Overanalyzing and thoughts on recycling

[Beware of Junk Psychology...]

First, I want to point out that I am well aware that I overthink things. It has a lot to do with childhood trauma that I won't get into right now (though I am also aware that its my crap from childhood that has led me into really bad relationships. Sigh). I overthink things because I like to be prepared. I do it with everything, its not that I'm trying to predict what will happen, I try to figure out the possibilities so that if x or y or z happens I will know what to do. Funny enough, it was my not being prepared for the first discard by my BPD ex that threw me for a loop - I never saw it coming and I felt like I had been dropped into an abyss.

Anyway...
I am trying to figure out if my BPDex is trying to feel me out for a recycle or if this is all innocent. A quick timeline:
We met at work in January 2020 and started talking more in February... then, lockdown. Spent the next 9 months in near constant contact (massive love bombing) and I fell hard (he changed companies in September so we no longer were working together). Started sleeping together in December. In January he said he loved me, talked about having children, talked about renting a cabin and going away for a weekend, lots of "future" talk. Feb 3, 2021, he abruptly discarded me and started dating someone else. They broke up in early June. We started talking more. He admitted he was pretty sure he had BPD, that his mother has BPD. The subtle love bombing started back up. I knew we weren't "back together", I know he was on dating apps - he literally told me that he was. But I was his lover, therapist, friend (basically a girlfriend without the label) and he was good at giving me hope that we would eventually get back together. On July 24th, I finally called him out on it, telling him I felt like he was using me...and his immediate response is that what I said was "hurtful" and that I was an amazing woman but he was no longer going to respond to me (yes this was over text). Boom. Done. No discussion, just...radio silence. For 13 weeks.   
(my first BPD Family post on the whole saga here :https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=350137)

Oct 23- he messaged me on Facebook to ask how my daughter was doing (she had broken her ankle in August and I had been posting updates on FB. There was literally no reason for him to reach out other than to try and establish contact). I waited 2 days to respond and it was uneventful. Whew.
(full thread on this saga here: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=351023)

Nov 9th - he showed up at a retirement party for my boss. While we used to work together, he left over a year ago and he didn't even report to her when he did work there. The first thing he said to me was "I bet you didn't expect to see me here". We chatted, and he acted like the entire last year hadn't happened-it was literally like our early relationship, before we became lovers - he was charming, flirty, sweet - it was as if he wrote off 2021 entirely. He also made several comments about how he forgets things, which was...weird.
(full thread on this here: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=351159)

He has not tried to contact me in the last few days and I don't want him to (ok, 95% of me doesn't want him to, there's still a small part of me that misses talking to him, misses our friendship, but I am well aware that it is a slippery slope and no good can come of it). But my analytical brain is trying to make sense of it. Is he tentatively poking around to see how I respond?  Am I just reading too much into these encounters? I have no idea if he's seeing anyone. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if he has a girlfriend but is looking for a backup again.

Yes, I should just let things unfold one day at a time and not worry about his motivation, but I already explained why I overanalyze things   I just don't want to be unprepared. And I am well aware I can block him if it comes to that- there is a piece of me who hopes we can remain civil, we do work in the same field after all and I honestly don't want to burn any career bridges if I don't have to (and that is the one aspect of his life he has together).

Also the whole basically forgetting the past year and ignoring the issues and how he threw a hissy fit and discarded me - it was like it never happened - apparently BPDs do this sometimes when they are starting to recycle (as a matter of fact he discarded his best friend for 5 months earlier this year and when I asked why(we were talking at the time) he said he didn't even remember. How do you not remember something you were so mad about you discarded your so-called best friend? As I think about this, he recycled this "best friend" about the same time he was recycling me after he broke up with the lady he dumped me for.  And if I recall, the "friends" he had been hanging out with had moved away before this. Interesting. Its like he has so many "slots" to fill - one goes away and he needs another. Hmmm. I guess its called recycling for a reason.

While we are here, I'd be curious about other's experience with their exes trying to recycle.
.

[ILMBPDC]

First, I want to point out that I am well aware that I overthink things. It has a lot to do with childhood trauma that I won't get into right now (though I am also aware that its my crap from childhood that has led me into really bad relationships. Sigh). I overthink things because I like to be prepared. I do it with everything, its not that I'm trying to predict what will happen, I try to figure out the possibilities so that if x or y or z happens I will know what to do. Funny enough, it was my not being prepared for the first discard by my BPD ex that threw me for a loop - I never saw it coming and I felt like I had been dropped into an abyss.

Anyway...
I am trying to figure out if my BPDex is trying to feel me out for a recycle or if this is all innocent. A quick timeline:
We met at work in January 2020 and started talking more in February... then, lockdown. Spent the next 9 months in near constant contact (massive love bombing) and I fell hard (he changed companies in September so we no longer were working together). Started sleeping together in December. In January he said he loved me, talked about having children, talked about renting a cabin and going away for a weekend, lots of "future" talk. Feb 3, 2021, he abruptly discarded me and started dating someone else. They broke up in early June. We started talking more. He admitted he was pretty sure he had BPD, that his mother has BPD. The subtle love bombing started back up. I knew we weren't "back together", I know he was on dating apps - he literally told me that he was. But I was his lover, therapist, friend (basically a girlfriend without the label) and he was good at giving me hope that we would eventually get back together. On July 24th, I finally called him out on it, telling him I felt like he was using me...and his immediate response is that what I said was "hurtful" and that I was an amazing woman but he was no longer going to respond to me (yes this was over text). Boom. Done. No discussion, just...radio silence. For 13 weeks.   
(my first BPD Family post on the whole saga here :https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=350137)

Oct 23- he messaged me on Facebook to ask how my daughter was doing (she had broken her ankle in August and I had been posting updates on FB. There was literally no reason for him to reach out other than to try and establish contact). I waited 2 days to respond and it was uneventful. Whew.
(full thread on this saga here: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=351023)

Nov 9th - he showed up at a retirement party for my boss. While we used to work together, he left over a year ago and he didn't even report to her when he did work there. The first thing he said to me was "I bet you didn't expect to see me here". We chatted, and he acted like the entire last year hadn't happened-it was literally like our early relationship, before we became lovers - he was charming, flirty, sweet - it was as if he wrote off 2021 entirely. He also made several comments about how he forgets things, which was...weird.
(full thread on this here: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=351159)

He has not tried to contact me in the last few days and I don't want him to (ok, 95% of me doesn't want him to, there's still a small part of me that misses talking to him, misses our friendship, but I am well aware that it is a slippery slope and no good can come of it). But my analytical brain is trying to make sense of it. Is he tentatively poking around to see how I respond?  Am I just reading too much into these encounters? I have no idea if he's seeing anyone. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if he has a girlfriend but is looking for a backup again.

Yes, I should just let things unfold one day at a time and not worry about his motivation, but I already explained why I overanalyze things   I just don't want to be unprepared. And I am well aware I can block him if it comes to that- there is a piece of me who hopes we can remain civil, we do work in the same field after all and I honestly don't want to burn any career bridges if I don't have to (and that is the one aspect of his life he has together).

Also the whole basically forgetting the past year and ignoring the issues and how he threw a hissy fit and discarded me - it was like it never happened - apparently BPDs do this sometimes when they are starting to recycle (as a matter of fact he discarded his best friend for 5 months earlier this year and when I asked why(we were talking at the time) he said he didn't even remember. How do you not remember something you were so mad about you discarded your so-called best friend? As I think about this, he recycled this "best friend" about the same time he was recycling me after he broke up with the lady he dumped me for.  And if I recall, the "friends" he had been hanging out with had moved away before this. Interesting. Its like he has so many "slots" to fill - one goes away and he needs another. Hmmm. I guess its called recycling for a reason.

While we are here, I'd be curious about other's experience with their exes trying to recycle.
.

[once removed]

recycling isnt a thing that people with bpd do.

its a thing that two people do when they have unresolved feelings and decide to try again. its a common, sometimes healthy, sometimes unhealthy thing; over 60% of relationships do not end after the first breakup.

why do i stress this point?

because a person cant recycle you. a person can court you, or try to reconcile, but they can only succeed if you are open to the idea. are you?

I finally called him out on it, telling him I felt like he was using me...and his immediate response is that what I said was "hurtful" and that I was an amazing woman but he was no longer going to respond to me (yes this was over text). Boom. Done. No discussion, just...radio silence. For 13 weeks
...
Also the whole basically forgetting the past year and ignoring the issues and how he threw a hissy fit and discarded me - it was like it never happened

what is most likely going on here is that the drama between the two of you has passed, and the warm feelings have returned after a few pleasant encounters. the relationship is "safe" again. youre on good terms.

is it more than that? possibly. its hard to say.

but i think that its up to you to determine where you want this to go (if anywhere). if you have romantic feelings, or hurt feelings, or fearful feelings, thats likely to come up in some form, and the relationship is unlikely to survive that.

what do you think?

[ILMBPDC]

recycling isnt a thing that people with bpd do.

its a thing that two people do when they have unresolved feelings and decide to try again. its a common, sometimes healthy, sometimes unhealthy thing; over 60% of relationships do not end after the first breakup.

why do i stress this point?

because a person cant recycle you. a person can court you, or try to reconcile, but they can only succeed if you are open to the idea. are you?

Good point. I was trying to avoid the dreaded "h" word here and used recycling instead but you are right I can't be recycled without my consent. I'm more curious if it seems like he is feeling me out to attempt it though.

what is most likely going on here is that the drama between the two of you has passed, and the warm feelings have returned after a few pleasant encounters. the relationship is "safe" again. youre on good terms.

is it more than that? possibly. its hard to say.

but i think that its up to you to determine where you want this to go (if anywhere). if you have romantic feelings, or hurt feelings, or fearful feelings, thats likely to come up in some form, and the relationship is unlikely to survive that.

what do you think?

I cannot go through another discard and I know that he hasn't changed ( and likely will not) so, no, I won't be led into a romantic relationship again.
Where I am struggling is if he wants to rekindle the friendship...I miss that part of him more than anything, before we ever got together. And like I said we are in the same field and I loved being able to bounce ideas off of him. But I guess I am scared I am not fully healed and even if we tried to be friends would that even work?  I've seen him discard friends as well, so maybe not. 

Like I said, I am trying to get a sense on what is going on - he refuses to speak to me for months, then acts like nothing has happened...from what I understand that can be classic BPD... Sigh. I'm probably way overthinking it.

[Deep Blue]

Hey ILMBPDC,

We’ve interacted a bit on this site and I sense we both think and view situations very similarly. Listen, your time is valuable. You are a very rational and caring person. This man is the opposite. Evidenced in the way he acts and treats those around him, he does not respect the people who enter into his life. He is unable to commit, is unable to accept responsibility, and has absolutely no clue or regard for how his actions affect other people. If you were to see these qualities in any other human being alive, wouldn’t you agree that this behavior is indicative of a toxic, immature, and manipulative individual who is unworthy of your precious emotions and care?

You are healing from a very traumatic experience. I’m right there with you. Things ended with me and the woman I loved only two months ago. It’s still fresh. I tell myself how much I miss our lovely moments, our laughs, our shared interests and experiences. But I’d say that you and me both know, deep down at least, that these thoughts are clinging to someone that ultimately wasn’t there. They are emotionally unavailable and unfeeling when it comes to any sort of meaningful connection. And when it ends, there is no closure. No respect.

I wouldn’t recommend rekindling a friendship. He shows no respect for you from what you’ve shared, and you deserve way more than that. Also, ask yourself, is your desire to form a friendship truly and completely born out of a purely platonic urge? Are there any other ulterior motives or hopes that are behind the desire to get back in touch?

You don’t deserve to be hurt ILMBPDC. You deserve to have your love reciprocated and respected. This man has proven to be a bottomless black hole that consumes and destroys any sort of personal connection that he comes across. You deserve better. Try to go on some dates or meet new people. It could help with showing that there are others who are more worthy of your time and affection. I know it’s hard and I know how unbelievably painful it was and is. But you can do this. I believe in you.

Deep Blue

[once removed]

Where I am struggling is if he wants to rekindle the friendship...I miss that part of him more than anything, before we ever got together. And like I said we are in the same field and I loved being able to bounce ideas off of him. But I guess I am scared I am not fully healed and even if we tried to be friends would that even work?   

most transitions between ex and friend dont work. thats usually because the relationship served its purpose, the two drifted apart, and whether or not they attempt a friendship after the fact, the two, eventually, go their separate ways.

im friends with a few of my exes. in particular, im pretty good friends with one who has bpd traits, and the breakup was pretty bad.

that friendship was only able to occur years after the fact. and the friendship looks very different than the relationship, or even to how it looked when we were friends before we dated. we catch up by text every couple of months, and i go to her halloween party once a year. thats about it. its not a super close relationship, at least not on my end. it enriches my life, but i wouldnt be saddened if we fell out. and by the way, she does lose it on me sometimes because shes very sensitive. its not a big deal, or at least not a big enough of one.

if you want to be friends, think it through, be realistic, and also be honest with yourself about where you are in your recovery.

this person is not in a place where they are giving this level of thought to the relationship you are. more than likely, the ice is thawing, and, again, it sounds like something where its become "safe" to catch up. that can certainly turn into a closer friendship, but such a thing cant, and shouldnt, be forced.

in other words, i think if you approach this with expectations, and if you push for them, its not likely to survive.

if you approach it with the goal of "being on good terms" are cool with whatever comes with that, and the pace with which it comes, thats a realistic attitude and possibility. you could be pals and catch up and bounce ideas; that sort of thing.

are you in a place where youre able to do that?

[ILMBPDC]

We’ve interacted a bit on this site and I sense we both think and view situations very similarly. Listen, your time is valuable. You are a very rational and caring person. This man is the opposite. Evidenced in the way he acts and treats those around him, he does not respect the people who enter into his life. He is unable to commit, is unable to accept responsibility, and has absolutely no clue or regard for how his actions affect other people. If you were to see these qualities in any other human being alive, wouldn’t you agree that this behavior is indicative of a toxic, immature, and manipulative individual who is unworthy of your precious emotions and care?

You are healing from a very traumatic experience. I’m right there with you. Things ended with me and the woman I loved only two months ago. It’s still fresh. I tell myself how much I miss our lovely moments, our laughs, our shared interests and experiences. But I’d say that you and me both know, deep down at least, that these thoughts are clinging to someone that ultimately wasn’t there. They are emotionally unavailable and unfeeling when it comes to any sort of meaningful connection. And when it ends, there is no closure. No respect.

Yes, you are right, of course. I have literally said these things about him aloud to myself, trying to get it through my emotional center that can't let go. He isn't worthy of me, its as simple as that. So, why is this so hard?

I wouldn’t recommend rekindling a friendship. He shows no respect for you from what you’ve shared, and you deserve way more than that. Also, ask yourself, is your desire to form a friendship truly and completely born out of a purely platonic urge? Are there any other ulterior motives or hopes that are behind the desire to get back in touch?

Honestly I don't want to get back with him in any romantic way. What I miss, have always missed, is that friendship we had initially, the easy conversations about topics that I literally have no one else to talk to about. It doesn't help that I have few friends and those I do have are more like acquaintances, no one I would reach out to if I needed someone. Of course, I can't count on my ex either so that would just put him in the acquaintance category should we ever speak again.

You don’t deserve to be hurt ILMBPDC. You deserve to have your love reciprocated and respected. This man has proven to be a bottomless black hole that consumes and destroys any sort of personal connection that he comes across. You deserve better. Try to go on some dates or meet new people. It could help with showing that there are others who are more worthy of your time and affection. I know it’s hard and I know how unbelievably painful it was and is. But you can do this. I believe in you.

Thank you. I needed that.

As for dating - no. Both my therapist and I agree that I am not in a place to be dating and frankly I am at a point of giving it all up. I really can't handle it anymore. I have a lot of healing to do before that even becomes an option, if it ever does (and no this is not even about him, its about every guy I dated who cheated, the con man I dated a decade ago, sexual assault and childhood trauma. I'm a damn mess). Its actually really hard to think that I may be alone forever, but that may honestly be the best thing for me if I expect to survive this life.

[Ad Meliora]

You're overthinking it too much, have a nice warm cup of tea and watch a movie.  I'm going to curl up and watch "Reminicence" with Hugh Jackman, it's a sci-fi thing.  We're getting snow here for the first time this season, which is late for this locale.  I'm guessing if you're anywhere near this location the weather is inclement and some hibernation time is in order.

You did the right thing.  Let us know when (if) he makes a move.

[ILMBPDC]

You're overthinking it too much, have a nice warm cup of tea and watch a movie. 

Thanks, I know I am but...

You did the right thing.  Let us know when (if) he makes a move.

He did message me late last night apologizing for coming "into my space" on Tuesday. He said he hoped I'm not mad. :rolling my eyes:

Here's the thing, I may be overthinking it-I do that, yes-but I don't think I am wrong. I think he is poking me to see if I've given up on him entirely.  I don't know what he wants. In his message during the final discard he said something along the lines of "I never wanted more" (then just friends) which was not only hurtful but blatantly false, unless he goes around talking future and kids and having sex with all his friends. Who knows, with his disordered thinking, maybe he does  .

I admit, I am curious what his motivation is and what he is after. I've proven to myself that I can have civil, unemotional conversations with him and if that's all this is, I am fine with that. But the second - the second - he tries for more, I'm done. I refuse to be used like that again.

We're getting snow here for the first time this season, which is late for this locale.  I'm guessing if you're anywhere near this location the weather is inclement and some hibernation time is in order

Upper Midwest USA here - its quite cold, no snow yet but its coming. Its snowing up north where my sister lives, she was sending me pictures last night. Tonight is my off night (no school, no other commitments) so I will likely curl up with the dogs and watch the Great British Baking Show's new episode on Netflix    No drama

[SinisterComplex]

Thanks, I know I am but...
He did message me late last night apologizing for coming "into my space" on Tuesday. He said he hoped I'm not mad. :rolling my eyes:

Here's the thing, I may be overthinking it-I do that, yes-but I don't think I am wrong. I think he is poking me to see if I've given up on him entirely.  I don't know what he wants. In his message during the final discard he said something along the lines of "I never wanted more" (then just friends) which was not only hurtful but blatantly false, unless he goes around talking future and kids and having sex with all his friends. Who knows, with his disordered thinking, maybe he does  .

I admit, I am curious what his motivation is and what he is after. I've proven to myself that I can have civil, unemotional conversations with him and if that's all this is, I am fine with that. But the second - the second - he tries for more, I'm done. I refuse to be used like that again.
 Upper Midwest USA here - its quite cold, no snow yet but its coming. Its snowing up north where my sister lives, she was sending me pictures last night. Tonight is my off night (no school, no other commitments) so I will likely curl up with the dogs and watch the Great British Baking Show's new episode on Netflix    No drama

So what exactly do you want? Yes you are driving yourself crazy by overthinking this far too much. Do you want him as a friend? Then be friends, but can you keep up stiff boundaries? If he tries something then shut his $$ down hard and at that point make the decision do you want to have to continue to deal with that because odds are it will happen again.

As for what he is after...validation of course and trying to prove he can still have you if he wants you (ego boost).

Midwest...ha another midwesterner who gets to enjoy the lovely blizzards that are coming supposedly. Stay warm, stay cozy, and be safe.

Cheers and best wishes to you!  

-SC-

[ILMBPDC]

So what exactly do you want? Yes you are driving yourself crazy by overthinking this far too much. Do you want him as a friend? Then be friends, but can you keep up stiff boundaries? If he tries something then shut his $$ down hard and at that point make the decision do you want to have to continue to deal with that because odds are it will happen again.

100% honesty - yes what I want is his friendship, I want to go back to where we were before the love bombing and emotional entanglement. I am also well aware this is unlikely to be something that could actually happen.

We had a conversation about the discard - I was able to say some things I had wanted to get off my chest and I feel a ton better. Does it matter to him or make a difference?  Probably not but I feel way better. And I am no longer driving myself crazy with wondering what was going to happen. I actually feel at peace for the first time all week.

Will we continue to talk?  Maybe. But I am in a much different position than I was before. I know his game and I know what I don't want and its very possible that as I enforce my new boundaries with him he may take off again...and I am ok with that.

As for what he is after...validation of course and trying to prove he can still have you if he wants you (ego boost).

Oh I don't doubt that at all.

Midwest...ha another midwesterner who gets to enjoy the lovely blizzards that are coming supposedly. Stay warm, stay cozy, and be safe.

Yeah I'm over the winters. Looking to move almost anywhere next spring or summer if all goes well.

[Ad Meliora]

Nov 9th - he showed up at a retirement party for my boss. While we used to work together, he left over a year ago and he didn't even report to her when he did work there. The first thing he said to me was "I bet you didn't expect to see me here". We chatted, and he acted like the entire last year hadn't happened-it was literally like our early relationship, before we became lovers - he was charming, flirty, sweet - it was as if he wrote off 2021 entirely. He also made several comments about how he forgets things, which was...weird.

Let's get this dead horse up for a few more whacks at the piñata.  I don't see why we shouldn't all not overanalyze a thread on "overanalyzing" which of course I confirmed for you.

So it was a work party, he was a co-worker (and fairly popular it sounds) so I would say him showing up isn't all that unusual.  You had some interaction a couple weeks before in form of a text.  Turned out innocuous.

I'd just say there is the whole object permanence thing and out-of-sight-out-of-mind thing.  You were there, he was there.  He wanted to talk, probably conjured up some things for him, and we know it did (a lot of things) for you.  He's probably  now texting some 55 year old and asking her if she'll have his child, because he's not too familiar with the human reproduction cycle (as reported) and he'd be just as clueless with her (physical) needs as he was with yours.

I understand the friendship portions and "talking shop".  My BiPDex of 15 years was really active in politics and I got dragged into a lot of things, many of which were good for me.  If you're a candidate your dream volunteer/organizer is someone with Bipolar Disorder on an "Up" cycle.  They are super fired up and don't sleep and will stay on issues like a rabid dog on amphetamines!  She spent most of her time in a down cycle though, a lump on the couch, but her mind was always sharp and she was a good person to talk to about all kinds of things.

This is one of the things I miss about a committed relationship in general.  Having someone to talk to and confide in.  Someone who knows your perspective and can offer an alternative view of a situation, in essence grounding you in the greater reality that is our collective society.  It is easy, and I think particularly easy for many of us here to get caught in our own thoughts, and obsess or overanalyze things.  It's a hallmark of the thinking that people with PD's have and they reside in that world constantly, an alternative reality of their own fabrication with only the tiniest tethers to what you and I know as objective reality.  The only reason they maintain those ties is because it suits their needs.  A job, for example, to make money and have prestige/attention.

We're all giving things up not having a partner like that when it is what we seek.  I know you mentioned that you aren't ready for dating yet, and I'm in that boat too, but I think you're getting closer.  Maybe it's that LSD therapy you're into (okay, I know that's not what it's called) and the somatic therapies(?).  It seems to me you're getting a good handle on things and you may not be as far away from finding that guy to talk shop with.

You know Ms. BPD was an analyst, working in logistics.  I'm sure there's plenty of shop talk that would overlap.  I'd put you in touch with her, but oh yeah , SHE'S CRAZY! 

[ILMBPDC]

I'd just say there is the whole object permanence thing and out-of-sight-out-of-mind thing.  You were there, he was there.  He wanted to talk, probably conjured up some things for him, and we know it did (a lot of things) for you.  He's probably  now texting some 55 year old and asking her if she'll have his child, because he's not too familiar with the human reproduction cycle (as reported) and he'd be just as clueless with her (physical) needs as he was with yours.

You're probably right, though I don't think he's into women that much older than him, but who knows.
I agree with the object permanence thing wholeheartedly - I think that was a huge factor in our relationship.

It is easy, and I think particularly easy for many of us here to get caught in our own thoughts, and obsess or overanalyze things.  

I sometimes wonder if I have a PD (I don't fit nearly enough criteria in any lists I've seen though). I broached this with my last therapist and he said no, he doesn't think I do. I definitely have issues though    Due to insurance changes I had to get a new therapist, I actually have my second session with her today. I chose her specifically because of her work with codependency and mood disorders but she is also well versed in personality disorders so it will be interesting to get her take on things.

It's a hallmark of the thinking that people with PD's have and they reside in that world constantly, an alternative reality of their own fabrication with only the tiniest tethers to what you and I know as objective reality.  The only reason they maintain those ties is because it suits their needs.  A job, for example, to make money and have prestige/attention.

Funny you should mention this. My ex once again mentioned he "wants to be rich" yesterday. This time it seems as though he is targeting cryptocurrency (last I knew he was going to start his own business to get rich...before that he was going to get a Masters degree so he could get a good tech job and be rich (he dropped out first semester).

I seriously wonder if that was his motive for reaching out yesterday - I had mentioned on Tuesday at the party that one of the classes I was in this semester was surrounding blockchain and we got into a long discussion about it. Yesterday, after our "discussion" on him discarding me, he turned the topic to crypto and wanted my opinion on some things he was thinking. I don't mind the discussion, I welcome it actually, no one else I know has a clue what I am talking about. But if he thinks that I am going to do any work or coding algorithms or anything for him he's off his rocker (no he hasn't asked but I know a lot more than him on the subject).  #boundaries

Side note: while we are tentatively "talking" I have zero intention of being the instigator in any conversation. Other than the conversation yesterday where I needed to get some stuff off my chest,  my plan is to keep him at arm's length. I've proven to myself that we can have perfectly civil conversations, but I refuse to allow myself to be pulled in. Yes I could block him and be done with it but being able to bounce ideas off him is beneficial for me as well. If that changes, then I know where the block button is.

I know you mentioned that you aren't ready for dating yet, and I'm in that boat too, but I think you're getting closer.  Maybe it's that LSD therapy you're into (okay, I know that's not what it's called) and the somatic therapies(?).  It seems to me you're getting a good handle on things and you may not be as far away from finding that guy to talk shop with.

Psilocybin not LSD but yeah...I do want a relationship, I'm just scared sh*tless to get into one again. Plus the thought of having to go out and date is exhausting

[Ad Meliora]

100% honesty - yes what I want is his friendship, I want to go back to where we were before the love bombing and emotional entanglement. I am also well aware this is unlikely to be something that could actually happen.

You know, I think it's pretty clear to me at least that you're still stuck on your ex.  From this and other posts, but that's not really what I want to talk about.  I want to talk about the possibility of the above happening with your BPDex and you with the help of Psilocybin.

Psilocybin not LSD but yeah...I do want a relationship, I'm just scared sh*tless to get into one again. Plus the thought of having to go out and date is exhausting--ILM

You've mentioned you're a tech person and seem like a smart cookie so I think you can handle what I'm gonna throw at you here. I don't really like computers, personally, but I love science.  If I would go into something it likely would be learning more about Quantum Theory and Mechanics.  That fascinates me, especially the ties they are finding when comparing these emerging theories to Eastern Thought which is millennia old, I'm thinking Lao Tzu here.

I watched a documentary years back which had a bunch of modern theorists and scientists talking about just that. One of them talked about how we generally think we can "influence the future, and only remember the past".  He said that's not how time equations work, at least not mathematically.  Simply put:  2+2=4, 4-2=2.  You can run them backwards and forwards.  He said theoretically we should be able to "remember the future" and "influence the past".  Kinda mind blowing, right?

This is where Psilocybin comes in.  It knocks out the constructs of time, our brains don't know what "time" is, we learn it.  Knock out that concept and now you can go back in time and "re-write" some of those problem memories and trauma, or at least minimize their effects on the conscious mind.  From what I understand this is at the core of the use of psychedelics in modern day medicine and to treat PTSD for example.

Anyway, BPD's already have an altered sense of time and I write repeatedly about my ex's Etch-A-Sketch memory.  Wouldn't it be theoretically possible to use that fact to your advantage and that through your treatment you could remove your "lonely-child" schema?  That, in theory, then wouldn't antagonize his "abandoned child" and you could return to some type of collegial co-worker r/s?  Maybe one in which he is open to talking to you more about going to behavior therapy himself?  Next thing you know, you're on the "reversing a break-up" board.  It's all far fetched, because you have a "history" but maybe Mr.BPD has Etch-A-Sketch mind too?

I wouldn't think too much of it but I had an experience of "remembering the future" several years back.  I can relate it in simple terms, if you're interested.  It can be easily discounted if your mind is deeply entrenched in linear time and you aren't interested in the musing of thinkers like Carl Jung on the topic.  I mean "linear" is just that, a line.  So we can see the points going backwards but doesn't there have to exist a "point" called tomorrow afternoon if we want to connect to it?

Anyway, maybe I'm not even real?  Maybe I'm just a consciousness from a future time who was injected into the 1's and 0's of the inter webs? Or...maybe I'm just a Packer's fan who is "remembering the future" of the game tomorrow at noon.  Yep, Packers win, crush Purple!  ha ha

[ILMBPDC]

You know, I think it's pretty clear to me at least that you're still stuck on your ex.  From this and other posts, but that's not really what I want to talk about.  

Stuck?  I don't think that's the right word. I am aware that I still have a...fondness...for him. I sometimes wish the relationship had gone down in flames like so many of yours. I went straight  from love bombing/future faking to being discarded with no in between devaluation, lies, cheating, fights, etc. It hurt to be abruptly cut off and I never want to experience that again but there were no other terrible moments to buffer the good memories so...its hard to hate him. However, my eyes are wide open now (thanks to this forum and tons of inner work on myself) and I am vividly aware that my residual emotions could be an issue and am keeping tight reigns on them. I am fully aware of his techniques and that ultimately I was nothing to him. And that's really what matters.

I want to talk about the possibility of the above happening with your BPDex and you with the help of Psilocybin

This is where Psilocybin comes in.  It knocks out the constructs of time, our brains don't know what "time" is, we learn it.  Knock out that concept and now you can go back in time and "re-write" some of those problem memories and trauma, or at least minimize their effects on the conscious mind.  From what I understand this is at the core of the use of psychedelics in modern day medicine and to treat PTSD for example.

I don't know if its so much "rewriting" as it is that it knocks out your ego so you can address some of the past traumas. Maybe in doing that it is "rewriting" things, at least emotionally. For instance, in one of my last sessions I had gone back to childhood. I didn't have any "visions" or anything but the emotions were there. I ended up crying and telling myself repeatedly "You were just a child, you should never have been put in those situations". Now, these are things I was aware of and would tell myself that exact thing - I was a child, I should not have been left to care for my younger sisters. I should never have been expected to be the adult, I should have been cared for and nurtured...but it wasn't until I took that journey that I actually broke through my ego and started to believe that.

Anyway, BPD's already have an altered sense of time and I write repeatedly about my ex's Etch-A-Sketch memory.  Wouldn't it be theoretically possible to use that fact to your advantage and that through your treatment you could remove your "lonely-child" schema?

 I truly hope so. Frankly, this was one of my purposes for trying the therapy. To dig deep into my psyche and work on those issues. Now that I know more about the lonely child schema I think it would be a fantastic focus for a journey. I haven't taken one since August, I had to take time to assimilate the last 2, they were tough. And now I'm so busy with school on the weekends I haven't wanted to take a full day to do another.

That, in theory, then wouldn't antagonize his "abandoned child" and you could return to some type of collegial co-worker r/s?

Its an interesting theory.  Funny story - he was the one who put me onto psychedelics to begin with. We had a few discussions about the studies that were being done on mental health and psychedelics and both had an interest. True to form, I took the reigns and actually ran with the idea and as far as I know he's done nothing.

Maybe one in which he is open to talking to you more about going to behavior therapy himself?  

We had those discussions, in the month or so before he cut me off completely. I actually helped him make a list of male therapists who specialized in DBT therapy. We had some extremely deep discussions and I made the mistake of thinking that his confiding in me, trusting me, was bringing us closer together. Ha. It brought me closer. Him, not so much. And, true to form, he never followed up with therapy. This is actually another huge reason we would ultimately never work - that lack of follow through drives me insane!

Next thing you know, you're on the "reversing a break-up" board.  

*shudder* no.

It's all far fetched, because you have a "history" but maybe Mr.BPD has Etch-A-Sketch mind too?

He does, yes. He had a TBI at age 20, was in a coma for a week or so and tends to forget a lot of things. I never know if his forgetfulness is from that or BPD or both. I originally chalked it up to the TBI but now I'm not so sure.

Anyway, maybe I'm not even real?  Maybe I'm just a consciousness from a future time who was injected into the 1's and 0's of the inter webs?

Heck maybe none of us are real and its all the matrix.

Or...maybe I'm just a Packer's fan who is "remembering the future" of the game tomorrow at noon.  Yep, Packers win, crush Purple!  ha ha

:D

[Ad Meliora]

For instance, in one of my last sessions I had gone back to childhood. I didn't have any "visions" or anything but the emotions were there. I ended up crying and telling myself repeatedly "You were just a child, you should never have been put in those situations". Now, these are things I was aware of and would tell myself that exact thing - I was a child, I should not have been left to care for my younger sisters. I should never have been expected to be the adult, I should have been cared for and nurtured...but it wasn't until I took that journey that I actually broke through my ego and started to believe that.

I'll have to give you a "ditto" at least what happened to me in my childhood.  At 7 all of a sudden I'm the "man of the house" learning how to mow the lawn, etc... wondering why my mom is crying frequently and I'm trying to take care of my younger sister telling her "it'll be allright", but how could I know?  I'm a child of divorce from the 70's, it's almost a cliche.  I should've been able to just "be a kid" for some more time.  I got over it, of course, but as you can see there's some residual garbage there.  The right person comes along and "BAM!" A Ream-a of Schema!

I need to get a little bit of what you're smoking, maybe?   I know you're not smoking the Psylocybin, but yeah, it' sounds like it's working for you.

Purple Prevailed (sigh).  If I could know the future you think I'd be wasting my time here?   12  16  24  42 59 and what's the powerball for the next drawing...?

[ILMBPDC]

Purple Prevailed (sigh).  If I could know the future you think I'd be wasting my time here?   12  16  24  42 59 and what's the powerball for the next drawing...?

I am so going to play those numbers. Then we will see...

(I'm kidding, in case that wasn't clear)