Please post your success stories in dealing with BPD

[a2sj]

Has anyone had success in dealing with a son, daughter or son/daughter In-law with BPD? If so please share your story. We would like to hear about it.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Leaf56]

Just FYI, I already tried this:
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=350050.0

[Huat]

To Leaf56...I do remember reading the post you wrote in July.

"The question that keeps coming back to me over and over is what has become of all the adult kids that were posted about here over the past 10-plus years? Can anyone offer any insight on their own situations or those of others they've collected anecdotally or do people just come and go from this community without follow-up? "

I, too, had spent time looking back in the archives of posts, then realized names just dropped off.   The same questions came to my mind.   The stories were just as shocking, heartbreaking as those presently being posted yet, all of a sudden, names disappeared leaving me to wonder what happened in those lives?

Then a2sj you wrote:

"Has anyone had success in dealing with a son, daughter or son/daughter-in-law with BPD."

Both your posts have had me sit and think about the word..."success”...in relation to my journey with my daughter.   I ask myself...is my story one that has/is ending in "success"?

When I first came on board about 5 years ago, I was a broken soul...so broken from years of fielding verbal abuse and rejection from a daughter to whom I had bent over backwards to help through her troubled life that included broken relationships, single-motherhood, financial meltdowns.  Oh the stories I told as I cried in writing my posts!   At my lowest I had even considered suicide.  (That makes me cringe as I write this!)  Gradually I learned from this website...got the support I craved from others who posted...did my homework on the information it offered.  Oh yes, it has been babysteps!

At his point in time has much changed in my daughter's life?  No.  Has much changed in mine? Yes.  I think now that I can talk of having "success."    I am not young.  It is said that "wisdom comes with age."  That could well be attributing to my healing (which is a work-in-progress).  Also what finally sunk in was the fact that the only person I could change was myself and that helped me to work on giving up the role of being her “victim”...and...letting go of my dream that blocked reality.

I think of a person who has say, lost a leg.  If "success" for that person is going to depend on having that leg grow back, it will be unattainable.  But, if that person is able/willing to accept different options that will give him/her back the opportunity to walk then, yes, success.

I will always be a Mom and will love this troubled/troublesome child of mine to the day I die.  Meanwhile, life for me is good and getting better.  The time I spend on this forum gets to be less and less because of other interests that are bringing sunshine into my life.  Could that be the case with the others who have disappeared from this forum?  Did they just get on with life?  I sincerely hope so!

My message to all is learn to love yourself...get those boundaries in place as you grab onto your portion of the pie.

((HUGS)...from Huat

[livednlearned]

There's a thread here about successes (tiny little changes or TLCs):

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=210800.msg12322442#msg12322442

[Leaf56]

Hi Huat, I love your response, but of course you know what I meant by success when I posted that back in July. I meant the basics: your child has stopped being a jerk (at least to you), stopped threatening suicide and rollercoastering up and down with their emotions, managed to find and keep a more or less healthy relationship, stopped doing drugs if they were doing them, and find and keep a job or marry someone (Hi, Flossy!) that allows them to be financially and physically independent from you. There's a lot of gravy you could ladle on top of that description, like the other dreams you might have had for your child, but the basics will do.

I 100% think that you and many others have been successful in your own life by doing the things you needed to do to detach from your child, to redefine success for yourself, and to reimagine what your life can be in the wake of this horror. It took/takes a ton of hard work and heartache, which I am going through now myself. And accepting that as the best success I can achieve is something I'm obviously working on. But no, it will never be the success I was describing.

[Flossy]

I don't consider TLC's (tiny little changes) to be successes. I would if they were cumulative and permanent changes, but in my experience with BPD , they aren't.That is not only with the one pwBPD, I have had several come into my life.

The changes they manage are never permanent and never cumulative. They are a reaction to an event and often taken on to appease someone they want to continue to manipulate.

I personally do not believe there are any success stories.

I believe it is futile, as I was told many years ago by a therapist.

I believe pwBPD are hopelessly #####les. Manipulative, lying, untrustworthy, irresponsible people, whether they are drinking or using drugs or sober.

We just don't want to believe that because they are our children.

But someone has to be the mother or father of all the manipulating, untrustworthy, irresponsible, bad tempered, alcoholic, drug-users or sobered up humans that exist in the world. I think it's us.

...and we didn't cause it. They choose to not learn how to be decent humans.

I know a lot won't like me saying that. I don't care any more. I think we have to face the reality and choose whether we will have such humans in our lives. Or whether we will put in the energy to 'control and manipulate" them right back to make them behave. To study how their minds work and use similar techniques to manage them.

I don't see a problem with that, if the parent finds it worthwhile to have a semblance of a relationship with their child. It will be like a dance and some would see it as a negative mindset on the part of the parent.

I guess it depends if your ethics will allow yourself to change from a nurturing parent to a controlling, insightful, wary human managing a human who has no ethics, morals or respect.

I guess it also depends on whether you want to bother. I don't. Not any more.

[Leaf56]

Flossy, you are on fire today! You have said many of the most insightful things I've read here already, but today, you've outdone yourself and articulated something that I've been struggling with putting into words for a while, the fact that we have to decide about this:

"whether we will put in the energy to 'control and manipulate' them right back to make them behave. To study how their minds work and use similar techniques to manage them...I guess it depends if your ethics will allow yourself to change from a nurturing parent to a controlling, insightful, wary human managing a human who has no ethics, morals or respect."

It's a fine hair to split, but what you are saying is that, yes, we can learn and practice new behaviors ourselves in order to control them (and that's fine for others if that's what they need to do to) but that in so doing it turns us into the very same type of person we don't want to be: controlling, dishonest, and manipulative instead of honest and straightforward. I am so happy you have such clarity because it helps me so much and explains why I buck so hard against the what we've referred to in the past as the party line. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

[Huat]

Flossy, your anger comes across in your post.  That is a good thing!  I needed that emotion before I was able to move forward...shedding the role of being a victim.  Gradually I started to feel the strength build within me.   I got serious about boundaries.  While some boundaries can be adjusted, others can't...especially when safety is a concern.   Seems the older I have gotten, the more pronounced has been my daughter's verbal abuse...that could well turn to physical abuse.  I can truthfully say that, while I still feel anger, it does not consume me but the little that I do harbour keeps me strong.

Of course all our situations are different.  There is a big difference if one is dealing with a younger child or if one (like me)  is dealing with an older one.

I can't sing the praises of this forum enough.  Being able to put fingers on the keyboard and pour out my heart/hurts without fear of being judged has helped immensely.  Although I do have very dear and caring friends, so many times when I would share a story, I would be met with silence because the journey I was on with my child was inconceivable to them.   They were dumbfounded and unable to find words.  Their silence shamed me even more.

Recently I decided it was time to once again meet up with a counsellor.  When I sat down and she asked me why I came, my first words were..."I need to tell my story."  I needed to hear that what our daughter has done to us (mainly me, her Mom) was not acceptable.  I came away from that appointment feeling so empowered.  Also, I am raising flags  ...making others aware of my situation.  A bully wants and thrives on silence.  I will not be silent.

Leaf56, in your July post you really asked 2 questions.  You were wanting to hear of dreams coming true...the BPD'ers changing their behaviours for the better...the feeling of hope that could bolster one in this difficult journey.   Livnlearned sent a link in which encouraging words have been passed along.   You also wanted to know why post'ers dropped off.  I attempted to answer the second question with my story.   As I have written, I feel myself participating less and less on this forum as I move on with other interests taking up my time.  The torch continues to get passed along as Newbies come on board.  I think you are doing a wonderful job as you share and care.  As time goes by I hope you look back onto your old posts and hopefully see the progress you have managed to make in yourself.

Huat

[Leaf56]

Hi Huat, I do want to address a few things from your response. First, I want to say that what you perceive as anger in Flossy I perceive as empowerment, resolve, and indifference. I'm pretty sure she's way past anger, and that what you hear is the attempt to not feel the inevitable sadness of a mother who has come to terms with the fact that her daughter can never be in her life. But I'm also certain that calling her angry comes across as condescension, and that that will then cause her to become angry and leave, which I very much don't want. I try very hard not to judge other posters and would appreciate being called out on it if someone thinks that I have, because that's never my intention.

And I'm gonna be nitpicky here because it bothers me too when folks mischaracterize what I say. I don't mind if they misunderstand, but I do mind if they mischaracterize. So this my post from July:

"Where are they now? What's become of the adult kids posted about here years ago?
The question that keeps coming back to me over and over is what has become of all the adult kids that were posted about here over the past 10-plus years? Can anyone offer any insight on their own situations or those of others they've collected anecdotally or do people just come and go from this community without follow-up? It would be great if we could compile a database and see if there are any trends. It would also be good to know if some folks feel that they diagnosed their loved ones themselves with BPD or received a clinical diagnosis of BPD that later seems to have been in error. I'm trying to backread old threads as quickly as possible, but I'd assume that the historical mods have a much better sense of things."

And then you mischaracterized it this way: "Leaf56, in your July post you really asked 2 questions.  You were wanting to hear of dreams coming true...the BPD'ers changing their behaviours for the better...the feeling of hope that could bolster one in this difficult journey."

As you can see by re-reading my post, I absolutely was not asking anything of the kind.   

You also said: "You also wanted to know why post'ers dropped off."

As you can see, I didn't ask *why* posters dropped off, I asked *whether* posters dropped off for the purpose of seeing if they were around to help compile the database I'd suggested.

You said: "I attempted to answer the second question with my story."

And I truly appreciate it. I appreciate anyone taking time out of their day in an honest attempt to try to help another person. My issue is that I try to be as precise as I can be in the language I use, and of course I understand when someone misunderstands but I do take issue with mischaracterization.

For instance, you say: "As time goes by I hope you look back onto your old posts and hopefully see the progress you have managed to make in yourself."

This is not why I'm here. I came here originally to see if there is anything that can be done for pwBPD that ends in success—as defined by me in a post above—that my S25 could benefit from. Within a few days I saw that no, that did not appear to be the case. I've stuck around to hone the theory I had developed shortly before my arrival that not helping is actually the only way to help, found some kindred spirits, and have mostly tried to stick only to the threads I've started so as to ruffle as few feathers as possible because I know my posting style is abrupt. I am not surprised at all if most people's reaction to reading my posts like this is "whatever lady, I don't have time for this. Wishing you the best!" I get it, believe me, I get it. But I want more and better out of every interaction I have with every human being. Falling back on the tried and true has never been and will never be my way. I continue to sincerely hope that there is room for everybody and every opinion here as long as the people giving it are listening intently to others and pruning condescension from their posts.

So, as this is not my thread, I'm hoping that as2j comes back and defines for us what he had in mind as "success." Since he posted the same thing on my thread after posting his cryptic message about confirmation bias and then went so far as to then create this post separately, I'm assuming he had something in mind. But I won't go so far as to assume what that was.

[Flossy]

Huat
I am including a quote from Leaf's response to your post as it defines exactly how your response made me feel.


"Hi Huat, I do want to address a few things from your response. First, I want to say that what you perceive as anger in Flossy I perceive as empowerment, resolve, and indifference. I'm pretty sure she's way past anger, and that what you hear is the attempt to not feel the inevitable sadness of a mother who has come to terms with the fact that her daughter can never be in her life. But I'm also certain that calling her angry comes across as condescension, and that that will then cause her to become angry and leave, which I very much don't want."


Firstly, I have to say up front, that I am definitely not angry at all.

I was angry up until about a year ago, but I have moved forward from this to empowerment, resolve and indifference.  As you may not have read my other posts, I know about grief. I lost my son at 20 to lung disease and I have PTSD which I have studied extensively.

I know the grief process relates to dealing with BPD as well. I have grieved the loss of my daughter.

Having to even explain that drains my precious energy reserves.

So, I ask you with all due respect to not analyse people and put your assumption down here as though it is fact.

Instead, if you are wanting open, honest communication, ask a question.
Ask for "Clarification". If you are in the habit of writing down something you have assumed as though it is fact, this is a good habit to get into. That way you don't make assumptions and you have healthy respectful communication and you don't piss people off or hurt their feelings. None o us need that. I am sure you don't want it either.

Simply say " Are you angry?". I would tell you that I am no longer angry. In order for this method to work, you have to believe what the person says when they answer you. That is where respect comes into it.

Due to how I felt when I read this one sentence of yours, I could not spare any more of my energy to read the rest of your response. So, when I have some energy again, I will go back and read it. There may be something in there that is helpful or useful.

Please try to do this healthy practise and we can all learn from each other and not create communication barriers on this forum. We need each other.

PS I just read a bit more of your post. I can see you are coming from a good place, but the first sentence was not necessary for you to assume.
PPS My daughter is 51 and I have not seen her or spoken to her in any constructive way for 14 years. (just some background).

I might look to see if we can put a background into our posts automatically, like a signature, to give readers important information.

[Lollypop]

Hi

A2sj

Yes, I have a much improved relationship with my adult son who is now 31. I came to this forum when he was 24.

I notice your wording and I’m sorry to be nit picky but I feel it’s important:

Success in dealing with

?

I don’t “deal” with him. I interact better with him.

Can I turn to this post from Leaf56?

I came here originally to see if there is anything that can be done for pwBPD that ends in success … that my S25 could benefit from.

Me too.

I was a fixer. I really struggle with your word success.

What I’ve learnt to do is to practically and emotionally separate “me” from “him”, I let him solve his own problems and learn his own “benefits”. That’s success for me.

I've stuck around to hone the theory I had developed shortly before my arrival that not helping is actually the only way to help

Leaf56, you are right but that’s not the full answer.

The truth is that I needed as much help as he did - although I didn’t realise that at the time.

Rather than have goals for him, I set some goals for myself (albeit linked to him) and got to work learning about bpd and got back to basics. I highly recommend you do the same.

Here are my original goals:
1.  Improve my relationship with my son
2.  Get him financial management skills
3.  To allow him to be able to live independently eventually

They worked for me and thus him. See how I sneakily worded them so he’d benefit too?

If I could turn the clock back these are what my goals would be:

1. Do more things that I enjoy doing - live a good, happy life.
2. Improve and achieve healthier relationships
3. Learn how to be calmer. 
4. Keep moving forwards in my personal development.

By the way, I’m still work in progress. My success is that I don’t have a need to talk about him and his problems much at all. One big reason for not being on this forum much now.

How can we turn a lose-lose to a win-win situation?

Radical acceptance. We cannot change others, only ourselves.

Take a leap of faith and try putting your needs first for a spell. It’s fun watching mouths drop  . It feels good to demonstrate a better life lived.

I hope you have managed to get some time to yourself

LP

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[ILMBPDC]

I am mainly on the forum for detaching from a BPD relationship but my daughter was diagnosed with BPD in her mid-teens. Funny enough, she was the reason I joined the forum in the first place, to learn about BPD...and then forgot about the forum until I dated a BPD man and was discarded, came back here and tried to sign up and lo-and-behold, I already had an account! LOL
Anyway, my daughter - she was diagnosed at 16. We generally think it developed due to a terribly emotionally/mentally abusive ex-boyfriend and a string of bullying "friends".  I know she didn't exhibit signs as a child anyway.

We are lucky because she was diagnosed pretty early and was willing to attend intensive DBP therapy. The DBP helped a lot and gave her some skills to deal with her emotional dysregulation. She is 23 now and very high-functioning. She does still have emotional spirals but she is well aware of them and is open about talking about them her loved ones when they happen.

A few months back, I commented that I wasn't sure she'd be diagnosed ad BPD anymore and she read through the criteria and said she still has at least 7 of them, which saddened me.  She can usually recognize them and manage them, but they still exist. Granted, she didn't continue with therapy into adulthood and that is something I mentioned to her that she might want to think about. She agreed that it would likely be helpful but the US healthcare system sucks and she doesn't have enough money to pay out of pocket so here we are.

I don't know if BPD is "curable" per se (maybe, if they have the means to do extensive therapy for years), but it can definitely be managed and it is extremely helpful for them to have a good support system with understanding people.
Here's the thing, it can be a fine line between being a good, understanding support system and being codependent or allowing them to walk all over you. The last time my daughter was spiraling, I just sat with her and let her talk about what was going on, how she felt, and I didn't try to tell her what to do or how to feel. I just reassured her that I loved her, reminded her that feelings aren't fact and let her talk. She was able to pull herself out of it but, again, she has developed those DBT skills over the years and is very high functioning. A lot of people who don't have the skills or the understanding wouldn't be able to do that.

The other thing is that a person with BPD (and any other mental illness, really) has to want to do the work, to heal. No one can force it on them and in a lot of BPD cases, it seems like they often feel like there is nothing wrong to begin with.

[Leaf56]

I'm sure some folks are just misunderstanding me and are well-intentioned, so I'm not going to get into the ways in which some of these reply posts are problematic. I'll just point you back to Flossy's helpful statement:

"If you are wanting open, honest communication, ask a question. Ask for 'clarification.' If you are in the habit of writing down something you have assumed as though it is fact, this is a good habit to get into. That way you don't make assumptions and you have healthy respectful communication and you don't piss people off or hurt their feelings. None of us need that. I am sure you don't want it either."

And in return, if anyone here feels that I have assumed something about them, please let me know. I assure you it was unintended. I'll just go back to the threads that I start. 

[beatricex]

I posted on a message board called Voicelessness for about a decade.  A couple things I learned from that board...

Don't ever put things in BOLD.  it's annoying.  I really wish they would turn the feature off on this site.

Don't tell someone else how they're feeling.  I get you're trying to get people to notice you and to get your point across, but it makes other's FEEL voiceless, to tell them how they must feel.

Don't write in all CAPs, super annoying.  , see I did it too

As far as the content of this thread, I found it helpful in two ways
1) no one had a success story
2) the thread devolved into disecting how we talk to each other about our children with BPD.

very interesting

Flossy, your comments resonated the most, and no, didn't get the angry vibe, not at all.
 More just seemed like resolute acceptance.  radical even.  I am going back and reading and re-reading it.   You might want to start a new thread, though, because this one sort of got hijacked (sorry to state the obvious)

maybe no one comes here to post, though, if they are successful?  just sayin

b

On revision:  Lollypop has a semi success story, but I think she might work for the board.  also, just sayin

[a2sj]

My success is that I've managed to separate myself from my daughters problems. It is her life and it's up to her to choose how she wants to deal with them.

Today I found out that she has found Jesus and has forgiven me for all the abuse she says that she suffered as a child.

I thanked her for this (even though the abuse is imagined) and just asked that she tell this all to her support staff if she ever chooses to get professional mental health help again.

For the time being she accepts Jesus every Sunday or whenever and this makes everything okay. Her life just resets and all her guilt, anger, confusion etc etc is gone, until it's not.

Not much I can do until we get more scientific insight into the operation of the mind along with some tools to make changes or fix things. I just hope it gets used for good vs evil and does not get weaponized.

I understand that DBT as ILMBPDC mentions improves the lives for many that actually want to do the work. And I really agree with "No one can force it on them and in a lot of BPD cases, it seems like they often feel like there is nothing wrong to begin with."

Some choose to do the work. Some choose magic since it's easier, but doesn't really work.