the worst in myself, which probably is why I am a perfectionist to my own detriment.

JNChell,

I don't know. I'm struggling to find anything that makes me feel better - other than alcohol, but I'm not about to abuse that.

Building from scratch,

I know that logically, but it doesn't help unfortunately. I don't know how not to place my level of self worth into the hands of others.


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BuildingFromScratch
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« Reply #6 on: September 18, 2020, 01:22:46 AM »

Grumpy: Yeah, I know, I mean I have been working on my self esteem for years and I still am affected by other people, and care what other people think. It's a slow process to rewire your brain to see good in yourself.

I too used to be a perfectionist, still am once in a while. I think some of it was to compensate for my lack of self worth and also I just had unrealistic expectations of myself, because I was kind of unloving and cruel to myself.

Sorry you're feeling hopeless man, I hope you feel better.
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JNChell
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« Reply #7 on: September 18, 2020, 01:33:07 AM »

Building, welcome. You sent a great message out. We have to be patient with ourselves. That’s a difficult task for a lot of us, but you’re right. Men and fathers are pushed very hard on a societal level. Sometimes it’s hard to slow down and catch that breath. Especially when we’re taught to not love ourselves.
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“Adversity can destroy you, or become your best seller.”
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JNChell
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« Reply #8 on: September 18, 2020, 01:40:37 AM »

grumpy, I lay awake at night wishing that this stuff was linear. A clear view through it all. I agree, alcohol won’t help you. Do you feel like going deeper into this?
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grumpydonut
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« Reply #9 on: September 18, 2020, 01:57:37 AM »

Nothing much deeper to delve into, unfortunately. Life sucks. I was mistreated. She's happy with her replacement; I've been used, abused and discarded. Justice doesn't exist in our world.
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BuildingFromScratch
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« Reply #10 on: September 18, 2020, 02:14:21 AM »

Grumpy, she might dilute herself and her target for a while into being happy. But they will both be miserable in no time. Borderlines are miserable people and they drag everyone down with them. She probably puts on a big facade about how wonderful things are and how she found the one, and he was tricked into believing that, or pressured to put up the same front. This isn't them riding off into the sunset. This is you being lucky enough to escape from her clutches and this guy is just another sucker that's gonna get screwed over by her.

Now, I'm not gonna pretend it feels like that, when my ex broke up I spent years pining for her and wondering where I went wrong, I spent years blaming myself (just like how my ex put all the blame on me). And at one point I felt like I was going to die from the emotional pain from being without her and seeing their marriage certificate on his Facebook wrecked me. But now I am grateful she is gone. Never again will I put up with such BS.
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JNChell
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« Reply #11 on: September 18, 2020, 02:32:25 AM »

You will recover and things will be better. It’s an awful thing to go through. It’s so hard to be betrayed by a person that you were open and honest with.

Life is a good thing. It’s our gift. Unfortunately, we weren’t taught that and we have to figure it out. Maybe justice doesn’t exist in our world, but choices do. Let’s weigh those two factors. Choices vs. Justice. You got  :cursing:ed over. There is nothing that you can do about that. No justice, but you can choose. That’s where your power is. This person isn’t the end of the world for you. She psychologically abused you and that’s why you’re in this headstate. You’re gonna be ok. These people are mentally powerful, but she’s one amongst billions.

She did what she did.  Cursing - won't cause site restrictions at Starbucks (click to insert in post) her. Her actions reflect who she is. You don’t need that close to you. I understand how it feels. I wouldn’t be here if I didn’t. I just hope that you see the worth in yourself to keep pressing on.
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« Reply #12 on: September 18, 2020, 03:09:25 AM »

i can relate a lot to the things you describe.

im a sort of personality perfectionist too, and very self critical. its hard to turn that voice off. its hard to use it proactively. although you can learn.

Excerpt
Self worth and masculinity. I feel weak and emasculated.

i did too. it might sound trite, but i endlessly listened to empowering music that made me feel like a badass. eminems recovery was my go to.

i know that wont cure anything, i mainly mention it in passing.

self worth and masculinity, and feelings of weakness, all of this speaks to the idea of rebuilding.

rebuilding requires active steps. it also just doesnt happen over night. it doesnt really happen in six months.

i see that you are, in fact, taking steps, and thats great, in and of itself. its not clear to me that you have a sense of direction, and may be mostly going through the motions, and thats understandable too. thats where i was at six months. a good support group, and a good therapist, can help you find that direction, and measurable progress, even if rebuilding doesnt happen over night.

Excerpt
Not sure what type, but it's focused on getting to the root of childhood issues. Seems my lack of self esteem comes from never feeling enough for my Mum - especially when she had a new partner. Seems to be where my feeling unmanly comes from, which is triggered when cheated on.

i think that this is invaluable insight, a critical part of the process, and it will help you more than you may know, later on.

im just wondering to what end. its really helpful to know what you are looking for in therapy. uncovering childhood issues is a part of it, but generally one part of it, and theres only so much you can do with it right now.

if it were me, id be looking, specifically, for coping tools. id be speaking to my therapist about my ocd tendencies, how im reverting back to them, and id be asking to learn about alternatives. id be talking to my therapist about my feelings about masculinity, and my own masculinity - there may be some cracks in your ideas, or your sense of it may be fragile, and thats partly what i mean when it comes to rebuilding. id be looking to find out if im clinically depressed, and seek coping tools and treatment. know what youre looking for, be specific, and be strategic. this is your recovery, grab it by the horns. all of us have struggled hard in it, but ive watched thousands of recoveries, and you either bring the scar tissue and the baggage into the next relationship, and the next, and compound your pain, or you reinvent yourself into a powerhouse.

somewhere in this, the stronger you get, reexamine your narrative of the relationship. aspects of your narrative may be causing you greater suffering, and/or keeping you stuck; i get that sense from your posts. my own narrative changed many, many times, over the course of a good five or six years.

but a lot of recovery is about going through the motions. you do the healthy stuff, like get good sleep, spend time with friends, dive into hobbies as youre able. and it doesnt really feel like it makes any difference at all. often times you find you feel even worse. and you then you feel worse because you dont feel better and feel like you should. but a point comes, eventually, that you look back, and you see how much time passed, and how it got you through. time doesnt heal any wounds, its what you do with it. but it does take time for what you do with it to bear fruit.
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     and I think it's gonna be all right; yeah; the worst is over now; the mornin' sun is shinin' like a red rubber ball…
grumpydonut
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« Reply #13 on: September 23, 2020, 12:45:15 AM »

Thanks, Once Removed.

The relationship, cheating, discard and instant replacement has served to destroy my sense of worth, masculinity and has increased the OCD traits that I've always had - which brings in fear, horror and a whole bunch of terrible / scary feelings.

It's been a tough year, but you're right about something keeping me stuck. I just want their relationship to fall apart. I am stuck on the idea of "justice". There is no justice when the person who treats the other person like she treated me just gets to move on and be happy. She destroyed my life and didn't even show remorse, just jumped ship. That's not fair, and I hate it.
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« Reply #14 on: September 23, 2020, 01:22:47 AM »

i wanted what i thought was justice, too (i didnt necessarily want "revenge", although im sure i had plenty of fantasies of telling her off).

one of the things i wanted was for my ex to know that i knew everything that went down, that she didnt "get away" with anything. i think part of that was me feeling small and defeated. i felt like a sucker, or i thought she saw me that way, at least. even when the pain had largely subsided, that feeling really burned in me.

there are several things that helped me.

i rarely say "its not about you/has nothing to do with you", but when it comes to someones coping mechanisms, like an instant replacement, its true. you could have been the worst boyfriend in the world, and someone jumping into a new relationship to avoid grieving is still an unhealthy coping mechanism that is more about escape, not a reflection on your significance as a human being. you likely understand that on an intellectual level. for me, healing was necessarily about owning my part, but letting her part be hers. if you can get to a point where you can achieve both, youre detaching.

try some writing. i journaled and vented. i wrote poetry that gave a certain voice to things i otherwise had a hard time expressing, or didnt even know i had inside me...that helped, especially, because it was healing and confidence boosting at the same time. sometimes i wrote really nasty, ugly stuff that i would never have wanted anyone to see, just bashing her.

follow your fantasies, whether about justice or revenge, to their logical conclusion in your mind. writing them can help guide them. dont act on them, dont inflame them, dont overindulge them, just explore them, and probe them in the process. see what they reveal to you, about you, about your detachment process. see how they change over time. bring them to an emotional close.

in that vein, cry, scream, punch your pillow, punch a punching bag. anger is a natural part of the grieving process, and longing for justice is normal in that context. according to the bible, even the dead longed for it.

i dont know if youre a religious man, but im not sure it matters: in my case, i reminded myself that God is the arbiter of justice. i think if i werent religious, id have just reminded myself that im not. we dont really have control over these things, and thats part of what makes it scary, and makes us feel small.

sometimes relationships just end badly, and one party is hurt more than the other, and no, it isnt fair. but when a relationship really ends, when we accept that it has ended, that quest for fairness ends with it. justice becomes less about what happens to her or her relationship (thats attachment) but about moving on and living our best lives. and sometimes, that too, can feel like attachment, because it can feel like we have something to prove, or at least it did for me. i found that goes away, and becomes more for the sake of doing it.

dont rebuild from the damage she did to your self worth. rebuild your self worth from the bottom up. rebuild your very concept of self worth - it may have been fragile or built on a shaky foundation to begin with.  

likewise, rebuild your concept of masculinity. this is a great, clinical outlook, not pick up artist shtick: https://books.google.com/books?id=0x_gBQAAQBAJ&printsec=frontcover&source=gbs_ge_summary_r&cad=0#v=onepage&q&f=false

lastly, accept that you dont know really know whats going on with your ex or the new relationship. im not going to sit here and tell you that it will fail, or that it will be a disaster, or that shes doing the same things to him as she did to you (my exes new relationship lasted a year longer than ours, and played out very differently). i will say that several months down the road, i became privy to a lot of it, and it just didnt match what i was projecting. dont torture yourself with what you dont know.
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