What if she's too afraid/ashamed to reach out?

[Ichi]

My exBPDgf discarded me 3 months ago after a 5 year live-in RS. Found out she monkey branched her replacement the last 2 months of our RS and is now with him. We've been in NC since she left except for a few emails/texts from her during the first 2 weeks about practical things to be arranged. After that nothing from her and neither did I initiate any contact. Although I think I handled things well during the discard and the aftermath, I'm still having a hard time and love and miss her immensely. I'm working really hard to pick up my life, hobbies, contacts and improving myself and also seeing a therapist.

NC has helped me to create time and distance to grieve, heal and get perspective on the RS, however as time goes by I find it increasingly hard not knowing when/if she'll ever reach out again. I know it's not wise to contact her, especially since I assume she's still with her replacement, and in my opinion the ball is in her court if/when she wants to contact me.

However, I keep thinking what if she does want to contact me, but is too afraid or ashamed to do so out of fear of rejection or thinking I'm mad at her or I don't want to talk to her. What if she's waiting for me to reach out to her. I know I'm most probably fooling myself, but I know she's very avoidant and also found it very difficult to reach out to people she hurt or broke with in the past. Also, when she discarded me she told me "I don't want to lose you" and gave the impression she wanted to stay 'friends', which I know doesn't mean much and can change with the flip of a dime and besides that, I don't want to just function as her 'supply'.

But is there any way I can show her the door is still open for contact, without coming across as needy, weak, desperate, chasing, pursuing and putting myself in a too vulnerable position to be used and hurt. I know I probably already know the answer and it's wishful thinking and I'm just fooling myself, but I keep thinking what if she's waiting for me to reach out first and thinks I don't care about her anymore or moved on if I don't. Or she might feel I abandoned her and in her mind it confirms I never cared about her and justifies her discarding me?

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[Cromwell]

Hi and welcome Ichi

This is a bit of hard advice probably to hear but its what worked for me. I really had to detach from wondering what she thought about me. Period. It will drive insanity and i understand how it got to that stage.

With regard to keeping a door open. Its the saying, where there is a will there is a way. Shell find you and reach out. I went complete no contact and closed down comms. 3 weeks later she was standing outside the bank i went in.

The other side is you are well within your rights to reconcile and reach out to her. Its entirely a judgment call, id suggest give yourself a bit of time to do it with some weighing up to go with the emotional and still in love reasons.

It sounds like you are pressurised to make a decision. Id like to say that 3 months no contact is an amazing thing to achieve.

Can i ask, is this a difficult moment out of nowhere like a craving?

Also how have you been doing during the no contact generally?

Sometimes its a case of a difficult moment, ive had plenty during the first year nc, they could pass quite quickly as much as they appeared out of nowhere.

[Ichi]

It sounds like you are pressurised to make a decision. Id like to say that 3 months no contact is an amazing thing to achieve.

Can i ask, is this a difficult moment out of nowhere like a craving?

Also how have you been doing during the no contact generally?

It's just that the longer we go NC the more it feels like she's drifting away from me, that she's forgetting about me and I'm losing her. I also keep wondering if she's hoping for me to chase her, wanting me to fight for her to 'prove' I really love her. I know she said about her previous ex that he didn't fight for her to get her back when she discarded him and to her that apparently meant he didn't love her enough. When she discarded me I made it very clear to her I still loved her and wanted to work on our RS, but I was not going to beg her for it. But she was very determined about ending it, so it seemed like nothing I would say or do could change her mind.

During the first month of NC I felt surprisingly strong, but maybe I was still in survival mode. I also felt pretty confident she would eventually reach out to me. Recently however, things are getting harder for me, I'm really missing her and losing hope she'll ever contact me again. Also I'm having heavy panic attacks, especially in the morning right after waking up. They usually decrease during the day and as long as I keep myself busy and find distraction I'm okay, but still panic can set in all of a sudden sometimes and then I have a really hard time thinking straight. I also find myself constantly ruminating about the situation and having difficulty not thinking about her at all.

[Goosey]

Just stating from my experience.
  (Mind you my relationship was decades long).
 She jumped right into my life. Literally.
But there was the other guy she left. , the bad guy, the guy that did this or that.
   I still miss her. I hate my brain.
  But my brain will allow me the insight and calculation that I am now that “bad”guy. 
   And she never went backwards. She moves forward.
  I feel for ya.
 Powerful pull they have.
  The suffering gets less.
   

[Ichi]

Thanks for the support Cromwell and Goosey. But I'm having a really bad day today and even wondering if posting on this forum isn't actually counterproductive in dealing with my feelings. It stirs op a lot of emotions...

[Cromwell]

Ichi.

It sure can stir up emotions.

It sounds good to take a break. I had a bit too much on my mind yesterday im taking a break too. Its great to have self awareness of when to call for a pause. Its a bit like lifting weights in the gym, the actual change and strength remodelling occurs during rest. I feel the same about therapy, a break is not just a good thing but a necessity.

Well, see you later. The supports always here just a few clicks away. Good for you.

[Ichi]

Well, it's not that I WANT to take a break. I was just wondering about it this morning as I was in a REALLY bad state and thinking it might have something to do with posting on this forum and stirring up emotions. But I'm really thankful for the support on this forum and I know at this moment I actually REALLY need it. So please I'm open to any suggestions/opinions/help.

[once removed]

Thanks for the support Cromwell and Goosey. But I'm having a really bad day today and even wondering if posting on this forum isn't actually counterproductive in dealing with my feelings. It stirs op a lot of emotions...

i was in a similar place to you when i arrived here. my ex had jumped into a new relationship very suddenly, and part of me wanted to detach, part of me wanted her back, and part of me just wanted to hear from her, and i wasnt sure what to do about any of it. after a few months, i felt like i was in an even worse place.

But is there any way I can show her the door is still open for contact, without coming across as needy, weak, desperate, chasing, pursuing and putting myself in a too vulnerable position to be used and hurt.

if you are looking to open the door with your ex, with those goals in mind, you may want to consider posting on the Bettering board, where you can work through the idea, and work through a plan, with help. Detaching is a board for shutting the door, and its a different type of support.

what i would tell you either way, is that when an ex jumps into a new relationship, there is really not a lot of space for processing the previous relationship, and thats generally by design. if you were to reach out, theres a high likelihood that even if she were receptive to it, her response would reflect that, and that would hurt. the new relationship is really something that has to play itself out. think about it...if you were in a new relationship, and your ex reached out, youd probably be apprehensive and unsure what to do with it. if your breakup has been relatively amicable, then you have probably made clear the door is open, but its hard to know what to say.

Recently however, things are getting harder for me, I'm really missing her and losing hope she'll ever contact me again. Also I'm having heavy panic attacks, especially in the morning right after waking up. They usually decrease during the day and as long as I keep myself busy and find distraction I'm okay, but still panic can set in all of a sudden sometimes and then I have a really hard time thinking straight. I also find myself constantly ruminating about the situation and having difficulty not thinking about her at all.

odds are youre experiencing depression. upwards of 80% of members are, when they arrive here. i was in a pretty bad way myself. a strong support system was really vital for me in feeling less alone. similarly, i was experiencing a lot of ruminating, crying jags, and daily anxiety attacks. seeing a doctor was one of the best decisions i made. all of these things at once can be a really heavy lift and make it even harder to cope or function.

[Ichi]

Thanks a lot once removed. Is it possible to move this thread to the Bettering board?

When you say 'seeing a doctor' do you mean using medication? I have experienced depression in the past and tried antidepressants for a while, but they didn't help much. Only numbed ALL emotions and made me feel like a zombie, aside from the sexual dysfunction side effects. I tried a different AD only recently but experienced the same problems so quit after a while.

[once removed]

i had less luck with medication than i did with supplements. there were a handful of supplements that helped my body and mind adjust, made everything in my head seem smaller, and really got me through.

[Ichi]

Do you mind telling what supplements you used?

[once removed]

not at all!

SAM-E was a big one, maybe the most effective. it really limited the ruminations. i recommend getting it at an herb store, it will be cheaper, and the grocery store stuff gave me an upset stomach at higher doses.
passion flower knocked out my anxiety attacks. i dont know how it would do with panic attacks, specifically.
ashwaghanda had a similar affect to SAM-E once SAM-E quit doing much for me

there are others worth looking into like indian holy basil, and 5htp.

so now that youre on the Bettering board, what do you think you want to do, if anything?

[crushedagain]

Just stating from my experience.
  (Mind you my relationship was decades long).
 She jumped right into my life. Literally.
But there was the other guy she left. , the bad guy, the guy that did this or that.
   I still miss her. I hate my brain.
  But my brain will allow me the insight and calculation that I am now that “bad”guy.  
   And she never went backwards. She moves forward.
  I feel for ya.
 Powerful pull they have.
  The suffering gets less.
  

This x 100. They're moving forward, chewin' 'em up and spittin' 'em out.

[Ichi]

not at all!

SAM-E was a big one, maybe the most effective. it really limited the ruminations. i recommend getting it at an herb store, it will be cheaper, and the grocery store stuff gave me an upset stomach at higher doses.
passion flower knocked out my anxiety attacks. i dont know how it would do with panic attacks, specifically.
ashwaghanda had a similar affect to SAM-E once SAM-E quit doing much for me

there are others worth looking into like indian holy basil, and 5htp.

so now that youre on the Bettering board, what do you think you want to do, if anything?

Thanks a lot once removed, I'll check them out.

To be honest, I'm still not sure what to do. My mind says let her new relationship run its course and don't reach out, as is the common advice I hear on this forum. However, my gut says that the more time passes the more she'll forget about me, thinks I no longer care about her, maybe feels abandoned by me and the smaller the chance she'll reach out or the possibility of reconciliation. I keep going in circles in my head and just don't know what to do. What's the best way to maximize my chances for a possible reconciliation?

Also she was more of the quiet BPD waif type, never really displayed any angry or hostile behavior towards me. Not before, during or after the discard. However she seemed to be very determined to end it and nothing could change her mind. She acted pretty cold and without much emotion, but did say she didn't want to lose me.

[Ichi]

Might add that I never knew about her BPD. She never told me she was and I'm still not sure if she's aware of it herself. In hindsight all red flags were there but I only realized it was BPD after the discard. I know she's had 10 years of therapy in the past for various problems, including emotional regulation therapy, so either she was aware but never told me or she was unaware because never properly diagnosed.

Looking back I see that she did show some awareness and tried her best to deal with her emotions, but me not knowing about her BPD made it hard sometimes to properly deal with it. Mind you, I tried my damn hardest, but looking back I should have handled things differently. If only I had known about her BPD it would have made things easier for her and me. Again, I tried my hardest to be there for her and giving her all my love, support and understanding but I also made mistakes that, with the knowledge I have now, made things more difficult, made her feel unheard and triggered her and her fear of abandonment. Me getting frustrated, irritated, defensive, angry with her sometimes really didn't help and I still feel a lot of guilt about that. I know I did the best I could with what I knew then and keep telling myself I'm only human and make mistakes, but the guilt keeps eating at me.

On the one hand I feel the need to tell her I didn't know about her BPD and regret how I've handled things, learned from it and would handle things different now. But on the other hand I doubt if that will accomplish anything and in the worst case, if she is actually unaware of her BPD, she might feel offended and make matters only worse.

[Ichi]

And while I am writing all of this, part of me says who am I kidding, she's with her replacement right now and has probably totally forgotten about me...

[once removed]

she's with her replacement right now and has probably totally forgotten about me...

in all likelihood, and as much as it may feel and seem that way, she has not totally forgotten about you. you were in a five year relationship together.

what is likely is that her energy is focused there, and she is short circuiting the grieving process when it comes to your five year relationship. it can be a hard thing to fathom (and experience), that, but its one way that some people cope.

that is partly why the relationship really needs to play out, and stand, and/or fall, on its own. lets say you were a major presence in her life, the relationship goes south, they break up, and she jumps back into a relationship with you. that would likely be a train wreck. on the other hand, if you reach out, whatever you say or do is unlikely to be something that shes prepared to emotionally deal with any time soon.

i suspect that one of three things would happen: youd get a very professional sounding pat on the head, you might get a hostile response, or, most likely, it would go unresponded to, and i have some idea of how that would feel. what is least likely is that she sees the error of her ways, ends the relationship, returns to you, and the two of you live happily ever after. the most youd probably achieve is giving her the impression that somewhere down the road, it will be safe to reach out to you.

the thing is, a person that leaves a relationship in that fashion tends to feel really bad about it, while also doing what they can to avoid feeling really bad about it.

a lot of post relationship contact (from us, from them, or from really any two people with similar circumstances) is about feeling better about how things ended...to say "im okay, youre okay". well meaning, but ultimately selfish. i would tend to suggest that that is not something you want to help her do, or soothe her feelings about. theyre her feelings to process, and besides, youll kick yourself harder than you are right now.

thats not to say we cant help you carve out whatever you might want to say or do in a way that will minimize putting your heart on the line, and give you the greatest likelihood of success, whatever success looks like to you. we can, and this board is a great place to get feedback for that. it is to say, whatever you do, you want to think it through.

my relationship ended very similarly. we were together for three years. someone was lined up for at least a month before we broke up (i wasnt even 100% certain we were broken up until she made her new relationship official). it caught me majorly off guard. for a time, i wasnt even certain it was real, i wondered if it was some sort of test. in a lot of ways, i got worse over those months. depression and anxiety and rumination were my existence. i had a lot of urges, i had a lot of fears, including many of the ones you have now, and fortunately, i had a lot of people around me to help and give feedback. today i have no regrets about how i handled it, and i can tell you, that will matter to you in the short term and the long term, no matter what happens.

one of the things that i kept returning to was that i had more power and control than i thought, or felt like i did. i reminded myself, and ill remind you, that not everything needs to be so "final". you can contact her any time you want. you can say whatever you want to say. you can do it now, you can do it a week from now, a month from now, a year from now. but now is probably not the best time to do it.

My mind says let her new relationship run its course and don't reach out, as is the common advice I hear on this forum. However, my gut says that the more time passes the more she'll forget about me, thinks I no longer care about her, maybe feels abandoned by me and the smaller the chance she'll reach out or the possibility of reconciliation. I keep going in circles in my head and just don't know what to do. What's the best way to maximize my chances for a possible reconciliation?

whatever you do, you dont want to act on anxiety. anxiety tends to make us feel like we have to act. some of these thoughts, fears, and ruminations, are likely a product of that. the fear of the unknown and the what ifs, and the tendency to wonder whats going on in her mind, may make you feel that not only do you need to act, but that youll deeply regret not doing so, miss your chance, make her forget you completely, etc. depression tends to make us focus on it, and worst case scenarios. its a vicious cycle. a lot of this is unrealistic. there simply isnt room or reason, for example, to fight for her or prove your love. one thing that helped me was to remind myself that i simply didnt know what she was thinking, whether it was good or bad.

whatever you do, or dont do, you want to do it in confidence and strength. and the thing is, when youre in that state, you tend to know what to do, or not to do, and you feel sure of it.

another part of it is that you are deep in grief. Bargaining is part of that process. Bargaining looks a lot like imagining scenarios and what ifs (even painful ones) that allow us to stave off the depression of grief, and yet, prolong the pain. one of the things that is often suggested on this board is to completely grieve the relationship as if it were dead, and consider any potential iteration of the relationship a very new relationship.

Detaching and trying to Reverse a Breakup actually dont look too dissimilar in your circumstances. first and foremost, you want to get your strength and balance back. youll feel stronger, and more certain about what you want to do, or not do. on top of that, if their relationship ended tomorrow, and she reached out, youd want to be in that strong, sure, confident place. otherwise youre likely to leave yourself very vulnerable.

another (and this is also easier to do when you have your strength back) is to examine what really went wrong in the relationship, how it transpired, how it broke down, and to determine whether it is salvageable, and what it would take to do so, if possible.

are the two of you connected on social media or anything?

[Ichi]

Thank you so much once removed, you're words helped me more than my therapist did today.

What really went wrong in the relationship and how it broke down is difficult to put in a few words, but in MY opinion nothing that couldn't be salvaged or worked on. My part in what went wrong I think is mostly what I mentioned in my previous post. Except the last months of our relationship a few things happened that I think triggered her fear of abandonment, things I've said and done and me getting angry. I think that was the turning point, because she said that changed and broke something inside her and I disgusted her. That was also the exact time she sourced her replacement. Just before and during the discard she gave me a few other reasons why she wasn't happy and wanted to end it, but I'm not sure if she was honest, giving me textbook reasons, and some didn't really make much sense to me at all and were pretty confusing and contradictory. In the end to me it feels like it was a case of 'I abandon you before you abandon me'.

We are still connected on social media, but I don't watch hers and I have no clue whether she watches mine. No contact on social media whatsoever though, however a few of her family members occasionally still like my posts.

[once removed]

things I've said and done and me getting angry. I think that was the turning point, because she said that changed and broke something inside her and I disgusted her.

what happened? from your perspective, what led up to the point that you reacted that way?

she gave me a few other reasons why she wasn't happy and wanted to end it, but I'm not sure if she was honest, giving me textbook reasons, and some didn't really make much sense to me at all and were pretty confusing and contradictory.

this is a very common way to go about breaking up with someone...whether its vague answers, or the whole kitchen sink and everything you ever did wrong (or both). this is a comedy routine, from a source id take with a grain of salt, but theres some truth to it: https://www.facebook.com/justforlaughs/videos/829305134305936

there is rarely a straight forward, simple answer, or at least, the person doing the breaking up can rarely pinpoint it. so its not always easy to see where and how things broke down. it often takes a combination of looking at it from your own perspective, from her perspective (as closely as you can), and from an outsiders 10000 ft perspective.

in my case i know there were several things that broke trust (from her and from me), and in retrospect the writing on the wall was on my relationship for at least the last year. still, the end came as an enormous shock to me, and often does, to the person being broken up with. whereas the person doing the breaking up has typically, to some extent, grieved the relationship, and is in a very different place. securing a new relationship before the other is over is a fear move, yes, and short circuits a lot of that grieving process.

so there may well have been a breaking point, but at the same time, it probably wasnt one single incident, either. relationships break down in stages. and in the case of BPD, people with bpd traits are hypervigilant about our feelings, the waxing and waning of our affections, and will act accordingly.

We are still connected on social media, but I don't watch hers and I have no clue whether she watches mine. No contact on social media whatsoever though, however a few of her family members occasionally still like my posts.

strong move not watching her social media. its easy for the most innocuous thing to just make your head spin. dont make a game of it, or be too showy, but its an attractive thing to be living your best life, and psychologically probably more effective than anything else you could say or do at the moment. you might consider posting in that light.

[Ichi]

what happened? from your perspective, what led up to the point that you reacted that way?

Well, there were a couple of instances, especially towards the end of our relationship that I was so emotionally drained, frustrated, stressed out and desparate because of the cyclical arguments, blame shifting, guilt-tripping and little regard for my feelings, combined with external factors that stressed me out, that I acted out with anger. Kicked a chair, slammed a door, threw something, things like that. However one time, I honestly don't remember what the argument was about, I totally lost it and told her to "F*ck off, get her stuff or else I'll throw it out". That's the most angry I've ever been at her those 5 years and the worst thing I've ever said to her. I deeply regret saying that and I apologized profusely and told her I didn't mean it, but I'm sure and understandingly it triggered her fear of abandonment.

Another incident was when I was angry, more stressed out actually, and drove pretty erratically (for a very short distance) with her in my car. This had nothing to do with her doing anything wrong at that moment, but it was the result of built up stress for a period of time. Apparently this incident made a big impact on her and she was very hurt by it. I regret it very much, making her feel bad, thinking it was her fault. I could have handled the situation differently and of course I made my sincere apologies to her. After that incident she told me to get help for my 'anger issues', because she couldn't handle my anger. Now, I don't consider myself to have 'anger issues', I could definitely have handled things a lot differently and I seriously regret the things I did and said, but at that time my emotional bucket was severely overflowing combined with stress from external factors which unfortunately lead to me acting that way. I really don't consider myself an angry person, rather positive and optimistic by nature and I have never before experienced that level of anger, but I take full responsibility for my part and the things I need to work on so I agreed to get help and talked to a therapist.

But apparently the damage was done as she told me my angry behavior changed and broke something inside her and it disgusted her. During our entire relationship I noticed that she was always VERY sensitive to anger or anything that could be even slightly perceived as anger. Even the smallest of arguments or discussions felt like huge fights to her, while really we were just talking or disagreeing. The smallest change in tone of my voice was perceived by her as yelling or raising my voice to her, which baffled me a lot of times. So I imagine the couple of times I did get really angry had a huge impact on her.

Later on, when she mentioned being unhappy in our relationship, I also suggested couples counseling and subtly suggested maybe individual therapy for her might also be helpful, and she agreed with both. However, while I was in the process of trying to fix our relationship, working on my part of the problems, and arranging couples counseling, she was already busy sourcing a replacement and discarded me shortly after, without trying to work things out.

[Ichi]

Also, the last year of our relationship there were other instances where her fear of abandonment was apparent when things weren't going smoothly between us. Like her saying "maybe you would be happier without me", and me reassuring her that I wouldn't be happier and wanted to work things out. Her telling me "if we'd ever break up I have no place to go", and me reassuring her she shouldn't be afraid we'd break up and IF that would ever happen we would always find a solution (TRIGGER). Her asking me "do you ever think of breaking up", and me (stupidly) saying that when things felt really bad between us it did of course sometimes cross my mind (TRIGGER), but nothing more than a thought and definitely not what I wanted. That I would never break up with her and always would keep on fighting for our relationship.

I am an honest and pretty 'matter of fact' guy and saw nothing wrong with what I said, however, now knowing about her BPD and with the knowledge I have now I would of course never have said these things and it probably triggered her fear of abandonment.

[once removed]

I was so emotionally drained, frustrated, stressed out and desparate because of the cyclical arguments, blame shifting, guilt-tripping and little regard for my feelings, combined with external factors that stressed me out, that I acted out with anger.

it sounds rough, and stressful. all of us know that its no picnic, loving someone with bpd. i said and did a lot of things i regret to this day as well. its worth keeping in mind, what a difficult relationship it was, can be, and would be, should you reconcile. this is a good start: https://www.bpdfamily.com/content/what-does-it-take-be-relationship

also, think hard about how much wanting her back, or wanting to speak, has to do with the fact that not only are you grieving a five year relationship, but a really brutal ending that would do a huge number on anyone, and their self esteem. i dont say that to discourage you or anything; its important to sort out, in terms of what action you take, if any.

as you do, consider what was broken (if anything) about the relationship, and what, if possible, it would take to lead it to steadier ground and a healthier trajectory, one that could work. she may always improve, but assume, for the sake of that exercise, that she doesnt.

[Ichi]

it sounds rough, and stressful.

It really was. Having a lot of anxiety this morning and driving myself crazy. Feeling a lot of guilt and regret and keep thinking whether it was actually all MY fault and I drove her away. In my head emphasizing all MY mistakes and shortcomings and emphasizing HER positive traits and the times she tried her best to handle things and her emotions. I know especially during the last year of our relationship I wasn't my best, was worn out, stressed, down, pessimistic, emotionally drained because of things between us and other factors like Covid and quitting smoking. I know I wasn't always the best and happiest to be around but I tried very very hard. I keep on blaming myself and feeling guilty that maybe I screwed up our relationship, made her unhappy, uncared for, maybe engulfed her and chased her away. Others keep telling me it wasn't my fault, that it would have happened eventually anyway but I just can't stop that feeling.

And it causes even more anxiety and the urge to 'make things right'. I also think what increases the anxiety is the constant feeling of rush and pushing myself to HAVE to feel better, I HAVE to be a better man, I HAVE to work on my part of the problems, no it needs to be fixed NOW. I don't WANT to feel like this, I WANT to be handle this situation, I WANT to be confident, strong and emotionally stable. For myself, the people around me and for her. I WANT to be in a position to be able to confidantly talk with her or maybe reconcile and show her I've changed, learned from my mistakes and working on things. It feels like I can't allow myself the time for this, rushing and pushing myself to speed up the process, for myself but also for her for the fear of her thinking nothing's changed and I'm still in a bad place. But I feel all of this only aggrevates my anxiety and it doesn't help me at all. I can't change the past and can only accept and work on my part of the problems, which I'm trying my hardest to do now... Sorry for rambling...

[Goosey]

Your not rambling. Those feelings are very familiar to many of us. Today is another day. One foot in front of the other.
   

[Ichi]

Thanks Goosey. Anyone else have experience/suggestions for dealing with the constant guilt and regret?

I have seen two different therapists the last months but I'm really disappointed and demoralized with the support and help they can provide. Really don't feel I'm being taken seriously. They almost literary tell me to just accept the situation, move on with my life and forget about it. Well if things were THAT simple there wouldn't be any need for therapists. They don't seem to understand the impact these relationships and discards have on a person and have no experience with BPD whatsoever. If I felt I could handle everything on my own I wouldn't have reached out for help. Problem is switching therapist is no option as there are huge waiting lists and it can take months and months. I really kinda feel 'abandoned' and like I should/have to deal with everything on my own.

strong move not watching her social media. its easy for the most innocuous thing to just make your head spin. dont make a game of it, or be too showy, but its an attractive thing to be living your best life, and psychologically probably more effective than anything else you could say or do at the moment. you might consider posting in that light.

That's what I was thinking/hoping too. I'm never showy, just sharing what I'm doing, trips, hobbies, my artwork, my photography. I'm definitely not posting with the purpose for her to see, but for myself and my friends/family. But on the one hand I'm thinking/hoping it might have the effect of her missing me and seeing I keep on living my life. On the other hand I wonder whether it might have the opposite effect, and her still being able to keep tabs on my life might make her NOT miss me, cause there's still a 'connection' and no mystery or wondering what I'm doing or who I'm doing it with. She might feel I'm still part of her life and doesn't really feel she's lost me. Any thoughts about this?

[Ichi]

We are still connected on social media, but I don't watch hers and I have no clue whether she watches mine. No contact on social media whatsoever though, however a few of her family members occasionally still like my posts.

Just realized that her family stopped liking my social media posts since a few weeks. They kept liking my posts for about 2 months after the discard, what gave me at least a feeling of reassurance that she didn't talk badly about me and they still liked me. Thing is they stopped liking my posts right after the day of her birthday, and now I'm worried she saw them that day and badmouthed or smeared me which changed their feelings about me and stopped liking my posts. Of course I'm not sure about that, however it can't really be a coincidence they ALL stopped right after that day.

I didn't wish my ex a happy birthday and maybe she was angry or hurt about that, I don't know. I contemplated doing so, but we were in NC, she's is in a new relationship and also I wanted her to feel the consequences of her discarding me and loosing me and not expecting it to be like nothing's changed. Besides that, she didn't wish me a happy birthday either a couple of weeks before. Double standards I know, but maybe in her mind me not wishing her a happy birthday means I moved on, don't care about her anymore, abandoned her.

It all just feels like it can't be a coincidence and I'm afraid she started to talk bad about me and turning people against me. I know I can't be sure and I know I shouldn't care, but apparently I do and it hurts me thinking about it.

[once removed]

you werent in the wrong not to wish her a happy birthday. when breakups happen, so does that.

its hard, impossible, to say whether she had a reaction to that, whether that reaction was to push her family to stop interacting with you on social media, etc.

but unfortunately, when breakups happen, mutual friends and family are often casualties. sides have to be chosen. if she forced their hand, or not, thats natural.

I have seen two different therapists the last months but I'm really disappointed and demoralized with the support and help they can provide. Really don't feel I'm being taken seriously. They almost literary tell me to just accept the situation, move on with my life and forget about it.

there are good and bad therapists. there are therapists that are good therapists, but bad fits.

its important, really important, to know what you are looking for in a therapist, and to select them based on that.

its hard to say whether these are "bad" therapists, or bad fits. a "good" therapist will tend to let you vent, and to be, for a while, although they will try to direct it in constructive ways. but generally speaking, a therapist is there to focus on you.

i completely understand the situation when it comes to the difficulty of switching therapists. have you tried sharing your feelings about how therapy is going with the one youre seeing? tell them these things. its an important part of the therapeutic relationship to provide feedback about the help/support youre seeking.

Feeling a lot of guilt and regret and keep thinking whether it was actually all MY fault and I drove her away.

there will be a time when this is a constructive exercise; when it will be invaluable to learn the lessons you want to take away, and into the next relationship.

when youre depressed or in a fragile or raw state, it tends to look more like what youre talking about: just incessant self blame, low self esteem, and painful thoughts. depression will have what is called a "garbage truck" effect. it will literally dig up painful thoughts to ruminate and haunt yourself with. its important to recognize this, in a mindful way, and not follow it too far down the rabbit hole.

I also think what increases the anxiety is the constant feeling of rush and pushing myself to HAVE to feel better, I HAVE to be a better man, I HAVE to work on my part of the problems, no it needs to be fixed NOW. I don't WANT to feel like this, I WANT to be handle this situation, I WANT to be confident, strong and emotionally stable. For myself, the people around me and for her. I WANT to be in a position to be able to confidantly talk with her or maybe reconcile and show her I've changed, learned from my mistakes and working on things. It feels like I can't allow myself the time for this, rushing and pushing myself to speed up the process, for myself but also for her for the fear of her thinking nothing's changed and I'm still in a bad place. But I feel all of this only aggrevates my anxiety and it doesn't help me at all. I can't change the past and can only accept and work on my part of the problems, which I'm trying my hardest to do now...

give yourself permission to grieve. everything got easier for me when i stopped judging what i was going through, and gave myself permission to grieve, and to feel whatever i was feeling. try this...just learning to observe my thoughts and feelings in a detached way, throughout the process, helped in a way that is hard to describe: https://bpdfamily.com/content/triggering-and-mindfulness-and-wise-mind

On the other hand I wonder whether it might have the opposite effect, and her still being able to keep tabs on my life might make her NOT miss me, cause there's still a 'connection' and no mystery or wondering what I'm doing or who I'm doing it with. She might feel I'm still part of her life and doesn't really feel she's lost me. Any thoughts about this?

posting or not posting is not going to make or break your goals. if you would like, though, do some of both. post about living your best life, and also go dark.

if theres one thing i want to get across, its that what you are going through is natural; i recognize a great deal of it. it may not feel like it, it may feel like you are getting worse, but the fact is, through all of it, you are healing (some of the hardest times for me, in retrospect, were when i was healing the most). it may not seem like it, but it will get better, and it does get better.

have you tried any of those supplements? grab some SAM-E. after 2-3 days of it, you will feel significantly better, and all of this will feel more manageable.

[Ichi]

Thanks so much one removed, I really value your opinion and it helps me a lot!

I notice the past few days I seem a bit more able to get out of my head and look at things more objectively. It still takes a lot of effort and I still have some bad moments of anxiety and ruminating, especially in the morning. But little by little I'm more able to 'observe' my thoughts and feelings without drowning in them.

At the moment, my biggest difficulty is the urge to 'act', to let her know I realize at least my part of what went wrong and that I'm working on it. It's like "How else would she know I'm aware of it, that I'm working on things and I've changed". If I can't tell her or show her, how would she be able to change her opinion about me or reconsider her decision.

have you tried any of those supplements? grab some SAM-E. after 2-3 days of it, you will feel significantly better, and all of this will feel more manageable.

Haven't tried the SAM-E yet, still looking into it. I'm always very hesitant taking any medication or supplements, but I'm really leaning towards giving it a try.

[once removed]

At the moment, my biggest difficulty is the urge to 'act', to let her know I realize at least my part of what went wrong and that I'm working on it. It's like "How else would she know I'm aware of it, that I'm working on things and I've changed". If I can't tell her or show her, how would she be able to change her opinion about me or reconsider her decision.

there is no real room to do this while shes in a relationship. there is no real way to do this via social media post.

but, psychologically speaking, when a person breaks up with someone, and then observes them, there is a tendency to notice changes, even to read a lot into them.

theres an episode of roseanne that makes for a great example. jackie and fred divorce because they were very different people, into different things. after the divorce, fred tries a lot of new things, a number of them things jackie tried to get him to do. she notices. she wonders out loud about it. she interrogates him about why he didnt do them before and why hes doing them now. she accuses him of doing these things to get her back. he just looks at her funny.

its an exaggerated, comical version of the basic psychology behind it. you stay on her radar, you pique her curiosity, you look like the confident, upbeat guy she fell for in the first place. thats what youre going for.

[Goosey]

Speaking of shows.
   My ex badgered our daughter to go her location to take care of “her “ dog. My daughter was stressed. I told her just suggest the dog can come here. That’s how it played out. I didn’t see the “ex”.
No contact
   So I’m “Walter “ in the “Big Lebowski”. Watching my crazy ex’s dog haha.
    Honestly I’m glad to be in this frame of mind finally. It’s no big deal. I know better then to be around during transfers  and have no desire (deep down )to see her anymore. It’s not worth the regression to my karma.
  The wheels do keep turning. Their wheels just spin faster.
   Nothing wrong with just talking to clouds and dogs.
You’ll get there.