Dating my BPDex and considering trying again (moving in together)

[sunsetsam]

Hi all,

About 4 years ago, I started this thread (https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=301168.0) as I entered the divorce process with my wife who was diagnosed with BPD.

A month after we divorced, we started to recycle the relationship, and it would usually end (by me) when I would catch her in a lie about going to therapy, talking to an ex she promised to stay away from, not drinking (which she started to do heavily) - all of which she promised she would do so that we could find a way back together. We've been on and off for 4 years.

We started "dating" again this past September, and despite a 6+ hour drive between us, have been together almost every other weekend. We've enjoyed all our old past-times (hiking, dining out, cuddling, watching funny or scary movies, and -of course- amazing sex), and our conversations have been good. There has been no raging other than one episode which she apologized for (and was minor in comparison to years ago). She has seemingly been on her meds consistently, though not active in therapy. She says she misses and loves my daughter and regrets all of her past actions - and continually tells me that she loves me and that all she ever wanted was to be my wife.

I still love her. My friends think I am insane. I have dated others, but nobody is *her* - there is something about her interests, passions, caring nature with animals, sense of humor - all of it. I want her back home, even though I know there will be episodes of anger (and hurt), but my hope is that time has helped mitigate some of her triggers and sensitivity (she is now in her 40s, if that matters) and she says she will go to therapy with me if/when she moves back.

However, I know she will always say what I want to hear, and I realize I am putting blinders on to her past lies of years ago - in part, excusing them because of the traumas I noted in the original post (death of dad, $60k inheritance stolen by aunt, death of her dog), plus the added trauma of divorce. Maybe she still will be jealous of my daughter? Maybe she'll not want to stay in therapy? Maybe she'll always blame me for the divorce and use it as a means to punish me in arguments? Etc.

Curious if anyone else has taken back a pwBPD and had a success story they can share? Any other thoughts on what I've shared are also most welcome.

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[Naughty Nibbler]

Hi Sunsetsam:

We started "dating" again this past September, and despite a 6+ hour drive between us, have been together almost every other weekend. We've enjoyed all our old past-times (hiking, dining out, cuddling, watching funny or scary movies, and -of course- amazing sex), and our conversations have been good.   

Sounds like an idealization phase.  Seeing each other every other weekend, since September, isn't a good test of time, especially since she has a history of lying.

Maybe she still will be jealous of my daughter? 

How old is your daughter now, early teenager, 13 or 14?  I believe you indicate in your original post, that your daughter is autistic?  To what degree is she impaired?  Will she eventually be able to live independently? Do you share parenting with your child's mom (from a different marriage)?

Jealousy is a hard trait to tame.  Others may have different opinions, but I'm pro child.  I'd say that there has been no test of time to validate that jealousy of your child is no longer an issue.

She says she misses and loves my daughter and regrets all of her past actions - and continually tells me that she loves me and that all she ever wanted was to be my wife.   

In my opinion, saying "all she ever wanted was to be my wife", is a bit of a red flag. 

The most common situation is that the person with BPD or BPD traits can periodically seem to have their act together.  Then, after moving back in, getting married, etc., it's back to behavior as usual.

A wise approach would be to NOT move in together and continue to date.  Maybe she can choose to move closer to you.  Just thinking that if she moves in with you, and the daily trials and tribulations of life are in the mix, you could easily be devalued and your daughter treated poorly.

[once removed]

the key to bettering a relationship or reversing a breakup is recognizing what broke it down to begin with, and what, if possible, is going to change this time around.

However, I know she will always say what I want to hear, and I realize I am putting blinders on to her past lies of years ago - in part, excusing them because of the traumas I noted in the original post (death of dad, $60k inheritance stolen by aunt, death of her dog), plus the added trauma of divorce. Maybe she still will be jealous of my daughter? Maybe she'll not want to stay in therapy? Maybe she'll always blame me for the divorce and use it as a means to punish me in arguments? Etc.

its good that you recognize this, but dont put blinders on. walk into this with eyes wide open.

1. its reasonably fair to say you cant count on her going to therapy. if this is a deal breaker for you, dont go back. if its a hill youre prepared to die on, then be willing to die on that hill, and stand by it. otherwise, its just a wedge between you, and practically speaking its better to let it go.
2. understand that while you have legitimate problems with the relationship, as well as an idea about what would fix it, she has a different perspective on both. saving this will require reconciling what each of you see as the fundamental problems with the relationship.
3. you didnt elaborate, but problems with your daughter are a significant issue. what is the issue as you see it, and as best you can, what do you think the issue is as she sees it?
4. again, go into this with eyes wide open. you love a difficult person. youre right that there will be hurt and anger. there will almost certainly be raging. thats the reality of whom you love. but more than that, this is a relationship on a relatively shaky foundation, one that has been through divorce. the problems of the old relationship will resurface. it is a given. the question is, how you intend to tackle them differently.

[sunsetsam]

Thank you for the replies.

My daughter is now 13, and she has high-functioning autism (used to be known as Aspergers).  I have her overnight a couple of nights a week and she will be able to be independent in her adult life, no doubt.

A wise approach would be to NOT move in together and continue to date.  Maybe she can choose to move closer to you.  Just thinking that if she moves in with you, and the daily trials and tribulations of life are in the mix, you could easily be devalued and your daughter treated poorly.

I think I agree with this - however, I know that this type of arrangement may lead to more abandonment issues on her end (since I am not fully "committing" by having her move in) and I really do want to give everything the benefit of the doubt and not let my anxieties control my life. But, otherwise, it is a good test of her commitment to the relationship and to therapy. I am torn.

you didnt elaborate, but problems with your daughter are a significant issue. what is the issue as you see it, and as best you can, what do you think the issue is as she sees it?

It's interesting - she'll say (now) that I am a great dad, but while we were together and she was raging, I was a "PLEASE READ dad" that didn't keep my daughter in line 100% of the time.  Honestly, in comparison to other kids in the neighborhood, mine was a saint.  I think the biggest issue from her point of view was just the jealousy that I would love my daughter unconditionally and that I would spend exclusive time with my daughter at the expense of time with her on those two overnights.

understand that while you have legitimate problems with the relationship, as well as an idea about what would fix it, she has a different perspective on both. saving this will require reconciling what each of you see as the fundamental problems with the relationship.

This is where I think joint counseling would be key. I approached the subject of maybe even doing virtual counseling prior to her coming back, and she immediately refused, saying she thought that was backwards - in other words, she wants to see the commitment from me that I want her back by having her move back to town (even if not in same home). I kind of see what she's saying, but at the same time, my anxiety wants to say "prove yourself to me."

[Cat Familiar]

Her refusing to participate in counseling is a    Pay attention to when these  show up.

[once removed]

My daughter is now 13, and she has high-functioning autism (used to be known as Aspergers).  I have her overnight a couple of nights a week and she will be able to be independent in her adult life, no doubt.

people with bpd traits do especially badly with stress.

a teenager is a significant amount of stress, period. its not necessarily more stressful, but its a unique kind of stress if the teenager is not your own.

It's interesting - she'll say (now) that I am a great dad, but while we were together and she was raging, I was a "PLEASE READ dad" that didn't keep my daughter in line 100% of the time

this may be her less than helpful way of trying to have a say when it comes to parenting.

blending a family is enormously hard. a parent raising a child/teenager that isnt their own, needs a certain amount of buy in, a certain level of authority. to make it work, they need that, but they need to balance it with a respect for the biological parents approach. this probably isnt something she was born with the skills to make happen...no one is.

i might make that the focus of therapy. i might sell her on it, too. she probably sees that as a significant conflict between the two of you (she wouldnt be wrong), and she may be more inclined to address it in therapy.

however, I know that this type of arrangement may lead to more abandonment issues on her end (since I am not fully "committing" by having her move in) and I really do want to give everything the benefit of the doubt and not let my anxieties control my life. But, otherwise, it is a good test of her commitment to the relationship and to therapy. I am torn.

i dont think its a matter of "move in or dont move in".

no one wants to remain in a dead end relationship.

at the same time, drastic moves that occur too quickly can be a death knell. they can amplify the conflict. youve been through divorce, and you know how bad that was; a breakup when youre living together is no picnic.

so she wants relationship security and commitment, and you tend to want stability first. these are competing interests, that if allowed to fester, will blow things up, but that doesnt mean they arent resolvable. ideally, you need some benchmarks, some agreements, some commitments on both sides that you can reasonably both work toward, as you take further steps. this, too, would be a helpful thing to work together on in therapy, if she were amenable, although its not necessarily something that the two of you cant discuss and try to get on the same page about.

[Rev]

Her refusing to participate in counseling is a    Pay attention to when these  show up.

Could not agree more...    This is not just for your protection but also the protection of your daughter.  Zero counselling means zero change.  Every fiber in my body says that you are on really dangerous ground.

Sorry. Don't mean to be a downer here.   Oddly, I want to ask the question - if the genders were reversed, and a woman came to you with the same story about a man in her life who refuse to go for counselling for his troubles and was pushing for a commitment, what would you tell her?

Think about this really seriously.

Rev

[Notwendy]

You got divorced and then one month later began the recycle ( push-pull ) pattern between you. Now you wonder if you should get back together for good again, so here's my 2 cents.

You two never broke up.

You may have changed the legal status of your relationship but one month past divorce isn't a break up.

Looks like you left the marriage, she "pulled" with the behavior you like, then she lies or cheats, you break up, she's pulling "good" again, you push.

Now, she's pulling "move in together"

This cycle, the highs ( the pull where she's painting you white, sex is great, she loves your daughter-- everything about you) and then followed by a low- can have an addictive quality for both of you.

So much of this thread focuses on her- will she be good finally, will this work out?

You two have been together for 7 years. I think you know the pattern by now. Has she changed? Have you? For that to happen, I think takes some significant personal work and therapy- for both of you. Unless someone has, chances are the dynamics between the two of you may not be much different.

You were already in a triangle with your daughter, but she was very young and not likely to notice her step mother's behavior. Now, she's 13 and she will notice and also probably speak her mind. Do you think your ex wife can manage a teen age girl with Asperger's in the home?

These are questions only you can answer and it's really your choice. The good times are great, but she's the whole package and so are you. Perhaps this push pull pattern keeps things interesting for you, even if it is stressful and possibly difficult with your daughter. But rather than look to her as the problem and the one who needs to change, maybe look at the patterns between the two of you.

You say she needs the security of a more permanent relationship but is this what you want? It makes sense that she does after dating you for a long time, she wants to know this is heading in a secure direction. I don't think that's unreasonable. But if you are considering living together for her, but truly don't think that's the best thing for you, then it's important to be honest with yourself and with her.