Withholding Information

[Link]

I have just recently discovered that my wife of 24 years may have BPD. She shows all of the signs and they have worsened considerably over the last 3-4 years. I have made a habit over the years to limit information that I share with my wife that I know will automatically trigger her insecurities and lead to a rage episode. Her biggest fear is for me to want another woman, look at another woman, find another woman attractive, leave her for another woman, ect. Even though I don't give her any reason, and I mean ANY, to believe that I want someone else she try's to control my every move to bring comfort to herself at the expense of my life. I can't go to the store without her, watch tv without her approving the program, we don't go on trips...you get the picture.

Today one of my biggest fears have come true. The company that I work for has just hired an attractive woman who will be working from the same office space that I am in. More than likely, I will be interacting with her at some point. My wife makes a habit of asking if new women have been hired. My knee jerk reaction is to say no...no matter what. I hate living like this. Constant fear of my wife's wrath.

Any advice?...Anyone have the same issues?

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

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[Gemsforeyes]

Hi Link-

Welcome to our site.  I’m really sorry that you’re going through this, and that your wife’s lack of trust and high jealousy level is so disabling that it actually interferes in living a joyful life.  Her jealousy truly IS crippling if that’s the reason she won’t travel...

I wonder what happened in her past to bring on this steep jealousy?  Has she been like this since you’ve known her? 

Has there ever been any infidelity, emotional or otherwise, (or suspicions of such) on either side during your 24 + years together?

At any rate, you really cannot control her reactions to things you’re not guilty of taking part in, can you?  No.

You say that your W’s behaviors worsened considerably 3-4 years ago.  If you’re up to it, can you describe what behaviors have worsened?

Was (were) there any event(s) that took place during that period that may have triggered these changes in your W?

Does your W work outside the home?

As for advice... You’re a professional and I would hope so are your colleagues, regardless of gender.  And you’re NOT a guilty man.  If you need to manage the contacts in your cell phone to keep peace in your home, then you know what you need to do.  Boundaries are always vital.  At work and home.  Work communication can normally be done via work email, correct?  So you, my friend can set the course and stay on it.

Please stay with us, share anything you’d like and again, welcome.  Your thoughts?

Warmly,
Gemsforeyes

[Link]

Thank you for responding Gemsforeyes!

My wife is very attractive. Small little thing; she was 19 when we met and probably weighed about 90 lbs. She has always put a lot of her worth and significance in her looks. She's a redhead and grew up really hating her looks and was picked on a lot. Her teenage years things started to change. Guys started to take notice and well there you go. Recently she has gained weight which she hates with a passion. I think she's beautiful and tell her that daily but she doesn't feel it so she doesn't believe me.

She was in a bad relationship around 16 and was pregnant at 17. He was abusive physically and mentally. I met her at work and we started dating and she left him for me, I left the girlfriend I was with for her. We married 2 years later.

I saw the jealousy early on. I was not what you would call especially moral when it came to sexuality. Rated R movies, girly magazines, strip clubs, ect. just seemed like normal things in my world but she was overly sensitive to seeing other attractive women. She would start fights over watching certain movies. At the time I thought it was weird and fought back thinking in time she would get used to it. Well, that didn't happen. The fights escalated, the jealousy grew to involve women just on the street. If she saw an attractive woman, obviously I was checking her out and wanted her.

Around 2001 I had been looking for help in our relationship and ran across a book entitled "Boundaries in Marriage". Instead of finding help for her, which is what I was trying to do, I found help for myself. Not only was the book relationally helpful, it was instrumental in leading me to a relationship with Jesus Christ. Suddenly my whole world view changed. I no longer wanted immoral things and wanted to live a morally upright life. My wife also became a Christian at that time. For the next 5-6 years, life was pretty good. Not perfect but pretty good. My wife had a reason to trust me. She believed that I was answering to a higher power (which I was) and she could rest in that fact.

Along came 2008 and our world was rocked. My wife had been a stay at home mother for many years and the job I was at was cutting back and things were tight. We were struggling to make the bills and I could not find extra work. I did not want to loose our house and asked my wife if she could go to work to help with the bills. She did and unfortunately within 3 months of being there, she had an affair with her boss. I reacted by making her quit, which I know now might have seemed right at the time but was the wrong thing to do. The affair did end and years later we started to connect again.

The jealousy returned once we started to reconnect. It worsened 3-4 years ago when I decided to take a job that was an 1.5 hour drive away. She fought with me every signal day for 7 months until I decided to quit and go back to my previous job. At this point, I'm stuck and can't move without her losing it.

The behaviors that have changed for the worse are-

1) Angry violent outbursts. Name calling, constantly bringing up failures of mine.
2) Jealousy has skyrocketed
3) Puts herself down physically...way more
4) Overreactions to every day things
5) Isolation...loneliness

My wife does not work outside the home.

I want nothing more than to have a happy, healthy, relationship with my wife. It so hard to see that ever happening.

[Link]

My wife was acting out for about a week. Last Thursday I was talking to her and at some point I could just see a change in her eyes. They softened towards me, I'm not even sure what I said or did or if it was me at all. Things have been calm between us, actually very loving. This is the cycle. It's great when it's like this but it's always fragile. Outbursts, anger, and rage episodes tend to happen at least one week out of a month. It's so difficult.

I came to this forum looking for some help from others that experience this and who are going through the same thing. My wife won't get help and she won't allow me to talk to anyone. I need help.

[kells76]

I came to this forum looking for some help from others that experience this and who are going through the same thing. My wife won't get help and she won't allow me to talk to anyone. I need help.

Glad we can be here for you. It sounds really isolating to want help but feel like you aren't allowed to reach out. Please keep posting here as long as you want to -- we'll be here for you.

What does it look like when your wife doesn't allow you to talk to anyone? Is she just not wanting you to tell certain people about her and her problems, or is it more pervasive in your life (i.e., she doesn't want you connecting to anyone about anything at all)?

[once removed]

having a jealous partner is really hard. my ex snooped, and started fights out of insecurity frequently. its exhausting.

i think maybe one of the hardest, and yet most important parts to understand, is that this comes from a place of deep insecurity, and you cant alleviate that, either by going out of your way to not interact with women, or by pleading your innocence. its likely to be something that you bump up against, at least from time to time.

the good news is that whats probably more important, long term, than each sort of jealous episode, is that the relationship, overall, feels secure to your wife, and thats achievable. when she reaches baseline, its what she will remember and hold onto.

we have a workshop here about dealing with a jealous partner: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=78324.0

a lot of what to do, whether its the specifics of whether to tell your wife about your new coworker, or more generally, really depends on the context of your relationship and how the two of you relate to each other. there can be a lot of trial and error. ideally, i think youre going to want to shift the dynamic a bit where you arent walking on eggshells. how to do it is a delicate matter. you dont want to change things too much, too soon, as that can be rough on any relationship.

[Link]

Thank you so much for the responses. Suffering in silence for the past 12 - 13 years has been taking its toll.

What does it look like when your wife doesn't allow you to talk to anyone? Is she just not wanting you to tell certain people about her and her problems, or is it more pervasive in your life (i.e., she doesn't want you connecting to anyone about anything at all)?

For so many years I've been trying to appease my wife by adjusting my behavior so much that really it's hard to even recognize who I am. I don't have any close friends other than my brother and our relationship is strained because of my marriage as well.

So the scenario goes something like this. If I get a text from my brother and don't tell her about it, she get's mad and says I'm hiding things from her. If I tell her every time he texts she says it must be nice to have friends and she doesn't have any. So she makes me feel guilty for texting him. If a coworker texts me (has to be a guy...I don't give my number to women, she will do the same but there is an even more jealous streak to her tone. One time a coworker attached a little GIF to the text which showed a car spinning out in snow. My wife's response after snooping on my phone and finding it was, "what other videos is he sending? Naked women?". She still to this day thinks of him as a threat. (he never once sent inappropriate images)

When my wife rages, I'll say we need help. She'll get out of control to the point of spitting in my face. Last time she did this, I said we need help and we should see a consoler. She refused, said she never will and she will never engage in a threesome. This is the way she refers to things when she's raging, always with weird sexual undertones. She tells me I'm being disloyal to her if I seek help for my self. I also told her recently after she spit in my face, told me to get out, she wanted a divorce that I was going to stay with my brother because I had no where else to go. She immediately ran outside and got in my car to stop me from going. "Don't ever tell your brother anything, it would be a total betrayal". ...ect...ect...ect...

I feel like I can't talk to anyone. It's maddening.

[Link]

a lot of what to do, whether its the specifics of whether to tell your wife about your new coworker, or more generally, really depends on the context of your relationship and how the two of you relate to each other.

I know from past experience that if I tell her about this coworker, she will immediately go into a tailspin. This woman's attractiveness is definitely an issue. Although, since my wife has gained a little weight and I tell her how beautiful she is, (which is the truth) she now believes I'm into overweight women. So really, no one is off limits for her jealousy. This coworker will be her ultimate threat in HER mind. I will avoid this woman to the best of my ability. It's what I do. I have very tall hedges in place. To the point where it could possibly hurt my job. I have a position at work where there is much expected of me. I have been asked at times by upper management to travel and meet with customers to add technical support if needed. I always refuse. My wife would accuse me of talking to women customers and I'm going to leave her so I avoid that.

I know that in the state that we are in right now that I will hear daily about how I'm checking this girl out. When she rages, she'll tell me to go f#$# her. I'll hear how ugly my wife is from her mouth constantly. She'll bug me all day long with texts. She will GPS my location, to the point of telling me that I wasn't at my desk all day so I must be cheating. It's absolute hell. I've tried listening, trying to understand, placing boundaries, reasoning with her. Then the other side...anger, yelling, mean words. I've tried talking softly, I've tried yelling. I've tried not responding. I've tried affection. I've threatened divorce.

If I am calm, she'll want me to be loud and angry. If I'm angry, she says I need to be calm. If I place a boundary she wants to break it down. If I yell, she yells louder. If I'm quiet she gets even more enraged. If I threaten divorce she spits in my face. If I try to leave she stops me.

I guess I just feel at a loss. How should I respond? What will calm her insecurities? How much abuse do I need to endure?

Right now as of today we are in a calm spot. It's loving between us for the moment. I know that it is fragile. At any moment things can swing to the other side of the spectrum. I don't believe that it will be anything that I do to cause it. At least I won't recognize the trigger when it happens. She will just spend a lot of time dwelling on bad and then her mood will start to change. I become her whipping boy when she explodes.

[Link]

I really need feedback on this one point. I had mentioned in previous posts that my wife had an affair at work. My wife blames me and has blamed me ever since and she refuses to acknowledge that she hurt me because she was manipulated by her boss and I wanted her to work there. So it was my fault and his fault.

Here are the key points that my wife keeps going back to. By the way, the peace is over.

- I wanted my wife to work at this job because it was the only one available at the time and her brother could get her a job there. She did not want to work there but she says I forced her to take the job. I fail to see how you can force someone to take a job but I guess I was pushy.

- She came to me and said, after a bit of time there, that her boss was falling in love with her. I took it as, her boss thought she was good looking and that my wife wasn't responding to him. I believed that my wife was devoted to me and I didn't think anything else could be going on. I said to her, "well tell him to get lost, you're a married woman." I wish I would have said..."Really, why do you think that?" I should have pried but I didn't. I assumed and I was wrong.

-A week or two after that she told me that she loved this guy and didn't know how she felt about me.

-I was floored and spent weeks pleading with her to end it. She kept saying she would but she wasn't.

- More time went by and I couldn't accept what was going on. My kids were young, our family was getting torn apart, my wife seemed like she was from a different planet, and I told her brother about it and he told her she needed to quit or he would do what he had to to get her fired. She quit.

- More time went by and she told me she needed to get away for the weekend to clear her head. She was going to a hotel to be alone. Out of stupidity I agreed. She meat up with him and they spent the night together which my wife informs me was the only time they slept together. And the reason she did it was because she needed to say goodbye. She's given other reasons as well.

My wife has since broke ties.

To this day my wife has said that I was the reason all of this happened. I didn't protect her by wanting her to go to work there. I didn't pull her out at the right time, which would have been when she said her boss was falling in love with her. The hotel happened because I made her quit at the wrong time.

Am I going insane? I do acknowledge my failures here, and I've voiced them to her over and over again. I've asked for forgiveness constantly. I've repented and have never asked her to do anything like this ever again.

I hate this!

Please... can anyone help?

[pursuingJoy]

To this day my wife has said that I was the reason all of this happened. I didn't protect her by wanting her to go to work there. I didn't pull her out at the right time, which would have been when she said her boss was falling in love with her. The hotel happened because I made her quit at the wrong time.

If she didn't want to work, it was her responsibility to say no. If she worked anyway and became resentful, that was her responsibility to manage. It was her responsibility to to set healthy boundaries with her boss, and to quit when she thought she should. The affair was her responsibility.

A counselor once told me that people typically default to either blaming others or blaming themselves. I said I blamed myself, and she said, "I know, and that's not a good thing. It's usually indicative of a desire to control the situation. If it's your fault, then you think you can still change it, you can fix it."

It's really important, for all involved, not to overstep and take responsibility for parts that aren't ours.

Most of us found this site at a time when we felt upside down. The most important thing you can do right now is find your footing. I'm really glad you're here, Link.

pj

[once removed]

I guess I just feel at a loss. How should I respond? What will calm her insecurities? How much abuse do I need to endure?

the long and short of it is that the dynamic the two of you are in is just no way to live, and isnt really sustainable.

for it to work, youre going to have to get it on healthier ground, and on a healthier trajectory...in terms of your own mental well being, as well. having said that, change is hard on any relationship. you will not want to be too drastic, try to change everything at once, bite off more than you can chew; that can upend any relationship, and it will invite a lot of pushback at the very least.

but things didnt get here over night. they wont change over night. they may, in fact, get worse, before they get better. but they can get better.

where, exactly, to start, is hard to say. theres a lot going on, and you have a very, very difficult partner. i think it would go a long way to start by learning a lot more about the disorder, and accepting that you love a difficult person who will always be a very difficult person. you cant cure someones anxieties - in fact, you can make them even worse when you try too hard - and for someone with bpd traits those insecurities are especially entrenched. you can create a more secure relationship environment - people with bpd traits thrive in that setting - but you cant make her a less insecure person.

a lot of it is going to be a combination of learning that your wife needs extra validation and patience than the average person (think of this as a special needs relationship), and learning not to walk on eggshells. youve been doing that for a long time, and undoing it will no doubt make you very anxious, and rightfully so, because your wife will likely react very strongly. keep your eye on the big picture, rather than trying to put out each fire as it comes.

[Link]

a lot of it is going to be a combination of learning that your wife needs extra validation and patience than the average person (think of this as a special needs relationship), and learning not to walk on eggshells.

Is it really possible for my wife to get better from this disorder with out realizing she has something wrong? What if she realizes something's wrong but won't get help for it? Does it even matter what I do?

[Link]

It's really important, for all involved, not to overstep and take responsibility for parts that aren't ours.

Seems like this can happen in a healthy relationship. Can this really happen when your spouse has BPD?

[once removed]

What if she realizes something's wrong

she probably does. she probably realizes something is off, or different.

Does it even matter what I do?

very much so. the number one indicator of recovery from BPD is having a strong support system.

this is what it takes: https://www.bpdfamily.com/content/what-does-it-take-be-relationship

this is written for parents, but very, very relevant: https://www.bpdfamily.com/content/support-child-therapy

most of us dont cope with our relationships in the healthiest or strongest of ways. these relationships arent intuitive, and the learning curve is steep. cleaning up our side of the street can significantly reduce conflict, and, often times, our loved ones follow our lead. again, you dont necessarily want to do too much, too quickly, in that regard, but theres a great deal that would take some shifting to get on a healthier trajectory.

[pursuingJoy]

Can this really happen when your spouse has BPD?

I believe it can, and accepting responsibility for your part only is something you have the ability to regulate. Your wife was blaming you for not making her quit sooner. The truth is, she's a grown adult who, BPD or not, is responsible for her actions and the choices she makes. The affair was ultimately her choice and her responsibility. If you apologize for not making her quit sooner, you're taking responsibility for something that wasn't yours. If you pressured her, apologize specifically for that part, but don't validate the invalid. I hope that makes sense.

Like once removed said, the learning curve is steep. My H doesn't have BPD, but he was raised by a mother that did, and he is enmeshed with her so he displays some really unhealthy behavior. I was taught to aspire to a certain kind of relationship, but I realized I was living a different reality. I had to learn to let go of expectations and hopes and learn to work with what I had. Boundary setting, including taking responsibility for only what was mine, played a big role in changing the dynamic. It takes time and patience, but many folks here (not all) find it possible be in healthy, fulfilling relationships with pwBPD.

[Link]

So we went since the last time I posted without a full blown episode. I try to stay calm, validate her feelings the best I can when she is starting to explode. It has been, for the most part calming her down. I have to daily, be mindful of her triggers. I don't go anywhere, I don't have anyone texting me, I stay away form the tv, I watch what I say, I try to keep my eyes on the floor when we are out in public...ect...ect. All of this to keep try and keep her from splitting. Living like this is enough to drive you insane. No matter how much you love someone, to live as that person's slave is not natural and not sustainable.

This morning I woke up to a split wife. Nothing I did that I know of other than she is thinking about things that have hurt her and now I'm the bad guy. It's hard to be the constant cheerleader when you're being torn apart by someone who says they love you. My life sucks...I'm sure others can relate.

[pursuingJoy]

I don't go anywhere, I don't have anyone texting me, I stay away form the tv, I watch what I say, I try to keep my eyes on the floor when we are out in public...ect...ect. All of this to keep try and keep her from splitting. Living like this is enough to drive you insane. No matter how much you love someone, to live as that person's slave is not natural and not sustainable.

I agree - this isn't sustainable. You're disappearing and getting smaller. In my experience, it worked at first but always backfired in the end. 

once removed mentioning starting with small boundaries and working your way up from there. Can you identify one thing that you want to change? One place to start?

I'm sorry if you've already answered this question, Link - are either of you in therapy? I remember feeling so drained and exhausted, I couldn't take one more step. Therapy has 'unstuck' me at these points in my life. I was able to unload in a neutral space, get the support I needed and see the next step more clearly.

[Snowflake90]

Hey there, are you in therapy?
If you aren't I highly suggest you do. Sounds like you need some self-love.
My suggestion is, try not to please her all the while. Yes, it can be overwhelming dealing with the chaos when you break the status quo. But what's the alternative? Shut up and obey every insane order? Get butterflies in your stomach, trying to filter information? Depersonalize yourself? Been there, done that, not cool I assure you. You're not a child who needs to be monitored. And if I understand correctly you are not the one who should be constantly suspected of infidelity. Seems like things are completely upside down in your husband-wife dynamic. Does she get treatment? Therapy, SSRIs, etc? Unfortunately, IMHO, the only way to deal with BPD is by estabilishing firm boundaries. I realize this is very stressing. Because when things don't go their way, it's the highway. Still, again, ponder the alternative. Will you walk on eggshells your whole life? Let the eggs break every now and then and say, I'm not going to hear your abuse. Come back when you're calmer. Or if you keep acting out I'll start leaving. Or what I think needs to be said is, the only way for this relationship to go on is for you to seek treatment. Also infidelity is a big no-no. It undermines what marriage is all about. You shouldn't plea for her to stay IMHO, it should be just the opposite. If she really wants you she needs to apologize and change. You're not the abuser here, you're the victim.
Sorry if I seem rough.

[Link]

Snowflake90...I can resonate with everything you are saying. It's actually refreshing to hear. I see that you are divorced in your description of yourself. Did your ex have BPD?
Can you elaborate on that?

Seems to always be around her period but she just explodes and you don't see it coming. When that happens, I am the worst person on the planet. Yesterday was an example. She woke up ready to fight, I tried to calm things and it worked for a little bit. Came home from work and sat with her on the couch watching some crime shows. 2 occasions she yelled at me for not looking away from the tv fast enough when a bra commercial came on. We are talking instant turning of my head but still, it wasn't good enough. We left to take a drive. Got in line at mcdonalds and I was driving. What happens usually is I pull up to the car in front of me and my wife will start to get quiet and kinda weird. I know whats coming next, instead of just pulling up and keeping a distance between me and the next car I am staring at the woman in the vehicle via her side mirror. So when we come to a stop I look away from the car and try not to look unless I have to move up. Doesn't matter, I'm accused of being a perv because it's a young blond in the vehicle. She rages when we get home, peace is over. She's been blowing up my cell all day with nasty, nasty comments.

What is my next move? What do I do with this? I tried to point out her raging is not normal, and that makes it worse. I stay quiet she yells louder. She spit in my face again and called me a pig. Is there no saving this?

She won't let me be in therapy and she believes there's nothing wrong with her. My kids are scared of her.

[thankful person]

Hi link, I completely relate, my wife is also extremely jealous of anyone I ever communicate with and I left my ex boyfriend for her after we met online and had an intense emotional affair while I was still with him. So she will always say she can never trust me and of course is threatened by both men and women and if I ever say I had a laugh with someone random like another customer in a shop or something, then she’ll say, do you want to have sex with that person? And if we’re watching tv she’s constantly asking who I find attractive and there is no correct answer. It has got to a point where I rarely mention anyone to her but then it’s also a rule that she has to know who is texting me and will look at my phone when she wants - again because she doesn’t trust me. I have made a few good friends through various jobs since being with her and have had to block several people just because they were too friendly towards me. It’s true her friends are very unreliable. She attracts people with mental health problems who are very unstable, whereas I also attract people with mental health problems but they are kind and loving people. Of course she is jealous because although I don’t “click” with many people, when I do then I make amazing friends easily. I keep everyone at arms length, it’s just not worth it otherwise and not fair on them. These days since Covid I am teaching working from home, which means she gets to listen to all my conversations and same when I speak to my family. She has told me to only talk about work when working but I refuse. I agree with what snowflake said about breaking the eggs. It’s something I am planning on changing… slowly breaking a few of these rules which I should have never agreed to. I am still treading carefully though. She is jealous of my relationship with our older child and sometimes tells me not to cuddle her. Someone on here told me to refuse when she screams PUT HER DOWN. And for that the child was snatched away and I was physically thrown from the room. I don’t want that to happen again but I want to be a better role model for the children.