I found out why I stay stuck - kind of

[WitzEndWife]

Hi everyone! It's been a LONG time since I've posted on here. I decided to try to find a new therapist and the one I now have is a true diamond in the rough. She is able to take all of my rambling and find key words, phrases, and patterns, and she can string things together so that they make sense. I told her that the main reason I was in therapy was to try to figure out why I can't leave my H, who has all nine symptoms of BPD.

It's been a few months since I started, and what she's picked up on is that I'm clearly getting something out of the relationship, that it's basically like an addiction. There's some "supply" there that's keeping me coming back for more, to where I can't let go. I know that codependents are codependent because they get something out of the relationship, even as it drains them of everything healthy and good in their lives. It's easy to think of yourself as the victim or of being trapped in the relationship, but the reality is that you're trapping yourself as much as you're being manipulated. Learning about all of this is fascinating and it does finally give me hope that there will eventually be a light at the end of the proverbial tunnel. I'm prepared to work through it with my therapist at my side.

Meanwhile, update on H: he's been attending community college for the past several months to become an auto mechanic. If anyone recalls, it's been a struggle to get him to work for as long as we've been together (wasn't legally able to work for the first two years of our relationship, then he went to real estate school and got his license, then he swore he was going to do YouTube full time, then have his own home car detailing business, then he was going to go to school). He was paying his bills doing Uber for a while last year, but when the pandemic hit, he was unable to do that, and the responsibility fell back onto me (because, long story, his car loan was in my name). He went to school in August and kept promising, "Once I do X, I'll apply to Y job." He swore up and down that he was going to get a certification in December that would allow him to make more money going into a shop, so that certification came along, he got it, and then he ran to get a job, right? Of course he didn't. Then it was, "It's the holidays and nobody is hiring. I'll apply in January!" Then, he started a new spate of courses in January, including an electronics course that I guess was a little tough. When I again asked about the job thing, at first he kept saying, "I'll call next week." Then, it was, "I'm taking a really tough course right now that's taking up all my time." Then, it was, "I need the time to work on our old car to get all the parts out of it." Yet, he was coming home from school and going straight into the second bedroom, where he'd stay all day long. Over the past few weeks, I guess because the weather has warmed up and his seasonal depression has lifted, he's started working out and walking the dogs during the day after school, or maybe doing a bit of cleaning or fixing up around the house. So, you can imagine, when, Saturday night, as he was coming to bed in the middle of the night, I mentioned something about him getting a job and paying for his car payment, he lost it on me. How DARE I bring up him getting a job, after he was doing SO much for us as it was? After all, he was going to school so that he could make a good living! How DARE I be so short-sighted?

He stormed out of the bedroom and into the guest bedroom, slamming the door. We commenced an hours-long text conversation, back and forth. Mind you, I was only asking him to make $100/week. He called me every name in the book, said I was "disingenuous" and that I now made him "lose motivation to do anything" and that he was going to quit school and stop doing anything around the house. I told him he would only be hurting himself there.

He did not talk to me at all yesterday. I cleaned and did my own thing while he watched TV in the living room all day. I briefly sat down in there at the end of the day. He pretended I didn't exist.

Later that night, after I'd gone to sleep, he sent me a LONG text diatribe. It read:

"The way you undermine me after the most successful months of my life reminds me of why I was so desperate to get to Mooresville. Don't be surprised if the first thing I do with my money after starting work is to get away from you.

Some things can't be forgiven. When I think about how you rage shouted our personal finances at me, it makes me despise you so much. Especially in the face of all the progress I've made. On all fronts.

You're just not engaged in this marriage anymore. Not physically. Not emotionally. And now you're trying to withdraw financially. Let's just f-ing end it before I'm really too old to start a family.

Sick of trying only to be met with ingratitude. You can offload that Cadillac all you want while I hit the road with my dog, my wagon, and my pet barrier [note: the wagon is MINE - I paid for it in full].

How dare you threaten me with an ultimatum. HOW. DARE. YOU. On a day after we bought a printer to start a home retailing business no less. Real f-ing show of confidence there.

If you actually thought of us as a marital unit you should be relieved we borrowed only $5K for [my community college] instead of $50K for [the school in Mooresville]. And you would literally have no reason to b-tch about my going to Pasadena to bring home a 1991 Taurus while making another movie about it. But again, small-minded.

You wanna sweat the small stuff, you're gong to be doing it ALONE.

If I had the chronological capacity [Note: um, huh? What does that even mean?] to start work sooner I would have. As it's been, I've been on my feet CONSTANTLY with dog duties, cleaning & tidying, and home improvements without feeling caught up.

So if you think increasing pressure on me with your shrieking psychic attack does anything helpful to our bottom line, you're mistaken. All it does is shake my confidence in myself and in this marriage and make me ask why I've even been bothering to extend effort into any of this.

I've literally never been angrier at you. And that's saying a lot. How many f-ing ways can you find to backstab me?"

So, basically, that's what I'm dealing with. Mind you, I asked him to chip in on his car payment, which I kindly picked up TEMPORARILY during the pandemic. It's CRYSTAL clear to me now that he has absolutely NO intention of working. And on top of that, will paint me as a horrible, hateful, unsupportive, shrieking monster in the process. The manipulation absolutely kills me. I actually cried silently to myself last night during the text exchange because of his cruelty. It occurred to me how seldom I cry these days, even when he's being terrible. I just shove it away, stuff it down. He's so cruel.

I know I shouldn't relent here, but also there isn't that much I can do with the car since I owe more than I've paid on it. Still, I think it gives me more fuel to move forward on my path to divorce. If he truly won't work, which is what I've suspected all along, he'll have to go. That's pretty clear cut.

Anyway, I'm trying to stay strong. Any tips for doing that, for staying in your power while they're being horrible and manipulative and splitting?

[CoherentMoose]

Hello WeW.  Welcome.  Glad you found this forum.  Some good people here.

Wow, some first class FOGging there.  And some gaslighting splash to add to the flavor of the word salad.  Sheesh.  Are you familiar with the term FOG (Fear, Obligation, Guilt)? 

In any event, no, you have every right to ask for some financial help.  IMHO anyway.  And the over the top response was clearly unwarranted.   

Have you read "Stop Walking on Eggshells"?  It's a great book on framing up the behaviors you are dealing with. 

Are you serious about leaving the relationship?  If so, suggest you also read "Splitting" by Bill Eddy.  It will help frame up what you may encounter as you move out on separating and divorce. 

Continue to post updates and ask questions in here.  You'll get good, honest advice from people that have lived similar stories.  Good luck.  CoMo

[ForeverDad]

You've been here for 3 to 4 years so this quote below is probably no surprise but I'll add it as a serious reminder.  I'm assuming you don't have children together.  Follow the link to read the full post if you wish.

If you do not yet have children with him, then don't.  At least until you've figured out what you will do going forward.  Why?  Having children together will not fix these deep personality disorders, whether diagnosed or not.  Having children together makes unwinding a marriage vastly more difficult and messy.

Also, do not depend on your spouse to practice reliable birth control.  All it takes is one Oops! moment...

Edit:  We don't tell you what to do or not do, that's your decision, but in most cases these early concerns such as you've experienced become even larger over time.  Especially when it becomes evident the spouse won't seek counseling or substantially improve behaviors.

I recall Dave Ramsey, a radio financial counselor, often observes that financial discord can easily lead to divorce.  When dealing with persons who are Personality Disordered, the financial issues are just a part of the overall multiple problems.

[formflier]

Hey...!  I'm glad you are gaining insight through the new therapist.

I would suggest that he has an intention of working that matches up the "image" in his mind of what working is...for him.

What do you know about his work prior to you meeting him?  Was he ever married before?

I would guess that his poor executive management skills (bpd hindered and otherwise) get in the way  when his version of "work" runs into the real world.  Especially when your dreams run into "reality"

Perhaps an example:  My third kid is 20.  Working his way through college.  His "long term" plans have been in flux for a while.  Currently working on criminal justice degree.

He also has this dream of being able to do just about anything on a car.  He always admired and wanted to learn "paintless dent repair".  So...in a very FF kid move he picks a local shop, walks in and tells the guy he wants to work there.  (no call..no interview...just walks in)

He was hired on the spot and as part of the deal he got free tuition to the guys PDR school.  After a few months I could tell he was frustrated and he kinda sheepishly admitted "pdr isn't for me".  (apparently it takes a lot of patience and it takes a while to "get it")

He has however gotten more into the business side of things, gotten a promotion after someone left and really spends most of his time in sales.  He drives around to local car lots and walks the lots (especially used places) and then presents bids to those lots to get rid of dents.

Now that he is established at a lot of places those lots call him, he goes and picks up the car, gets the dents out and takes it back to them.  He gets a base hourly rate and percentage of sales.

My point of the story is that when his "dream" of PDR crumbled...he was able to pivot and make good money and still "learn about the car business".  pwBPD seem to have a hard time "pivoting" when "reality" meets "dream".  Perhaps they spend lots of time "blaming" or "justifying failure".

The youtube thing.  I would love to do it.  I have hours and hours of content...I've published a few videos.  Bottom line, I would much rather work on cars with my kids...than publish the videos.

Maybe one day one of my kids really gets into that and moves that dream along...until then it will stay "in the parking lot".

I suppose the bottom line of this story is there are tons of ways to make money (good money) around cars.  Trust me..I've been looking for the "easy money" and...it appears elusive.  Today S18 and I are going to a state police auction to pick up a wrecked charger we bought.  Front fender and door are messed up.  We have another charger at home with bullet holes on one side...but a good fender and door on the other.  Door and fender come off the bullet hole car...go on the other car (cars are same color) and then I maybe take the exhaust off of bullet hole car or figure out why the new car is so loud and then...poof

I should have something to sell that sticks a couple grand of profit in our pockets.

It is fun..but at some point you just have to do the work and figure frustrating stuff out.

Oh yeah...you read that right...I bought a car that was shot all to pieces.  Crazy.

Good to hear from you WitzEndWife.  Do you think your hubby is picking things he believes that you don't know much about, to try and confuse the issue..so he "gets away with not working".

Oh yeah..what course is "really tough"?

Best,

FF

[WitzEndWife]

  Hi FF! Long time no "see"!

He did agree to look for a job, finally, after all that nonsense. I just have to keep remembering that I, ultimately, have the upper hand here, even though he yells and rages and throws his weight around. It's really hard in the moment. TOTAL FOG

For example, today, the laundry machine quit spinning. He's fixed it once before and I know it's only a matter of time before we have to replace it, but, again, now is not a good time. He has been begging to install an upstairs closet w/d (there's electricity and plumbing, but no hook-ups), so, of course, this was his chance to INSIST we do it. Not only that, but he insisted that we use our stimulus money to get high-dollar luxury w/d units, to match the dishwasher he bought. He has very high falutin' tastes for someone who doesn't work. I told him no, that we needed that money to help pay down debt, period. Of course, he raged and screamed. Luckily, I had a meeting, so I cut him off.

Now, he's downstairs, I think, trying to fix it again. There's a lot of banging and guttural roars of rage. As we know, he's nothing if not dramatic.

At any rate, I'm holding firm here. I'm not going to let him bully me into making obscene purchases. He's done that to me too many times to count, throwing tantrums like an entitled little prince.

As for the courses being complicated, I don't think he's deliberately choosing things I won't understand. He's always been passionate about cars and he makes me watch hours and hours of mechanic YouTube videos. The course that was tough was all about electrical systems. Still, we'll see if he follows through or if his claim to agree to look for work is just a way to push me off down the road. If history is any indicator, well, we know which one it is.