Why can't he just say its over

[Depression = 72% of members]

I've had to change my name slightly because I couldn't get logged in.

I've had very minimal contact with the person in my life since he pulled back end of last year just before the holidays. I'd dared for the first time in years to question him on a two week disappearance after being  consistently obsessive with his contact. I'd been worried about him and his excuse was that he'd been unwell which had never stopped him before  even with a serious illness, I'd always asked him to not just disappear without warning.  He retreated over the holidays, something he'd also never done before. I've been the only person he wanted in his life whilst he was unhappy and depressed during the 'inevitable ending' of his marriage, one in which he felt trapped and during that time he always told me he and I were 'meant to be'. It was extremely emotional and I found myself allowing it all to take over from everything else in my life. Up until my questioning him he always referred to me as a goddess, the only person he has ever really loved, the only one who 'kept him straight and level headed. There were some contradictions in the previous two years and he would flip flop between everything being terrible, saying awful things about the spouse but that he had no financial possibility of leaving and nowhere to go. I knew his financial status changed for the better just before he withdrew a bit which caused me to overthink, analyse and obsess over things, he had an excuse for not being able to utilise those finances. He had a lot of excuses in fact. I felt the fading out really badly and asked for an explanation. He blamed  depression which he'd had for 3 years so it didn't make any sense that he stopped wanting to share his problems with me, the only one who kept him level headed. He would reply if I reached out but only really had one contact from him in four months telling me again I'm the only person he loves and asking me not to leave, then cutting me off so I can't reply.
I've seen him in person a few times when he's been rushed but always professed the same usual loving things but all I could think about was the fact that he doesn't want to reach out. He has changed employment in a rushed forced manner recently and gone from crying to me, full of sadness and despair. To last time being ' much better, a bit happier and promising he will be in touch with photos of his new position and arrangements to meet, none of which has happened. He has told me he doesn't want me to go but isn't making any effort at all to keep me around.
My dilemma is that I have stressed I would be okay with this as a friendship if he can't move forward to more but he is asking me to hang on.
I'm in pain with it. I have his birthday approaching and don't know if I should send a greeting or just totally block everything because he's broken his promise and I'm stuck because his excuses always seem valid.
Advice would be good.

[Laylabelle1]

I've had to change my name slightly because I couldn't get logged in.

I've had very minimal contact with the person in my life since he pulled back end of last year just before the holidays. I'd dared for the first time in years to question him on a two week disappearance after being  consistently obsessive with his contact. I'd been worried about him and his excuse was that he'd been unwell which had never stopped him before  even with a serious illness, I'd always asked him to not just disappear without warning.  He retreated over the holidays, something he'd also never done before. I've been the only person he wanted in his life whilst he was unhappy and depressed during the 'inevitable ending' of his marriage, one in which he felt trapped and during that time he always told me he and I were 'meant to be'. It was extremely emotional and I found myself allowing it all to take over from everything else in my life. Up until my questioning him he always referred to me as a goddess, the only person he has ever really loved, the only one who 'kept him straight and level headed. There were some contradictions in the previous two years and he would flip flop between everything being terrible, saying awful things about the spouse but that he had no financial possibility of leaving and nowhere to go. I knew his financial status changed for the better just before he withdrew a bit which caused me to overthink, analyse and obsess over things, he had an excuse for not being able to utilise those finances. He had a lot of excuses in fact. I felt the fading out really badly and asked for an explanation. He blamed  depression which he'd had for 3 years so it didn't make any sense that he stopped wanting to share his problems with me, the only one who kept him level headed. He would reply if I reached out but only really had one contact from him in four months telling me again I'm the only person he loves and asking me not to leave, then cutting me off so I can't reply.
I've seen him in person a few times when he's been rushed but always professed the same usual loving things but all I could think about was the fact that he doesn't want to reach out. He has changed employment in a rushed forced manner recently and gone from crying to me, full of sadness and despair. To last time being ' much better, a bit happier and promising he will be in touch with photos of his new position and arrangements to meet, none of which has happened. He has told me he doesn't want me to go but isn't making any effort at all to keep me around.
My dilemma is that I have stressed I would be okay with this as a friendship if he can't move forward to more but he is asking me to hang on.
I'm in pain with it. I have his birthday approaching and don't know if I should send a greeting or just totally block everything because he's broken his promise and I'm stuck because his excuses always seem valid.
Advice would be good.

[grumpydonut]

Hey Laylabelle,

Sorry to read that. It sounds like you have been devalued and are now a back up. Your story sounds very similar to mine, for what that is worth. My ex kept me on the hook, telling me not to let go, while making no effort to keep me around. Turned out that she was seeing someone else in the background. From what I can tell, I was her fall back in case things fell through.

Basic info about BPD tells us that they hate abandonment and being alone. It sounds like you are no longer the person he wants the most, but you are a valuable utility should things fall through with his other option.

We can speculate all we want, but the key takeaway from what you said is that you deserve better treatment, and you're unlikely to get it.

From a psychological standpoint, maybe it's good to be aware of a concept that is common in abusive relationships - intermittent reinforcement. This is what addicts us to these relationships. I recommend you take a look. It sounds like you're in the cycle, hoping for the good old days to return.

[Laylabelle1]

Grumpy, I'm not waiting for those days now, I knew when he started using words like 'busy' and 'tired' but he'd been ill with the virus so I excused it, that was until it was a two week break. He had a bereavement early last year and it was me he wanted for emotional support all the time. I think I've been his favourite person until I questioned him. He began making little cutting remarks which he passed of as jokes when he's always told me how beautiful I am in every single contact. Asking me to hang on made me reach out to him out of total confusion and I began to feel sick dreading him pulling away again. I know I have to let it go and I've got used to him not contacting me, but I'm really hurting that he was stroking my face, kissing me and promised to  let me know about his new venture and make arrangements to meet up. It appears that he's been devaluing me and I've now been discarded whilst he's happily moved on. And on top of that I can see he's on social media late at night when he always used to be there with me. I'm dreading his birthday because I don't know whether to send a greeting if only a friendly one. Why do I feel like this when its him who broke his promise?

[Giulietta]

He had a bereavement early last year and it was me he wanted for emotional support all the time. I think I've been his favourite person until I questioned him. He began making little cutting remarks which he passed of as jokes when he's always told me how beautiful I am in every single contact. Asking me to hang on made me reach out to him out of total confusion and I began to feel sick dreading him pulling away again. I know I have to let it go and I've got used to him not contacting me, but I'm really hurting that he was stroking my face, kissing me and promised to  let me know about his new venture and make arrangements to meet up. It appears that he's been devaluing me and I've now been discarded whilst he's happily moved on. And on top of that I can see he's on social media late at night when he always used to be there with me. I'm dreading his birthday because I don't know whether to send a greeting if only a friendly one.

That sounds a lot like my pwBPD. He would idealize me for months and then, out of the blue, seemed to devalue/discard me whenever there was some sort of festive occasion in sight: before his birthday, before his mother's birthday, before he was christened, before a trip, before his graduation... and I never knew what to do, whether I should send a greeting or not. In the end I always ended up sending the greeting out of  politeness, and also in an attempt to "speed up" the making up process (it never worked, he would snob me just the same and then come back a couple of months later as if nothing had happened). Honestly I don't know if I did well to send those greetings, perhaps it would have been better to just let it go, but I was addicted to his love-bombing, I really wanted to go back to the "good times", and it always did happen eventually. However, it doesn't last. It's a vicious cycle and years later we were back to square one, except the abuse, when it came, got worse and worse.

My heart goes out to you, as I know full well what this feels like. In hindsight, I think I should never have sent greetings or even talked to him again, but I am at a different moment in the relationship and now that's easy for me to say.

[Laylabelle1]

Giuletta,
It was completely full on obsessive for over 2 years, but I was beginning to feel like it was waning when his contact was all about him. His grief, his bad marriage, his illnesses, I was always there listening, advising, even crying with him whilst he would sob because he felt trapped with his spouse who was ill when he wanted to be with me. But he stopped asking about me, how I was, how my day was etc. I understood he was depressed but couldn't understand why that suddenly stopped him.
I keep going from being angry that he broke his word to trying to rationalise that he's busy wirh his new job.to knowing he's online eith someone else.

[Giulietta]

His grief, his bad marriage, his illnesses, I was always there listening, advising, even crying with him whilst he would sob because he felt trapped with his spouse who was ill when he wanted to be

They are too absorbed by their own feelings and suffering to give us too much attention, and in the end we also have needs and deserve better. They may do it in the beginning, but sooner or later this is bound to happen. I’m afraid it’s always going to be all about him. At first I thought I could deal with this, but it’s an endless frustration. They will give you breadcrumbs now and again, just enough to keep you in the relationship. They do not want us to leave, and they do care about us in their own way. Problem is, their own way is not enough for me or you.

I keep going from being angry that he broke his word to trying to rationalise that he's busy wirh his new job.to knowing he's online eith someone else.

Yes, we always want to rationalize. I desperately wanted to find excuses for my pwBPD, and for years I went through this same cycle: anger - rationalizing - finding excuses - letting him into my life again. Of course,, they are troubled, they’ve probably gone through some pretty hard times in their lives, but at the end of the day, the reason they are that way doesn’t really matter. What matters is that they are not meeting your needs and probably never will. It’s soo hard to accept that, but it’s the truth. You alone can decide whether you will send him greetings or not, but if you do, be prepared for him to eventually try to recycle the relationship, only to do the same thing again after a while. Their pain and suffering never ends. I’m telling you this based on my own experience, of course, but reading this board made me see how common this is.

[once removed]

there is no future in a relationship where you are depending on someone else to end it and walk away.

His grief, his bad marriage, his illnesses, I was always there listening, advising, even crying with him whilst he would sob because he felt trapped with his spouse who was ill when he wanted to be with me. But he stopped asking about me, how I was, how my day was etc. I understood he was depressed but couldn't understand why that suddenly stopped him.

it sounds like this was a significant part of the foundation your relationship was built upon.

when that changes...when the divorce happens, or when the married couple decides to remain together, or when, inevitably, the things you originally bonded over become old hat, the dynamic changes.

whether you want to walk away or not (if you dont, id encourage you to post on the Bettering board and work on a strategy), it will help to accept that the initial, euphoric dynamic of the relationship is not coming back, at least not in any permanent way.

was his divorce ever completed? 

[Laylabelle1]

Hi once removed,
No it wasn't, he has been saying from the start that his marriage is over but it seems he just couldn't leave due to financial commitments. He appeared back in my life after choosing to stay in his marriage once before. Saying he made a terrible mistake. Wanted to be with me and expected me to accept it though we'd not been in contact for two years. I'd been in therapy for PTSD (I didn't tell him that) It felt like a death to me and I  never got over him. I wouldn't make that commitment straight away due to trust issues, I didn't want to be a fall back . Id had a lot of pain and confusion the first time round and been abandoned but from the beginning he seemed sincere. There have been confusing times though, he's  let slip at times that he tries with his spouse but to no avail which made me pull back with the trust. I've kept it purely emotional because of that. He pulled back before the festive season from consistent contact to nothing when things got slightly physical and I felt all those old wounds re surfacing. Since then its been scattered  and I suspect he's made commitments with the spouse though he says not. I know I have to detach from it hence posting back on this board but I'm finding it hard to believe he's made promises to keep me updated but just disappeared. I cant/ won't ask why, he wants me to always be there. Id like to leave it all with some respect on both sides for the bond we've shared but the intermittent reinforcement has me stuck.

[FindingMe2011]

 I relate to alot of what you are saying and it expresses a place I once dwelled in...When somebody shows you whom they are believe them. The words are not necessary as the actions will speak volumes. To think that this person wouldnt treat you, the same way you have witnessed them treat others, would be deficient thinking on your part. The words he spoke are choreographed and most likely used on every relationship they have ever had. Why? Because it works. To believe happiness can be achieved on someone else's tears is a pipe dream at best. A house of cards waiting to crumble. I wish you well, Peace

[once removed]

the intermittent reinforcement has me stuck.

a member here often compares it to a three legged stool.

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=285886.msg12695156#msg12695156

the marriage is almost certainly missing something. it may be romance. it may be passion. your relationship is one of the three legs, and so is theirs. remove a leg from the stool and the stool falls.

with all three legs, the relationship works for him. in some way, it works for all of you. and it can "work" in that way for a long time, even indefinitely.

it ultimately leaves you in a situation where you are chasing an emotionally unavailable person. in some ways, that may even be part of the draw.

trying to improve the situation, or trying to detach, dont actually look that different. both would involve seeing things from a more detached perspective, and not necessarily as you want them to be, and from there, it becomes easier to navigate.

detaching specifically, though, involves getting to the heart of "whats in it for you"; whats the real draw here in this dynamic that keeps you invested, and making the hard, but necessary choices involved in detaching from that draw, from the relationship, and from its wounds.

[Laylabelle1]

Thank you for the replies.
I feel bad enough that this is a marriage I'm talking about, but I have been present in calls so I do know that it isn't good, however, I have felt over time that it is also intermittent feeling that he is flipping between the both of us.
I really do feel that the withdrawal began when I put a boundary in place. and questioned his sincerity. I felt bad for that which I shouldn't have, but I think the intermittent reinforcement began to panic me again making me reach out for answers and trying to prove my own sincerity which in turn made him retreat.
I know he has had a lot to deal with over the past year, but it was always me he came to for support and to have it stop suddenly was like a kick in the gut.

You're right about the words, his replies have always been the same but have frustrated me because actions are not matching. I'm analysing everything he says, finding contradictions and he isn't finishing sentences but ending them with 'but',
This week is a turning point for me. He promised to send photos of a new vehicle he was buying with arrangements to spend time together. I've been waiting two weeks but seen the vehicle around town. I think I knew then that his promises were false. I know there is no excuse for that, he has been alone enough to find time and I can't put myself forward for him to come back in as though it didn't matter, that is just pure bare faced lying and future faking and to use the word 'busy' is total disrespect.

[once removed]

Thank you for the replies.
I feel bad enough that this is a marriage I'm talking about, but I have been present in calls so I do know that it isn't good, however, I have felt over time that it is also intermittent feeling that he is flipping between the both of us.

no judgment. the circumstances for virtually all of us were such that we found ourselves in a turbulent relationship that filled a void. we all also did things we said or did in the relationship that we regret; i know i did. people dont enter rehab when theyre already clean and sober, ya know? its just important to understand the dynamics that brought us here so we can begin to know where we want to go.

it was always me he came to for support and to have it stop suddenly was like a kick in the gut.

it sounds like this is a significant part of what you are fighting with, and for.

[Upandown]

With them everything is either in-the-moment, or manipulation, or painted black, or out of sight out of mind, or replaced.  Nothing is real in the way that we think of reality - reasonably consistent and reliable and existing into the future.  Makes me think of the phrase from Macbeth - "a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing."  I would find myself believing things that were said each time, even though Lucy took the football away always. 

[Laylabelle1]

Yes he actually told me once when I referred to something he once promised, he said 'that was how I felt at the time'