OK, how to I finally completely detach emotionally? cPTSD triggered

[ILMBPDC]

As expected, my ex is plastering his Facebook story with pictures of him and his new woman (something he has never done with me). He hasn't so much as said "Hi" to me since Wednesday (not even in response to me) and we were talking almost every day before that...

The thing is - this is exactly what I wanted!  I was hoping that this would trigger my anger enough to finally just pull the plug on the "friendship" - sadly all its doing is triggering my cPTSD and rejection response.

I know what I need to do - block him, delete him, just be done with it all...but something inside me is resisting. It makes me sick to my stomach at the thought of not having him in my life in some capacity - and I am learning that this is a huge part of cPTSD from my childhood neglect. I also feel that just up and blocking him is childish and cowardly and that we should have a conversation.  And yet I also know that pwBPD don't seem to care about the feelings of the people they leave behind.

I remember how being no contact with him for 3 1/2 months last summer/fall didn't kill me and actually was probably really good for me. I also know that its my own fault I slipped back into this dysfunctional pattern with him - I really think we could have been fine as friends if I didn't have my own issues that allowed him to start treating me the same as before.

I have a ton of work to do on my own emotions, I realize that. I am actually exploring taking a leave of absence at work for my cPTSD as I cant even concentrate anymore, that's how bad it is (and not just about him, though that obviously doesn't help anything)

So I guess I'm just wondering if anyone has any advice, besides blocking him?  (I am truly working on that - and its funny because I have told so many people here that NC is the way to go and now I can't follow my own advice)

[once removed]

I really think we could have been fine as friends if I didn't have my own issues that allowed him to start treating me the same as before.

ive been in this position. its not easy!

it certainly helps to see this for what it is. and to understand that its a relatively normal situation, and a relatively normal reaction.

how to manage it?

the first thing id do is unfollow/mute him. its a good test to face and overcome our triggers, but you dont need stuff like that in your face and on your social media, no one does, so give yourself space from that.

the second is that i would pull back, and id pull back significantly. not go silent on him, not give the silent treatment, but while hes getting into a new relationship (which will preoccupy him) id take the space to adjust and to get him out of my day to day life, where im thinking about him less. in my experience, that can take a week or two, sometimes more. it helps to find things you can immerse yourself in and/or look forward to. for the foreseeable future, id let him do all the reaching out, though i also wouldnt expect him to do much if any right now.

thats how you detach emotionally. you find healthy (and safe) ways to adjust your thinking, your attachment, and the relationship.

[ILMBPDC]

the first thing id do is unfollow/mute him. its a good test to face and overcome our triggers, but you dont need stuff like that in your face and on your social media, no one does, so give yourself space from that.

the second is that i would pull back, and id pull back significantly. not go silent on him, not give the silent treatment, but while hes getting into a new relationship (which will preoccupy him) id take the space to adjust and to get him out of my day to day life, where im thinking about him less. in my experience, that can take a week or two, sometimes more. it helps to find things you can immerse yourself in and/or look forward to. for the foreseeable future, id let him do all the reaching out, though i also wouldnt expect him to do much if any right now.

thats how you detach emotionally. you find healthy (and safe) ways to adjust your thinking, your attachment, and the relationship.

Thank you for this. Really, its the same actions as when he discarded me before. I already have him muted though we are still "friends" on FB and IG. I have to seek out his page/story and I almost never do, but this morning I had messaged him asking why he hasn't said so much as "hi" in 3 days (still no response though he's seen the message) it had a link to his story and I couldn't help myself. Then I obsessively re-watched it like 5 times and even went to her IG to check out her page. (She seems sweet, I don't wish his BPD on her but that's not my problem) Funny enough, her IG is now private, just in the last few hours (no I didn't do anything stupid like like her pics).  Oh well.

I admit, I was spiraling this morning. I was all set to just block everything and be done with it (much like some pwBPD do!  But that's one of the overlaps with cPTSD unfortunately). I believe it was partly in a bid to keep myself from the pain of being rejected by him again. I have since talked myself down and came to the same conclusion as you have suggested - as a matter of fact I have spent the last couple weeks pulling back on him already but this still threw me for a loop. I wrote an extensive journal entry earlier today trying to figure out why I can't let go and luckily I see my therapist on Tuesday.

Know what's really funny - its been almost exactly one year since the first time this happened - he started seeing someone new the last week of last January and discarded me for the first time last Feb 3.  Weird.

One big thing that I have figured out today is that I need to work on respecting myself so that I stop allowing him (and other men) to treat me poorly.

[Biggus]

So I guess I'm just wondering if anyone has any advice, besides blocking him?  (I am truly working on that - and its funny because I have told so many people here that NC is the way to go and now I can't follow my own advice)

It's hard to go NC and it's harder not to go NC. I chose NC and it's so much better. I don't own her, she's free to do how she pleases, and I don't have to react to that.

Missing someone is a big bundle of feelings, much like love. Recognize and separate different feelings you had and still have towards him. Accept more than fight against them. Learn from them. That might help.

For example, when thinking about my ex, I have several, such as disappointment, how it again went the way it did. I felt resentment, as before break up she was so unwelcoming and one sided, it was quite impossible to get through to her - but I have forgiven that. I don't feel anger or hate towards her, just sadness because she can't find peace in a loving atmosphere, or properly recognize one, or function in one, and that comes from her childhood - I feel anger towards her parents, their selfishness. I miss her less, just because I understand the impossibility of it. I know I care about her and feel so much compassion towards her, there is some love too. These are my feelings that exist, as we have broken up, they don't need to be valitated by her.

Most importantly, you should move your focus from him and social media to your own life. How to make your life more interesting and meaningful to yourself. When you're thinking about your ex you are focusing to a very narrow area in your life, it's like there's a dot in the horizon. Instead of focusing to be present in this beautiful scenery, you choose to focus on that tiny dot somewhere in the distance.

[grumpydonut]

One big thing that I have figured out today is that I need to work on respecting myself so that I stop allowing him (and other men) to treat me poorly

L, you've been writing this for months. It's time to take steps towards doing it.

Staying friends with a man who emotionally abused you was the opposite of doing this, and was a means of staying attached to him.

We all make mistakes - and often they're the same ones. I fear, however, that your journey of self realization is - atm - nothing more than information for your brain. It's not changing your behaviour. It's not getting you closer to a healthy relationship.

As someone who did that for over a year, I'm greatly wanting to you to start doing what you know is the right choice.

[babyducks]

It makes me sick to my stomach at the thought of not having him in my life in some capacity - and I am learning that this is a huge part of cPTSD from my childhood neglect.

hello ILMBPDC,

I can relate to your post.     From my experience, what worked for me was to really come to understand that my relationship was not 'normal' and the recovery from it would not follow normal patterns.   or what I thought was normal.

Looking back at it,  I believe that I became involved with my Ex because of my childhood neglect.    That idealization phase was so very addictive.  Being with my Ex felt very familiar.  it felt like coming home.

and because they were so closely tied together, letting go of my EX also meant I had to let go of the idea that I could fix or resolve my childhood.   it was a double whammy in many ways.

it made me feel very alone.    which is a very strong left over feeling from my childhood.   Like I was alone, trying to meet my needs the best I could and not doing a good job at it.     I remember shop lifting food when I was a kid so I could eat.    and feeling so strong and fierce in that moment.   like I was taking care of myself.     it tied into my feelings with my EX.    this is what I have to do to take care of myself.   this is what I have to put up with to get what I need.   if I do X, Y and Z then some one will care about me.

these are difficult things to grapple with.   tough issues.

what I have found to be true for me is that these patterns I learned at a young age don't ~go away~.    they are still very much a part of me.    I can learn to make friends with these patterns.    not judge them or beat myself up because of them.    recognize them for what they are and make conscious decisions to do things differently.

breaking up with my EX sent me into a cPTSD spiral for quite a while.    as these relationships normally do, we didn't have a clean or neat break up.    there was a lot of weird behavior and some stalking type behavior from her.   which drove me nuts.    my Ex engaged in a lot of proving she was the better person.    there was the smear campaign.     there was crossing my boundaries to provoke a response.    there was a bunch of social media evidence proving how well she was doing or how great things were for her.

I often describe my relationship as a needs entitlement war.    which is true.  but an awful lot of it was both of us proving "I am a good person and deserving of love."    that was a hook for both of us.   See what I am doing (did)  I am a good and caring person deserving of love.

In the book "Stop Caretaking the Borderline or Narcissist: How to end the Drama and Get on with your Life"   the author Margalis Fjelstad talks about the 6 Thought Distortions of Caretakers.    I found it to be interesting stuff.   She talks about Perfectionism and Superior/Inferior thinking.   I recommend the book.

One of the lines that stays with me from the book is: "Caretakers (us) almost never see themselves as perfectionists because they cannot see themselves as ever being perfect - quite a twist of thinking in itself."

There is no way to do a break up perfectly.    for those of us who have a need to always be 'good' or 'nice', we can look at how always being the good person in the relationship creates a (false) sense of superiority. 

my two cents

'ducks

[ILMBPDC]

L, you've been writing this for months. It's time to take steps towards doing it.

Staying friends with a man who emotionally abused you was the opposite of doing this, and was a means of staying attached to him.

We all make mistakes - and often they're the same ones. I fear, however, that your journey of self realization is - atm - nothing more than information for your brain. It's not changing your behaviour. It's not getting you closer to a healthy relationship.

As someone who did that for over a year, I'm greatly wanting to you to start doing what you know is the right choice.

Thanks grumpy, once again. I know this. I woke up every 2 hours last night and immediately thought about him. Its not healthy for me. I tried to be friends but it just doesn't work for *me*. I  know this. So why is is so damn hard to pull the plug?  I actually started the process of blocking him as soon as I woke up, but I have been sitting here staring at his fb account (where we chat the most and the the last thing I need to block besides my phone) for 20 minutes, unable to pull the plug. I've been reading our last messages, no drama, no issues, and wonder if I'm doing the right thing. It feels like such a loss of a close, easy friendship.  And it is. But its also a loss of a toxic romance, which is the part I need to lose.

I think there is a sense of FOG. I feel like I have to be there to support him. I wrote in my journal yesterday that I wonder if the reason I feel this way toward him (where I never have before with other relationships) is that I see a lot of myself in him and maybe what I am doing is trying to protect myself through him. Its weird, I know, but since I've been in ACA and doing inner child work I am realizing just how large my core wounds are. I know I would be devastated if he ghosted me like I am thinking about doing to him right now and I'd hate to cause him the same abandonment pain.

Looking back at it,  I believe that I became involved with my Ex because of my childhood neglect.    That idealization phase was so very addictive.  Being with my Ex felt very familiar.  it felt like coming home.

I am finding out this exact thing - that I am just recreating childhood neglect patterns. The further he pushes me away the harder I cling, much like I did with my parents.

it made me feel very alone.    which is a very strong left over feeling from my childhood.   Like I was alone, trying to meet my needs the best I could and not doing a good job at it.     I remember shop lifting food when I was a kid so I could eat.    and feeling so strong and fierce in that moment.   like I was taking care of myself.     it tied into my feelings with my EX.    this is what I have to do to take care of myself.   

Yes. This is exactly it. Sounds like we had a very similar childhood. I didn't shoplift food, but food was scarce - my mom got busted dumpster diving behind the grocery store at least once. And I was the caretaker for my younger sisters, never getting a childhood of my own. So having someone want to be with me so fiercely (at the beginning) and think that I am so amazing was a drug, really.

this is what I have to put up with to get what I need.   

Funny you say this, I actually realized this not that long ago - that this is exactly what my mom did with my dad. When he died in '99, I distinctly remember her lamenting that she put up with all the bad stuff for 25 years and now that it was finally getting good she wouldn't get to enjoy the fruits of her suffering (she didn't say suffering but basically that's what she meant). I never really realized it until the last month or so that I was literally brought up to put up with pain because eventually rewards will come. And that matches most of my relationships (without the reward).

if I do X, Y and Z then some one will care about me.

I know I do this. I keep trying to prove my worth to the world. I keep trying to achieve more hoping someone will value me. And I  have come to realize that this is really my inner child trying to convince my parents I'm valuable. Every achievement I make just makes me feel empty because its still not giving me what I really crave, and it never will. So, along with digging into my childhood and my pseudo-relationship I am re-evaluating my life choices and trying to figure out what it is I actually want (and I have no idea)

what I have found to be true for me is that these patterns I learned at a young age don't ~go away~.    they are still very much a part of me.    I can learn to make friends with these patterns.    not judge them or beat myself up because of them.    recognize them for what they are and make conscious decisions to do things differently.

This is disheartening. I guess I know that they won't go away but I am so tired of living this way and not knowing how to get out of the patterns. I am alone, depressed, and exhausted. It doesn't feel like a life worth living at this point.
I also know I can choose to be different if I can learn how to be (and there is the big issue!  HOW do I do this?) - I did make the conscious choice to not raise my daughter how I was raised and for the most part did well.

breaking up with my EX sent me into a cPTSD spiral for quite a while.

 
I'm already there and I haven't even spoken to him yet. I honestly don't want to but, like I said in the OP, I feel like a coward not talking to him first. I think I need to, though, to get closure or else my brain will just continue to spiral.

And the cPTSD spiral is more than just about him. Bringing up all these old childhood wounds recently has been exhausting. What I really need is someone to support me in that, not make my spiral worse. To be fair, one aspect of my cPTSD is not reaching out for help and so he likely doesn't even know how bad it is in my head. At the same time, I don't feel like he cares enough to provide the support I really need (but that could just be me being hyper independent). And I can't see me finding anyone who would want to take on that support, it would be a huge ask for anyone much less someone I barely know. And maybe that's another reason I'm clinging to him - because just having his occasional kind word is something.

One of the lines that stays with me from the book is: "Caretakers (us) almost never see themselves as perfectionists because they cannot see themselves as ever being perfect - quite a twist of thinking in itself."

There is no way to do a break up perfectly.    for those of us who have a need to always be 'good' or 'nice', we can look at how always being the good person in the relationship creates a (false) sense of superiority. 

This is really interesting. I have seen the book recommended quite often but I rarely read self help books - I prefer to read for comfort and escapism (). I know I should read this one though, it sounds like it has good advice.

[babyducks]

So why is is so damn hard to pull the plug?

those of us who have been loved and been in love with a pwBPD exquisitely know that feeling of being deeply seen and completely adored.    It's hard to describe how exhilarating and how completing that feeling is.     It's hard to let go of that.    Its hard to believe that feeling has passed.     Something that intense can not last long right?    But we all, always, believe we can recreate it somehow.

 It feels like such a loss of a close, easy friendship.  And it is. But its also a loss of a toxic romance, which is the part I need to lose.

boundaries are porous with a pwBPD.   so are ours.    Can you honestly hold the boundary of the friendship?   and not stray into the toxic romance?

I wonder if the reason I feel this way toward him (where I never have before with other relationships) is that I see a lot of myself in him and maybe what I am doing is trying to protect myself through him.

could be.    it took me a while to realize that my Ex and I were a lot a like.    Just not in how we expressed ourselves.    but our thought patterns were a lot a like.
She was always afraid that love and care and concern were going to disappear.    I clung to those same sensations myself, just did it differently.

This is disheartening. I guess I know that they won't go away but I am so tired of living this way and not knowing how to get out of the patterns.

I said this badly.   the patterns might not completely go away but that doesn't mean that the continue to be a problem.     all of us have our limitations with something.    that doesn't mean those limitations cause hurt.    we can accept, embrace and move on.     

I also know I can choose to be different if I can learn how to be (and there is the big issue!  HOW do I do this?) - I did make the conscious choice to not raise my daughter how I was raised and for the most part did well.

I would suggest that first you find a way out of the emotional flashback of the cPTSD.    you mentioned that the cPTSD was bad enough you were thinking about leaving your job.     that sounds bad to me.    how do you normally work to stop and recover from emotional flashbacks?    what steps do you use?
 

I'm already there and I haven't even spoken to him yet. I honestly don't want to but, like I said in the OP, I feel like a coward not talking to him first. I think I need to, though, to get closure or else my brain will just continue to spiral.

this is interesting.     is it likely you would get closure from him?     there have been opportunities for closure before, right?    and they didn't really work out?   I'm not that familiar with your story.    many of us continually returned to the source of hurt looking for closure or healing or something.    not many of us found it.   basically, we are gifting someone who is emotionally chaotic and potentially damaging the power to hurt us again.     why would we do that?    basically it has to do with the nature of trauma bonds and the human belief that the person who inflicted the emotional injury can heal the emotional injury.     this belief really deserves some close examination.    is it true?    is it reasonable?    is it likely?

And the cPTSD spiral is more than just about him. Bringing up all these old childhood wounds recently has been exhausting. What I really need is someone to support me in that, not make my spiral worse.

can you provide yourself the support you need?    what one thing can you do to treat yourself well?   what would that look like if you had to describe it to me?    how would it feel if you were supporting yourself?     

'ducks

[ILMBPDC]

boundaries are porous with a pwBPD.   so are ours.    Can you honestly hold the boundary of the friendship?   and not stray into the toxic romance?

I'd like to think I can but I have proven repeatedly that I can't.

I would suggest that first you find a way out of the emotional flashback of the cPTSD.    you mentioned that the cPTSD was bad enough you were thinking about leaving your job.     that sounds bad to me.    how do you normally work to stop and recover from emotional flashbacks?    what steps do you use?

It is bad. I am extremely depressed and while not suicidal, I can definitely see the reason some people in my situation want to die -its hell living like this.
I started seeing an acupuncturist and that helps calm my nervous system for a good day or two. I wish I could afford to see her more than weekly. I also found that vaping lemon balm helps calm my system, as does some breathing techniques. I try to do yoga each evening and have been journaling occasionally. I don't know what else to do tbh.
 

is it likely you would get closure from him?     there have been opportunities for closure before, right?    and they didn't really work out?   I'm not that familiar with your story.    many of us continually returned to the source of hurt looking for closure or healing or something.    not many of us found it.   basically, we are gifting someone who is emotionally chaotic and potentially damaging the power to hurt us again.     why would we do that?    basically it has to do with the nature of trauma bonds and the human belief that the person who inflicted the emotional injury can heal the emotional injury.     this belief really deserves some close examination.    is it true?    is it reasonable?    is it likely?

Yeah I don't even know. He also can't let go of me for some reason (otherwise why would he ignore me for 3+ months and then reconnect?) and his actions and words never match. The second discard he told me "I never wanted anything more [than friends]" but he didn't act like that - I mean there were times he talked about having kids together. If that's not "more than friends" I don't know what is.
So, he did respond last night and was kind of dismissive - he is pushing me away, I recognize the pattern. And even though it hurts, I know its for the best. He really isn't capable of having a fully loving relationship and I know that he can't give me what I truly need.

Your point about believing that the person who inflicted the emotional injury can heal the emotional injury is interesting and probably spot on. I also believe that I hold on to hope and potential way too much. I see so much potential in him (in us) and I have hope that he will live up to that potential. But I also recognize that is really all in my brain and I need to stop thinking that way and look solely at the present - and in the present he is incapable of that potential. Plus he is sliding down a slippery slope with alcohol (and possibly adding other substances) and having some major issues with his ex wife and custody of their son (she keeps accusing him of abuse, he claims she is NPD and lying - neither doctors nor CPS have ever found evidence for her claims and even with his BPD he doesn't have the rage issues that many do. On the other hand he is saying his family is "mad" at him about the whole thing because he needs to have supervision when he's with his son and it falls to them to help out.)
Yeah just typing that out make me shake my head. I really don't need to be involved in all of that. I wonder if a person without cPTSD/codependency would see all of that as a red flag. I didn't because growing up with an alcoholic father, and codependent/narcissistic mother means that is all "normal" to me and something to look past if you like the person. (also when we met he wasn't going through all of this)

can you provide yourself the support you need?    what one thing can you do to treat yourself well?   what would that look like if you had to describe it to me?    how would it feel if you were supporting yourself?     

I don't think I can. I know a big part of everything I read is that I need to learn to love and respect myself but at this point I just don't have it in me and I really, really, really need someone to hold me and tell me its going to be ok and that they won't leave me. While my family won't abandon me, they also don't have the emotional capacity to give me the support I need. This is a huge familial issue - there are half hugs and pats on the back but no real emotional connection, and frankly this is a big reason I am like I am. And probably the reason I cling to my ex - the whole "recreating childhood patterns" thing.

I know this forum is not a mental health forum but I am grateful you are listening to me hash this out.

[GTS22]

ILMBPDC:  You've been heard.  I feel the same way.  I'm struggling and depressed (fortunately not suicidal either) as well.  I've heard the same things too - love yourself, work on yourself, let go of the hope, etc.  The problem is HOW?  Hang in there and keep posting.  You're not alone.  You and I (and everyone else) will all get through this. 

[once removed]

i think theres a dilemma in front of you, and one that doesnt have easy answers.

is the solution to:

1. detach in a way that allows you to remain friends
2. cut all contact
3. some combination of those things
4. none of the above

ive had a primary best friend since day one of middle school when we first met. it would take far too long to write, but we have always been like brothers.

over the years, starting in our twenties, we drifted apart. increasingly, i started feeling left out of his life. it was, and has been, incredibly hurtful, and frankly triggering.

there were times i wanted to confront him. there were times i wanted to do things to send a message. there were times i wanted to cut contact. often times, the hurt and my thoughts about it consumed me. it was really difficult to sit with the hurt, and hurtful things continued to happen in the process.

when i confided in others, that is what was generally recommended to me to do. to detach, without blowing up bridges. to let go of my version of the relationship, without ending the relationship. to process my hurt along the way. today, finally, ive come a long way with that, think about it a lot less, have started to move on and get past my hurt and resentment. we are still friends, id do anything for him, but i dont invest anything, and we dont talk much. it is what it is.

walking away from a friendship or a relationship, whether we do it quietly, or whether we do it overtly (with notice), are, of course, valid options. so is maintaining a relationship while we work through our issues, even when its hardest. the latter seems like what youre attempting to do, and i commend you for that, but what isnt necessarily clear is whether that is the right answer, and what the right answer is.

by and large, its a values question. how much do you value him? how much do you value the relationship? how much do you value yourself? what do your values dictate that you do, or dont do?

[ILMBPDC]

ILMBPDC:  You've been heard.  I feel the same way.  I'm struggling and depressed (fortunately not suicidal either) as well.  I've heard the same things too - love yourself, work on yourself, let go of the hope, etc.  The problem is HOW?  Hang in there and keep posting.  You're not alone.  You and I (and everyone else) will all get through this. 

GTS22, thank you.
Yep, the "how" gets me too. How do I detach? How do I heal my childhood trauma? How do I ensure this doesn't happen again? But there is proof on these boards it can be done.  I am in therapy and attending ACA meetings so I hope to learn some tools to address these "how's". I know its not going to happen overnight and that's hard too, I'm so exhausted from it all. But all I can do is put one foot in front of the other and move forward.

[ILMBPDC]

i think theres a dilemma in front of you, and one that doesnt have easy answers.

is the solution to:

1. detach in a way that allows you to remain friends
2. cut all contact
3. some combination of those things
4. none of the above

when i confided in others, that is what was generally recommended to me to do. to detach, without blowing up bridges. to let go of my version of the relationship, without ending the relationship. to process my hurt along the way. today, finally, ive come a long way with that, think about it a lot less, have started to move on and get past my hurt and resentment. we are still friends, id do anything for him, but i dont invest anything, and we dont talk much. it is what it is.

I had a long conversation with my sister today. I admitted I was still entangled with my ex, which I had been keeping from her out of embarrassment for being roped in for a third time. It was a weight off my chest. I shared my fears and my loneliness and my pain. She was really understanding which was nice. She didn't tell me what to do but it helped me get some things straight in my head.

My plan is to detach, without blowing up bridges, as you said - no reaching out, just work on myself. I am not completely going no contact but I am not going to make first contact. If he wants to talk to me we can have a conversation but I need to ensure I don't start relying on him for my emotional boost, which I realized I was doing.

Since he is starting a new relationship I am not worried about him trying to flirt with me - he does have boundaries regarding that. So there's only 2 reasons he would contact me - something tech/work related or something to do with his custody battle. So I don't anticipate much contact to be honest. If his pattern holds, he will be in this relationship around 3-4 months at which point I will be so much further on my journey of healing that I expect I will be strong enough to not repeat my own pattern in this dysfunction. This is something that was not present at all in the past.

I actually feel really good right now, stating that - I WILL be on my healing journey and I WILL be strong. I AM on that journey.

walking away from a friendship or a relationship, whether we do it quietly, or whether we do it overtly (with notice), are, of course, valid options. so is maintaining a relationship while we work through our issues, even when its hardest. the latter seems like what youre attempting to do, and i commend you for that, but what isnt necessarily clear is whether that is the right answer, and what the right answer is.

by and large, its a values question. how much do you value him? how much do you value the relationship? how much do you value yourself? what do your values dictate that you do, or dont do?

Is it the right answer? I really don't know. I believe that if it is not the right answer then I will discover that along my journey and rectify it.
I do value our friendship. Its the romantic relationship that is a toxic mess. I need to be able to detangle those two things. I do want to salvage the friendship - I've been saying it for months. But if I can't, I need to be able to leave the friendship as well. I think I am there. I am much clearer headed today and realize that even though I want to save the friendship, I made a breakthrough yesterday in the letting go department by coming within minutes of blocking him from my life. While I realized that I was being childish and I was only wanting to do it to save a hard conversation, I also feel like something changed in my head. I realized I will go on with or without him. Its a step in the right direction.

Back to the entanglement with the friendship and romantic relationship. While its true he always makes the first move, its me who has always made the choice to say "Yes" and get re-involved. He had never pressured me into anything, he just offers and I always take him up on it. Should that ever come up again (knock on wood that it doesn't), I know I have the right to say no, its not a good idea. I just have to work on asserting my own boundaries.

In the meantime I realize I need to keep cultivating some of the tentative friendships I have made. I need other people in my life, not just my ex. It makes it way too easy to cling to him/not let go when he is the only one I am really close to. I actually have known this was an issue for a long time and its one of my long standing patterns, one I need to get out of.

So yeah I have a lot to work on and a lot to occupy me in the upcoming months.

[Cant breathe]

I'm sorry to hear you are back in this position. When I was struggling with my loss months ago I found your advice to be so wise. I appreciated your guidance. I hope you can find a path that finally works for you. My advice is that NC really does work. I also quit social media, which helped because I am not tempted to look at him or spy on his
relationship. After a devastating fifth (or was it six?) rejection by this man last August, I finally came to realize I will never find answers or comfort from this man. He will never get better, no matter who he is with now. He has lost the privilege of knowing me. I am still hurt by this, but I am so much better now. My life will be great without him. I hope you come to the same conclusion with your situation.

[ILMBPDC]

I'm sorry to hear you are back in this position. When I was struggling with my loss months ago I found your advice to be so wise. I appreciated your guidance. I hope you can find a path that finally works for you.

Thank you! I am happy to hear that my advice helped. I do give good advice I just have a hard time listening to myself 

My advice is that NC really does work. I also quit social media, which helped because I am not tempted to look at him or spy on his relationship. After a devastating fifth (or was it six?) rejection by this man last August, I finally came to realize I will never find answers or comfort from this man. He will never get better, no matter who he is with now.

All good advice and actually sounds like things I've told people in the past . I remember repeatedly telling people that we will never understand what goes on in their heads. And we won't. And he will never have a functioning relationship as long as he refuses to get therapy.

I've been contemplating the 3 1/2 months we were NC and while it hurt so much at first, by 3 months or so I was actually feeling pretty good about it all. It was only a couple weeks later he broke NC and I truly thought I was healed enough to be friends with him. Little did I know how easy it would be to slide back into those patterns.

He has lost the privilege of knowing me.

I love this.
I have taken to telling myself out loud when I'm in the car that he is not good for me, that its his loss, not mine. I'm not sure Its fully embedded in my head yet but I'm trying.

I am still hurt by this, but I am so much better now. My life will be great without him. I hope you come to the same conclusion with your situation.

I am so happy to hear this.
I know my life will be great without him - better, even, once I can truly cultivate that self-love and self-respect I so need.
(I am obviously in such a better place mentally than I was yesterday. Lets hope it stays that way!)

[babyducks]

Yep, the "how" gets me too. How do I detach? How do I heal my childhood trauma? How do I ensure this doesn't happen again? But there is proof on these boards it can be done.  I am in therapy and attending ACA meetings so I hope to learn some tools to address these "how's". I know its not going to happen overnight and that's hard too, I'm so exhausted from it all. But all I can do is put one foot in front of the other and move forward.

a couple of thoughts on the "How" of it all.

• rest is important.  all different kinds of rest.   it's important/necessary to rest.
• deliberately change your focus.  away from others.   away from him.  onto yourself. 

• focus on emotionally neutral or emotionally positive things. play cheerful music.  read happy stories.  distract yourself from negative inner thoughts.
• don't ruminate

• be deliberate about positive self affirmations.  even if they sound silly at first.
• be protective of yourself, your emotions,  what you can/should do each and every day.

everyone has a different approach to the how of it.   it feels unique to each individual.  but the beginning is putting yourself first.   conscious efforts at self care.

[ILMBPDC]

a couple of thoughts on the "How" of it all.

• rest is important.  all different kinds of rest.   it's important/necessary to rest.
• deliberately change your focus.  away from others.   away from him.  onto yourself. 

• focus on emotionally neutral or emotionally positive things. play cheerful music.  read happy stories.  distract yourself from negative inner thoughts.
• don't ruminate

• be deliberate about positive self affirmations.  even if they sound silly at first.
• be protective of yourself, your emotions,  what you can/should do each and every day.

everyone has a different approach to the how of it.   it feels unique to each individual.  but the beginning is putting yourself first.   conscious efforts at self care.

Thanks ducks
I am working on myself - hugely working on myself. I have begun digging into my childhood trauma and learning why exactly I am like I am - and why I get into these types of relationships. Its hard but ultimately it will be good. Unfortunately this also means that I am spending a lot of time not in a positive place. I am trying to otherwise be positive and focus on other stuff. It can be hard, especially when my depression monster hits

I am also trying really hard not to ruminate, which is practically impossible to stop once I get into it. I have been trying to find techniques to stop ruminations, let me know if you have any ideas

And I have been resting as necessary. Now that I am done with school I don't have as much on my plate and I have been practicing being gentle with myself when I just can't do anything.

I have an app that pops up positive affirmations 4 times a day and I say them out loud. I sound like a dork but who cares, I find saying them out loud is better than just reading them. Luckily I work from home 

[GTS22]

Yes, thanks babyducks. 

And, ILMBPDC, I'm with you.  I can't stop the ruminations either.  And I'm also trying to dig into my past, which is painful.  I want this feeling to stop, and I know only I have the ability to stop the sadness and feel better, but I'm not quite sure how. 

[ILMBPDC]

And, ILMBPDC, I'm with you.  I can't stop the ruminations either.  And I'm also trying to dig into my past, which is painful.  I want this feeling to stop, and I know only I have the ability to stop the sadness and feel better, but I'm not quite sure how. 

I just got out of therapy with my new trauma focused therapist and I truly believe that this is going to help me immensely. Yes digging into your past is painful but at the same time it is eye opening and you cant heal something without getting to the root cause. I am in shock about how much of my childhood has informed my actions throughout my life. I can see the dysfunctional mechanisms I used with my BPDex...really with all my exes. Its going to take time to heal - a lot of time, I'm sure, but I actually see a small glimmer of hope that I might actually be able to do it and eventually have a truly healthy relationship in the future.

A good therapist, I am learning, is not just going to listen to you and say "how does that make you feel", rather they will guide you through the things you need to deal with and make a plan of action for you and work through it all with you (which is awesome since I have no clue how to do it myself).  I've that 3 therapists in the last year and I think I finally found the one who will make a difference.

[SinisterComplex]

I just got out of therapy with my new trauma focused therapist and I truly believe that this is going to help me immensely. Yes digging into your past is painful but at the same time it is eye opening and you cant heal something without getting to the root cause. I am in shock about how much of my childhood has informed my actions throughout my life. I can see the dysfunctional mechanisms I used with my BPDex...really with all my exes. Its going to take time to heal - a lot of time, I'm sure, but I actually see a small glimmer of hope that I might actually be able to do it and eventually have a truly healthy relationship in the future.

A good therapist, I am learning, is not just going to listen to you and say "how does that make you feel", rather they will guide you through the things you need to deal with and make a plan of action for you and work through it all with you (which is awesome since I have no clue how to do it myself).  I've that 3 therapists in the last year and I think I finally found the one who will make a difference.

This is good news. Keep us posted on your progress with that therapist.

Cheers and best wishes!

-SC-

[babyducks]

Hello ILMBPDC

I am working on myself - hugely working on myself.

Yes.    Yes you are.     No doubts about that.      Like Once Removed mentioned upstream, this type of work takes time.    And it's often painful.    To oversimplify by about a thousand percent, recovering from a traumatic relationship is like recovering from a broken leg.   Results are not immediate.   The leg will often hurt.   The pain can both be a symptom of injury and a symptom of healing.   there will be times when it doesn't feel like the leg is going to heal or the cast is going to come off.

ILMBPDC,  after reading along with you for a little while it strikes me that you may not being giving yourself enough credit for all you have accomplished and all you are doing.     Its sounds like maybe you are being too hard on yourself.   

You are familiar with 12 step programs, so I am sure you have heard the quote:

acceptance is the answer to all my problems today. When I am disturbed, it is because I find some person, place, thing or situation – some fact of my life – unacceptable to me. I can find no serenity until I accept that person, place, thing or situation as being exactly the way it is supposed to be at this moment.

Where you are right now is okay.   you are okay.   it's not going to be this way forever.    you are going to continue to make good progress with learning and growing.   

I am also trying really hard not to ruminate, which is practically impossible to stop once I get into it. I have been trying to find techniques to stop ruminations, let me know if you have any ideas

ruminations are hard.   there are a lot of thought stopping or thought redirection skills.    I used two a lot.    The pick a color one.   and the mantra one.   

In pick a color you find everything in the room or area you are in that is or has the color green let's say.    so you pick green.   you look around the room, what is/has green?   what has the smallest amount of the color green?  how many things have the color green?    obviously, the point is changing your mental focus.

for the mantra one - you find a phrase that means a lot to you. It could be inspirational, calming, reassuring, etc. Repeat it in your head. Say it out loud if you need to. Find a phrase (or a few) that really resonate with you.    if you have a meaningful faith tradition you could use the words of prayer.   Dad50 once said here that he used "Not Your Turn" when thoughts of his EX popped into his head.   That's a good one.    Long time ago I used "I release you. I am free to move on."    that one was right from Google, (letting go mantras)     Sometimes I still use "I don't give into darkness."

its whatever works for you, but understand it isn't going to work each and every time.   it takes practice to derail the Automatic Negative Thoughts.    even with practice some times you ruminate.

'ducks

[ILMBPDC]

Yes.    Yes you are.     No doubts about that.      Like Once Removed mentioned upstream, this type of work takes time.    And it's often painful.    To oversimplify by about a thousand percent, recovering from a traumatic relationship is like recovering from a broken leg.   Results are not immediate.   The leg will often hurt.   The pain can both be a symptom of injury and a symptom of healing.   there will be times when it doesn't feel like the leg is going to heal or the cast is going to come off.

Yeah I know it takes time. I've had 47 years to get this screwed up, I can't fix it overnight, as my therapist reminded me yesterday. Mr BPD was just a symptom of my issues. My not being able to detach is a symptom of my issues.
Its funny you use a broken leg analogy - my daughter broke her leg in August and while the bone is healed she is having a lot of issues with her flexibility in the ankle that PT isn't helping and has to go back to the surgeon for advice. Much like that, I have to remind myself that I will make progress but there will also be setbacks.

ILMBPDC,  after reading along with you for a little while it strikes me that you may not being giving yourself enough credit for all you have accomplished and all you are doing.     Its sounds like maybe you are being too hard on yourself.   

Sounds about right. I have a huge inner critic. I have a hard time accepting myself and this is something we will be working on in therapy.

Where you are right now is okay.   you are okay.   it's not going to be this way forever.    you are going to continue to make good progress with learning and growing. 

 
Thank you. I need this reminder.

ruminations are hard.   there are a lot of thought stopping or thought redirection skills.    I used two a lot.    The pick a color one.   and the mantra one.   

In pick a color you find everything in the room or area you are in that is or has the color green let's say.    so you pick green.   you look around the room, what is/has green?   what has the smallest amount of the color green?  how many things have the color green?    obviously, the point is changing your mental focus.

for the mantra one - you find a phrase that means a lot to you. It could be inspirational, calming, reassuring, etc. Repeat it in your head. Say it out loud if you need to. Find a phrase (or a few) that really resonate with you.    if you have a meaningful faith tradition you could use the words of prayer.   Dad50 once said here that he used "Not Your Turn" when thoughts of his EX popped into his head.   That's a good one.    Long time ago I used "I release you. I am free to move on."    that one was right from Google, (letting go mantras)     Sometimes I still use "I don't give into darkness."

its whatever works for you, but understand it isn't going to work each and every time.   it takes practice to derail the Automatic Negative Thoughts.    even with practice some times you ruminate.

Thank you for this - the color one is interesting and one I haven't heard before. I use the mantra pretty regularly.